Hillary won more votes for President

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Comments

  • Go BeaversGo Beavers Posts: 9,419
    BS44325 said:

    They are both terrible. Trump's terrible can at least be checked. Hillary will continue to get away with her terrible. I am for the terrible that is easier to police.
    This seems like an attempt by some conservatives to try and lessen the blow of what they picture a Trump presidency would be like. The president has to make actual decisions that have outcomes. It's not like that would be suspended because we elected a buffoon. Past presidents made horrible decisions, why would Trump be magically stopped from doing the same?
  • This seems like an attempt by some conservatives to try and lessen the blow of what they picture a Trump presidency would be like. The president has to make actual decisions that have outcomes. It's not like that would be suspended because we elected a buffoon. Past presidents made horrible decisions, why would Trump be magically stopped from doing the same?
    Are you asking people in the Hillary thread about Trump?
    If so well, what bad decisions will Trump do that you want him to be magically stopped?
  • Go BeaversGo Beavers Posts: 9,419

    Are you asking people in the Hillary thread about Trump?
    If so well, what bad decisions will Trump do that you want him to be magically stopped?
    If Trump was prez, I can imagine that I'd disagree with about 99% of his decisions.
  • If Trump was prez, I can imagine that I'd disagree with about 99% of his decisions.
    This is why he is in the 1% and is in the running for POTUS.
    Same w/ Hillary.
  • BS44325BS44325 Posts: 6,124
    mrussel1 said:

    Why do you think Trump can be checked and Hillary can't? At least Hillary isn't erratic and batshit crazy.
    Not erratic? Uh...the secret service seems to disagree. Trump can be checked because he is running against the republican and democratic establishment. Congress, regardless of who controls it, along with the lifelong bureaucrats will be far more likely to resist any change by Trump which they feel as forced. The system doesn't like him and they along with the media will push back. Clinton on the other hand has shown to be entrenched in the system and the bureaucracy/media will be compliant with her wishes. It's a system where they all get rich and it has been going on for years and it won't change. His terribleness will be resisted while her terribleness is contagious.
  • Go BeaversGo Beavers Posts: 9,419
    BS44325 said:

    Not erratic? Uh...the secret service seems to disagree. Trump can be checked because he is running against the republican and democratic establishment. Congress, regardless of who controls it, along with the lifelong bureaucrats will be far more likely to resist any change by Trump which they feel as forced. The system doesn't like him and they along with the media will push back. Clinton on the other hand has shown to be entrenched in the system and the bureaucracy/media will be compliant with her wishes. It's a system where they all get rich and it has been going on for years and it won't change. His terribleness will be resisted while her terribleness is contagious.
    You know the president doesn't have to run everything by congress, right?
  • BS44325BS44325 Posts: 6,124

    This seems like an attempt by some conservatives to try and lessen the blow of what they picture a Trump presidency would be like. The president has to make actual decisions that have outcomes. It's not like that would be suspended because we elected a buffoon. Past presidents made horrible decisions, why would Trump be magically stopped from doing the same?
    Believe me I know. We have just had 8 years of horrible decisions. Hillary participated in them. Nothing will magically stop Trump but I don't see him getting a free pass from anybody on any decision. He will constantly have to explain himself and whether anybody is satisfied with his answers or not the one thing we do know is that he makes himself far more available to the press then Hillary does. She has a history of being unaccountable and that won't change.
  • Go BeaversGo Beavers Posts: 9,419
    Available to the press? It's not admirable that he feeds his ego by getting free press for his brand.
  • Available to the press? It's not admirable that he feeds his ego by getting free press for his brand.

