9-11 plotters get a trial date. finally.
Comments
-
You obviously know the answer to this so Just get to your point.eddiec said:
I have to ask- If a US plane was shot down over Afghanistan, and the pilots were tortured to death, would you be okay with that?mcgruff10 said:
I could care less about moral ground. I m all for it if it saves lives. Doesn’t Canada do the same?oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
Yes i believe it can be very effective when extracting vitaloftenreading said:
And you believe that torture is an effective, ethical and legal way to do that?mcgruff10 said:
Because it is war. Completely different set of rules. Extracting information can save hundreds if not thousands of lives.oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
In war? Absolutely.brianlux said:
You really approve of using torture as a punishment? That kind of fucks with my head, to be honest.mcgruff10 said:
War is hell. Torture/interrogation has a time and place. This is definitely one of those times.brianlux said:
You actually promote torture? Really man, think about that.Meltdown99 said:That’s good hear. Can we torture the bastards before we execute them. They caused so many people unspeakable pain. Not the mention the wars.
Why?
The Geneva Convention signatories would disagree.
information. Also, name a country the us has fought that followed the Geneva convention.
So your argument is "everybody else does it?". Why is that relevant? The US is a signatory, is it not?
If you are willing to use torture just because your enemies do it, you have no basis to claim any moral high ground.
Plus, you don't know the research data on forced confessions very well.I'll ride the wave where it takes me......0 -
You know my point, which is- If the US condones torture then we cannot be outraged if torture is used against us.mcgruff10 said:
You obviously know the answer to this so Just get to your point.eddiec said:
I have to ask- If a US plane was shot down over Afghanistan, and the pilots were tortured to death, would you be okay with that?mcgruff10 said:
I could care less about moral ground. I m all for it if it saves lives. Doesn’t Canada do the same?oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
Yes i believe it can be very effective when extracting vitaloftenreading said:
And you believe that torture is an effective, ethical and legal way to do that?mcgruff10 said:
Because it is war. Completely different set of rules. Extracting information can save hundreds if not thousands of lives.oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
In war? Absolutely.brianlux said:
You really approve of using torture as a punishment? That kind of fucks with my head, to be honest.mcgruff10 said:
War is hell. Torture/interrogation has a time and place. This is definitely one of those times.brianlux said:
You actually promote torture? Really man, think about that.Meltdown99 said:That’s good hear. Can we torture the bastards before we execute them. They caused so many people unspeakable pain. Not the mention the wars.
Why?
The Geneva Convention signatories would disagree.
information. Also, name a country the us has fought that followed the Geneva convention.
So your argument is "everybody else does it?". Why is that relevant? The US is a signatory, is it not?
If you are willing to use torture just because your enemies do it, you have no basis to claim any moral high ground.
Plus, you don't know the research data on forced confessions very well.0 -
As an American you honestly feel that way? You are ok with us servicemen and women being tortured death just because the cia does it?eddiec said:
You know my point, which is- If the US condones torture then we cannot be outraged if torture is used against us.mcgruff10 said:
You obviously know the answer to this so Just get to your point.eddiec said:
I have to ask- If a US plane was shot down over Afghanistan, and the pilots were tortured to death, would you be okay with that?mcgruff10 said:
I could care less about moral ground. I m all for it if it saves lives. Doesn’t Canada do the same?oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
Yes i believe it can be very effective when extracting vitaloftenreading said:
And you believe that torture is an effective, ethical and legal way to do that?mcgruff10 said:
Because it is war. Completely different set of rules. Extracting information can save hundreds if not thousands of lives.oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
In war? Absolutely.brianlux said:
You really approve of using torture as a punishment? That kind of fucks with my head, to be honest.mcgruff10 said:
War is hell. Torture/interrogation has a time and place. This is definitely one of those times.brianlux said:
You actually promote torture? Really man, think about that.Meltdown99 said:That’s good hear. Can we torture the bastards before we execute them. They caused so many people unspeakable pain. Not the mention the wars.
Why?
The Geneva Convention signatories would disagree.
information. Also, name a country the us has fought that followed the Geneva convention.
So your argument is "everybody else does it?". Why is that relevant? The US is a signatory, is it not?
If you are willing to use torture just because your enemies do it, you have no basis to claim any moral high ground.
Plus, you don't know the research data on forced confessions very well.
I'll ride the wave where it takes me......0 -
How did you arrive that I feel that way? I think you're misconstruing what I said. Obviously I'm against the torture of US citizens, just as I'm against torture in general.mcgruff10 said:
As an American you honestly feel that way? You are ok with us servicemen and women being tortured death just because the cia does it?eddiec said:
You know my point, which is- If the US condones torture then we cannot be outraged if torture is used against us.mcgruff10 said:
You obviously know the answer to this so Just get to your point.eddiec said:
I have to ask- If a US plane was shot down over Afghanistan, and the pilots were tortured to death, would you be okay with that?mcgruff10 said:
I could care less about moral ground. I m all for it if it saves lives. Doesn’t Canada do the same?oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
Yes i believe it can be very effective when extracting vitaloftenreading said:
And you believe that torture is an effective, ethical and legal way to do that?mcgruff10 said:
Because it is war. Completely different set of rules. Extracting information can save hundreds if not thousands of lives.oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
In war? Absolutely.brianlux said:
You really approve of using torture as a punishment? That kind of fucks with my head, to be honest.mcgruff10 said:
War is hell. Torture/interrogation has a time and place. This is definitely one of those times.brianlux said:
You actually promote torture? Really man, think about that.Meltdown99 said:That’s good hear. Can we torture the bastards before we execute them. They caused so many people unspeakable pain. Not the mention the wars.
