Should the US institute a ban on assault weapons.

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Comments

  • myoung321
    myoung321 Posts: 2,855
    edited July 2016
    Yes
    “The fact that we’re living in a country where 90 percent of the people want further gun laws — to maybe somehow put a dent in some of this insanity that’s happening — and yet there’s no further legislation taking place, it’s very frustrating and upsetting,” Vedder told Richards in a clip from the discussion, which HuffPost Entertainment is debuting above. “If I didn’t have music to kind of at least get some of the aggression out or take the edge off, you wouldn’t want me having a gun either.”

    “I get so angry that I almost wish bad things upon these people,” Vedder said. “But I don’t have to because it seems like they happen anyways. It seems like every week I’m reading about a 4-year-old either shooting their sister, their dad, their dog, their brother or themselves, because there’s fucking guns laying around. But I guess it’s ‘fun.’”

    Eddie Vedder

    Article link



    Post edited by myoung321 on
    "The heart and mind are the true lens of the camera." - Yusuf Karsh
     


  • PJPOWER
    PJPOWER Posts: 6,499
    edited July 2016
    other
    myoung321 said:

    “The fact that we’re living in a country where 90 percent of the people want further gun laws — to maybe somehow put a dent in some of this insanity that’s happening — and yet there’s no further legislation taking place, it’s very frustrating and upsetting,” Vedder told Richards in a clip from the discussion, which HuffPost Entertainment is debuting above. “If I didn’t have music to kind of at least get some of the aggression out or take the edge off, you wouldn’t want me having a gun either.”

    “I get so angry that I almost wish bad things upon these people,” Vedder said. “But I don’t have to because it seems like they happen anyways. It seems like every week I’m reading about a 4-year-old either shooting their sister, their dad, their dog, their brother or themselves, because there’s fucking guns laying around. But I guess it’s ‘fun.’”

    Eddie Vedder

    Article link



    Sounds like a good reason to create laws that give people tax breaks for learning safe handling techniques. Or maybe be a true activist and teach a safe gun handling/storage class of your own for free to the public. Guns are here, but the more people that learn how to safely store firearms=less people's kiddos shooting their dogs, sister, dad, selves, because it would also=less guns lying around. Just because we don't agree with your laws does not mean we are not pushing for solutions and a safer society. That seems to be lost on some.
    Post edited by PJPOWER on
  • Thirty Bills Unpaid
    Thirty Bills Unpaid Posts: 16,881
    Yes
    PJPOWER said:

    myoung321 said:

    “The fact that we’re living in a country where 90 percent of the people want further gun laws — to maybe somehow put a dent in some of this insanity that’s happening — and yet there’s no further legislation taking place, it’s very frustrating and upsetting,” Vedder told Richards in a clip from the discussion, which HuffPost Entertainment is debuting above. “If I didn’t have music to kind of at least get some of the aggression out or take the edge off, you wouldn’t want me having a gun either.”

    “I get so angry that I almost wish bad things upon these people,” Vedder said. “But I don’t have to because it seems like they happen anyways. It seems like every week I’m reading about a 4-year-old either shooting their sister, their dad, their dog, their brother or themselves, because there’s fucking guns laying around. But I guess it’s ‘fun.’”

    Eddie Vedder

    Article link



    Sounds like a good reason to create laws that give people tax breaks for learning safe handling techniques. Or maybe be a true activist and teach a safe gun handling/storage class of your own for free to the public. Guns are here, but the more people that learn how to safely store firearms=less people's kiddos shooting their dogs, sister, dad, selves, because it would also=less guns lying around. Just because we don't agree with your laws does not mean we are not pushing for solutions and a safer society. That seems to be lost on some.
    You mean like safe injection sites for heroin users?

    What's lost here, sir, is the very basic correlation that is simply indisputable: more guns equals more deaths by guns.

    Defend your hobby any way you want, but don't try to dissuade intelligent people to dismiss common sense (gun courses for all and no problems!). You'd get more respect from me saying, "F**k all you wussies. I love my guns and you ain't ever getting them" versus trying to frame an argument that flies in the face of logic.
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • Godfather.
    Godfather. Posts: 12,504
    No
    somebody call whaaaaaabulance.

