Obamacare is a mess

EdsonNascimento · February 2017

So, the Feds can't pay for the money Obama promised in a law nobody read and now it's being blamed on a responsible Congress who refuse to fill the hole left by the colossal (purposeful) miscalculation by the prior regime? Crazy. As much as it hurts the insurance industry, I hope Congress holds fast and ignores ignorant people who don't understand that blame lies at the feet of those that put yet another untenable entitlement program in place without having the proper funding in place. Without the insurance companies payment, this scheme could not work and those smarter than the prior President knew that (though that's unfair. He's smart enough. He got it and also understood this would happen. That's why the timing of the main components going into place and when the bill came due was a time bomb set of whoever followed him).

And before you say single payer - this is effectively single payer. That's the problem.

If you understand what Obama did, you would be for its repeal too. It's easy to give money away. Especially someone else's.

Go Beavers · February 2017

What do you think of trump's plan?

dignin · February 2017

ACA is not a single payer system.

ledvedderman · February 2017

It's such a mess it takes over seven years and counting to think of a way to replace it.

Halifax2TheMax · February 2017

It's a mess because republicans have sabotaged it. From day one. They even opposed pieces that they previously supported. All to "see this president fail." And they still don't have a solution other than, "let the market decide." Which isn't a solution.

rssesq · February 2017

have a "cadillac" plan with anthem bc/bs, before ACA $395, now $690
Appreciate it bro.

EdsonNascimento · February 2017

Go Beavers said:
What do you think of trump's plan?

You mean access to HSAs and pushing Medicare Advantage and mandated managed care for Medicaid? More the overall Republican plan, but in terms of bending the cost curve, it's better, and is much more affordable than what was shoved down our collective gullets without a review. Also, I'm fine with states keeping their expanded Medicaid definitions if they so choose, but returning the federal subsidies back to pre-ACA.

Also, fully agree with elimination of ACOs as they have been a complete boondoggle. That's not to say there haven't been a handful of successful ones, but on balance they've cost the system far more than they've saved. The fact is if all docs acted in their patients best interest like the successful ACOs and HMOs have, we wouldn't need all this forced systemic hysteria. Of course, that requires more clinical driven decisions than what goes on in most parts. And before you say hmos are the ones that don't do that, think again. There are problem ones no doubt. But there are far more providers that are not optimizing patient outcomes that are resulting in avoidable, preventable exacerbation that careful patient tracking and care could remedy. If we could somehow replicate the many good providers, we would be winning. However, inidvidual providers are not in position for many reasons to do so.

Sorry. I could go on, but there are patient based solutions that really would bend the cost curve which after all is what Obama promised. Funny, none of the folks with their hands out remember that teeny, tiny failure.

EdsonNascimento · February 2017

Halifax2TheMax said:
It's a mess because republicans have sabotaged it. From day one. They even opposed pieces that they previously supported. All to "see this president fail." And they still don't have a solution other than, "let the market decide." Which isn't a solution.

How,did they sabotage it? By not writing a blank check? Good for them.

EdsonNascimento · February 2017

dignin said:
ACA is not a single payer system.

Well, not by the letter, but in reality all the "success" you hear is based on expanded Medicaid and subsidies. Where does all that money come from? A single payer (well, not really, it comes from all of us, but you get the idea). I don't mind making an inordinate contribution, but I want it to be something that actually does its stated purpose - bend the cost curve while not impacting people's previously existing coverage.

For example, when Bush put in Part D drug coverage into Medicare, he tried to balance overage and affordability. Was still extremely expensive, but at least he tried by providing a creative coverage solution. As was expected, the Dems then filled in the holes and yowzers. How expensive now? There needs to be prudence.

I don't think many don't agree with providing coverage. But let's be reasonable and require some checks and responsibility. Doesn't that seem a reasonable ask?

EdsonNascimento · February 2017

ledvedderman said:
It's such a mess it takes over seven years and counting to think of a way to replace it.