Why?
The Geneva Convention signatories would disagree.
information. Also, name a country the us has fought that followed the Geneva convention.
So your argument is "everybody else does it?". Why is that relevant? The US is a signatory, is it not?
If you are willing to use torture just because your enemies do it, you have no basis to claim any moral high ground.
Plus, you don't know the research data on forced confessions very well.0 -
So you don't care if you're doing what you castigate others for, and you don't care if it actually is effective.mcgruff10 said:
I could care less about moral ground. I m all for it if it saves lives. Doesn’t Canada do the same?oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
Yes i believe it can be very effective when extracting vitaloftenreading said:
And you believe that torture is an effective, ethical and legal way to do that?mcgruff10 said:
Because it is war. Completely different set of rules. Extracting information can save hundreds if not thousands of lives.oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
In war? Absolutely.brianlux said:
You really approve of using torture as a punishment? That kind of fucks with my head, to be honest.mcgruff10 said:
War is hell. Torture/interrogation has a time and place. This is definitely one of those times.brianlux said:
You actually promote torture? Really man, think about that.Meltdown99 said:That’s good hear. Can we torture the bastards before we execute them. They caused so many people unspeakable pain. Not the mention the wars.
Why?
The Geneva Convention signatories would disagree.
information. Also, name a country the us has fought that followed the Geneva convention.
So your argument is "everybody else does it?". Why is that relevant? The US is a signatory, is it not?
If you are willing to use torture just because your enemies do it, you have no basis to claim any moral high ground.
Plus, you don't know the research data on forced confessions very well.
Wonderful. But not actually surprising.my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf0 -
Not surprising that you are advocating for the rights of people who orchestrated an attack thatoftenreading said:
So you don't care if you're doing what you castigate others for, and you don't care if it actually is effective.mcgruff10 said:
I could care less about moral ground. I m all for it if it saves lives. Doesn’t Canada do the same?oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
Yes i believe it can be very effective when extracting vitaloftenreading said:
And you believe that torture is an effective, ethical and legal way to do that?mcgruff10 said:
Because it is war. Completely different set of rules. Extracting information can save hundreds if not thousands of lives.oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
In war? Absolutely.brianlux said:
You really approve of using torture as a punishment? That kind of fucks with my head, to be honest.mcgruff10 said:
War is hell. Torture/interrogation has a time and place. This is definitely one of those times.brianlux said:
You actually promote torture? Really man, think about that.Meltdown99 said:That’s good hear. Can we torture the bastards before we execute them. They caused so many people unspeakable pain. Not the mention the wars.
Why?
The Geneva Convention signatories would disagree.
information. Also, name a country the us has fought that followed the Geneva convention.
So your argument is "everybody else does it?". Why is that relevant? The US is a signatory, is it not?
If you are willing to use torture just because your enemies do it, you have no basis to claim any moral high ground.
Plus, you don't know the research data on forced confessions very well.
Wonderful. But not actually surprising.
killed nearly 3,000 civilians. Yeah those people deserved ehat was done to them. Maybe if Canada had some sort of event like 9/11 you would feel different.Post edited by mcgruff10 onI'll ride the wave where it takes me......0 -
So you feel the us should be better than our enemies? After surrendering or capture you get three meals, entry to the us, maybe free college education? (I am obviously being sarcastic).eddiec said:
How did you arrive that I feel that way? I think you're misconstruing what I said. Obviously I'm against the torture of US citizens, just as I'm against torture in general.mcgruff10 said:
As an American you honestly feel that way? You are ok with us servicemen and women being tortured death just because the cia does it?eddiec said:
You know my point, which is- If the US condones torture then we cannot be outraged if torture is used against us.mcgruff10 said:
You obviously know the answer to this so Just get to your point.eddiec said:
I have to ask- If a US plane was shot down over Afghanistan, and the pilots were tortured to death, would you be okay with that?mcgruff10 said:
I could care less about moral ground. I m all for it if it saves lives. Doesn’t Canada do the same?oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
Yes i believe it can be very effective when extracting vitaloftenreading said:
And you believe that torture is an effective, ethical and legal way to do that?mcgruff10 said:
Because it is war. Completely different set of rules. Extracting information can save hundreds if not thousands of lives.oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
In war? Absolutely.brianlux said:
You really approve of using torture as a punishment? That kind of fucks with my head, to be honest.mcgruff10 said:
War is hell. Torture/interrogation has a time and place. This is definitely one of those times.brianlux said:
You actually promote torture? Really man, think about that.Meltdown99 said:That’s good hear. Can we torture the bastards before we execute them. They caused so many people unspeakable pain. Not the mention the wars.
