Should celebrities avoid talking politics to fans ?

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  • my2hands
    my2hands Posts: 17,117
    PJfanwillneverleave1 said:

    ledvedderman said:

    PJfanwillneverleave1 said:

    Celebrities should not talk politics to fans.
    Rock bands yes.
    Madonna no.

    So, celebrities should not talk politics...but, by all means, run for President?
    President Trump was a celebrity?
    That's actually all he has been for the last 20 years...
  • mace1229
    mace1229 Posts: 9,829
    Degeneratefk said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    mrussel1 said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    mrussel1 said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    How many fucking highways are being blocked by protests anyway?? I know protests disrupt downtown traffic a lot, but highways and bridges that are the only route in and out of town? Just how often does that even happen? I don't even really see the point of debating such a rare occasion. How about thinking more about what actually happens on a regular basis? That's what really matters. Peaceful protestors being attacked by police is what matters, because that is what happens on a regular basis right now.

    I can tell you what happened to me. So whether it was once or 50, it had an effect. You don't have to be for violent police to be against protesters that disrupt everyday lives. You can think both suck.
    No. It is simply my personal belief that those who reject peaceful protest because they were inconvenienced are being very selfish.
    Waiting close 2 hours in bumper to bumper traffic on a Thursday afternoon while scrambling to find someone to pikc your child up because you are so late runs a little past the point of inconvenienced.
    I figure as long as it doesn't actually hurt you, suck it up and appreciate that people can protest without getting gunned down (for now).
    What if you were in an ambulance having a heart attack trying to get to a hospital? Are you being selfish for wanting to get to the hospital asap?
    Forget the ambulance, why does someone have the right to break a law and not be held accountable just because they are protesting?
    It isn't selfish to enforce laws, especially those designed for safety reasons.
  • PJPOWER
    PJPOWER Posts: 6,499
    edited March 2017
    Smellyman said:

    PJPOWER said:

    I really don't care if celebrities talk politics. My problem is with the sheeple that base their political beliefs on what a celebrity says.

    I hate it more when people base it off of racism, bigotry, a bible, sexism, hatred and greed.
    Celebrities can preach all of the above as well...
  • PJPOWER
    PJPOWER Posts: 6,499
    edited March 2017
    Double post oops
  • benjs
    benjs Toronto, ON Posts: 9,367
    mace1229 said:

    Degeneratefk said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    mrussel1 said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    mrussel1 said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    How many fucking highways are being blocked by protests anyway?? I know protests disrupt downtown traffic a lot, but highways and bridges that are the only route in and out of town? Just how often does that even happen? I don't even really see the point of debating such a rare occasion. How about thinking more about what actually happens on a regular basis? That's what really matters. Peaceful protestors being attacked by police is what matters, because that is what happens on a regular basis right now.

    I can tell you what happened to me. So whether it was once or 50, it had an effect. You don't have to be for violent police to be against protesters that disrupt everyday lives. You can think both suck.
    No. It is simply my personal belief that those who reject peaceful protest because they were inconvenienced are being very selfish.
    Waiting close 2 hours in bumper to bumper traffic on a Thursday afternoon while scrambling to find someone to pikc your child up because you are so late runs a little past the point of inconvenienced.
    I figure as long as it doesn't actually hurt you, suck it up and appreciate that people can protest without getting gunned down (for now).
    What if you were in an ambulance having a heart attack trying to get to a hospital? Are you being selfish for wanting to get to the hospital asap?
    Forget the ambulance, why does someone have the right to break a law and not be held accountable just because they are protesting?
    It isn't selfish to enforce laws, especially those designed for safety reasons.
    I wholeheartedly agree. There was a protest in Toronto for issues surrounding the Tamil people, and they blocked the emergency entrance to the hospital. At that point, I think they (rightfully) lost all sympathy.
    '05 - TO, '06 - TO 1, '08 - NYC 1 & 2, '09 - TO, Chi 1 & 2, '10 - Buffalo, NYC 1 & 2, '11 - TO 1 & 2, Hamilton, '13 - Buffalo, Brooklyn 1 & 2, '15 - Global Citizen, '16 - TO 1 & 2, Chi 2

    EV
    Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
  • PJ_Soul
    PJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,668
    edited March 2017
    PJPOWER said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    mrussel1 said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    mrussel1 said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    How many fucking highways are being blocked by protests anyway?? I know protests disrupt downtown traffic a lot, but highways and bridges that are the only route in and out of town? Just how often does that even happen? I don't even really see the point of debating such a rare occasion. How about thinking more about what actually happens on a regular basis? That's what really matters. Peaceful protestors being attacked by police is what matters, because that is what happens on a regular basis right now.

