My story dealing with several horrible entitled “railbirds” in GA at Wrigley 2

Bentleyspop said:

Which of you Americans are going to fly all the way to Australia? To Sydney, Melbourne,  Brisbane, etc. Just to sit on sidewalks day after day after day, see some concerts,  and then fly back home?

Gtilley8 said:

Bentleyspop said:

Which of you Americans are going to fly all the way to Australia? To Sydney, Melbourne,  Brisbane, etc. Just to sit on sidewalks day after day after day, see some concerts,  and then fly back home?

I was waiting for this.  Thank you.  Here's the short answer..... It doesn't fucking matter.  I don't give a shit if you flew 21 hours, or drove 3 minutes.  None of that gives you an entitlement to shit.  10 Club set out specific times you could and couldn't lineup.  Don't like the rules, don't play the game.  

ascahn said:

I’ll take this opportunity to give my side of a story that occurred in the the GA line for the Monday show with information going back to the Saturday show. 

As I have never been on the rail before, our party of 4 decided to try and make that happen. Prior to the first Wrigley show, we were aware of the 8:00 am lineup rule and checked the line several times throughout the night to see if anyone had begun to line up or if everyone was adhering to that rule. It was at 6:20 am on Saturday when we found that a line had been started and we entered that line. Clearly not everyone adhered to the 8:00 am rule. 

Moving forward to Sunday night and knowing that the 8:00 am rule was not going to be followed, we stood at the designated area, off of Cubs property, the same exact spot that the line began for the previous show. If not everyone was going to follow the rules, then I see it as fair game. 

Now, it becomes apparent that there is a group of Ten Club members with apparent Australian accents and a very cult like bearded leader that appear on the rail at just about show, including the Wrigley 1 show where they were at the front of the line as usual. You don’t have to search too hard to find or recognize this “fan”.  I would be happy to provide a picture to anyone that asks.  After sitting for about 3 hours, a member of their group which, at this time, appears to number in the range of 30-40 people, approaches us and inquired as to what we are doing. We said we are waiting. We were then told that what we were doing was not good and they offered to let us in to their group where we could be added to their list. When we reminded this person that, as per TC rules, there are not to be any lists, we were told that the outcome of this would not work out well for us. There would be an additional 4 people that work come over from their group and do the exact thing over the next several hours, even telling us what number we would be on that list. We declined every time to join there list citing the Ten Club rules on lists and numbering systems. Several times we were even told that Ten Club and Ten Club Security approved of their system and authorized them to continue to do it that way. When we asked to be shown this document nothing was ever shown. We were told that we were “cutting in their line”, when in fact, we had started the line. At any time they could have lined up behind us. 

Moving forward to 4:00 am on Monday morning, it became very apparent that 4:00 am was the time given to others to arrive as no less than 8 vehicles arrived and dropped off people that went straight to the group that had assembled in front of Murphy’s on the southeast corner of Waveland and and Sheffield. Sometime about 5:30 am or so every person in that group ran at the same time across Waveland Ave and line up on Cubs property where the official line would be moved to at 8:00. Once there, they were put into order from a list carried by one of the female Australians that travels with this group. Not long after, they were removed from that property, by security I assume, and moved behind where we were lined up. It was at this time that the now 5 of us ahead of them would be verbally abused and attempts to intimidate us were made. This would be a constant stream until 8:00 am, when we were all moved to the start of the official line on Cubs property.  Again, we were at the front of the line having not been intimidated from their constant stream of attempted bullying and verbal abuse.  Members of there group began to take pictures and video of us, with which they proceeded to post on various Ten Club and PJ Facebook groups, lying about how we cut into the line, and calling us names. Many comments were made by others, some suggested violence against us and others laced with profanity towards us. Can someone explain to me how a group of 5 could cut in front of a group of roughly 70 and not physically removed?  Really?  This group got people to believe that our group of 5 just walked in front of their group of 70 and muscled them out of the way and they let it happen?  We became a group of 4 at this time, as one member of our group decided to leave due to the circumstances. Again, we did not “cut” into the line, we started the line. They had every right to start the line at the designated spot as they did for the previous show and they chose not too. They somehow thought that their list was law, even though Ten Club prohibits lists. We chose to not be intimidated and stand out ground. 

