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  • mrussel1
    mrussel1 Posts: 30,876
    BS44325 said:

    Cards being put on the table

    http://www.politico.com/story/2017/03/devin-nunes-donald-trump-surveillance-obama-236366

    You hear that? That's the sound of the other shoe dropping.

    Incidental collection.. no one argued it. Is it news that Flynn was picked up in surveillance while monitoring the Russian ambassador?

    Nunes described the surveillance as most likely being “incidental collection.” This can occur when a person inside the United States communicates with a foreign target of U.S. surveillance. In such cases, the identities of U.S. citizens are supposed to be kept secret — but can be “unmasked” by intelligence officials under certain circumstances.
  • mfc2006
    mfc2006 HTOWN Posts: 37,489
    BS44325 said:

    Cards being put on the table

    http://www.politico.com/story/2017/03/devin-nunes-donald-trump-surveillance-obama-236366

    You hear that? That's the sound of the other shoe dropping.

    "Nunes said the surveillance appeared to be legal but that he was concerned because it was not related to the FBI’s investigation into Russia’s meddling in the election and was widely disseminated across the intelligence community."

    We don't have all the facts yet. I think we can all agree on that.
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  • rssesq
    rssesq Fairfield County Posts: 3,299
  • Cliffy6745
    Cliffy6745 Posts: 34,022
    Wonder what kind of singing voice Manafort has, because he is gonna be singing at the top of his lungs
  • mrussel1
    mrussel1 Posts: 30,876

    Wonder what kind of singing voice Manafort has, because he is gonna be singing at the top of his lungs

    I don't know if you rat out the Russians.. that seems to be a risky proposition.
  • HesCalledDyer
    HesCalledDyer Maryland Posts: 16,491
    rssesq said:
    So your answer is a false sense of security as a result of fear-mongering. Got it.
  • Merkin Baller
    Merkin Baller Posts: 12,750

    rssesq said:
    So your answer is a false sense of security as a result of fear-mongering. Got it.
    I wonder what the gun control laws are like in those 65 countries, and if we'll be advocating for those too.
  • BS44325
    BS44325 Posts: 6,124
    mfc2006 said:

    BS44325 said:

    Cards being put on the table

    http://www.politico.com/story/2017/03/devin-nunes-donald-trump-surveillance-obama-236366

    You hear that? That's the sound of the other shoe dropping.

    "Nunes said the surveillance appeared to be legal but that he was concerned because it was not related to the FBI’s investigation into Russia’s meddling in the election and was widely disseminated across the intelligence community."

    We don't have all the facts yet. I think we can all agree on that.
    Exactly. That is the whole point. Trump might still be proven right on surveillance.
  • ikiT
    ikiT USA Posts: 11,059
    edited March 2017
    BS44325 said:

    Cards being put on the table

    http://www.politico.com/story/2017/03/devin-nunes-donald-trump-surveillance-obama-236366

    You hear that? That's the sound of the other shoe dropping.

    the daily kos called it a "bombshell of vagueness"

    if the campaign and transition team weren't so busy running their mouths to the Russians instead of figuring out how to actually govern and doing things the American public actually wanted (like not torpedoing the EPA and the Department of Education), they wouldn't find themselves being surveilled (incidentally).

    idiots.
    Bristow 05132010 to Amsterdam 2 06132018
  • mrussel1
    mrussel1 Posts: 30,876

    Wonder what kind of singing voice Manafort has, because he is gonna be singing at the top of his lungs

    I don't know if you rat out the Russians.. that seems to be a risky proposition.
    BS44325 said:

    mfc2006 said:

    BS44325 said:

    Cards being put on the table

    http://www.politico.com/story/2017/03/devin-nunes-donald-trump-surveillance-obama-236366

    You hear that? That's the sound of the other shoe dropping.

    "Nunes said the surveillance appeared to be legal but that he was concerned because it was not related to the FBI’s investigation into Russia’s meddling in the election and was widely disseminated across the intelligence community."

    We don't have all the facts yet. I think we can all agree on that.
    Exactly. That is the whole point. Trump might still be proven right on surveillance.
    Proven right the he was wiretapped by Obama? Seems like we closed that book already.
  • my2hands
    my2hands Posts: 17,117
    BS44325 said:

    mfc2006 said:

    BS44325 said:

    Cards being put on the table

    http://www.politico.com/story/2017/03/devin-nunes-donald-trump-surveillance-obama-236366

    You hear that? That's the sound of the other shoe dropping.

    "Nunes said the surveillance appeared to be legal but that he was concerned because it was not related to the FBI’s investigation into Russia’s meddling in the election and was widely disseminated across the intelligence community."