    I can tell you what happened to me. So whether it was once or 50, it had an effect. You don't have to be for violent police to be against protesters that disrupt everyday lives. You can think both suck.
    No. It is simply my personal belief that those who reject peaceful protest because they were inconvenienced are being very selfish.
    Waiting close 2 hours in bumper to bumper traffic on a Thursday afternoon while scrambling to find someone to pikc your child up because you are so late runs a little past the point of inconvenienced.
    I figure as long as it doesn't actually hurt you, suck it up and appreciate that people can protest without getting gunned down (for now).
    So if a group of what you might consider eccentrics block access, by standing in the street, to an abortion clinic or concert, I expect you to appreciate that they are "peacefully protesting" and suck it up. Bonus if they start lighting fires in middle the road or breaking random shit.
    Well first of all, peaceful protest does not involve burning or breaking things, so let's remove that little red herring right now.
    Second, what are you talking about? "Eccentrics" blocking access to an abortion clinic or a concert? Care to elaborate? I said twice now that there are rational exceptions, and your come back is to appeal to an irrational argument. Specifically blocking people from accessing any particular legal medical care is not a rational example. I would need more info re your little scenario about the concert. If there were protestors blocking access to a concert that I had tickets to, I certainly would "suck it up", whatever the reason. I am not a huge baby about cancelled concerts like some people around here are, especially since cancelled concerts generally give refunds. Had I had plans to go to NC for that cancelled Springsteen or PJ show, I'd have been happy to miss it for that cause. In fact, remember when this scenario actually kind of happened, I think for the Forum for the LA PJ concert a few years ago? The union was picketing the forum. I didn't have tickets to that show and they weren't blocking entry of course, since that is kind of an absurd scenario, but if I had had tix to that show, I 100% would have torn up the tix and joined the picket line, since I am a union member and don't cross picket lines. If a concert I was going to was being totally blocked by protestors (not a real example - as far as I know this has never happened) with whom I disagreed... yeah, I'd suck it up. What's the alternative? I certainly wouldn't want people arrested and have a record for peaceful protest, and I wouldn't want to attack them, so.... Of course, this example isn't equivalent to blocking a street, since a street is public property and a music venue generally isn't.
    Post edited by PJ_Soul on
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • PJ_Soul
    PJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,668
    edited March 2017
    Degeneratefk said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    mrussel1 said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    mrussel1 said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    How many fucking highways are being blocked by protests anyway?? I know protests disrupt downtown traffic a lot, but highways and bridges that are the only route in and out of town? Just how often does that even happen? I don't even really see the point of debating such a rare occasion. How about thinking more about what actually happens on a regular basis? That's what really matters. Peaceful protestors being attacked by police is what matters, because that is what happens on a regular basis right now.

