Is This Life?

Halifax2TheMax
Halifax2TheMax Posts: 43,066
in A Moving Train

19 or 20 something years in a vegetative state, since the age of 2, I believe. Why? Who is paying for this? Most importantly, is it "life?"

https://www.cnn.com/2019/01/09/us/arizona-woman-vegetative-state-gives-birth/index.html

And yes, the scumbag rapist should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.

09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR; 05/03/2025, New Orleans, LA;

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Comments

  • PJ_Soul
    PJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,886
    Halifax2TheMax said:

    19 or 20 something years in a vegetative state, since the age of 2, I believe. Why? Who is paying for this? Most importantly, is it "life?"

    https://www.cnn.com/2019/01/09/us/arizona-woman-vegetative-state-gives-birth/index.html

    And yes, the scumbag rapist should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.

    Well nobody I know wants to live like that, that is for sure. My and my entire family have all been VERY clear about that with each other. Do NOT keep us alive if that is what we'll be like... In fact, don't keep us alive if we're even halfway to that. We all basically feel that if we can't actually take care of ourselves, we're out. Thanks but no thanks. We've all got the Hemlock Society book on the bookshelf, ready for reference. We have good chats about the best ways to best take ourselves or each other out if we don't qualify for doctor assisted suicide. 

    Is this life? Well, technically, yeah. But you knew that already. I don't know the specific circumstances here... Would she die if she were unplugged somewhere? Or no? If not, then it's a complicated issue in terms of the law. Though I don't at all find it complicated when it comes to morals. I think it's absolutely sick to keep someone "alive" like this. Cruel and unusual.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • jeffbr
    jeffbr Seattle Posts: 7,177
    Halifax2TheMax said:

    19 or 20 something years in a vegetative state, since the age of 2, I believe. Why? Who is paying for this? Most importantly, is it "life?"

    https://www.cnn.com/2019/01/09/us/arizona-woman-vegetative-state-gives-birth/index.html

    And yes, the scumbag rapist should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.

    Had the same discussion with my wife. As a 2 yr old she'd have been a lot better off dying. I know I'd rather be dead than veg. Perhaps they're hoping for some technological / medical breakthroughs or something. Perhaps they're blinded by a religion that preaches "sanctity of life" above all else. Perhaps she's a ward of the state and nobody is looking out for her interests. Perhaps her tribe is calling the shots. Either way, it is a shitty way to "live" and I know I wouldn't want that kind of "life" for myself or for anyone I love.
    "I'll use the magic word - let's just shut the fuck up, please." EV, 04/13/08
  • PJ_Soul
    PJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,886
    jeffbr said:
    Halifax2TheMax said:

    19 or 20 something years in a vegetative state, since the age of 2, I believe. Why? Who is paying for this? Most importantly, is it "life?"

    https://www.cnn.com/2019/01/09/us/arizona-woman-vegetative-state-gives-birth/index.html

    And yes, the scumbag rapist should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.

    Had the same discussion with my wife. As a 2 yr old she'd have been a lot better off dying. I know I'd rather be dead than veg. Perhaps they're hoping for some technological / medical breakthroughs or something. Perhaps they're blinded by a religion that preaches "sanctity of life" above all else. Perhaps she's a ward of the state and nobody is looking out for her interests. Perhaps her tribe is calling the shots. Either way, it is a shitty way to "live" and I know I wouldn't want that kind of "life" for myself or for anyone I love.
    The horrific thing is that she was apparently "Heard moaning and grunting" when she went into labour. That's how they realized what was happening. That means we know that, while she can't do anything else, she still feels pain. That is just heinous. I consider keeping someone like this alive a form of torture. I don't even think it should be legal.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • brianlux
    brianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,760
    jeffbr said:
    Halifax2TheMax said:

    19 or 20 something years in a vegetative state, since the age of 2, I believe. Why? Who is paying for this? Most importantly, is it "life?"

    https://www.cnn.com/2019/01/09/us/arizona-woman-vegetative-state-gives-birth/index.html

    And yes, the scumbag rapist should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.

    Had the same discussion with my wife. As a 2 yr old she'd have been a lot better off dying. I know I'd rather be dead than veg. Perhaps they're hoping for some technological / medical breakthroughs or something. Perhaps they're blinded by a religion that preaches "sanctity of life" above all else. Perhaps she's a ward of the state and nobody is looking out for her interests. Perhaps her tribe is calling the shots. Either way, it is a shitty way to "live" and I know I wouldn't want that kind of "life" for myself or for anyone I love.
    I agree, better dead than veg.
    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni

  • Bentleyspop
    Bentleyspop Craft Beer Brewery, Colorado Posts: 11,634
    PJ_Soul said:
    jeffbr said:
    Halifax2TheMax said:

    19 or 20 something years in a vegetative state, since the age of 2, I believe. Why? Who is paying for this? Most importantly, is it "life?"

    https://www.cnn.com/2019/01/09/us/arizona-woman-vegetative-state-gives-birth/index.html

    And yes, the scumbag rapist should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.