    We don't have all the facts yet. I think we can all agree on that.
    Exactly. That is the whole point. Trump might still be proven right on surveillance.
    LOL
  • Cliffy6745
    Cliffy6745 Posts: 34,022
    mrussel1 said:

    Wonder what kind of singing voice Manafort has, because he is gonna be singing at the top of his lungs

    I don't know if you rat out the Russians.. that seems to be a risky proposition.
    The cat is out of the bag on the Russians. Don't think it's the Russians that are going to be much of the focus, no?
  • Halifax2TheMax
    Halifax2TheMax Posts: 41,952
    BS44325 said:

    Cards being put on the table

    http://www.politico.com/story/2017/03/devin-nunes-donald-trump-surveillance-obama-236366

    You hear that? That's the sound of the other shoe dropping.

    Leakers! Find the leakers! Both candidates were under investigation but only one was publically exposed before the election. With all the Russian ties, shady business dealings and Wiki knowledge, why would it be a surprise that Trump was under surveillance? And, we've already heard testimony that Obama couldn't order up a wiretap. Distraction and deflection from the true crimes of the Trump administration.

    “I have seen intelligence reports that clearly show that the president-elect and his team were, I guess, at least monitored,” Nunes told reporters. “It looks to me like it was all legally collected, but it was essentially a lot of information on the president-elect and his transition team and what they were doing.”

    Nunes described the surveillance as most likely being “incidental collection.” This can occur when a person inside the United States communicates with a foreign target of U.S. surveillance. In such cases, the identities of U.S. citizens are supposed to be kept secret — but can be “unmasked” by intelligence officials under certain circumstances.

    He also said he did not know yet whether the Trump transition team members who were unmasked were communicating from Trump Tower. Earlier this month, Trump claimed in a series of Tweets that former President Barack Obama ordered a wiretap of the phones at Trump Tower — something Nunes reiterated on Wednesday he had no evidence of.


    FBI Director James Comey appeared before the panel on Monday and confirmed that the FBI launched a counterintelligence investigation in July into Russia’s election meddling, including possible coordination with the Trump campaign.

    More like the sound of a felt slipper falling gently to a carpeted floor in the basement. Nice try though.
    09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;

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  • Halifax2TheMax
    Halifax2TheMax Posts: 41,952
    BS44325 said:

    mfc2006 said:

    BS44325 said:

    Cards being put on the table

    http://www.politico.com/story/2017/03/devin-nunes-donald-trump-surveillance-obama-236366

    You hear that? That's the sound of the other shoe dropping.

    "Nunes said the surveillance appeared to be legal but that he was concerned because it was not related to the FBI’s investigation into Russia’s meddling in the election and was widely disseminated across the intelligence community."

    We don't have all the facts yet. I think we can all agree on that.
    Exactly. That is the whole point. Trump might still be proven right on surveillance.
    Yea, that's the whole point. That Trump was under surveillance. Sure, not the reasons why he was under surveillance. Brilliance at its finest.
    09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;

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  • mfc2006
    mfc2006 HTOWN Posts: 37,489
    If they had been investigating the Russian connection since July 2016 & had found that a lot of the Russian ties were to the Trump campaign, it makes perfect sense that they would look into the transition team. This is just spin, folks.

    Like I stated earlier, we don't have all of the facts. That being said, based on what we know, this doesn't look good for Trump and/or his administration/transition team/whateveryouwantocallthem. Manafort went from being a "key part of the campaign & transition" to being a nobody overnight. Why? SPIN & DEFLECTION.
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  • BS44325
    BS44325 Posts: 6,124
    mrussel1 said:

    Wonder what kind of singing voice Manafort has, because he is gonna be singing at the top of his lungs

    I don't know if you rat out the Russians.. that seems to be a risky proposition.
    BS44325 said:

    mfc2006 said:

    BS44325 said:

    Cards being put on the table

    http://www.politico.com/story/2017/03/devin-nunes-donald-trump-surveillance-obama-236366

    You hear that? That's the sound of the other shoe dropping.

    "Nunes said the surveillance appeared to be legal but that he was concerned because it was not related to the FBI’s investigation into Russia’s meddling in the election and was widely disseminated across the intelligence community."

    We don't have all the facts yet. I think we can all agree on that.
    Exactly. That is the whole point. Trump might still be proven right on surveillance.
    Proven right the he was wiretapped by Obama? Seems like we closed that book already.
    The book was closed on the literal interpretation of the tweet but not on the substance that people within the Obama administration were conducting surveillance of the Trump administration via a backdoor of incidental collection and then selectively leaked said information illegally for nefarious purposes.

    http://freebeacon.com/politics/obama-admin-loyalists-government-insiders-sabotage-trump-white-house/

    Most of you support this type of duplicitous game as members of the #resistance but rest assured it is watergate 2.0 if true. People don't seem to be comprehending how seriously this damages your country. With a new found hate for Putin members of the previous administration decided to act like him. When the story is finally told this will be the Obama and Democratic party legacy.