Why?
The Geneva Convention signatories would disagree.
information. Also, name a country the us has fought that followed the Geneva convention.
So your argument is "everybody else does it?". Why is that relevant? The US is a signatory, is it not?
If you are willing to use torture just because your enemies do it, you have no basis to claim any moral high ground.
Plus, you don't know the research data on forced confessions very well.
I'll ride the wave where it takes me......0 -
arent we supposed to be better than that? if what we have is so exceptional for the world, then dont we have to live it? adhere to the founding principles?to abandon that in the face of that horror, shows we arent. they win/won. if thats the case we should stop kidding ourselves and rip it up. it becomes meaningless.mcgruff10 said:
Not surprising that you are advocating for the rights of people who orchestrated an attack thatoftenreading said:
So you don't care if you're doing what you castigate others for, and you don't care if it actually is effective.mcgruff10 said:
I could care less about moral ground. I m all for it if it saves lives. Doesn’t Canada do the same?oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
Yes i believe it can be very effective when extracting vitaloftenreading said:
And you believe that torture is an effective, ethical and legal way to do that?mcgruff10 said:
Because it is war. Completely different set of rules. Extracting information can save hundreds if not thousands of lives.oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
In war? Absolutely.brianlux said:
You really approve of using torture as a punishment? That kind of fucks with my head, to be honest.mcgruff10 said:
War is hell. Torture/interrogation has a time and place. This is definitely one of those times.brianlux said:
You actually promote torture? Really man, think about that.Meltdown99 said:That’s good hear. Can we torture the bastards before we execute them. They caused so many people unspeakable pain. Not the mention the wars.
Why?
The Geneva Convention signatories would disagree.
information. Also, name a country the us has fought that followed the Geneva convention.
So your argument is "everybody else does it?". Why is that relevant? The US is a signatory, is it not?
If you are willing to use torture just because your enemies do it, you have no basis to claim any moral high ground.
Plus, you don't know the research data on forced confessions very well.
Wonderful. But not actually surprising.
killed nearly 3,000 civilians. Yeah those people deserved ehat was done to them. Maybe if Canada had some sort of event like 9/11 you would feel different.
_____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '140 -
Not in this instance. These people are the definition of evil and deserve what happened to them after being captured. They attacked our soil by flying four commercial jets into areas of civilian life, why do we have to be better than them? What would you have done with them?mickeyrat said:
arent we supposed to be better than that? if what we have is so exceptional for the world, then dont we have to live it? adhere to the founding principles?to abandon that in the face of that horror, shows we arent. they win/won. if thats the case we should stop kidding ourselves and rip it up. it becomes meaningless.mcgruff10 said:
Not surprising that you are advocating for the rights of people who orchestrated an attack thatoftenreading said:
So you don't care if you're doing what you castigate others for, and you don't care if it actually is effective.mcgruff10 said:
I could care less about moral ground. I m all for it if it saves lives. Doesn’t Canada do the same?oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
Yes i believe it can be very effective when extracting vitaloftenreading said:
And you believe that torture is an effective, ethical and legal way to do that?mcgruff10 said:
Because it is war. Completely different set of rules. Extracting information can save hundreds if not thousands of lives.oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
In war? Absolutely.brianlux said:
You really approve of using torture as a punishment? That kind of fucks with my head, to be honest.mcgruff10 said:
War is hell. Torture/interrogation has a time and place. This is definitely one of those times.brianlux said:
You actually promote torture? Really man, think about that.Meltdown99 said:That’s good hear. Can we torture the bastards before we execute them. They caused so many people unspeakable pain. Not the mention the wars.
Why?
The Geneva Convention signatories would disagree.
information. Also, name a country the us has fought that followed the Geneva convention.
So your argument is "everybody else does it?". Why is that relevant? The US is a signatory, is it not?
If you are willing to use torture just because your enemies do it, you have no basis to claim any moral high ground.
Plus, you don't know the research data on forced confessions very well.
Wonderful. But not actually surprising.