Because to undo a massive entitlement program is precarious and Obama and Pelosi did that on purpose including the timing of rolling out key parts of the law nobody read. Honestly, they should just repeal it and reset. Because its unrecoverable. There are good ideas within it, but those are for the most part inseparable, so oh well. There are a few that can be easily added, but overall it is tied to the enormous expansive of Medicaid (including exchange subsidies in this definition, as that's what that is).

Unfortunately, that's impossible to do. But good job. Trillions of dollars spent not doing what was the stated intention - bending the cost curve. Everyone remembers the hand out. Nobody remembers the stated intention (not that anyone was fooled for one second on that).

That being said, other than direct expansion the Medicaid, they can simply let the market die its own death. So, the politically savvy thing is to postpone any fix for 2 years as the customers will join the screaming for a new way. Though, the blame will be wrongly placed at that point because most people are under educated on the facts of Obamacare. If it had been repealed 3 years ago, it would have been effective bc many of the meaningful parts hadn't been launched yet. But, obviously that was impossible as the 726 repeal votes proved.

ledvedderman · February 2017

We are all aware that Trump originally was for single payer, right? And that his plan, in his own words, "everyone will be covered".
If he makes that happen, I'll give him due credit.

EdsonNascimento · February 2017

ledvedderman said:
We are all aware that Trump originally was for single payer, right? And that his plan, in his own words, "everyone will be covered".
If he makes that happen, I'll give him due credit.

Don't want single payer. That would be the dumbest thing ever. Right now employers subsidies a sizable part of the healthcare system (including covering higher provider fees to compensate for fixed lower fee schedules for Medicare and Medicaid). Single payer would be a disaster for providers. Why would we turn away a willing participant in funding a program as employers are in having to compete for employees? Instead, Obamacare thought narrowly as you are and hindered that and actually got employers to get out.

This is another smart move Bush made in implementing Part D. He provided an incentive for employers to continue covering retirees and helping to finance the program. Of course Pelosi and her band of idiots slowly eroded that (though not completely) bc it was "helping the rich." Of course they ignored the fact that it was helping to fund the overall structure of a new benefit for Seniors.

It is amazing to me how little people know and understand about the financing of our healthcare system. People should make the effort to learn, and they'll see who's really taking measured approaches vs just spending money for sound bites. Giving shit away is easy when it's someone else's money.

Halifax2TheMax · February 2017

EdsonNascimento said:

Halifax2TheMax said:
It's a mess because republicans have sabotaged it. From day one. They even opposed pieces that they previously supported. All to "see this president fail." And they still don't have a solution other than, "let the market decide." Which isn't a solution.
How,did they sabotage it? By not writing a blank check? Good for them.

Republicans in congress, rather than work with Obama, fought it tooth and nail, the idea of universal care. Rather than be part of the process, they screamed death panels and opposed compromise they previously supported. Then republican states barred the expansion of Medicare as an alternative option. And still they have no plan. None.

Prior to Obamacare, my premiums and copays increased by double digit %'s year after year after year. The only times they didn't is when I was a union member and collectively we spoke up and since passage, my premiums increased in single % digits and have stayed flat for the past two years. But then again, I work in a state that embraced romneycare from day one and it's what?, only been a decade? And yes, I get excellent care.

So, what's Trump's solution? Here's a clue, he doesn't have one.

EdsonNascimento · February 2017

Halifax2TheMax said:

EdsonNascimento said:

Halifax2TheMax said:
It's a mess because republicans have sabotaged it. From day one. They even opposed pieces that they previously supported. All to "see this president fail." And they still don't have a solution other than, "let the market decide." Which isn't a solution.
How,did they sabotage it? By not writing a blank check? Good for them.
Republicans in congress, rather than work with Obama, fought it tooth and nail, the idea of universal care. Rather than be part of the process, they screamed death panels and opposed compromise they previously supported. Then republican states barred the expansion of Medicare as an alternative option. And still they have no plan. None.

Prior to Obamacare, my premiums and copays increased by double digit %'s year after year after year. The only times they didn't is when I was a union member and collectively we spoke up and since passage, my premiums increased in single % digits and have stayed flat for the past two years. But then again, I work in a state that embraced romneycare from day one and it's what?, only been a decade? And yes, I get excellent care.