Soon after we moved, in order, to the offical line at 8:00, security became involved and a discussion began. Their group of 70 all began to lie about what happened, saying they had no list and we cut to the front. I then showed the security personnel the Ten Club rules on unofficial lists and numbering systems and how they are prohibited. Security then decided to bring in event staff to further assist. Again their group shouted and screamed and I asked the event staff to read the same Ten Club rules. After discussion, event staff decided that we would stay at they front of the line and that any further issues of intimidation or threats would result in that person behind removed from the GA line. 

For the the next 8 hours we endured a continuous stream of subtle intimidation and even had people come up to us from the street to call us names and make faces. One of these people made a video andnposted to several Facebook groups in which he told us that we would have beer dumped on us all night for what we did. We had several people come to us in the front of the line asking us if this is where they receive their number. It was obvious that some people were told by the group to stop by the front of the line to find your number, as they would be in the front of the line. A pretty telling detail. 

Eventually, we enterered through security and into Wrigley Field, where there were still members of that group trying to intimidate us. We all know the rain that followed and we chose not to enter the melee that followed to get back into GA after the storm, instead watching from the back. 

This group, that contains many Australians, is on the rail at what may very well be every opportunity to do so. How can that be?  Every time?  They all win GA tickets and are lucky enough to be at the front of the GA line every show?  The odds on this happening randomly would be huge. Only it’s not happening randomly. Their system is in place and they intimidate anyone that might get in the way of them being first. It is very much like a
cult. The tactics that they used, the mode by which they organized, the intimidation they attempted. When we didn’t break or give in to them, they turned to social media to spread lies, trying to make themselves, this group that far outnumbered the 4 of us, look like victims.  We had no way to get our side of the story to those same people, so we must be in the wrong. It’s sad, but we stood up for ourselves and I would do it again the exact same way if I had to. The clear leaders of this group appear to be all Australians. Their tactics need to be stopped. Everyone that is a member of Ten Club and purchases their GA tickets should have the same opportunities to experience a show from the rail if that’s what they choose. They shouldn’t have to abide by the rules and lies of a group who have decided to claim the rail every show and that if you don’t join their group, you will never have a chance to experience a show from the rail. 

I know this was a crazy crazy long post, but there is no other way to get the story across. There are certainly details that haven’t been added that I would gladly discuss with anyone that would care to hear them.  I also have many pictures to support my claims if anyone is interested and feels like they need additional proof. I could have put those pictures all over Facebook groups as well, but I chose not too. Anyone is certainly free to make their own decision as to whom they thought were right or wrong. I just ask that you make an educated decision based on as much factual information as possible and not just base your decision based on who can yell and scream the loudest. Thanks for reading. 
  

And I'm not talking about arbitrary rules. The people who get there first are first in line and first through the gates. This is widely accepted in all areas. 

ascahn said:

I’ll take this opportunity to give my side of a story that occurred in the the GA line for the Monday show with information going back to the Saturday show. 

As I have never been on the rail before, our party of 4 decided to try and make that happen. Prior to the first Wrigley show, we were aware of the 8:00 am lineup rule and checked the line several times throughout the night to see if anyone had begun to line up or if everyone was adhering to that rule. It was at 6:20 am on Saturday when we found that a line had been started and we entered that line. Clearly not everyone adhered to the 8:00 am rule. 

Moving forward to Sunday night and knowing that the 8:00 am rule was not going to be followed, we stood at the designated area, off of Cubs property, the same exact spot that the line began for the previous show. If not everyone was going to follow the rules, then I see it as fair game. 