killed nearly 3,000 civilians. Yeah those people deserved ehat was done to them. Maybe if Canada had some sort of event like 9/11 you would feel different.I'll ride the wave where it takes me......0 -
the rule of law is everything or it is nothing. choose.mcgruff10 said:
Not in this instance. These people are the definition of evil and deserve what happened to them after being captured. They attacked our soil by flying four commercial jets into areas of civilian life, why do we have to be better than them? What would you have done with them?mickeyrat said:
arent we supposed to be better than that? if what we have is so exceptional for the world, then dont we have to live it? adhere to the founding principles?to abandon that in the face of that horror, shows we arent. they win/won. if thats the case we should stop kidding ourselves and rip it up. it becomes meaningless.mcgruff10 said:
Not surprising that you are advocating for the rights of people who orchestrated an attack thatoftenreading said:
So you don't care if you're doing what you castigate others for, and you don't care if it actually is effective.mcgruff10 said:
I could care less about moral ground. I m all for it if it saves lives. Doesn’t Canada do the same?oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
Yes i believe it can be very effective when extracting vitaloftenreading said:
And you believe that torture is an effective, ethical and legal way to do that?mcgruff10 said:
Because it is war. Completely different set of rules. Extracting information can save hundreds if not thousands of lives.oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
In war? Absolutely.brianlux said:
You really approve of using torture as a punishment? That kind of fucks with my head, to be honest.mcgruff10 said:
War is hell. Torture/interrogation has a time and place. This is definitely one of those times.brianlux said:
You actually promote torture? Really man, think about that.Meltdown99 said:That’s good hear. Can we torture the bastards before we execute them. They caused so many people unspeakable pain. Not the mention the wars.
Why?
The Geneva Convention signatories would disagree.
information. Also, name a country the us has fought that followed the Geneva convention.
So your argument is "everybody else does it?". Why is that relevant? The US is a signatory, is it not?
If you are willing to use torture just because your enemies do it, you have no basis to claim any moral high ground.
Plus, you don't know the research data on forced confessions very well.
Wonderful. But not actually surprising.
killed nearly 3,000 civilians. Yeah those people deserved ehat was done to them. Maybe if Canada had some sort of event like 9/11 you would feel different.
_____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '140 -
9/11 was different, you know that. Plus when this happened it was legal under W.mickeyrat said:
the rule of law is everything or it is nothing. choose.mcgruff10 said:
Not in this instance. These people are the definition of evil and deserve what happened to them after being captured. They attacked our soil by flying four commercial jets into areas of civilian life, why do we have to be better than them? What would you have done with them?mickeyrat said:
arent we supposed to be better than that? if what we have is so exceptional for the world, then dont we have to live it? adhere to the founding principles?to abandon that in the face of that horror, shows we arent. they win/won. if thats the case we should stop kidding ourselves and rip it up. it becomes meaningless.mcgruff10 said:
Not surprising that you are advocating for the rights of people who orchestrated an attack thatoftenreading said:
So you don't care if you're doing what you castigate others for, and you don't care if it actually is effective.mcgruff10 said:
I could care less about moral ground. I m all for it if it saves lives. Doesn’t Canada do the same?oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
Yes i believe it can be very effective when extracting vitaloftenreading said:
And you believe that torture is an effective, ethical and legal way to do that?mcgruff10 said:
Because it is war. Completely different set of rules. Extracting information can save hundreds if not thousands of lives.oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
In war? Absolutely.brianlux said:
You really approve of using torture as a punishment? That kind of fucks with my head, to be honest.mcgruff10 said:
War is hell. Torture/interrogation has a time and place. This is definitely one of those times.brianlux said:
You actually promote torture? Really man, think about that.Meltdown99 said:That’s good hear. Can we torture the bastards before we execute them. They caused so many people unspeakable pain. Not the mention the wars.
Why?
The Geneva Convention signatories would disagree.
information. Also, name a country the us has fought that followed the Geneva convention.
So your argument is "everybody else does it?". Why is that relevant? The US is a signatory, is it not?
If you are willing to use torture just because your enemies do it, you have no basis to claim any moral high ground.
Plus, you don't know the research data on forced confessions very well.
Wonderful. But not actually surprising.
killed nearly 3,000 civilians. Yeah those people deserved ehat was done to them. Maybe if Canada had some sort of event like 9/11 you would feel different.I'll ride the wave where it takes me......0 -
no. it applies ALWAYS or never. choose.mcgruff10 said:
9/11 was different, you know that. Plus when this happened it was legal under W.mickeyrat said:
the rule of law is everything or it is nothing. choose.mcgruff10 said:
Not in this instance. These people are the definition of evil and deserve what happened to them after being captured. They attacked our soil by flying four commercial jets into areas of civilian life, why do we have to be better than them? What would you have done with them?mickeyrat said:
arent we supposed to be better than that? if what we have is so exceptional for the world, then dont we have to live it? adhere to the founding principles?to abandon that in the face of that horror, shows we arent. they win/won. if thats the case we should stop kidding ourselves and rip it up. it becomes meaningless.mcgruff10 said:
Not surprising that you are advocating for the rights of people who orchestrated an attack thatoftenreading said:
So you don't care if you're doing what you castigate others for, and you don't care if it actually is effective.mcgruff10 said:
I could care less about moral ground. I m all for it if it saves lives. Doesn’t Canada do the same?oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
Yes i believe it can be very effective when extracting vitaloftenreading said:
And you believe that torture is an effective, ethical and legal way to do that?mcgruff10 said:
Because it is war. Completely different set of rules. Extracting information can save hundreds if not thousands of lives.oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
In war? Absolutely.brianlux said:
You really approve of using torture as a punishment? That kind of fucks with my head, to be honest.mcgruff10 said:
War is hell. Torture/interrogation has a time and place. This is definitely one of those times.brianlux said:
You actually promote torture? Really man, think about that.Meltdown99 said:That’s good hear. Can we torture the bastards before we execute them. They caused so many people unspeakable pain. Not the mention the wars.
