The Democratic Presidential Debates
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Spiritual_Chaos said:CM189191 said:Spiritual_Chaos said:CM189191 said:Spiritual_Chaos said:CM189191 said:josevolution said:So will most of you vote for who ever comes out of the Democrats or just not vote or vote for the Baffoon?
I wish that were the case Jose.
Unfortunately I'm concerned there are a bunch of idiots out there who don't understand we have a two-party system.
They'll get distracted by shiny objects like Tulsi or Bernie or Stein, and piss their vote away because they don't understand the fundamentals of how our government works.
Get yourself some more parties.
Biden will win by people not wanting Trump. But he will not get one punch in on Trump the whole race.
See what I mean @josevolution ? The complete inability to grasp basic American political concepts.
For the hundredth time, our checks and balances are within the 3 branches of government. People who didn't understand this during the last election cost us 2 SCJ & numerous Federal Court appointments, that will take a whole fucking generation to fix.
We are not a multi-party system. We are not set up that way. We never were.
Two parties is awfully close to one party.
We are not a multi-party system. We are not set up that way.
Again, this is grade school level civics class
The US is not a direct or pure democracy
It is a constitutional republic0 -
JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:The bolded states will not help the Democrats at all in November, but tonight will help the party machine secure the nominee it wants. If you really want to know where the base is, pay attention to the rest.
Alabama
Arkansas
California
Colorado
Maine
Massachusetts
Minnesota
North Carolina
Oklahoma
Tennessee
Texas
Utah
Vermont
VirginiaWouldn't you have said Michigan and Wisconsin didn't matter at this same point in 2016? Assuming you can use the south to nominate whatever candidate makes the machine most comfortable is dangerous. The idea that blue states will vote for whoever we tell them to, and that blue states will be blue states forever, is reckless.Blue states matter. Purple states matter. Red states don't. (Except in this primary where they are given huge importance.)
Further... Clinton won the primaries in PA, OH, FL, VA, AZ, NM, NV. So she won at least half of the swing states.
12 of the 20 states that voted for Sanders in the primary went to Trump. I just don't understand how your argument works here. By quick math, 15 of the 31 Clinton states went to Trump.
Democrats win when the base is energized. Whether they live in a state they have a chance to win like NC, or one where the odds are low like SC. That's why turnout is such an important indicator and was at record levels in SC and that's why the party went to bat for Biden. He got better turnout than obama.
I know we disagreed on this before SC, but to me it seems fairly logical. In the 3 states bernie did well, turnout was nothing special, which is ample evidence the millenials are not about to set records for a new revolution (maybe that changes tonight ). In the state Biden did well, turnout was excellent.
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mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:The bolded states will not help the Democrats at all in November, but tonight will help the party machine secure the nominee it wants. If you really want to know where the base is, pay attention to the rest.
Alabama
Arkansas
California
Colorado
Maine
Massachusetts
Minnesota
North Carolina
Oklahoma
Tennessee
Texas
Utah
Vermont
VirginiaWouldn't you have said Michigan and Wisconsin didn't matter at this same point in 2016? Assuming you can use the south to nominate whatever candidate makes the machine most comfortable is dangerous. The idea that blue states will vote for whoever we tell them to, and that blue states will be blue states forever, is reckless.Blue states matter. Purple states matter. Red states don't. (Except in this primary where they are given huge importance.)
Further... Clinton won the primaries in PA, OH, FL, VA, AZ, NM, NV. So she won at least half of the swing states.
12 of the 20 states that voted for Sanders in the primary went to Trump. I just don't understand how your argument works here. By quick math, 15 of the 31 Clinton states went to Trump.___________________________________________
"...I changed by not changing at all..."0 -
Lerxst1992 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:The bolded states will not help the Democrats at all in November, but tonight will help the party machine secure the nominee it wants. If you really want to know where the base is, pay attention to the rest.
Alabama
Arkansas
California
Colorado
Maine
Massachusetts
Minnesota
North Carolina
Oklahoma
Tennessee
Texas
Utah
Vermont
VirginiaWouldn't you have said Michigan and Wisconsin didn't matter at this same point in 2016? Assuming you can use the south to nominate whatever candidate makes the machine most comfortable is dangerous. The idea that blue states will vote for whoever we tell them to, and that blue states will be blue states forever, is reckless.Blue states matter. Purple states matter. Red states don't. (Except in this primary where they are given huge importance.)