    Godfather.
  • PJPOWER
    PJPOWER Posts: 6,499
    edited July 2016
    other
    Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

    PJPOWER said:

    myoung321 said:

    “The fact that we’re living in a country where 90 percent of the people want further gun laws — to maybe somehow put a dent in some of this insanity that’s happening — and yet there’s no further legislation taking place, it’s very frustrating and upsetting,” Vedder told Richards in a clip from the discussion, which HuffPost Entertainment is debuting above. “If I didn’t have music to kind of at least get some of the aggression out or take the edge off, you wouldn’t want me having a gun either.”

    “I get so angry that I almost wish bad things upon these people,” Vedder said. “But I don’t have to because it seems like they happen anyways. It seems like every week I’m reading about a 4-year-old either shooting their sister, their dad, their dog, their brother or themselves, because there’s fucking guns laying around. But I guess it’s ‘fun.’”

    Eddie Vedder

    Article link



    Sounds like a good reason to create laws that give people tax breaks for learning safe handling techniques. Or maybe be a true activist and teach a safe gun handling/storage class of your own for free to the public. Guns are here, but the more people that learn how to safely store firearms=less people's kiddos shooting their dogs, sister, dad, selves, because it would also=less guns lying around. Just because we don't agree with your laws does not mean we are not pushing for solutions and a safer society. That seems to be lost on some.
    You mean like safe injection sites for heroin users?

    What's lost here, sir, is the very basic correlation that is simply indisputable: more guns equals more deaths by guns.

    Defend your hobby any way you want, but don't try to dissuade intelligent people to dismiss common sense (gun courses for all and no problems!). You'd get more respect from me saying, "F**k all you wussies. I love my guns and you ain't ever getting them" versus trying to frame an argument that flies in the face of logic.
    Typical elitist response... If someone disagrees with your strategy, they are disrespectful and illogical. I just believe in education over regulation, plus it's something that can be done now, instead of waiting on politicians. You would gain my respect if you weren't so condescending. That's okay, I can ignore you from now on too...what a jerk... Go ahead an continue beating your head against a wall trying to make guns disappear and I'll continue pushing my realistic ideas of logical, common sense, change, "change you can believe in" lol.
    Post edited by PJPOWER on
  • rgambs
    rgambs Posts: 13,576
    other
    PJPOWER said:

    myoung321 said:

    “The fact that we’re living in a country where 90 percent of the people want further gun laws — to maybe somehow put a dent in some of this insanity that’s happening — and yet there’s no further legislation taking place, it’s very frustrating and upsetting,” Vedder told Richards in a clip from the discussion, which HuffPost Entertainment is debuting above. “If I didn’t have music to kind of at least get some of the aggression out or take the edge off, you wouldn’t want me having a gun either.”

    “I get so angry that I almost wish bad things upon these people,” Vedder said. “But I don’t have to because it seems like they happen anyways. It seems like every week I’m reading about a 4-year-old either shooting their sister, their dad, their dog, their brother or themselves, because there’s fucking guns laying around. But I guess it’s ‘fun.’”

    Eddie Vedder

    Article link



    Sounds like a good reason to create laws that give people tax breaks for learning safe handling techniques. Or maybe be a true activist and teach a safe gun handling/storage class of your own for free to the public. Guns are here, but the more people that learn how to safely store firearms=less people's kiddos shooting their dogs, sister, dad, selves, because it would also=less guns lying around. Just because we don't agree with your laws does not mean we are not pushing for solutions and a safer society. That seems to be lost on some.
    PJPOWER said:

    myoung321 said:

    “The fact that we’re living in a country where 90 percent of the people want further gun laws — to maybe somehow put a dent in some of this insanity that’s happening — and yet there’s no further legislation taking place, it’s very frustrating and upsetting,” Vedder told Richards in a clip from the discussion, which HuffPost Entertainment is debuting above. “If I didn’t have music to kind of at least get some of the aggression out or take the edge off, you wouldn’t want me having a gun either.”

    “I get so angry that I almost wish bad things upon these people,” Vedder said. “But I don’t have to because it seems like they happen anyways. It seems like every week I’m reading about a 4-year-old either shooting their sister, their dad, their dog, their brother or themselves, because there’s fucking guns laying around. But I guess it’s ‘fun.’”