    Is it admirable for Hillary to get branded by the press as corrupt?
  • Go BeaversGo Beavers Posts: 9,419
    I don't think you understood what I wrote.
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 30,591
    BS44325 said:

    Not erratic? Uh...the secret service seems to disagree. Trump can be checked because he is running against the republican and democratic establishment. Congress, regardless of who controls it, along with the lifelong bureaucrats will be far more likely to resist any change by Trump which they feel as forced. The system doesn't like him and they along with the media will push back. Clinton on the other hand has shown to be entrenched in the system and the bureaucracy/media will be compliant with her wishes. It's a system where they all get rich and it has been going on for years and it won't change. His terribleness will be resisted while her terribleness is contagious.
    Okay so Jason Chaffetz, Mitch, the Teap Party Caucus.... They are just part of Hillarys America and go right along with her plans. Got it. Makes sense. That's why we shut down the the government and have so many useful bills passed.
  • BS44325BS44325 Posts: 6,124

    Available to the press? It's not admirable that he feeds his ego by getting free press for his brand.

    He goes on any show at anytime with no script and no handlers. Sure he dodges like anybody else but he puts himself out there warts and all. He will be judged on his successes and his failures and nobody will cut him any slack. #NeverTrump on the right is not going away and the left/media will pummel him. That creates a chance for real accountability and it is accountability in government that is lacking. Congressional "obstruction" will no longer be an acceptable excuse for failure.
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 30,591
    edited November 2016
    BS44325 said:

    He goes on any show at anytime with no script and no handlers. Sure he dodges like anybody else but he puts himself out there warts and all. He will be judged on his successes and his failures and nobody will cut him any slack. #NeverTrump on the right is not going away and the left/media will pummel him. That creates a chance for real accountability and it is accountability in government that is lacking. Congressional "obstruction" will no longer be an acceptable excuse for failure.
    Easy for a Canadian to say when you don't have to deal with the fallout from his judicial appointments. Will you or your neighbors lose access to planned parenthood services? Healthcare? Gay rights?
  • BS44325BS44325 Posts: 6,124
    mrussel1 said:

    Easy for a Canadian to say when you don't have to deal with the fallout from his judicial appointments. Will you or your neighbors lose access to planned parenthood services? Healthcare? Gay rights?
    Completely fair point on judicial appointments but the senate will still remain closely divided no matter what. This is why I think it's a mistake for the democrats to already say they will use the nuclear option if they take control of the senate and the presidency. They have tipped their hand so on the outside chance that Trump wins (still not likely) then a republican senate could now do the same thing because the dems already said they would do it first.
  • bootlegger10bootlegger10 Posts: 16,185
    It is unfortunate that so many people get left in the wake of the Clintons. They are disgusting people.
  • It is unfortunate that so many people get left in the wake of the Clintons. They are disgusting people.

    How so?
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 30,591
    BS44325 said:

    Completely fair point on judicial appointments but the senate will still remain closely divided no matter what. This is why I think it's a mistake for the democrats to already say they will use the nuclear option if they take control of the senate and the presidency. They have tipped their hand so on the outside chance that Trump wins (still not likely) then a republican senate could now do the same thing because the dems already said they would do it first.
    No associate justice has ever been subject to a filibuster. But if Trump wins, I can assure you the Dems didn't win the Senate. So it not sure there is any hand tipping going on.
  • bootlegger10bootlegger10 Posts: 16,185
    edited November 2016

    How so?
    Donna Brazile, Huma Abedin, DWS, James Comey, Loretta Lynch, etc...reputations ruined all in service to the Queen or having to be part her mess.
    Post edited by bootlegger10 on
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,089
    Free said:

    Oh, good god, go read the Posesta thread. Plenty of proof there. I'm so sick of hearing people insisting over and over again (not particularly you Hugh) that her campaign hasn't cheated yet there is endless evidence. This just happened in the last week for starters...

    And she's being questioned again by whom? Oh yeah, the FBI.

    http://theantimedia.org/leaked-dnc-rigged-bernie-primary/
    no. full disclosure: i know some of it, but i simply don't have the time to read that entire thread.
    "every society honours its live conformists and its dead troublemakers"




  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,089
    Free said:

    Oh, good god, go read the Posesta thread. Plenty of proof there. I'm so sick of hearing people insisting over and over again (not particularly you Hugh) that her campaign hasn't cheated yet there is endless evidence. This just happened in the last week for starters...