Further... Clinton won the primaries in PA, OH, FL, VA, AZ, NM, NV. So she won at least half of the swing states.
12 of the 20 states that voted for Sanders in the primary went to Trump. I just don't understand how your argument works here. By quick math, 15 of the 31 Clinton states went to Trump.
Democrats win when the base is energized. Whether they live in a state they have a chance to win like NC, or one where the odds are low like SC. That's why turnout is such an important indicator and was at record levels in SC and that's why the party went to bat for Biden. He got better turnout than obama.
I know we disagreed on this before SC, but to me it seems fairly logical. In the 3 states bernie did well, turnout was nothing special, which is ample evidence the millenials are not about to set records for a new revolution (maybe that changes tonight ). In the state Biden did well, turnout was excellent.___________________________________________
"...I changed by not changing at all..."0 -
Ledbetterman10 said:mrussel1 said:Ledbetterman10 said:brianlux said:Amy and Pete both dropped out just before Super Tuesday. I have a theory about this. I think the party bosses for the DNC don't want Bernie to win the primaries and put the pressure on Pete and Amy to drop out so that Biden would capture more of their moderate votes. If that is true, it would bother me not because I am or am not for Bernie, but because it would bother me that this is more about manipulating of the system. I'm also unhappy because I voted by mail in ballot and Amy dropped out two days after I mailed in my ballot so it was a wasted vote. What a drag!
And they dropped out Sunday and Monday respectively. Is that really not fast enough to be considered a decision on the factors I outlined?
And who's our Boss Tweed?Hugh Freaking Dillon is currently out of the office, returning sometime in the fall0 -
CM189191 said:josevolution said:So will most of you vote for who ever comes out of the Democrats or just not vote or vote for the Baffoon?
I wish that were the case Jose.
Unfortunately I'm concerned there are a bunch of idiots out there who don't understand we have a two-party system.
They'll get distracted by shiny objects like Tulsi or Bernie or Stein, and piss their vote away because they don't understand the fundamentals of how our government works.
I'm tired of being insulted and attacked as an "establishment" party voter in conspiracy with corporate billionaires to permanently oppress my fellow citizens just because I disagree with his pie in the sky plans. I'm tired of him tearing down journalists and the media the same way Buffoon does just to sow doubt and distrust of people who don't agree with him. I'm tired of him deciding the rules need to change every time the rules don't work in his favor.
I absolutely will not vote for another authoritarian-inclined leader of a "movement" to turn this country upside down. Can't do it.Post edited by what dreams on0 -
rgambs said:mrussel1 said:rgambs said:mrussel1 said:rgambs said:what dreams said:Last night I listened on C-Span to Trump at a rally bragging about his greatest presidency in human history.
I woke up to Sanders at a rally bragging about his campaign being the greatest campaign in human history.
The cheering crowd sounded the same.
As Sanders bragged about how much money he's raised, I couldn't help but wonder how all these cash strapped young people can send him a check every month but can't pay their loan payment.
Last, my daughter entertained going to get her MBA but we said nope. Go get a job, work for a few years, and get with a company that offers tuition reimbursement. She just landed her first job last week with a company in DC that does just that after 2 years. So like I said, I'm mildly sympathetic, but I've watched lots of people make really bad judgments on their education decisions. I'm not inclined to bail them out.
😲🤦♂️
So they all did, because they trusted the "experts" and were all saddled with an extra 15-20k to pay off at 6.5% interest. The money was spent up in elective expenditures that didn't feel very elective and, while 15k is not a monumental loan on it's own, it really delays the payment on the principal and just increases those interest payments.
We can't have our future professionals paying 500k on 100k loans, income inflation is way too far behind to support that sort of debt.
Kudos to you for advising your kids to be smarter about it, society tells a kid, "go to college, have fun, get a degree, worry about the rest later" their whole life and a ton of really smart kids go right along without questioning.0 -
mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:The bolded states will not help the Democrats at all in November, but tonight will help the party machine secure the nominee it wants. If you really want to know where the base is, pay attention to the rest.
Alabama
Arkansas
California
Colorado
Maine
Massachusetts
Minnesota
North Carolina
Oklahoma
Tennessee
Texas
Utah
Vermont
VirginiaWouldn't you have said Michigan and Wisconsin didn't matter at this same point in 2016? Assuming you can use the south to nominate whatever candidate makes the machine most comfortable is dangerous. The idea that blue states will vote for whoever we tell them to, and that blue states will be blue states forever, is reckless.Blue states matter. Purple states matter. Red states don't. (Except in this primary where they are given huge importance.)