    I can tell you what happened to me. So whether it was once or 50, it had an effect. You don't have to be for violent police to be against protesters that disrupt everyday lives. You can think both suck.
    No. It is simply my personal belief that those who reject peaceful protest because they were inconvenienced are being very selfish.
    Waiting close 2 hours in bumper to bumper traffic on a Thursday afternoon while scrambling to find someone to pikc your child up because you are so late runs a little past the point of inconvenienced.
    I figure as long as it doesn't actually hurt you, suck it up and appreciate that people can protest without getting gunned down (for now).
    What if you were in an ambulance having a heart attack trying to get to a hospital? Are you being selfish for wanting to get to the hospital asap?
    No, you're not being selfish for wanting to get to the hospital quickly. If you wanted the ambulance to run over and hurt people so you can get to the hospital faster, yes, that's called being selfish. Look people, living in such a black and white reality must be comforting to some, but how about we come back to reality, where everything is grey?
    Anyway, I stand by this: Just being inconvenienced - yes, even if you're stuck in traffic! Gasp! - is a terrible reason to get pissy about peaceful protest, and an even worse reason to call for jail time for the protestors, I mean wtf? Suck it up. If the protestors are blocking an emergency vehicle route, that is different. No protest should do that.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • mace1229
    mace1229 Posts: 9,829
    edited March 2017
    The problem I have is if the law says don't do X, and you do it while protesting, that shouldn't matter. Anyone doing X should face the same consequences whether they are protesting or not. Whether it is blocking public roads, trespassing on private property, whatever it is. If the law is clear, and you intentionally break the law, you face the consequences. And anyone willing to break the law while protesting should be willing to accept those consequences, or find a different way to protest. Lots places to protest, march down the sidewalk, in a public park. Occupy did it for months without blocking freeways.
    You can't have people choosing when to follow the law, and expect police to choose when to enforce it.
    Or next time I'm pulled over for speeding I'll just tell the cop I'm speeding to find a cure for cancer.
    Post edited by mace1229 on
  • CM189191
    CM189191 Posts: 6,927
    Degeneratefk said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    mrussel1 said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    mrussel1 said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    How many fucking highways are being blocked by protests anyway?? I know protests disrupt downtown traffic a lot, but highways and bridges that are the only route in and out of town? Just how often does that even happen? I don't even really see the point of debating such a rare occasion. How about thinking more about what actually happens on a regular basis? That's what really matters. Peaceful protestors being attacked by police is what matters, because that is what happens on a regular basis right now.

    I can tell you what happened to me. So whether it was once or 50, it had an effect. You don't have to be for violent police to be against protesters that disrupt everyday lives. You can think both suck.
    No. It is simply my personal belief that those who reject peaceful protest because they were inconvenienced are being very selfish.
    Waiting close 2 hours in bumper to bumper traffic on a Thursday afternoon while scrambling to find someone to pikc your child up because you are so late runs a little past the point of inconvenienced.
    I figure as long as it doesn't actually hurt you, suck it up and appreciate that people can protest without getting gunned down (for now).
    What if you were in an ambulance having a heart attack trying to get to a hospital? Are you being selfish for wanting to get to the hospital asap?
    What really happens when an emergency vehicle comes upon a protest
  • PJPOWER
    PJPOWER Posts: 6,499
    mace1229 said:

    The problem I have is if the law says don't do X, and you do it while protesting, that shouldn't matter. Anyone doing X should face the same consequences whether they are protesting or not. Whether it is blocking public roads, trespassing on private property, whatever it is. If the law is clear, and you intentionally break the law, you face the consequences. And anyone willing to break the law while protesting should be willing to accept those consequences, or find a different way to protest. Lots places to protest, march down the sidewalk, in a public park. Occupy did it for months without blocking freeways.
    You can't have people choosing when to follow the law, and expect police to choose when to enforce it.
    Or next time I'm pulled over for speeding I'll just tell the cop I'm speeding to find a cure for cancer.

    Right! I do not believe that protests that potentially put the lives of moterists or property in danger can be called "peaceful protests". Popping out your boobs for "free the nipple", smoking pot in mass, chanting your beliefs- all peaceful. Blocking a highway, filled with people trying to get places for potentially life or death reasons= non-peaceful. If any property damage, injuries occurs due to their carelessness, they should be held financially/legally responsible.
  • PJ_Soul
    PJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,668
    edited March 2017
    CM189191 said:

    Degeneratefk said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    mrussel1 said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    mrussel1 said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    How many fucking highways are being blocked by protests anyway?? I know protests disrupt downtown traffic a lot, but highways and bridges that are the only route in and out of town? Just how often does that even happen? I don't even really see the point of debating such a rare occasion. How about thinking more about what actually happens on a regular basis? That's what really matters. Peaceful protestors being attacked by police is what matters, because that is what happens on a regular basis right now.