So, what's Trump's solution? Here's a clue, he doesn't have one.

Well, if you look at HealthyIndiana you start to get an idea. Ryan has put forth some ideas too. It's not necessarily trumps job to come up with a solution. Oh for the days when congress was the legislature.

Is your plan on the exchanges?

I've done union employee benefits. You guys were giving up other stuff to maintain those things, it's a choice, which is fine. You made that collectively. Wish we had that for Obamacare.

And not disagreeing with the rhetoric you sited, but it's just that rhetoric. Cut through that. How were the republicans given a chance? Obama and Pelosi rammed a 2,000 page bill through without allowing anyone to read it. Nice revisionist history in your part.

Halifax2TheMax · February 2017

EdsonNascimento said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

EdsonNascimento said:

Halifax2TheMax said:
It's a mess because republicans have sabotaged it. From day one. They even opposed pieces that they previously supported. All to "see this president fail." And they still don't have a solution other than, "let the market decide." Which isn't a solution.
How,did they sabotage it? By not writing a blank check? Good for them.
Republicans in congress, rather than work with Obama, fought it tooth and nail, the idea of universal care. Rather than be part of the process, they screamed death panels and opposed compromise they previously supported. Then republican states barred the expansion of Medicare as an alternative option. And still they have no plan. None.

Prior to Obamacare, my premiums and copays increased by double digit %'s year after year after year. The only times they didn't is when I was a union member and collectively we spoke up and since passage, my premiums increased in single % digits and have stayed flat for the past two years. But then again, I work in a state that embraced romneycare from day one and it's what?, only been a decade? And yes, I get excellent care.

So, what's Trump's solution? Here's a clue, he doesn't have one.
Well, if you look at HealthyIndiana you start to get an idea. Ryan has put forth some ideas too. It's not necessarily trumps job to come up with a solution. Oh for the days when congress was the legislature.

Is your plan on the exchanges?

I've done union employee benefits. You guys were giving up other stuff to maintain those things, it's a choice, which is fine. You made that collectively. Wish we had that for Obamacare.

And not disagreeing with the rhetoric you sited, but it's just that rhetoric. Cut through that. How were the republicans given a chance? Obama and Pelosi rammed a 2,000 page bill through without allowing anyone to read it. Nice revisionist history in your part.

Because during negotiations the repubs failed to offer alternatives, support or anything that would result in a final product or victory for Obama. Even after he agreed to address their concerns. They failed. Because all they were concerned about was seeing him fail.

Why is it that all of our allies have universal health care? Is it really that bad of a concept? It is the 21st century afterall.

Halifax2TheMax · February 2017

And I didn't give up anything to maintain my union benefits, personally.

Halifax2TheMax · February 2017

Strength in numbers. The walmart approach to purchasing. But you're okay with Walmart?

EdsonNascimento · February 2017

Halifax2TheMax said:
And I didn't give up anything to maintain my union benefits, personally.

So you think you got health benefits without trade offs elsewhere? Well, that's good. Then you got everything you think you deserved. Which is a great way to end a negotiation.

EdsonNascimento · February 2017

Halifax2TheMax said:

EdsonNascimento said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

EdsonNascimento said:

Halifax2TheMax said:
It's a mess because republicans have sabotaged it. From day one. They even opposed pieces that they previously supported. All to "see this president fail." And they still don't have a solution other than, "let the market decide." Which isn't a solution.
How,did they sabotage it? By not writing a blank check? Good for them.
Republicans in congress, rather than work with Obama, fought it tooth and nail, the idea of universal care. Rather than be part of the process, they screamed death panels and opposed compromise they previously supported. Then republican states barred the expansion of Medicare as an alternative option. And still they have no plan. None.

Prior to Obamacare, my premiums and copays increased by double digit %'s year after year after year. The only times they didn't is when I was a union member and collectively we spoke up and since passage, my premiums increased in single % digits and have stayed flat for the past two years. But then again, I work in a state that embraced romneycare from day one and it's what?, only been a decade? And yes, I get excellent care.