Further... Clinton won the primaries in PA, OH, FL, VA, AZ, NM, NV. So she won at least half of the swing states.
12 of the 20 states that voted for Sanders in the primary went to Trump. I just don't understand how your argument works here. By quick math, 15 of the 31 Clinton states went to Trump.
The numbers for the primary turnout were high, but still lower than the total amount of votes that have been cast for D presidential election candidates. Those numbers aggregated are still nothing compared to the 1 million who typically vote R. Until the numbers get to within several thousands and not hundreds of thousands, no democrat is going to win in SC unless they act like more of a Republican and oppose a weak republican candidate who doesn't follow the party platform.It's a hopeless situation...0 -
It's smart politics if you believe Bernie can't win in the fall. (Or, more accurately, that you don't want him to.) Had the Republicans done something similar four years ago they may have stopped Trump.___________________________________________
"...I changed by not changing at all..."0 -
JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:The bolded states will not help the Democrats at all in November, but tonight will help the party machine secure the nominee it wants. If you really want to know where the base is, pay attention to the rest.
Alabama
Arkansas
California
Colorado
Maine
Massachusetts
Minnesota
North Carolina
Oklahoma
Tennessee
Texas
Utah
Vermont
VirginiaWouldn't you have said Michigan and Wisconsin didn't matter at this same point in 2016? Assuming you can use the south to nominate whatever candidate makes the machine most comfortable is dangerous. The idea that blue states will vote for whoever we tell them to, and that blue states will be blue states forever, is reckless.Blue states matter. Purple states matter. Red states don't. (Except in this primary where they are given huge importance.)
Further... Clinton won the primaries in PA, OH, FL, VA, AZ, NM, NV. So she won at least half of the swing states.
12 of the 20 states that voted for Sanders in the primary went to Trump. I just don't understand how your argument works here. By quick math, 15 of the 31 Clinton states went to Trump.0 -
HughFreakingDillon said:Ledbetterman10 said:mrussel1 said:Ledbetterman10 said:brianlux said:Amy and Pete both dropped out just before Super Tuesday. I have a theory about this. I think the party bosses for the DNC don't want Bernie to win the primaries and put the pressure on Pete and Amy to drop out so that Biden would capture more of their moderate votes. If that is true, it would bother me not because I am or am not for Bernie, but because it would bother me that this is more about manipulating of the system. I'm also unhappy because I voted by mail in ballot and Amy dropped out two days after I mailed in my ballot so it was a wasted vote. What a drag!
And they dropped out Sunday and Monday respectively. Is that really not fast enough to be considered a decision on the factors I outlined?
And who's our Boss Tweed?0 -
Lerxst1992 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:The bolded states will not help the Democrats at all in November, but tonight will help the party machine secure the nominee it wants. If you really want to know where the base is, pay attention to the rest.
Alabama
Arkansas
California
Colorado
Maine
Massachusetts
Minnesota
North Carolina
Oklahoma
Tennessee
Texas
Utah
Vermont
VirginiaWouldn't you have said Michigan and Wisconsin didn't matter at this same point in 2016? Assuming you can use the south to nominate whatever candidate makes the machine most comfortable is dangerous. The idea that blue states will vote for whoever we tell them to, and that blue states will be blue states forever, is reckless.Blue states matter. Purple states matter. Red states don't. (Except in this primary where they are given huge importance.)
Further... Clinton won the primaries in PA, OH, FL, VA, AZ, NM, NV. So she won at least half of the swing states.
12 of the 20 states that voted for Sanders in the primary went to Trump. I just don't understand how your argument works here. By quick math, 15 of the 31 Clinton states went to Trump.
Democrats win when the base is energized. Whether they live in a state they have a chance to win like NC, or one where the odds are low like SC. That's why turnout is such an important indicator and was at record levels in SC and that's why the party went to bat for Biden. He got better turnout than obama.
I know we disagreed on this before SC, but to me it seems fairly logical. In the 3 states bernie did well, turnout was nothing special, which is ample evidence the millenials are not about to set records for a new revolution (maybe that changes tonight ). In the state Biden did well, turnout was excellent.It's a hopeless situation...0 -
mrussel1 said:HughFreakingDillon said:Ledbetterman10 said:mrussel1 said:Ledbetterman10 said:brianlux said:Amy and Pete both dropped out just before Super Tuesday. I have a theory about this. I think the party bosses for the DNC don't want Bernie to win the primaries and put the pressure on Pete and Amy to drop out so that Biden would capture more of their moderate votes. If that is true, it would bother me not because I am or am not for Bernie, but because it would bother me that this is more about manipulating of the system. I'm also unhappy because I voted by mail in ballot and Amy dropped out two days after I mailed in my ballot so it was a wasted vote. What a drag!