    Eddie Vedder

    Article link



    Sounds like a good reason to create laws that give people tax breaks for learning safe handling techniques. Or maybe be a true activist and teach a safe gun handling/storage class of your own for free to the public. Guns are here, but the more people that learn how to safely store firearms=less people's kiddos shooting their dogs, sister, dad, selves, because it would also=less guns lying around. Just because we don't agree with your laws does not mean we are not pushing for solutions and a safer society. That seems to be lost on some.
    PJPOWER said:

    myoung321 said:

    “The fact that we’re living in a country where 90 percent of the people want further gun laws — to maybe somehow put a dent in some of this insanity that’s happening — and yet there’s no further legislation taking place, it’s very frustrating and upsetting,” Vedder told Richards in a clip from the discussion, which HuffPost Entertainment is debuting above. “If I didn’t have music to kind of at least get some of the aggression out or take the edge off, you wouldn’t want me having a gun either.”

    “I get so angry that I almost wish bad things upon these people,” Vedder said. “But I don’t have to because it seems like they happen anyways. It seems like every week I’m reading about a 4-year-old either shooting their sister, their dad, their dog, their brother or themselves, because there’s fucking guns laying around. But I guess it’s ‘fun.’”

    Eddie Vedder

    Article link



    Sounds like a good reason to create laws that give people tax breaks for learning safe handling techniques. Or maybe be a true activist and teach a safe gun handling/storage class of your own for free to the public. Guns are here, but the more people that learn how to safely store firearms=less people's kiddos shooting their dogs, sister, dad, selves, because it would also=less guns lying around. Just because we don't agree with your laws does not mean we are not pushing for solutions and a safer society. That seems to be lost on some.
    This is just fantasy. The idea that proper education about firearms will stop people from using them is naive at best. Children who have been taught gun safety by parents who are gun obsessed still get the guns out to show off to their friends or play pretend, and they still blow each other away.
    Gun education doesn't stop cops from blowing people away at the theaters, or gun advocate women from blowing their daughters away in the heat of an argument.
    The number of people who have guns and lack the education you propose is minimal and violence is not deterred by knowing safety techniques, no matter how much you wish it to be so.
    Monkey Driven, Call this Living?
  • PJPOWER
    PJPOWER Posts: 6,499
    edited July 2016
    other
    rgambs said:

    PJPOWER said:

    myoung321 said:

    “The fact that we’re living in a country where 90 percent of the people want further gun laws — to maybe somehow put a dent in some of this insanity that’s happening — and yet there’s no further legislation taking place, it’s very frustrating and upsetting,” Vedder told Richards in a clip from the discussion, which HuffPost Entertainment is debuting above. “If I didn’t have music to kind of at least get some of the aggression out or take the edge off, you wouldn’t want me having a gun either.”

    “I get so angry that I almost wish bad things upon these people,” Vedder said. “But I don’t have to because it seems like they happen anyways. It seems like every week I’m reading about a 4-year-old either shooting their sister, their dad, their dog, their brother or themselves, because there’s fucking guns laying around. But I guess it’s ‘fun.’”

    Eddie Vedder

    Article link



    Sounds like a good reason to create laws that give people tax breaks for learning safe handling techniques. Or maybe be a true activist and teach a safe gun handling/storage class of your own for free to the public. Guns are here, but the more people that learn how to safely store firearms=less people's kiddos shooting their dogs, sister, dad, selves, because it would also=less guns lying around. Just because we don't agree with your laws does not mean we are not pushing for solutions and a safer society. That seems to be lost on some.
    PJPOWER said:

    myoung321 said:

    “The fact that we’re living in a country where 90 percent of the people want further gun laws — to maybe somehow put a dent in some of this insanity that’s happening — and yet there’s no further legislation taking place, it’s very frustrating and upsetting,” Vedder told Richards in a clip from the discussion, which HuffPost Entertainment is debuting above. “If I didn’t have music to kind of at least get some of the aggression out or take the edge off, you wouldn’t want me having a gun either.”