So, what's Trump's solution? Here's a clue, he doesn't have one.
Well, if you look at HealthyIndiana you start to get an idea. Ryan has put forth some ideas too. It's not necessarily trumps job to come up with a solution. Oh for the days when congress was the legislature.

Is your plan on the exchanges?

I've done union employee benefits. You guys were giving up other stuff to maintain those things, it's a choice, which is fine. You made that collectively. Wish we had that for Obamacare.

And not disagreeing with the rhetoric you sited, but it's just that rhetoric. Cut through that. How were the republicans given a chance? Obama and Pelosi rammed a 2,000 page bill through without allowing anyone to read it. Nice revisionist history in your part.
Because during negotiations the repubs failed to offer alternatives, support or anything that would result in a final product or victory for Obama. Even after he agreed to address their concerns. They failed. Because all they were concerned about was seeing him fail.

Why is it that all of our allies have universal health care? Is it really that bad of a concept? It is the 21st century afterall.

We do have universal health care. I guess it's how you define that. When other countries have our diversity, they can start comparing problems. Did you know there's a small area in Queens NY that has more ethnicities than anywhere in the world? Does Canada have as many ethnicities as Queens NY in its entire country?

EdsonNascimento · February 2017

Halifax2TheMax said:
Strength in numbers. The walmart approach to purchasing. But you're okay with Walmart?

Do I agree with everything Walmart does? I'm sure not, but I honestly haven't study that micro economy that much. But does Walmart provide a valuable service for consumers and employees? Not saying it's perfect. Just asking if Walmart did not provide the prices and wide variety of products it does would it's consumers be better or worse off? And does that enable more or less employment?

oftenreading · February 2017

EdsonNascimento said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

EdsonNascimento said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

EdsonNascimento said:

Halifax2TheMax said:
It's a mess because republicans have sabotaged it. From day one. They even opposed pieces that they previously supported. All to "see this president fail." And they still don't have a solution other than, "let the market decide." Which isn't a solution.
How,did they sabotage it? By not writing a blank check? Good for them.
Republicans in congress, rather than work with Obama, fought it tooth and nail, the idea of universal care. Rather than be part of the process, they screamed death panels and opposed compromise they previously supported. Then republican states barred the expansion of Medicare as an alternative option. And still they have no plan. None.

Prior to Obamacare, my premiums and copays increased by double digit %'s year after year after year. The only times they didn't is when I was a union member and collectively we spoke up and since passage, my premiums increased in single % digits and have stayed flat for the past two years. But then again, I work in a state that embraced romneycare from day one and it's what?, only been a decade? And yes, I get excellent care.

So, what's Trump's solution? Here's a clue, he doesn't have one.
Well, if you look at HealthyIndiana you start to get an idea. Ryan has put forth some ideas too. It's not necessarily trumps job to come up with a solution. Oh for the days when congress was the legislature.

Is your plan on the exchanges?

I've done union employee benefits. You guys were giving up other stuff to maintain those things, it's a choice, which is fine. You made that collectively. Wish we had that for Obamacare.

And not disagreeing with the rhetoric you sited, but it's just that rhetoric. Cut through that. How were the republicans given a chance? Obama and Pelosi rammed a 2,000 page bill through without allowing anyone to read it. Nice revisionist history in your part.
Because during negotiations the repubs failed to offer alternatives, support or anything that would result in a final product or victory for Obama. Even after he agreed to address their concerns. They failed. Because all they were concerned about was seeing him fail.

Why is it that all of our allies have universal health care? Is it really that bad of a concept? It is the 21st century afterall.
We do have universal health care. I guess it's how you define that. When other countries have our diversity, they can start comparing problems. Did you know there's a small area in Queens NY that has more ethnicities than anywhere in the world? Does Canada have as many ethnicities as Queens NY in its entire country?

It doesn't matter what ethnicity you are, you still deserve health care. That's a ridiculous non sequitur.

And the US has universal health care? By what measure?

Obamacare is a mess

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