And they dropped out Sunday and Monday respectively. Is that really not fast enough to be considered a decision on the factors I outlined?
And who's our Boss Tweed?Hugh Freaking Dillon is currently out of the office, returning sometime in the fall0 -
mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:The bolded states will not help the Democrats at all in November, but tonight will help the party machine secure the nominee it wants. If you really want to know where the base is, pay attention to the rest.
Alabama
Arkansas
California
Colorado
Maine
Massachusetts
Minnesota
North Carolina
Oklahoma
Tennessee
Texas
Utah
Vermont
VirginiaWouldn't you have said Michigan and Wisconsin didn't matter at this same point in 2016? Assuming you can use the south to nominate whatever candidate makes the machine most comfortable is dangerous. The idea that blue states will vote for whoever we tell them to, and that blue states will be blue states forever, is reckless.Blue states matter. Purple states matter. Red states don't. (Except in this primary where they are given huge importance.)
Further... Clinton won the primaries in PA, OH, FL, VA, AZ, NM, NV. So she won at least half of the swing states.
12 of the 20 states that voted for Sanders in the primary went to Trump. I just don't understand how your argument works here. By quick math, 15 of the 31 Clinton states went to Trump.And I can't help notice you continue to point to other states that are not South Carolina, rather than offer any evidence of blue hope in South Carolina.44 years, man.___________________________________________
"...I changed by not changing at all..."0 -
CM189191 said:Spiritual_Chaos said:CM189191 said:Spiritual_Chaos said:CM189191 said:Spiritual_Chaos said:CM189191 said:josevolution said:So will most of you vote for who ever comes out of the Democrats or just not vote or vote for the Baffoon?
I wish that were the case Jose.
Unfortunately I'm concerned there are a bunch of idiots out there who don't understand we have a two-party system.
They'll get distracted by shiny objects like Tulsi or Bernie or Stein, and piss their vote away because they don't understand the fundamentals of how our government works.
Get yourself some more parties.
Biden will win by people not wanting Trump. But he will not get one punch in on Trump the whole race.
See what I mean @josevolution ? The complete inability to grasp basic American political concepts.
For the hundredth time, our checks and balances are within the 3 branches of government. People who didn't understand this during the last election cost us 2 SCJ & numerous Federal Court appointments, that will take a whole fucking generation to fix.
We are not a multi-party system. We are not set up that way. We never were.
Two parties is awfully close to one party.
We are not a multi-party system. We are not set up that way.
Again, this is grade school level civics class
The US is not a direct or pure democracy
It is a constitutional republic
So, what in your constitutional republic with your three branches of government stops Monica, who has 3 apples, from, in theory, starting a party, getting a lot of traction and, a strong organization and trying to run for Senator, or congressperson or President for her newly started party?
What makes it illegal to do so - if you are not part of the republican party or the democratic party?
I missed that in my grade school level civics class. So sorry about that.
And if it is somehow ilmpossible then my point stands -- Get yourself some more parties.Post edited by Spiritual_Chaos on"Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"0 -
JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:The bolded states will not help the Democrats at all in November, but tonight will help the party machine secure the nominee it wants. If you really want to know where the base is, pay attention to the rest.
Alabama
Arkansas
California
Colorado
Maine
Massachusetts
Minnesota
North Carolina
Oklahoma
Tennessee
Texas
Utah
Vermont
VirginiaWouldn't you have said Michigan and Wisconsin didn't matter at this same point in 2016? Assuming you can use the south to nominate whatever candidate makes the machine most comfortable is dangerous. The idea that blue states will vote for whoever we tell them to, and that blue states will be blue states forever, is reckless.Blue states matter. Purple states matter. Red states don't. (Except in this primary where they are given huge importance.)
Further... Clinton won the primaries in PA, OH, FL, VA, AZ, NM, NV. So she won at least half of the swing states.