    “I get so angry that I almost wish bad things upon these people,” Vedder said. “But I don’t have to because it seems like they happen anyways. It seems like every week I’m reading about a 4-year-old either shooting their sister, their dad, their dog, their brother or themselves, because there’s fucking guns laying around. But I guess it’s ‘fun.’”

    Eddie Vedder

    Article link



    Sounds like a good reason to create laws that give people tax breaks for learning safe handling techniques. Or maybe be a true activist and teach a safe gun handling/storage class of your own for free to the public. Guns are here, but the more people that learn how to safely store firearms=less people's kiddos shooting their dogs, sister, dad, selves, because it would also=less guns lying around. Just because we don't agree with your laws does not mean we are not pushing for solutions and a safer society. That seems to be lost on some.
    PJPOWER said:

    myoung321 said:

    “The fact that we’re living in a country where 90 percent of the people want further gun laws — to maybe somehow put a dent in some of this insanity that’s happening — and yet there’s no further legislation taking place, it’s very frustrating and upsetting,” Vedder told Richards in a clip from the discussion, which HuffPost Entertainment is debuting above. “If I didn’t have music to kind of at least get some of the aggression out or take the edge off, you wouldn’t want me having a gun either.”

    “I get so angry that I almost wish bad things upon these people,” Vedder said. “But I don’t have to because it seems like they happen anyways. It seems like every week I’m reading about a 4-year-old either shooting their sister, their dad, their dog, their brother or themselves, because there’s fucking guns laying around. But I guess it’s ‘fun.’”

    Eddie Vedder

    Article link



    Sounds like a good reason to create laws that give people tax breaks for learning safe handling techniques. Or maybe be a true activist and teach a safe gun handling/storage class of your own for free to the public. Guns are here, but the more people that learn how to safely store firearms=less people's kiddos shooting their dogs, sister, dad, selves, because it would also=less guns lying around. Just because we don't agree with your laws does not mean we are not pushing for solutions and a safer society. That seems to be lost on some.
    This is just fantasy. The idea that proper education about firearms will stop people from using them is naive at best. Children who have been taught gun safety by parents who are gun obsessed still get the guns out to show off to their friends or play pretend, and they still blow each other away.
    Gun education doesn't stop cops from blowing people away at the theaters, or gun advocate women from blowing their daughters away in the heat of an argument.
    The number of people who have guns and lack the education you propose is minimal and violence is not deterred by knowing safety techniques, no matter how much you wish it to be so.
    I'm curious as to how you back up these claims. So parenting classes are bad because some people still abuse their children? I feel that training and education in a number of different areas could be beneficial. Fantasy is believing that evil people or firearms are not always going to be around. Fantasy is believing that there will be bipartisan support for any kind of firearm bans. Reality is that people save lives that have been trained in basic first aid, CPR, active shooter response, situational awareness, gun safety. If people had financial incentives to attend such trainings, there would be many more attendees. With the billions of dollars wasted on failed legislation attempts, you could probably have provided every gun owner with a handgun safe or $50 cash for attending trainings. How the hell can you say that accidents would not be reduced if more people learned proper safety techniques. I'm starting to think that you guys just want to punish people that do not agree with you instead of thinking of other sensible strategies. Hell, I don't even care if you keep pushing this ridiculous "make assault weapons disappear" rhetoric, but do something to help yourself or the community in the mean time. Are you trained in CPR, active shooter awareness, basic first aid or anything like that? It's hard to take people seriously that do not attempt to even help themselves. Keep on waiting for the government to make things better for you, that always seems to work in such an efficient timely manner. Being an activist is about more than holding signs at a protest or playing on online forums. Get out and learn active shooter awareness and teach others what you have learned. The more people that know how to properly barricade a door or apply a tourniquet or respond with force...the more lives get saved when bad people decide to do bad things. Seems like a reasonable way to spend your time in between wishing that guns and bad people would disappear.
    Here's a good place to start!!!
    https://www.dhs.gov/active-shooter-preparedness
    Post edited by PJPOWER on
  • Bentleyspop
    Bentleyspop Craft Beer Brewery, Colorado Posts: 11,410
    Yes
    Godfather. said:

    somebody call whaaaaaabulance.

    Godfather.