    I can tell you what happened to me. So whether it was once or 50, it had an effect. You don't have to be for violent police to be against protesters that disrupt everyday lives. You can think both suck.
    No. It is simply my personal belief that those who reject peaceful protest because they were inconvenienced are being very selfish.
    Waiting close 2 hours in bumper to bumper traffic on a Thursday afternoon while scrambling to find someone to pikc your child up because you are so late runs a little past the point of inconvenienced.
    I figure as long as it doesn't actually hurt you, suck it up and appreciate that people can protest without getting gunned down (for now).
    What if you were in an ambulance having a heart attack trying to get to a hospital? Are you being selfish for wanting to get to the hospital asap?
    What really happens when an emergency vehicle comes upon a protest
    I have lived the situation. The ambulance wanted to get through a solid crowd of peaceful people (not protestors) for an idiot who decided to try tightrope walking the street car cables and fell. Well, the paramedics didn't get out of the ambulance and walk to the guy with a stretcher (who I was standing about 20 feet from). They easily could have done this - the crowd was willing and able to let them through like that. The ambulance just couldn't get through because there was not enough room for the people to move that much. But they sat there in the vehicle for an extraordinary amount of time, refusing to bring a stretcher to the injured person even though it was safe, and then the cops decided that pepper spray was the best way to move the peaceful, even joyous, crowd. And that is how the Vancouver riot of 1994 started. If the paramedics and the cops had just kept their shit together and used their brains, it would have remained a peaceful gathering rather than causing millions of dollars worth of damage and injuries to many people who were not acting like idiots.
    Post edited by PJ_Soul on
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • PJPOWER
    PJPOWER Posts: 6,499
    edited March 2017
    CM189191 said:

    Degeneratefk said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    mrussel1 said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    mrussel1 said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    How many fucking highways are being blocked by protests anyway?? I know protests disrupt downtown traffic a lot, but highways and bridges that are the only route in and out of town? Just how often does that even happen? I don't even really see the point of debating such a rare occasion. How about thinking more about what actually happens on a regular basis? That's what really matters. Peaceful protestors being attacked by police is what matters, because that is what happens on a regular basis right now.

    I can tell you what happened to me. So whether it was once or 50, it had an effect. You don't have to be for violent police to be against protesters that disrupt everyday lives. You can think both suck.
    No. It is simply my personal belief that those who reject peaceful protest because they were inconvenienced are being very selfish.
    Waiting close 2 hours in bumper to bumper traffic on a Thursday afternoon while scrambling to find someone to pikc your child up because you are so late runs a little past the point of inconvenienced.
    I figure as long as it doesn't actually hurt you, suck it up and appreciate that people can protest without getting gunned down (for now).
    What if you were in an ambulance having a heart attack trying to get to a hospital? Are you being selfish for wanting to get to the hospital asap?
    What really happens when an emergency vehicle comes upon a protest
    Thanks for the one example, here is one too:
    http://www.nbcconnecticut.com/news/local/Marchers-Protesting-President-Trumps-Immigration-Policies-Block-Streets-in-New-Haven-412789233.html
    Or do you prefer this one:
    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=gvCdAuBBh0U&feature=youtu.be
    Post edited by PJPOWER on
  • PJ_Soul
    PJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,668
    edited March 2017
    ^^ Did you read the story that CM posted? It did not support the theory that protests really impeded ambulances. And the article you posted doesn't either.
    My experience from when the paramedics and cops started that riot was different in that the person the ambulance wanted to get to was literally in the middle of the crowd, and not somewhere past it (if it had not been the centre of the crowd they were aiming for, they easily could have gone around). As for that video... those idiots are deliberately and specifically blocking an ambulance on purpose. I'm pretty sure there are already laws on the books that make that illegal. That is definitely not the kind of scenario I have been talking about, nor the one that anyone has been talking about IMO. When people specifically block an ambulance on purpose, that is a whole other story.
    Post edited by PJ_Soul on
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • mrussel1
    mrussel1 Posts: 30,881
    The difference in the Minneapolis version was that the people were blocking the street and that's all. What happened in NJ when they closed the GW was that the CARS were causing the traffic jam. They can't just move like people. So if protesters create a traffic jam, that's much different than just individuals moving out of the way.
  • mace1229
    mace1229 Posts: 9,829
    Inconvenience is when the grocery store union goes on strike and I have to go to the other side of town to get groceries. This is beyond inconvenience, and is illegal. I really dont know why there is a debate, if something is illegal, being part of a protest should not excuse illegal activity. If you don't, be prepared to be arrested.
  • PJ_Soul
    PJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,668
    mace1229 said:

    Inconvenience is when the grocery store union goes on strike and I have to go to the other side of town to get groceries. This is beyond inconvenience, and is illegal. I really dont know why there is a debate, if something is illegal, being part of a protest should not excuse illegal activity. If you don't, be prepared to be arrested.

    There is a debate because it just isn't a black and white issue. Most things aren't.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • mrussel1
    mrussel1 Posts: 30,881
    mace1229 said:

    Inconvenience is when the grocery store union goes on strike and I have to go to the other side of town to get groceries. This is beyond inconvenience, and is illegal. I really dont know why there is a debate, if something is illegal, being part of a protest should not excuse illegal activity. If you don't, be prepared to be arrested.

    As a good liberal, I agree with this.
  • PJPOWER
    PJPOWER Posts: 6,499
    mace1229 said:

    Inconvenience is when the grocery store union goes on strike and I have to go to the other side of town to get groceries. This is beyond inconvenience, and is illegal. I really dont know why there is a debate, if something is illegal, being part of a protest should not excuse illegal activity. If you don't, be prepared to be arrested.

    Agreed, well stated.
  • CM189191
    CM189191 Posts: 6,927
    PJPOWER said:

    CM189191 said:

    Degeneratefk said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    mrussel1 said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    mrussel1 said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    How many fucking highways are being blocked by protests anyway?? I know protests disrupt downtown traffic a lot, but highways and bridges that are the only route in and out of town? Just how often does that even happen? I don't even really see the point of debating such a rare occasion. How about thinking more about what actually happens on a regular basis? That's what really matters. Peaceful protestors being attacked by police is what matters, because that is what happens on a regular basis right now.

    I can tell you what happened to me. So whether it was once or 50, it had an effect. You don't have to be for violent police to be against protesters that disrupt everyday lives. You can think both suck.
    No. It is simply my personal belief that those who reject peaceful protest because they were inconvenienced are being very selfish.
    Waiting close 2 hours in bumper to bumper traffic on a Thursday afternoon while scrambling to find someone to pikc your child up because you are so late runs a little past the point of inconvenienced.
    I figure as long as it doesn't actually hurt you, suck it up and appreciate that people can protest without getting gunned down (for now).
    What if you were in an ambulance having a heart attack trying to get to a hospital? Are you being selfish for wanting to get to the hospital asap?
    What really happens when an emergency vehicle comes upon a protest
    Thanks for the one example, here is one too:
    http://www.nbcconnecticut.com/news/local/Marchers-Protesting-President-Trumps-Immigration-Policies-Block-Streets-in-New-Haven-412789233.html
    Or do you prefer this one:
    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=gvCdAuBBh0U&feature=youtu.be
    Hey, that's great.

    So the people rioting and blocking emergency vehicles were arrested for laws already on the books. As it should be.

    The problem starts when you use anecdotes like these to oppress speech. When people talk about the right way, the right place, the right time to protest you head down that slippery slope.

    "I heard a guy died in an ambulance blocked by protesters once. We should pass a law making protesting legal only on the third Thursday of every other month. But only at the public park on the other side of town from the capitol building. With a permit. And proper security paid for by the protesters."

    Not to mention, many organized protests I've seen will put out a statement with a starting and end point. Like a parade. "We're going to meet at the governor's mansion on this time & day, and march to the capitol." Then everyone knows to avoid that area.

    Obviously, spontaneous impromptu demonstrations don't have the same luxury. But I have been informed there is no such thing as an spontaneous protest, since they're all really paid protesters being organized by the deep state or something...
  • my2hands
    my2hands Posts: 17,117
    how come all you anti-protest republicans didn't have a problem with a republican governor closing down a bridge? I wonder how many emergency vehicles were slowed or diverted because of that?
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