Why?
The Geneva Convention signatories would disagree.
information. Also, name a country the us has fought that followed the Geneva convention.
So your argument is "everybody else does it?". Why is that relevant? The US is a signatory, is it not?
If you are willing to use torture just because your enemies do it, you have no basis to claim any moral high ground.
Plus, you don't know the research data on forced confessions very well.
Wonderful. But not actually surprising.
killed nearly 3,000 civilians. Yeah those people deserved ehat was done to them. Maybe if Canada had some sort of event like 9/11 you would feel different.
_____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '140 -
If it saves American or allied lives than I am all for it.mickeyrat said:
no. it applies ALWAYS or never. choose.mcgruff10 said:
9/11 was different, you know that. Plus when this happened it was legal under W.mickeyrat said:
the rule of law is everything or it is nothing. choose.mcgruff10 said:
Not in this instance. These people are the definition of evil and deserve what happened to them after being captured. They attacked our soil by flying four commercial jets into areas of civilian life, why do we have to be better than them? What would you have done with them?mickeyrat said:
arent we supposed to be better than that? if what we have is so exceptional for the world, then dont we have to live it? adhere to the founding principles?to abandon that in the face of that horror, shows we arent. they win/won. if thats the case we should stop kidding ourselves and rip it up. it becomes meaningless.mcgruff10 said:
Not surprising that you are advocating for the rights of people who orchestrated an attack thatoftenreading said:
So you don't care if you're doing what you castigate others for, and you don't care if it actually is effective.mcgruff10 said:
I could care less about moral ground. I m all for it if it saves lives. Doesn’t Canada do the same?oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
Yes i believe it can be very effective when extracting vitaloftenreading said:
And you believe that torture is an effective, ethical and legal way to do that?mcgruff10 said:
Because it is war. Completely different set of rules. Extracting information can save hundreds if not thousands of lives.oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
In war? Absolutely.brianlux said:
You really approve of using torture as a punishment? That kind of fucks with my head, to be honest.mcgruff10 said:
War is hell. Torture/interrogation has a time and place. This is definitely one of those times.brianlux said:
You actually promote torture? Really man, think about that.Meltdown99 said:That’s good hear. Can we torture the bastards before we execute them. They caused so many people unspeakable pain. Not the mention the wars.
Why?
The Geneva Convention signatories would disagree.
information. Also, name a country the us has fought that followed the Geneva convention.
So your argument is "everybody else does it?". Why is that relevant? The US is a signatory, is it not?
If you are willing to use torture just because your enemies do it, you have no basis to claim any moral high ground.
Plus, you don't know the research data on forced confessions very well.
Wonderful. But not actually surprising.
killed nearly 3,000 civilians. Yeah those people deserved ehat was done to them. Maybe if Canada had some sort of event like 9/11 you would feel different.
I'll ride the wave where it takes me......0 -
mcgruff10 said:
If it saves American or allied lives than I am all for it.mickeyrat said:
no. it applies ALWAYS or never. choose.mcgruff10 said:
9/11 was different, you know that. Plus when this happened it was legal under W.mickeyrat said:
the rule of law is everything or it is nothing. choose.mcgruff10 said:
Not in this instance. These people are the definition of evil and deserve what happened to them after being captured. They attacked our soil by flying four commercial jets into areas of civilian life, why do we have to be better than them? What would you have done with them?mickeyrat said:
arent we supposed to be better than that? if what we have is so exceptional for the world, then dont we have to live it? adhere to the founding principles?to abandon that in the face of that horror, shows we arent. they win/won. if thats the case we should stop kidding ourselves and rip it up. it becomes meaningless.mcgruff10 said:
Not surprising that you are advocating for the rights of people who orchestrated an attack thatoftenreading said:
So you don't care if you're doing what you castigate others for, and you don't care if it actually is effective.mcgruff10 said:
I could care less about moral ground. I m all for it if it saves lives. Doesn’t Canada do the same?oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
Yes i believe it can be very effective when extracting vitaloftenreading said:
And you believe that torture is an effective, ethical and legal way to do that?mcgruff10 said:
Because it is war. Completely different set of rules. Extracting information can save hundreds if not thousands of lives.oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
In war? Absolutely.brianlux said:
You really approve of using torture as a punishment? That kind of fucks with my head, to be honest.mcgruff10 said:
War is hell. Torture/interrogation has a time and place. This is definitely one of those times.brianlux said:
You actually promote torture? Really man, think about that.Meltdown99 said:That’s good hear. Can we torture the bastards before we execute them. They caused so many people unspeakable pain. Not the mention the wars.
Why?
The Geneva Convention signatories would disagree.
information. Also, name a country the us has fought that followed the Geneva convention.
So your argument is "everybody else does it?". Why is that relevant? The US is a signatory, is it not?