    “I get so angry that I almost wish bad things upon these people,” Vedder said. “But I don’t have to because it seems like they happen anyways. It seems like every week I’m reading about a 4-year-old either shooting their sister, their dad, their dog, their brother or themselves, because there’s fucking guns laying around. But I guess it’s ‘fun.’”

    Eddie Vedder
  • PJPOWER
    PJPOWER Posts: 6,499
    other
    Bentleyspop said:

    Godfather. said:

    somebody call whaaaaaabulance.

    Godfather.

    “I get so angry that I almost wish bad things upon these people,” Vedder said. “But I don’t have to because it seems like they happen anyways. It seems like every week I’m reading about a 4-year-old either shooting their sister, their dad, their dog, their brother or themselves, because there’s fucking guns laying around. But I guess it’s ‘fun.’”

    Eddie Vedder
    Does having armed security make celebrities safer or less safe? Too bad we cannot all afford our own armed security everywhere we go...
  • mcgruff10
    mcgruff10 New Jersey Posts: 29,114
    No
    PJPOWER said:

    rgambs said:

    PJPOWER said:

    myoung321 said:

    “The fact that we’re living in a country where 90 percent of the people want further gun laws — to maybe somehow put a dent in some of this insanity that’s happening — and yet there’s no further legislation taking place, it’s very frustrating and upsetting,” Vedder told Richards in a clip from the discussion, which HuffPost Entertainment is debuting above. “If I didn’t have music to kind of at least get some of the aggression out or take the edge off, you wouldn’t want me having a gun either.”

    “I get so angry that I almost wish bad things upon these people,” Vedder said. “But I don’t have to because it seems like they happen anyways. It seems like every week I’m reading about a 4-year-old either shooting their sister, their dad, their dog, their brother or themselves, because there’s fucking guns laying around. But I guess it’s ‘fun.’”

    Eddie Vedder

    Article link



    Sounds like a good reason to create laws that give people tax breaks for learning safe handling techniques. Or maybe be a true activist and teach a safe gun handling/storage class of your own for free to the public. Guns are here, but the more people that learn how to safely store firearms=less people's kiddos shooting their dogs, sister, dad, selves, because it would also=less guns lying around. Just because we don't agree with your laws does not mean we are not pushing for solutions and a safer society. That seems to be lost on some.
    PJPOWER said:

    myoung321 said:

    “The fact that we’re living in a country where 90 percent of the people want further gun laws — to maybe somehow put a dent in some of this insanity that’s happening — and yet there’s no further legislation taking place, it’s very frustrating and upsetting,” Vedder told Richards in a clip from the discussion, which HuffPost Entertainment is debuting above. “If I didn’t have music to kind of at least get some of the aggression out or take the edge off, you wouldn’t want me having a gun either.”

    “I get so angry that I almost wish bad things upon these people,” Vedder said. “But I don’t have to because it seems like they happen anyways. It seems like every week I’m reading about a 4-year-old either shooting their sister, their dad, their dog, their brother or themselves, because there’s fucking guns laying around. But I guess it’s ‘fun.’”

    Eddie Vedder

    Article link



    Sounds like a good reason to create laws that give people tax breaks for learning safe handling techniques. Or maybe be a true activist and teach a safe gun handling/storage class of your own for free to the public. Guns are here, but the more people that learn how to safely store firearms=less people's kiddos shooting their dogs, sister, dad, selves, because it would also=less guns lying around. Just because we don't agree with your laws does not mean we are not pushing for solutions and a safer society. That seems to be lost on some.
    PJPOWER said:

    myoung321 said:

    “The fact that we’re living in a country where 90 percent of the people want further gun laws — to maybe somehow put a dent in some of this insanity that’s happening — and yet there’s no further legislation taking place, it’s very frustrating and upsetting,” Vedder told Richards in a clip from the discussion, which HuffPost Entertainment is debuting above. “If I didn’t have music to kind of at least get some of the aggression out or take the edge off, you wouldn’t want me having a gun either.”

    “I get so angry that I almost wish bad things upon these people,” Vedder said. “But I don’t have to because it seems like they happen anyways. It seems like every week I’m reading about a 4-year-old either shooting their sister, their dad, their dog, their brother or themselves, because there’s fucking guns laying around. But I guess it’s ‘fun.’”

