Hillary won more votes for President

Ledbetterman10 said:

The Juggler said:

Ledbetterman10 said:

dignin said:

JimmyV said:

JC29856 said:

Hillary Clinton lost the election in the Midwest. Donald Trump won 50 Midwestern electoral votes that went to Barack Obama in 2012 -- Iowa, Wisconsin, Michigan and Ohio -- plus 20 more in Pennsylvania, where the two-thirds of voters beyond metro Philadelphia are Midwestern in culture and concerns. Trump could have lost Florida and still won.

In the popular vote, Clinton came close to equaling Obama's 2012 percentages in the South and not-yet-fully-counted West, and her 4 percent drop in the Northeast cost her no electoral votes. But in the Midwest and Pennsylvania, the Democratic presidential percentage dropped from 54 percent in 2008 and 51 percent in 2012 to 45 percent in 2016.

Yep. There shouldn't be any doubt. This wasn't Comey or Wiki or Sexism or Third Parties. None of those things helped, certainly, but none of them caused this defeat, either. Campaign strategy and messaging, more than anything else, led to Donald Trump.

I don't believe that. She lost a few of those states by really close margins. To say that the FBI, or hacked emails, or sexism, or third parties didn't account for those lost close margins is ignoring a big part of the story.

And to say that campaign strategy didn't account for those lost close margins is ignoring a big part of the story too. Look at the very last night of the campaign. Where was Hillary? She was in Philadelphia, where she was already surely going to get a large portion of the electorate, having what one can describe as a party (complete with Beyoncé). Where was Trump? He was in Lackawanna County in Pennsylvania (the Scranton area) campaigning. Obama got 63% of the vote in Lackawanna County in 2012 and Hillary got only 50% in 2016; technically a narrow win for Hillary, but really, just for making up so much ground, a win for Trump. This is despite both Hillary's grandfather and Joe Biden hailing from Scranton.

Now I'm not saying that one additional campaign stop in a battleground area was the difference. But it does stand as a microcosm for the entire campaign season: Trump campaigning to the bitter end and Hillary pre-maturely celebrating. And I've read that Bill Clinton had suggested to Hillary's camp that they should campaign more in Michigan and Wisconsin but they weren't worried about those states. But what does Bill know. He's only been referred to (by conservatives that hate him, no less) as one of the best politicians ever.

And enough about sexism, it's arguable that Hillary's sex was part of her success. Really, what else did she have going for her other than being a woman? Take a comparable male candidate, that's under federal investigation, that has no charisma, that's being shoved down the voters' throats by the DNC, and he doesn't come close to Hillary's vote total.

In the end, she just didn't inspire enough people. That's why so many democrats stayed home. Or maybe they stayed home because they, like her, thought she had it in the bag. Why wait in line to vote when the result is inevitable? Trump, despite his claims of not being a politician, proved to be the far superior politician. You can criticize the means in which he went about things, the fact that he rarely has a clue what he's talking about, all his lies, his shady business career, etc. and they'd all be valid criticisms (ones that I've made myself). But in the end, like Hillary's previous presidential opponents (Sanders and Obama), he got people passionate about him. Nobody was passionate about Hillary. As I filled in the circle next to her name on election day, it was under the idea of "this is what I should do" rather than "this is what I WANT to do."

I agree with the passion and enthusiasm stuff but disagree about it being a mistake to end her campaign the way she did in Philly. If she ran up the numbers a little more in Philly and surrounding areas, she may have won the state. At that point she was more likely to get more people from her traditional blue area of the state to come out and vote for her than hoping to change some people's minds up in the Scranton area.....despite having some family roots there.

And Philly wasn't the last stop. She ended in NC a few hours later....with Lady Gaga. haha

But you see what I'm saying: Celebratory-like bashes with Beyonce and Lady Gaga vs. Trump just...um...trumping..show a sharp contrast in the campaigns...even if I'm only realizing it in hindsight.

I dunno. There just always seemed like an "I got this" vibe from Hillary that annoyed me throughout the entire primary and general election. Consider this clip....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AFGiZT-MnI4

So Trump throws out this one-liner that, like many of his statements, is unbecoming of a presidential debate. And knowing that, Hillary just ignores it and moves on. "I'm not dignifying that with a response" she must have thought. "Soon I'll be president and this circus act will be forgotten." Wrong attitude. If Trump drops that "you'd be in jail" line on Bernie Sanders, Sanders replies "No, Mr. Trump. YOU should be in jail. YOU don't pay taxes, YOU rip-off your contractors, and YOU have been accused of sexual assault by 10 women in the past week." But Hillary couldn't be bothered with that sort of back-and-forth. It's "beneath" her.

Watching Hillary was like watching the Tomlin-coached Steelers against a crappy team. "We got this. Look how much better we are than them." Then Tebow connects on an 80-yard TD to beat you in overtime.

JC29856 said:

Anyone know if Clinton's are offering black Friday sales on speeches??

Gern Blansten said:

Basically 108,000 votes decided the election. That was Trump's margin of victory in PA, WI, MI

Yet Clinton received 2.5 million votes more than Trump. Doesn't make sense.

Gern Blansten said:

Basically 108,000 votes decided the election. That was Trump's margin of victory in PA, WI, MI

Yet Clinton received 2.5 million votes more than Trump. Doesn't make sense.