If you are willing to use torture just because your enemies do it, you have no basis to claim any moral high ground.
Plus, you don't know the research data on forced confessions very well.
Wonderful. But not actually surprising.
killed nearly 3,000 civilians. Yeah those people deserved ehat was done to them. Maybe if Canada had some sort of event like 9/11 you would feel different.then tear the constitution up and use it for toilet paper.every single service member swears an oath to preserve and defend that document and the ldeals it contains.There are no exceptions._____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '140 -
Having rules during a war is quite ridiculous...war causes mass murder.Give Peas A Chance…0
-
Where in the constitution does it say that? Pretty sure patriot act gives us permission tomickeyrat said:mcgruff10 said:
If it saves American or allied lives than I am all for it.mickeyrat said:
no. it applies ALWAYS or never. choose.mcgruff10 said:
9/11 was different, you know that. Plus when this happened it was legal under W.mickeyrat said:
the rule of law is everything or it is nothing. choose.mcgruff10 said:
Not in this instance. These people are the definition of evil and deserve what happened to them after being captured. They attacked our soil by flying four commercial jets into areas of civilian life, why do we have to be better than them? What would you have done with them?mickeyrat said:
arent we supposed to be better than that? if what we have is so exceptional for the world, then dont we have to live it? adhere to the founding principles?to abandon that in the face of that horror, shows we arent. they win/won. if thats the case we should stop kidding ourselves and rip it up. it becomes meaningless.mcgruff10 said:
Not surprising that you are advocating for the rights of people who orchestrated an attack thatoftenreading said:
So you don't care if you're doing what you castigate others for, and you don't care if it actually is effective.mcgruff10 said:
I could care less about moral ground. I m all for it if it saves lives. Doesn’t Canada do the same?oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
Yes i believe it can be very effective when extracting vitaloftenreading said:
And you believe that torture is an effective, ethical and legal way to do that?mcgruff10 said:
Because it is war. Completely different set of rules. Extracting information can save hundreds if not thousands of lives.oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
In war? Absolutely.brianlux said:
You really approve of using torture as a punishment? That kind of fucks with my head, to be honest.mcgruff10 said:
War is hell. Torture/interrogation has a time and place. This is definitely one of those times.brianlux said:
You actually promote torture? Really man, think about that.Meltdown99 said:That’s good hear. Can we torture the bastards before we execute them. They caused so many people unspeakable pain. Not the mention the wars.
Why?
The Geneva Convention signatories would disagree.
information. Also, name a country the us has fought that followed the Geneva convention.
So your argument is "everybody else does it?". Why is that relevant? The US is a signatory, is it not?
If you are willing to use torture just because your enemies do it, you have no basis to claim any moral high ground.
Plus, you don't know the research data on forced confessions very well.
Wonderful. But not actually surprising.
killed nearly 3,000 civilians. Yeah those people deserved ehat was done to them. Maybe if Canada had some sort of event like 9/11 you would feel different.then tear the constitution up and use it for toilet paper.every single service member swears an oath to preserve and defend that document and the ldeals it contains.There are no exceptions.
do so. And I agree with meltdown, there should be no rules with war. We lose when politicians get involved.
Post edited by mcgruff10 onI'll ride the wave where it takes me......0 -
mcgruff10 said:
Where in the constitution does it say that? Pretty sure patriot act gives us permission tomickeyrat said:mcgruff10 said:
If it saves American or allied lives than I am all for it.mickeyrat said:
no. it applies ALWAYS or never. choose.mcgruff10 said:
9/11 was different, you know that. Plus when this happened it was legal under W.mickeyrat said:
the rule of law is everything or it is nothing. choose.mcgruff10 said:
Not in this instance. These people are the definition of evil and deserve what happened to them after being captured. They attacked our soil by flying four commercial jets into areas of civilian life, why do we have to be better than them? What would you have done with them?mickeyrat said:
arent we supposed to be better than that? if what we have is so exceptional for the world, then dont we have to live it? adhere to the founding principles?to abandon that in the face of that horror, shows we arent. they win/won. if thats the case we should stop kidding ourselves and rip it up. it becomes meaningless.mcgruff10 said:
Not surprising that you are advocating for the rights of people who orchestrated an attack thatoftenreading said:
So you don't care if you're doing what you castigate others for, and you don't care if it actually is effective.mcgruff10 said:
I could care less about moral ground. I m all for it if it saves lives. Doesn’t Canada do the same?oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
Yes i believe it can be very effective when extracting vitaloftenreading said:
And you believe that torture is an effective, ethical and legal way to do that?mcgruff10 said:
Because it is war. Completely different set of rules. Extracting information can save hundreds if not thousands of lives.oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
In war? Absolutely.brianlux said:
You really approve of using torture as a punishment? That kind of fucks with my head, to be honest.mcgruff10 said:
War is hell. Torture/interrogation has a time and place. This is definitely one of those times.brianlux said:
You actually promote torture? Really man, think about that.Meltdown99 said:That’s good hear. Can we torture the bastards before we execute them. They caused so many people unspeakable pain. Not the mention the wars.