    Eddie Vedder

    Article link



    Sounds like a good reason to create laws that give people tax breaks for learning safe handling techniques. Or maybe be a true activist and teach a safe gun handling/storage class of your own for free to the public. Guns are here, but the more people that learn how to safely store firearms=less people's kiddos shooting their dogs, sister, dad, selves, because it would also=less guns lying around. Just because we don't agree with your laws does not mean we are not pushing for solutions and a safer society. That seems to be lost on some.
    This is just fantasy. The idea that proper education about firearms will stop people from using them is naive at best. Children who have been taught gun safety by parents who are gun obsessed still get the guns out to show off to their friends or play pretend, and they still blow each other away.
    Gun education doesn't stop cops from blowing people away at the theaters, or gun advocate women from blowing their daughters away in the heat of an argument.
    The number of people who have guns and lack the education you propose is minimal and violence is not deterred by knowing safety techniques, no matter how much you wish it to be so.
    I'm curious as to how you back up these claims. So parenting classes are bad because some people still abuse their children? I feel that training and education in a number of different areas could be beneficial. Fantasy is believing that evil people or firearms are not always going to be around. Fantasy is believing that there will be bipartisan support for any kind of firearm bans. Reality is that people save lives that have been trained in basic first aid, CPR, active shooter response, situational awareness, gun safety. If people had financial incentives to attend such trainings, there would be many more attendees. With the billions of dollars wasted on failed legislation attempts, you could probably have provided every gun owner with a handgun safe or $50 cash for attending trainings. How the hell can you say that accidents would not be reduced if more people learned proper safety techniques. I'm starting to think that you guys just want to punish people that do not agree with you instead of thinking of other sensible strategies. Hell, I don't even care if you keep pushing this ridiculous "make assault weapons disappear" rhetoric, but do something to help yourself or the community in the mean time. Are you trained in CPR, active shooter awareness, basic first aid or anything like that? It's hard to take people seriously that do not attempt to even help themselves. Keep on waiting for the government to make things better for you, that always seems to work in such an efficient timely manner. Being an activist is about more than holding signs at a protest or playing on online forums. Get out and learn active shooter awareness and teach others what you have learned. The more people that know how to properly barricade a door or apply a tourniquet or respond with force...the more lives get saved when bad people decide to do bad things. Seems like a reasonable way to spend your time in between wishing that guns and bad people would disappear.
    Here's a good place to start!!!
    https://www.dhs.gov/active-shooter-preparedness
    Well said bud!
    I'll ride the wave where it takes me......
  • rgambs
    rgambs Posts: 13,576
    other
    .
    I'm curious as to how you back up these claims. So parenting classes are bad because some people still abuse their children? I feel that training and education in a number of different areas could be beneficial. Fantasy is believing that evil people or firearms are not always going to be around. Fantasy is believing that there will be bipartisan support for any kind of firearm bans. Reality is that people save lives that have been trained in basic first aid, CPR, active shooter response, situational awareness, gun safety. If people had financial incentives to attend such trainings, there would be many more attendees. With the billions of dollars wasted on failed legislation attempts, you could probably have provided every gun owner with a handgun safe or $50 cash for attending trainings. How the hell can you say that accidents would not be reduced if more people learned proper safety techniques. I'm starting to think that you guys just want to punish people that do not agree with you instead of thinking of other sensible strategies. Hell, I don't even care if you keep pushing this ridiculous "make assault weapons disappear" rhetoric, but do something to help yourself or the community in the mean time. Are you trained in CPR, active shooter awareness, basic first aid or anything like that? It's hard to take people seriously that do not attempt to even help themselves. Keep on waiting for the government to make things better for you, that always seems to work in such an efficient timely manner. Being an activist is about more than holding signs at a protest or playing on online forums. Get out and learn active shooter awareness and teach others what you have learned. The more people that know how to properly barricade a door or apply a tourniquet or respond with force...the more lives get saved when bad people decide to do bad things. Seems like a reasonable way to spend your time in between wishing that guns and bad people would disappear.
    Here's a good place to start!!!
    https://www.dhs.gov/active-shooter-preparedness

    Well, I didn't say proper training and education is a bad thing, only that it will not stop violent people from using guns that shouldn't have been so widely available to murder people in cold blood or heat of the moment. Sure, some accidents will be avoided, but I doubt very many. The idea that learning first aid is helping the community or being an activist is like thinking that putting a bandaid on a severed limb is a viable medical solution to the problem of bleeding out.
    I am an Eagle scout, so first aid, situational awareness, etc is all just common sense to me and mine. I have used CPR, though I didn't save any lives, it's rare that it is effective in doing so.