    Addendum - What's crazy is that Trump had this information all along but he and Nunez waited for the massive over reach by the left post-Comey that they knew would come. Most of you just can't help yourselves. Brilliance.
  • benjs
    benjs Toronto, ON Posts: 9,359
    BS44325 said:

    mfc2006 said:

    BS44325 said:

    Cards being put on the table

    http://www.politico.com/story/2017/03/devin-nunes-donald-trump-surveillance-obama-236366

    You hear that? That's the sound of the other shoe dropping.

    "Nunes said the surveillance appeared to be legal but that he was concerned because it was not related to the FBI’s investigation into Russia’s meddling in the election and was widely disseminated across the intelligence community."

    We don't have all the facts yet. I think we can all agree on that.
    Exactly. That is the whole point. Trump might still be proven right on surveillance.
    If Trump is correct based on this conversation, then the full, honest story would read: "The US routinely surveils foreign targets, and captures conversations between those foreign targets and domestic counterparts. If Trump or his associates were in contact with those foreign targets, it is plausible that security agencies would have recorded said conversations."

    Instead, the story delivered was: "How low has President Obama gone to tapp my phones during the very sacred election process. This is Nixon/Watergate. Bad (or sick) guy!"

    Whether true or not, the man uses ambiguity and timing to control messages brilliantly. The omission of context (if this is, in fact, the context he was referring to) and the accusation of malice attributed directly to Obama, are highly effective means of controlling the perception of an event. Trump has managed to frame a controversial and potentially damaging story (my team and I were in contact with foreign agents being monitored by security agencies) as one where they are victims (I've been spied on by my own government). If Trump knew that this information would come to light, there's little doubt in my mind that his action (making an ambiguous statement involving conspiracy, shock value, discrediting of the establishment) was the most effective damage control available. Best case scenario, he gave people a meaningless and unimpeachable topic to distract them while he continues with the topics people have serious objection to (like a poor attempt at a Health Care Bill). Worst case scenario, he loses a handful of supporters for a re-election he likely has no concern about, and is no further away or closer to accomplishing what he'd like to.
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  • mrussel1
    mrussel1 Posts: 30,876
    BS44325 said:

    mrussel1 said:

    Wonder what kind of singing voice Manafort has, because he is gonna be singing at the top of his lungs

    I don't know if you rat out the Russians.. that seems to be a risky proposition.
    BS44325 said:

    mfc2006 said:

    BS44325 said:

    Cards being put on the table

    http://www.politico.com/story/2017/03/devin-nunes-donald-trump-surveillance-obama-236366

    You hear that? That's the sound of the other shoe dropping.

    "Nunes said the surveillance appeared to be legal but that he was concerned because it was not related to the FBI’s investigation into Russia’s meddling in the election and was widely disseminated across the intelligence community."

    We don't have all the facts yet. I think we can all agree on that.
    Exactly. That is the whole point. Trump might still be proven right on surveillance.
    Proven right the he was wiretapped by Obama? Seems like we closed that book already.
    The book was closed on the literal interpretation of the tweet but not on the substance that people within the Obama administration were conducting surveillance of the Trump administration via a backdoor of incidental collection and then selectively leaked said information illegally for nefarious purposes.

    http://freebeacon.com/politics/obama-admin-loyalists-government-insiders-sabotage-trump-white-house/

    Most of you support this type of duplicitous game as members of the #resistance but rest assured it is watergate 2.0 if true. People don't seem to be comprehending how seriously this damages your country. With a new found hate for Putin members of the previous administration decided to act like him. When the story is finally told this will be the Obama and Democratic party legacy.



    Addendum - What's crazy is that Trump had this information all along but he and Nunez waited for the massive over reach by the left post-Comey that they knew would come. Most of you just can't help yourselves. Brilliance.
    Watergate 2.0.. you're drinking the crazy juice. Watergate was a break in, an ILLEGAL wiretap and a cover up. Using Director Comey's testimony as a source, which of those things happened to implicate Obama?
  • BS44325
    BS44325 Posts: 6,124

    BS44325 said:

    mfc2006 said:

    BS44325 said:

    Cards being put on the table

    http://www.politico.com/story/2017/03/devin-nunes-donald-trump-surveillance-obama-236366

    You hear that? That's the sound of the other shoe dropping.