Why?
The Geneva Convention signatories would disagree.
information. Also, name a country the us has fought that followed the Geneva convention.
So your argument is "everybody else does it?". Why is that relevant? The US is a signatory, is it not?
If you are willing to use torture just because your enemies do it, you have no basis to claim any moral high ground.
Plus, you don't know the research data on forced confessions very well.
Wonderful. But not actually surprising.
killed nearly 3,000 civilians. Yeah those people deserved ehat was done to them. Maybe if Canada had some sort of event like 9/11 you would feel different.then tear the constitution up and use it for toilet paper.every single service member swears an oath to preserve and defend that document and the ldeals it contains.There are no exceptions.
do so. And I agree with meltdown, there should be no rules with war. We lose when politicians get involved.pssst we werent at war with nonstate actors. which al Qaeda is.so let me ask you this. Where in the constitution does it say the rule of law applies except for when ......?_____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '140 -
The patriot act? And again, it was legal under W which is when it happened.mickeyrat said:mcgruff10 said:
Where in the constitution does it say that? Pretty sure patriot act gives us permission tomickeyrat said:mcgruff10 said:
If it saves American or allied lives than I am all for it.mickeyrat said:
no. it applies ALWAYS or never. choose.mcgruff10 said:
9/11 was different, you know that. Plus when this happened it was legal under W.mickeyrat said:
the rule of law is everything or it is nothing. choose.mcgruff10 said:
Not in this instance. These people are the definition of evil and deserve what happened to them after being captured. They attacked our soil by flying four commercial jets into areas of civilian life, why do we have to be better than them? What would you have done with them?mickeyrat said:
arent we supposed to be better than that? if what we have is so exceptional for the world, then dont we have to live it? adhere to the founding principles?to abandon that in the face of that horror, shows we arent. they win/won. if thats the case we should stop kidding ourselves and rip it up. it becomes meaningless.mcgruff10 said:
Not surprising that you are advocating for the rights of people who orchestrated an attack thatoftenreading said:
So you don't care if you're doing what you castigate others for, and you don't care if it actually is effective.mcgruff10 said:
I could care less about moral ground. I m all for it if it saves lives. Doesn’t Canada do the same?oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
Yes i believe it can be very effective when extracting vitaloftenreading said:
And you believe that torture is an effective, ethical and legal way to do that?mcgruff10 said:
Because it is war. Completely different set of rules. Extracting information can save hundreds if not thousands of lives.oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
In war? Absolutely.brianlux said:
You really approve of using torture as a punishment? That kind of fucks with my head, to be honest.mcgruff10 said:
War is hell. Torture/interrogation has a time and place. This is definitely one of those times.brianlux said:
You actually promote torture? Really man, think about that.Meltdown99 said:That’s good hear. Can we torture the bastards before we execute them. They caused so many people unspeakable pain. Not the mention the wars.
Why?
The Geneva Convention signatories would disagree.
information. Also, name a country the us has fought that followed the Geneva convention.
So your argument is "everybody else does it?". Why is that relevant? The US is a signatory, is it not?
If you are willing to use torture just because your enemies do it, you have no basis to claim any moral high ground.
Plus, you don't know the research data on forced confessions very well.
Wonderful. But not actually surprising.
killed nearly 3,000 civilians. Yeah those people deserved ehat was done to them. Maybe if Canada had some sort of event like 9/11 you would feel different.then tear the constitution up and use it for toilet paper.every single service member swears an oath to preserve and defend that document and the ldeals it contains.There are no exceptions.
do so. And I agree with meltdown, there should be no rules with war. We lose when politicians get involved.pssst we werent at war with nonstate actors. which al Qaeda is.so let me ask you this. Where in the constitution does it say the rule of law applies except for when ......?
I'll ride the wave where it takes me......0 -
mcgruff10 said:
The patriot act? And again, it was legal under W which is when it happened.mickeyrat said:mcgruff10 said:
Where in the constitution does it say that? Pretty sure patriot act gives us permission tomickeyrat said:mcgruff10 said:
If it saves American or allied lives than I am all for it.mickeyrat said:
no. it applies ALWAYS or never. choose.mcgruff10 said:
9/11 was different, you know that. Plus when this happened it was legal under W.mickeyrat said:
the rule of law is everything or it is nothing. choose.mcgruff10 said:
Not in this instance. These people are the definition of evil and deserve what happened to them after being captured. They attacked our soil by flying four commercial jets into areas of civilian life, why do we have to be better than them? What would you have done with them?mickeyrat said:
arent we supposed to be better than that? if what we have is so exceptional for the world, then dont we have to live it? adhere to the founding principles?to abandon that in the face of that horror, shows we arent. they win/won. if thats the case we should stop kidding ourselves and rip it up. it becomes meaningless.mcgruff10 said:
Not surprising that you are advocating for the rights of people who orchestrated an attack thatoftenreading said:
So you don't care if you're doing what you castigate others for, and you don't care if it actually is effective.mcgruff10 said:
I could care less about moral ground. I m all for it if it saves lives. Doesn’t Canada do the same?oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
Yes i believe it can be very effective when extracting vitaloftenreading said:
And you believe that torture is an effective, ethical and legal way to do that?mcgruff10 said:
Because it is war. Completely different set of rules. Extracting information can save hundreds if not thousands of lives.oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
In war? Absolutely.brianlux said:
You really approve of using torture as a punishment? That kind of fucks with my head, to be honest.mcgruff10 said:
War is hell. Torture/interrogation has a time and place. This is definitely one of those times.brianlux said:
You actually promote torture? Really man, think about that.Meltdown99 said:That’s good hear. Can we torture the bastards before we execute them. They caused so many people unspeakable pain. Not the mention the wars.