    You keep saying that billions are wasted on gun control, I have never seen any reliable data on such a claim. It is the job of legislative representatives to draft legislation, not pass out gun safes, so if you look at every bill that doesn't pass as wasted money, you are holding a standard that is ridiculously impossible to uphold.
    Monkey Driven, Call this Living?
  • PJPOWER
    PJPOWER Posts: 6,499
    edited July 2016
    other
    rgambs said:

    .

    I'm curious as to how you back up these claims. So parenting classes are bad because some people still abuse their children? I feel that training and education in a number of different areas could be beneficial. Fantasy is believing that evil people or firearms are not always going to be around. Fantasy is believing that there will be bipartisan support for any kind of firearm bans. Reality is that people save lives that have been trained in basic first aid, CPR, active shooter response, situational awareness, gun safety. If people had financial incentives to attend such trainings, there would be many more attendees. With the billions of dollars wasted on failed legislation attempts, you could probably have provided every gun owner with a handgun safe or $50 cash for attending trainings. How the hell can you say that accidents would not be reduced if more people learned proper safety techniques. I'm starting to think that you guys just want to punish people that do not agree with you instead of thinking of other sensible strategies. Hell, I don't even care if you keep pushing this ridiculous "make assault weapons disappear" rhetoric, but do something to help yourself or the community in the mean time. Are you trained in CPR, active shooter awareness, basic first aid or anything like that? It's hard to take people seriously that do not attempt to even help themselves. Keep on waiting for the government to make things better for you, that always seems to work in such an efficient timely manner. Being an activist is about more than holding signs at a protest or playing on online forums. Get out and learn active shooter awareness and teach others what you have learned. The more people that know how to properly barricade a door or apply a tourniquet or respond with force...the more lives get saved when bad people decide to do bad things. Seems like a reasonable way to spend your time in between wishing that guns and bad people would disappear.
    Here's a good place to start!!!
    https://www.dhs.gov/active-shooter-preparedness

    Well, I didn't say proper training and education is a bad thing, only that it will not stop violent people from using guns that shouldn't have been so widely available to murder people in cold blood or heat of the moment. Sure, some accidents will be avoided, but I doubt very many. The idea that learning first aid is helping the community or being an activist is like thinking that putting a bandaid on a severed limb is a viable medical solution to the problem of bleeding out.
    I am an Eagle scout, so first aid, situational awareness, etc is all just common sense to me and mine. I have used CPR, though I didn't save any lives, it's rare that it is effective in doing so.

    You keep saying that billions are wasted on gun control, I have never seen any reliable data on such a claim. It is the job of legislative representatives to draft legislation, not pass out gun safes, so if you look at every bill that doesn't pass as wasted money, you are holding a standard that is ridiculously impossible to uphold.

    The billions I was talking about was more of a shot at Bloomberg and the likings. He could have passed out gun safes and been way more effective at lowering gun deaths than the billions he spent on this "Everytown" thing that only appeals to his constituents. Props for you for being an Eagle Scout, maybe if we backed those programs and made them more available, you have obviously learned skills that could save your life and the lives of others. And learning first aid is more like knowing not to put a bandaid on a severed limb that is bleeding out and knowing to use a tourniquet instead... You're right, learning basic skills such as those learned in scouts is common sense. In my opinion, "legislation" that has been proposed is much more of a political display than a realistic way of reducing violence and would probably do little in the way of gun ownership, I'll refer once again to this article that sums up my opinions on the matter pretty well. Funny how no one has refuted the statements made here: https://reason.com/archives/2016/06/21/what-will-gun-controllers-do-when-americ
    Post edited by PJPOWER on
  • pjhawks
    pjhawks Posts: 12,911
    Yes
    Godfather. said:


    there will never be a America without guns, the people will never allow it.