    Had the same discussion with my wife. As a 2 yr old she'd have been a lot better off dying. I know I'd rather be dead than veg. Perhaps they're hoping for some technological / medical breakthroughs or something. Perhaps they're blinded by a religion that preaches "sanctity of life" above all else. Perhaps she's a ward of the state and nobody is looking out for her interests. Perhaps her tribe is calling the shots. Either way, it is a shitty way to "live" and I know I wouldn't want that kind of "life" for myself or for anyone I love.
    The horrific thing is that she was apparently "Heard moaning and grunting" when she went into labour. That's how they realized what was happening. That means we know that, while she can't do anything else, she still feels pain. That is just heinous. I consider keeping someone like this alive a form of torture. I don't even think it should be legal.
    There are experts who say the act of keeping alive someone in a vegetative state by loved ones is a purely selfish act.
  • PJ_Soul
    PJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,886
    edited January 2019
    Bentleyspop said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    jeffbr said:
    Halifax2TheMax said:

    19 or 20 something years in a vegetative state, since the age of 2, I believe. Why? Who is paying for this? Most importantly, is it "life?"

    https://www.cnn.com/2019/01/09/us/arizona-woman-vegetative-state-gives-birth/index.html

    And yes, the scumbag rapist should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.

    Had the same discussion with my wife. As a 2 yr old she'd have been a lot better off dying. I know I'd rather be dead than veg. Perhaps they're hoping for some technological / medical breakthroughs or something. Perhaps they're blinded by a religion that preaches "sanctity of life" above all else. Perhaps she's a ward of the state and nobody is looking out for her interests. Perhaps her tribe is calling the shots. Either way, it is a shitty way to "live" and I know I wouldn't want that kind of "life" for myself or for anyone I love.
    The horrific thing is that she was apparently "Heard moaning and grunting" when she went into labour. That's how they realized what was happening. That means we know that, while she can't do anything else, she still feels pain. That is just heinous. I consider keeping someone like this alive a form of torture. I don't even think it should be legal.
    There are experts who say the act of keeping alive someone in a vegetative state by loved ones is a purely selfish act.
    They're 100% right. I don't get how anyone could see it any other way.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • Thirty Bills Unpaid
    Thirty Bills Unpaid Posts: 16,881
    While I agree with the above comments, I can understand parents keeping their child alive on a hope (a medical breakthrough... a fluke of science... etc.).
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • PJ_Soul
    PJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,886
    edited January 2019
    Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
    While I agree with the above comments, I can understand parents keeping their child alive on a hope (a medical breakthrough... a fluke of science... etc.).
    I'm not sure I can, if it means that child suffering for years and years and years just on a glimmer of hope. It's inhumane and definitely very selfish.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • Halifax2TheMax
    Halifax2TheMax Posts: 43,066
    Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
    While I agree with the above comments, I can understand parents keeping their child alive on a hope (a medical breakthrough... a fluke of science... etc.).
    27 years? Maybe we need a legal definition of “death?” When does it begin, what constitutes it and when does it occur? 
    09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR; 05/03/2025, New Orleans, LA;

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  • Thirty Bills Unpaid
    Thirty Bills Unpaid Posts: 16,881
    I understand them clinging to hope. Yes.
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • PJ_Soul
    PJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,886
    Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
    I understand them clinging to hope. Yes.
    Even if it means your child lives for years in pain, with literally no life though? I actually don't get how any parent could live with that choice.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • PJ_Soul
    PJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,886
    Halifax2TheMax said:
    Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
    While I agree with the above comments, I can understand parents keeping their child alive on a hope (a medical breakthrough... a fluke of science... etc.).
    27 years? Maybe we need a legal definition of “death?” When does it begin, what constitutes it and when does it occur? 
    There is definitely already a legal definition of death.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • Halifax2TheMax
    Halifax2TheMax Posts: 43,066
    PJ_Soul said:
    Halifax2TheMax said:
    Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
    While I agree with the above comments, I can understand parents keeping their child alive on a hope (a medical breakthrough... a fluke of science... etc.).
    27 years? Maybe we need a legal definition of “death?” When does it begin, what constitutes it and when does it occur? 
    There is definitely already a legal definition of death.
    Maybe it should be updated?
    09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR; 05/03/2025, New Orleans, LA;