    "Nunes said the surveillance appeared to be legal but that he was concerned because it was not related to the FBI’s investigation into Russia’s meddling in the election and was widely disseminated across the intelligence community."

    We don't have all the facts yet. I think we can all agree on that.
    Exactly. That is the whole point. Trump might still be proven right on surveillance.
    Yea, that's the whole point. That Trump was under surveillance. Sure, not the reasons why he was under surveillance. Brilliance at its finest.

    BS44325 said:

    mfc2006 said:

    BS44325 said:

    Cards being put on the table

    http://www.politico.com/story/2017/03/devin-nunes-donald-trump-surveillance-obama-236366

    You hear that? That's the sound of the other shoe dropping.

    "Nunes said the surveillance appeared to be legal but that he was concerned because it was not related to the FBI’s investigation into Russia’s meddling in the election and was widely disseminated across the intelligence community."

    We don't have all the facts yet. I think we can all agree on that.
    Exactly. That is the whole point. Trump might still be proven right on surveillance.
    Yea, that's the whole point. That Trump was under surveillance. Sure, not the reasons why he was under surveillance. Brilliance at its finest.

    BS44325 said:

    mfc2006 said:

    BS44325 said:

    Cards being put on the table

    http://www.politico.com/story/2017/03/devin-nunes-donald-trump-surveillance-obama-236366

    You hear that? That's the sound of the other shoe dropping.

    "Nunes said the surveillance appeared to be legal but that he was concerned because it was not related to the FBI’s investigation into Russia’s meddling in the election and was widely disseminated across the intelligence community."

    We don't have all the facts yet. I think we can all agree on that.
    Exactly. That is the whole point. Trump might still be proven right on surveillance.
    Yea, that's the whole point. That Trump was under surveillance. Sure, not the reasons why he was under surveillance. Brilliance at its finest.
    Still trying to have it both ways...

    1) There is so much evidence through surveillance that Trump is colluding with Russia!

    2) Trump is a liar on "wire tapping"! Obama's administration wasn't spying on him! This is outrageous!

    3) Well of course he was under surveillance! He was colluding with Russia for fuck sakes!

    This has been the basics of HalifaxToTheMaxineWatters since inauguration. It is why I spend most of the time laughing at you. It is funny.
  • Halifax2TheMax
    Halifax2TheMax Posts: 41,952
    mrussel1 said:

    BS44325 said:

    mrussel1 said:

    Wonder what kind of singing voice Manafort has, because he is gonna be singing at the top of his lungs

    I don't know if you rat out the Russians.. that seems to be a risky proposition.
    BS44325 said:

    mfc2006 said:

    BS44325 said:

    Cards being put on the table

    http://www.politico.com/story/2017/03/devin-nunes-donald-trump-surveillance-obama-236366

    You hear that? That's the sound of the other shoe dropping.

    "Nunes said the surveillance appeared to be legal but that he was concerned because it was not related to the FBI’s investigation into Russia’s meddling in the election and was widely disseminated across the intelligence community."

    We don't have all the facts yet. I think we can all agree on that.
    Exactly. That is the whole point. Trump might still be proven right on surveillance.
    Proven right the he was wiretapped by Obama? Seems like we closed that book already.
    The book was closed on the literal interpretation of the tweet but not on the substance that people within the Obama administration were conducting surveillance of the Trump administration via a backdoor of incidental collection and then selectively leaked said information illegally for nefarious purposes.

    http://freebeacon.com/politics/obama-admin-loyalists-government-insiders-sabotage-trump-white-house/

    Most of you support this type of duplicitous game as members of the #resistance but rest assured it is watergate 2.0 if true. People don't seem to be comprehending how seriously this damages your country. With a new found hate for Putin members of the previous administration decided to act like him. When the story is finally told this will be the Obama and Democratic party legacy.



    Addendum - What's crazy is that Trump had this information all along but he and Nunez waited for the massive over reach by the left post-Comey that they knew would come. Most of you just can't help yourselves. Brilliance.
    Watergate 2.0.. you're drinking the crazy juice. Watergate was a break in, an ILLEGAL wiretap and a cover up. Using Director Comey's testimony as a source, which of those things happened to implicate Obama?
    All you need to know or see is the opening statements from the respective party leaders of the House Intelligence Committee. One was sweaty, nervous, misspoke, eyes blinking and darted around. The other was calm, steady, didn't blink much and looked the camera in the eye as he listed all the things we do know and wondered aloud if they were coincidences. And that the investigation was continuing. I expect Obama will be locked up, just like Hillary?

    Follow the money, from Russia with love, all the way to impeachment. That'll be the real brilliance.
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