    And she's being questioned again by whom? Oh yeah, the FBI.

    http://theantimedia.org/leaked-dnc-rigged-bernie-primary/
    being questioned means zero. ZERO.

    the debate question shit is faux outrage. who cares. the debates are a meaningless farce anyway. it's grandstanding and ratings bullshit. if trump had been given all the questions in advance he still would have shit the bed. it comes down to how good a public speaker you are, and how much of a moron she isn't. he is terrible at the mic. terrible.

    electiontainment. i may have just coined a new term. it will be trending by the weekend.
    "every society honours its live conformists and its dead troublemakers"




  • JC29856JC29856 Posts: 9,617

    Yes they are all politicians but one side (the GOP) is far worse than the democrats. All politicians stretch the truth...the GOP just flat out lies and deceives. JC's link about Hillary's tax return is proof. How in the hell can there be any criticism of her returns when she has released EVERY return and Trump has released NONE?
    When anyone gets all exited about taxes and tax returns just think of Marc Rich.

    http://www.counterpunch.org/2016/10/03/the-pardon-of-arc-rich-how-hillary-clinton-served-as-the-secret-weapon-for-one-of-the-biggest-tax-cheats-in-american-history/
  • BS44325BS44325 Posts: 6,124
    A lot more detail coming out on the Weiner/Abedin computer

    http://nypost.com/2016/10/31/huma-abedins-april-warning-from-the-fbi/

    The original sin is the server but Clinton has to cut Abedin loose if her campaign is going to recover from this. Or does Abedin know too much? Time is running out.
  • FreeFree Posts: 3,562
    edited November 2016

    being questioned means zero. ZERO.

    the debate question shit is faux outrage. who cares. the debates are a meaningless farce anyway. it's grandstanding and ratings bullshit. if trump had been given all the questions in advance he still would have shit the bed. it comes down to how good a public speaker you are, and how much of a moron she isn't. he is terrible at the mic. terrible.

    electiontainment. i may have just coined a new term. it will be trending by the weekend.
    That is *1* thing you brought up ( yet she was questioning not once, but twice by the FBI) out of a mountain of evidence that she cheated, including repealing Obama is a rule that corporate money and special interest money would not be allowed into campaigns, the use of superdelegates, the rigging of the DNC against Bernie Sanders… I can go on. How about all the people left in the wake of Hillary Clinton, Donna Brazile, DWS, Secret service, etc...
    Post edited by Free on
  • JC29856JC29856 Posts: 9,617
    How can Hilliary be tied with trump in the popular vote? Forget electoral college winner take all electioneering, I'm asking the popular vote.
    Doesn't that mean she already failed? She is running against Donald Trump!
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,089
    Free said:

    That is *1* thing you brought up ( yet she was questioning not once, but twice by the FBI) out of a mountain of evidence that she cheated, including repealing Obama is a rule that corporate money and special interest money would not be allowed into campaigns, the use of superdelegates, the rigging of the DNC against Bernie Sanders… I can go on. How about all the people left in the wake of Hillary Clinton, Donna Brazile, DWS, Secret service, etc...
    again, superdelegates are not cheating. I think they suck as a rule, but they are perfectly legal within the confines of the DNC. just because you think it isn't fair doesn't mean it's cheating.

    I still keep reading "rigging the DNC against bernie" comments, but I don't know how it was rigged.