12 of the 20 states that voted for Sanders in the primary went to Trump. I just don't understand how your argument works here. By quick math, 15 of the 31 Clinton states went to Trump.And I can't help notice you continue to point to other states that are not South Carolina, rather than offer any evidence of blue hope in South Carolina.44 years, man.0 -
mrussel1 said:HughFreakingDillon said:Ledbetterman10 said:mrussel1 said:Ledbetterman10 said:brianlux said:Amy and Pete both dropped out just before Super Tuesday. I have a theory about this. I think the party bosses for the DNC don't want Bernie to win the primaries and put the pressure on Pete and Amy to drop out so that Biden would capture more of their moderate votes. If that is true, it would bother me not because I am or am not for Bernie, but because it would bother me that this is more about manipulating of the system. I'm also unhappy because I voted by mail in ballot and Amy dropped out two days after I mailed in my ballot so it was a wasted vote. What a drag!
And they dropped out Sunday and Monday respectively. Is that really not fast enough to be considered a decision on the factors I outlined?
And who's our Boss Tweed?
I don't understand the current problem. Haven't people on here for weeks asking the untenable moderates to drop out of the middle lane? Now they've done it, and people are questioning it?
So sorry for folks who do mail in or early voting. It's why I prefer the voting booth. People who vote in primaries know who is left. Average schmoe who doesn't follow the race doesn't vote in a primary.0 -
mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:The bolded states will not help the Democrats at all in November, but tonight will help the party machine secure the nominee it wants. If you really want to know where the base is, pay attention to the rest.
Alabama
Arkansas
California
Colorado
Maine
Massachusetts
Minnesota
North Carolina
Oklahoma
Tennessee
Texas
Utah
Vermont
VirginiaWouldn't you have said Michigan and Wisconsin didn't matter at this same point in 2016? Assuming you can use the south to nominate whatever candidate makes the machine most comfortable is dangerous. The idea that blue states will vote for whoever we tell them to, and that blue states will be blue states forever, is reckless.Blue states matter. Purple states matter. Red states don't. (Except in this primary where they are given huge importance.)
Further... Clinton won the primaries in PA, OH, FL, VA, AZ, NM, NV. So she won at least half of the swing states.
12 of the 20 states that voted for Sanders in the primary went to Trump. I just don't understand how your argument works here. By quick math, 15 of the 31 Clinton states went to Trump.And I can't help notice you continue to point to other states that are not South Carolina, rather than offer any evidence of blue hope in South Carolina.44 years, man.
My point remains. Having SC vote third and treating it as some sort of bellwether for the Democratic base are both mistakes.___________________________________________
"...I changed by not changing at all..."0 -
JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:mrussel1 said:JimmyV said:The bolded states will not help the Democrats at all in November, but tonight will help the party machine secure the nominee it wants. If you really want to know where the base is, pay attention to the rest.
Alabama
Arkansas
California
Colorado
Maine
Massachusetts
Minnesota
North Carolina
Oklahoma
Tennessee
Texas
Utah
Vermont
VirginiaWouldn't you have said Michigan and Wisconsin didn't matter at this same point in 2016? Assuming you can use the south to nominate whatever candidate makes the machine most comfortable is dangerous. The idea that blue states will vote for whoever we tell them to, and that blue states will be blue states forever, is reckless.Blue states matter. Purple states matter. Red states don't. (Except in this primary where they are given huge importance.)
Further... Clinton won the primaries in PA, OH, FL, VA, AZ, NM, NV. So she won at least half of the swing states.
12 of the 20 states that voted for Sanders in the primary went to Trump. I just don't understand how your argument works here. By quick math, 15 of the 31 Clinton states went to Trump.And I can't help notice you continue to point to other states that are not South Carolina, rather than offer any evidence of blue hope in South Carolina.44 years, man.
My point remains. Having SC vote third and treating it as some sort of bellwether for the Democratic base are both mistakes.0 -
Running mate?
2000: Camden 1, 2003: Philly, State College, Camden 1, MSG 2, Hershey, 2004: Reading, 2005: Philly, 2006: Camden 1, 2, East Rutherford 1, 2007: Lollapalooza, 2008: Camden 1, Washington D.C., MSG 1, 2, 2009: Philly 1, 2, 3, 4, 2010: Bristol, MSG 2, 2011: PJ20 1, 2, 2012: Made In America, 2013: Brooklyn 2, Philly 2, 2014: Denver, 2015: Global Citizen Festival, 2016: Philly 2, Fenway 1, 2018: Fenway 1, 2, 2021: Sea. Hear. Now. 2022: Camden, 2024: Philly 2, 2025: Pittsburgh 1
Pearl Jam bootlegs:
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