Why?
The Geneva Convention signatories would disagree.
information. Also, name a country the us has fought that followed the Geneva convention.
So your argument is "everybody else does it?". Why is that relevant? The US is a signatory, is it not?
If you are willing to use torture just because your enemies do it, you have no basis to claim any moral high ground.
Plus, you don't know the research data on forced confessions very well.
Wonderful. But not actually surprising.
killed nearly 3,000 civilians. Yeah those people deserved ehat was done to them. Maybe if Canada had some sort of event like 9/11 you would feel different.then tear the constitution up and use it for toilet paper.every single service member swears an oath to preserve and defend that document and the ldeals it contains.There are no exceptions.
do so. And I agree with meltdown, there should be no rules with war. We lose when politicians get involved.pssst we werent at war with nonstate actors. which al Qaeda is.so let me ask you this. Where in the constitution does it say the rule of law applies except for when ......?then deemed illegal, so it kinda calls into question its initial legality OR SCOTUS wouldnt have knocked that down.psst slavery was legal at one time too...._____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '140 -
Correct, the 13th amendment took care of that. However I still stand by my opinion thatmickeyrat said:mcgruff10 said:
The patriot act? And again, it was legal under W which is when it happened.mickeyrat said:mcgruff10 said:
Where in the constitution does it say that? Pretty sure patriot act gives us permission tomickeyrat said:mcgruff10 said:
If it saves American or allied lives than I am all for it.mickeyrat said:
no. it applies ALWAYS or never. choose.mcgruff10 said:
9/11 was different, you know that. Plus when this happened it was legal under W.mickeyrat said:
the rule of law is everything or it is nothing. choose.mcgruff10 said:
Not in this instance. These people are the definition of evil and deserve what happened to them after being captured. They attacked our soil by flying four commercial jets into areas of civilian life, why do we have to be better than them? What would you have done with them?mickeyrat said:
arent we supposed to be better than that? if what we have is so exceptional for the world, then dont we have to live it? adhere to the founding principles?to abandon that in the face of that horror, shows we arent. they win/won. if thats the case we should stop kidding ourselves and rip it up. it becomes meaningless.mcgruff10 said:
Not surprising that you are advocating for the rights of people who orchestrated an attack thatoftenreading said:
So you don't care if you're doing what you castigate others for, and you don't care if it actually is effective.mcgruff10 said:
I could care less about moral ground. I m all for it if it saves lives. Doesn’t Canada do the same?oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
Yes i believe it can be very effective when extracting vitaloftenreading said:
And you believe that torture is an effective, ethical and legal way to do that?mcgruff10 said:
Because it is war. Completely different set of rules. Extracting information can save hundreds if not thousands of lives.oftenreading said:mcgruff10 said:
In war? Absolutely.brianlux said:
You really approve of using torture as a punishment? That kind of fucks with my head, to be honest.mcgruff10 said:
War is hell. Torture/interrogation has a time and place. This is definitely one of those times.brianlux said:
You actually promote torture? Really man, think about that.Meltdown99 said:That’s good hear. Can we torture the bastards before we execute them. They caused so many people unspeakable pain. Not the mention the wars.
Why?
The Geneva Convention signatories would disagree.
information. Also, name a country the us has fought that followed the Geneva convention.
So your argument is "everybody else does it?". Why is that relevant? The US is a signatory, is it not?
If you are willing to use torture just because your enemies do it, you have no basis to claim any moral high ground.
Plus, you don't know the research data on forced confessions very well.
Wonderful. But not actually surprising.
killed nearly 3,000 civilians. Yeah those people deserved ehat was done to them. Maybe if Canada had some sort of event like 9/11 you would feel different.then tear the constitution up and use it for toilet paper.every single service member swears an oath to preserve and defend that document and the ldeals it contains.There are no exceptions.
do so. And I agree with meltdown, there should be no rules with war. We lose when politicians get involved.pssst we werent at war with nonstate actors. which al Qaeda is.so let me ask you this. Where in the constitution does it say the rule of law applies except for when ......?then deemed illegal, so it kinda calls into question its initial legality OR SCOTUS wouldnt have knocked that down.psst slavery was legal at one time too....
torture should be used in interrogations when trying to extract vital information in order to save American or allied lives.
I'll ride the wave where it takes me......0
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