Now, it becomes apparent that there is a group of Ten Club members with apparent Australian accents and a very cult like bearded leader that appear on the rail at just about show, including the Wrigley 1 show where they were at the front of the line as usual. You don’t have to search too hard to find or recognize this “fan”.  I would be happy to provide a picture to anyone that asks.  After sitting for about 3 hours, a member of their group which, at this time, appears to number in the range of 30-40 people, approaches us and inquired as to what we are doing. We said we are waiting. We were then told that what we were doing was not good and they offered to let us in to their group where we could be added to their list. When we reminded this person that, as per TC rules, there are not to be any lists, we were told that the outcome of this would not work out well for us. There would be an additional 4 people that work come over from their group and do the exact thing over the next several hours, even telling us what number we would be on that list. We declined every time to join there list citing the Ten Club rules on lists and numbering systems. Several times we were even told that Ten Club and Ten Club Security approved of their system and authorized them to continue to do it that way. When we asked to be shown this document nothing was ever shown. We were told that we were “cutting in their line”, when in fact, we had started the line. At any time they could have lined up behind us. 

Moving forward to 4:00 am on Monday morning, it became very apparent that 4:00 am was the time given to others to arrive as no less than 8 vehicles arrived and dropped off people that went straight to the group that had assembled in front of Murphy’s on the southeast corner of Waveland and and Sheffield. Sometime about 5:30 am or so every person in that group ran at the same time across Waveland Ave and line up on Cubs property where the official line would be moved to at 8:00. Once there, they were put into order from a list carried by one of the female Australians that travels with this group. Not long after, they were removed from that property, by security I assume, and moved behind where we were lined up. It was at this time that the now 5 of us ahead of them would be verbally abused and attempts to intimidate us were made. This would be a constant stream until 8:00 am, when we were all moved to the start of the official line on Cubs property.  Again, we were at the front of the line having not been intimidated from their constant stream of attempted bullying and verbal abuse.  Members of there group began to take pictures and video of us, with which they proceeded to post on various Ten Club and PJ Facebook groups, lying about how we cut into the line, and calling us names. Many comments were made by others, some suggested violence against us and others laced with profanity towards us. Can someone explain to me how a group of 5 could cut in front of a group of roughly 70 and not physically removed?  Really?  This group got people to believe that our group of 5 just walked in front of their group of 70 and muscled them out of the way and they let it happen?  We became a group of 4 at this time, as one member of our group decided to leave due to the circumstances. Again, we did not “cut” into the line, we started the line. They had every right to start the line at the designated spot as they did for the previous show and they chose not too. They somehow thought that their list was law, even though Ten Club prohibits lists. We chose to not be intimidated and stand out ground. 

Soon after we moved, in order, to the offical line at 8:00, security became involved and a discussion began. Their group of 70 all began to lie about what happened, saying they had no list and we cut to the front. I then showed the security personnel the Ten Club rules on unofficial lists and numbering systems and how they are prohibited. Security then decided to bring in event staff to further assist. Again their group shouted and screamed and I asked the event staff to read the same Ten Club rules. After discussion, event staff decided that we would stay at they front of the line and that any further issues of intimidation or threats would result in that person behind removed from the GA line. 

For the the next 8 hours we endured a continuous stream of subtle intimidation and even had people come up to us from the street to call us names and make faces. One of these people made a video andnposted to several Facebook groups in which he told us that we would have beer dumped on us all night for what we did. We had several people come to us in the front of the line asking us if this is where they receive their number. It was obvious that some people were told by the group to stop by the front of the line to find your number, as they would be in the front of the line. A pretty telling detail. 

Eventually, we enterered through security and into Wrigley Field, where there were still members of that group trying to intimidate us. We all know the rain that followed and we chose not to enter the melee that followed to get back into GA after the storm, instead watching from the back. 