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  • PJ_Soul
    PJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,886
    edited January 2019
    Halifax2TheMax said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    Halifax2TheMax said:
    Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
    While I agree with the above comments, I can understand parents keeping their child alive on a hope (a medical breakthrough... a fluke of science... etc.).
    27 years? Maybe we need a legal definition of “death?” When does it begin, what constitutes it and when does it occur? 
    There is definitely already a legal definition of death.
    Maybe it should be updated?
    I couldn't agree more. But that, of course, would be insanely controversial. Most lawmakers wouldn't want to touch that with a 10-foot poll.
    Post edited by PJ_Soul on
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • Halifax2TheMax
    Halifax2TheMax Posts: 43,066
    PJ_Soul said:
    Halifax2TheMax said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    Halifax2TheMax said:
    Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
    While I agree with the above comments, I can understand parents keeping their child alive on a hope (a medical breakthrough... a fluke of science... etc.).
    27 years? Maybe we need a legal definition of “death?” When does it begin, what constitutes it and when does it occur? 
    There is definitely already a legal definition of death.
    Maybe it should be updated?
    I couldn't agree more. But that, of course, would be insanely controversial. Most lawmakers wouldn't want to touch that with a 10-foot poll.
    How many questions on that 10 foot poll?
    09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR; 05/03/2025, New Orleans, LA;

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  • PJ_Soul
    PJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,886
    Halifax2TheMax said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    Halifax2TheMax said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    Halifax2TheMax said:
    Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
    While I agree with the above comments, I can understand parents keeping their child alive on a hope (a medical breakthrough... a fluke of science... etc.).
    27 years? Maybe we need a legal definition of “death?” When does it begin, what constitutes it and when does it occur? 
    There is definitely already a legal definition of death.
    Maybe it should be updated?
    I couldn't agree more. But that, of course, would be insanely controversial. Most lawmakers wouldn't want to touch that with a 10-foot poll.
    How many questions on that 10 foot poll?
    I dunno - how many questions were asked with that Terri Schiavo case? Probably a lot.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • Halifax2TheMax
    Halifax2TheMax Posts: 43,066
    PJ_Soul said:
    Halifax2TheMax said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    Halifax2TheMax said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    Halifax2TheMax said:
    Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
    While I agree with the above comments, I can understand parents keeping their child alive on a hope (a medical breakthrough... a fluke of science... etc.).
    27 years? Maybe we need a legal definition of “death?” When does it begin, what constitutes it and when does it occur? 
    There is definitely already a legal definition of death.
    Maybe it should be updated?
    I couldn't agree more. But that, of course, would be insanely controversial. Most lawmakers wouldn't want to touch that with a 10-foot poll.
    How many questions on that 10 foot poll?
    I dunno - how many questions were asked with that Terri Schiavo case? Probably a lot.
    Good question but the Supreme Court ruled in the husband’s favor and she was allowed to die. Their decision might be worth a read. 
     
    09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR; 05/03/2025, New Orleans, LA;

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  • PJ_Soul
    PJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,886
    edited January 2019
    Halifax2TheMax said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    Halifax2TheMax said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    Halifax2TheMax said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    Halifax2TheMax said:
    Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
    While I agree with the above comments, I can understand parents keeping their child alive on a hope (a medical breakthrough... a fluke of science... etc.).
    27 years? Maybe we need a legal definition of “death?” When does it begin, what constitutes it and when does it occur? 
    There is definitely already a legal definition of death.
    Maybe it should be updated?
    I couldn't agree more. But that, of course, would be insanely controversial. Most lawmakers wouldn't want to touch that with a 10-foot poll.
    How many questions on that 10 foot poll?
    I dunno - how many questions were asked with that Terri Schiavo case? Probably a lot.
    Good question but the Supreme Court ruled in the husband’s favor and she was allowed to die. Their decision might be worth a read. 
     
    Yes, but that was still her husband's wishes. You're talking about changing the law so that NO family member actually has a choice, to avoid suffering on the part of the patient. I think a law like that would be great and is the only logical option, but you see why it would potentially be political death for any law maker.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • Thirty Bills Unpaid
    Thirty Bills Unpaid Posts: 16,881
    PJ_Soul said:
    Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
    I understand them clinging to hope. Yes.
    Even if it means your child lives for years in pain, with literally no life though? I actually don't get how any parent could live with that choice.

    I wouldn't be one of those parents. I'm just saying I understand where some parents might cling to hope.

    I'm not arguing for keeping vegetables alive.
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • PJ_Soul
    PJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,886
    Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
    I understand them clinging to hope. Yes.
    Even if it means your child lives for years in pain, with literally no life though? I actually don't get how any parent could live with that choice.

    I wouldn't be one of those parents. I'm just saying I understand where some parents might cling to hope.

    I'm not arguing for keeping vegetables alive.
    Oh yeah, I didn't think you were. I'm just trying to understand how it's understandable, lol.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata

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