    The rest I am admittedly ignorant about, so can't comment.
    "every society honours its live conformists and its dead troublemakers"




  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,089
    I really can't for the life of me believe that either convention would use their leverage to purposely nominate the less-popular candidate as their leader. that simply makes zero sense if the purpose is to win in the general.
    "every society honours its live conformists and its dead troublemakers"




  • benjsbenjs Toronto, ON Posts: 9,312
    edited November 2016
    Free said:

    That is *1* thing you brought up ( yet she was questioning not once, but twice by the FBI) out of a mountain of evidence that she cheated, including repealing Obama is a rule that corporate money and special interest money would not be allowed into campaigns, the use of superdelegates, the rigging of the DNC against Bernie Sanders… I can go on. How about all the people left in the wake of Hillary Clinton, Donna Brazile, DWS, Secret service, etc...
    A system has loopholes and the users of the system are blamed for exploiting those loopholes? Clinton exploiting the political breaks is absolutely no different than Trump exploiting taxation loopholes for his own benefit. For some reason, with Trump he was impulsively scrutinized for his exploitation, then quickly it was admitted that this was legal and the criticism belongs with the lack of checks and balances that permit his actions. With Clinton, she is still being criticized for her exploitation. For someone who loathes "the system" as much as you do, you've been completely unable to articulate what to do about it.

    I've said this before and I'll say it again: who governs the government? There's an inherent flaw with a capitalist democracy, which is that its political players are permitted to partake infinitely in the currency of power (money), which means the natural course of a politician will inevitably gravitate towards the self-serving actions which garner him or her more power (aka money). Without a third-party governing these politicians and the direction of the laws they pass, you will not ever be rid of this corruption. The answer is not a political messiah (sure, Bernie's Jewish and has made promises that he was never able to keep just like Jesus, but that's where the similarities end): that's stacked odds to the n-th degree. The answer MIGHT be a mobilized people who force the empowerment of government watchdog groups - and even then, these groups will be subject to their own corruption if not truly held accountable by the people. I'm not saying this would be perfect, but I think it would be a step in the right direction.

    To summarize, don't hate the players, hate the game - and we should be way more focused on finding ways to communicate with the game makers, tell them we won't tolerate the poorly constructed rules, and provide an alternative set.
    Post edited by benjs on
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    EV
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  • Go BeaversGo Beavers Posts: 9,419
    JC29856 said:

    How can Hilliary be tied with trump in the popular vote? Forget electoral college winner take all electioneering, I'm asking the popular vote.
    Doesn't that mean she already failed? She is running against Donald Trump!

    I'm seeing her about 4 points ahead of Trump.
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,089
    benjs said:

    A system has loopholes and the users of the system are blamed for exploiting those loopholes? Clinton exploiting the political breaks is absolutely no different than Trump exploiting taxation loopholes for his own benefit. For some reason, with Trump he was impulsively scrutinized for his exploitation, then quickly it was admitted that this was legal and the criticism belongs with the lack of checks and balances that permit his exploitation. With Clinton, she is still being criticized for her exploitation. For someone who loathes "the system" as much as you do, you've been completely unable to articulate what to do about the system.

    I've said it before and I'll say it again: who governs the government? There's an inherent flaw with a capitalist democracy, which is that its political players are permitted to partake infinitely in the currency of power (money), which means the natural course of a politician will inevitably gravitate towards the self-serving actions which garner him or her more power (aka money). Without a third-party governing these politicians and the direction of the laws they pass, you will not ever be rid of this corruption. The answer is not a political messiah (sure, Bernie's Jewish and has made promises that he was never able to keep just like Jesus, but that's where the similarities end): that's stacked odds to the n-th degree. The answer MIGHT be a mobilized people who force the empowerment of government watchdog groups - and even then, these groups will be subject to their own corruption if not truly held accountable by the people. I'm not saying this would be perfect, but I think it would be a step in the right direction.
    excellently put.
    "every society honours its live conformists and its dead troublemakers"




  • Jason PJason P Posts: 19,201
    So is this it for Huma? It would be weird if Hillary punished her for standing by her womanizing husband, right?
    Be Excellent To Each Other
    Party On, Dudes!
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