This group, that contains many Australians, is on the rail at what may very well be every opportunity to do so. How can that be?  Every time?  They all win GA tickets and are lucky enough to be at the front of the GA line every show?  The odds on this happening randomly would be huge. Only it’s not happening randomly. Their system is in place and they intimidate anyone that might get in the way of them being first. It is very much like a
cult. The tactics that they used, the mode by which they organized, the intimidation they attempted. When we didn’t break or give in to them, they turned to social media to spread lies, trying to make themselves, this group that far outnumbered the 4 of us, look like victims.  We had no way to get our side of the story to those same people, so we must be in the wrong. It’s sad, but we stood up for ourselves and I would do it again the exact same way if I had to. The clear leaders of this group appear to be all Australians. Their tactics need to be stopped. Everyone that is a member of Ten Club and purchases their GA tickets should have the same opportunities to experience a show from the rail if that’s what they choose. They shouldn’t have to abide by the rules and lies of a group who have decided to claim the rail every show and that if you don’t join their group, you will never have a chance to experience a show from the rail. 

I know this was a crazy crazy long post, but there is no other way to get the story across. There are certainly details that haven’t been added that I would gladly discuss with anyone that would care to hear them.  I also have many pictures to support my claims if anyone is interested and feels like they need additional proof. I could have put those pictures all over Facebook groups as well, but I chose not too. Anyone is certainly free to make their own decision as to whom they thought were right or wrong. I just ask that you make an educated decision based on as much factual information as possible and not just base your decision based on who can yell and scream the loudest. Thanks for reading. 
  

timdwilli said:

Ledbetterman10 said:

bootlegger10 said:

Oh you hung out on the sidewalk by murphy’s The last two days? That’s odd.  

When I saw someone post that they left during YLB on night one to get in line for night two, I thought I misread it because imy brain couldn’t process that anyone would wait two full days. Insane. 

How does one even enjoy the show if they've spent the previous 48 hours on a sidewalk?

Go Beavers said:

ForceofNature101 said:

And I'm not talking about arbitrary rules. The people who get there first are first in line and first through the gates. This is widely accepted in all areas. 

True, the people who get to the line first, are the first through the gates.  Just like the fine people who were the first through the gates at Wrigley 2

And well if you want a proper way to handle it, apparently Wrigley has many concerts and the 8am thing is assumed to be a thing at every show, no?  And there is no reported crazy mobs, so maybe call them up - I don't mean that in a condescending way at all, but just I have followed many bands and been to many shows and PJ is the only band where this line issue has really happened in such a big way.  I am sure not every band that plays there have the exact same "unofficial line rules" set by fans like this and it must be going well.  

I guess I'm surprised to see people adopt this 8:00 am thing over people who created the line by camping out. Now I'm curious what 'line issues' you're referring to? I've never been to see a band where fans camp out the previous night(s). Only ones where they get there really early in the morning the same day of the show

Go Beavers said:

ForceofNature101 said:

Go Beavers said:

bootlegger10 said:

Why would I honor a line that starts before 8am if the official line up is not allowed until 8am?    I can’t help what people chose to do and where with their time before 8am.  

Oh you hung out on the sidewalk by murphy’s The last two days? That’s odd.  

That’s the issue. The 8:00 am line isn’t official, that’s an external rule from the venue. What’s official is the informal line that starts however many days prior. If someone’s sleeping on the sidewalk for two days, hell yes they should have the rail. 

Wouldn't the "official" line be whichever one is considered legitimate by the actual venue?  External rules from the venue automatically supercede all else right?

Which is where the tension comes into play. What is “official”? To me, it would be fan determined because I think we should be able to regulate ourselves and I value rewarding those who put in the commitment. It’s kind of like in ye old days when people would camp out to buy tickets. Just because a venue doesn’t want the hassle of campers out front doesn’t determine norms around who has priority. I say we just view it as the line started away at a certain distance from the door. I think we can handle that.