    Godfather.

    this is the narrative of the gun supporters i don't understand. no sane person has ever advocated getting rid of all guns or overturning the 2nd amendment. unfortunately the NRA and other gun groups have convinced many of the gun owners (and some people here) that even one regulation will eventually lead to a full on ban of all guns. it's just non sense rhetoric and some people eat it up. it's sad really considering there is no product in modern times we have done that to. i mean fuck we still let people buy cigarettes in this country.
  • PJPOWER
    PJPOWER Posts: 6,499
    edited July 2016
    other
    pjhawks said:

    Godfather. said:


    there will never be a America without guns, the people will never allow it.

    Godfather.

    this is the narrative of the gun supporters i don't understand. no sane person has ever advocated getting rid of all guns or overturning the 2nd amendment. unfortunately the NRA and other gun groups have convinced many of the gun owners (and some people here) that even one regulation will eventually lead to a full on ban of all guns. it's just non sense rhetoric and some people eat it up. it's sad really considering there is no product in modern times we have done that to. i mean fuck we still let people buy cigarettes in this country.
    So you are saying it is insane to advocate getting rid of all guns or overturning the 2nd Amendment? I fully agree with this statement and hope that those mentioning it throughout this thread get the mental health treatment that they need.
    BTW, didn't we ban marijuana products and the growing of hemp? That still seems to be causing modern dilemmas.
    Post edited by PJPOWER on
  • Thirty Bills Unpaid
    Thirty Bills Unpaid Posts: 16,881
    Yes
    PJPOWER said:

    Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

    PJPOWER said:

    myoung321 said:

    “The fact that we’re living in a country where 90 percent of the people want further gun laws — to maybe somehow put a dent in some of this insanity that’s happening — and yet there’s no further legislation taking place, it’s very frustrating and upsetting,” Vedder told Richards in a clip from the discussion, which HuffPost Entertainment is debuting above. “If I didn’t have music to kind of at least get some of the aggression out or take the edge off, you wouldn’t want me having a gun either.”

    “I get so angry that I almost wish bad things upon these people,” Vedder said. “But I don’t have to because it seems like they happen anyways. It seems like every week I’m reading about a 4-year-old either shooting their sister, their dad, their dog, their brother or themselves, because there’s fucking guns laying around. But I guess it’s ‘fun.’”

    Eddie Vedder

    Article link



    Sounds like a good reason to create laws that give people tax breaks for learning safe handling techniques. Or maybe be a true activist and teach a safe gun handling/storage class of your own for free to the public. Guns are here, but the more people that learn how to safely store firearms=less people's kiddos shooting their dogs, sister, dad, selves, because it would also=less guns lying around. Just because we don't agree with your laws does not mean we are not pushing for solutions and a safer society. That seems to be lost on some.
    You mean like safe injection sites for heroin users?

    What's lost here, sir, is the very basic correlation that is simply indisputable: more guns equals more deaths by guns.

    Defend your hobby any way you want, but don't try to dissuade intelligent people to dismiss common sense (gun courses for all and no problems!). You'd get more respect from me saying, "F**k all you wussies. I love my guns and you ain't ever getting them" versus trying to frame an argument that flies in the face of logic.
    Typical elitist response... If someone disagrees with your strategy, they are disrespectful and illogical. I just believe in education over regulation, plus it's something that can be done now, instead of waiting on politicians. You would gain my respect if you weren't so condescending. That's okay, I can ignore you from now on too...what a jerk... Go ahead an continue beating your head against a wall trying to make guns disappear and I'll continue pushing my realistic ideas of logical, common sense, change, "change you can believe in" lol.
    More guns equals more deaths by guns.

    This and other points such as how the odds of you dying by gunfire increase dramatically upon the introduction of a gun to your household are items you and others consistently fail to address.

    You're focused on the delivery of the message which I can admit to being poor (guy gets a little irritated some times- forgive me), but you should probably think of things such as the aforementioned items when responding. The 'common sense' things you speak of aren't really common sense- they're band aid solutions that won't achieve what people want. And no... people don't want to take all your guns... they want to make your country safer like all the other developed countries that don't sell assault rifles and hand guns to any cash or visa purchaser such as the terrorist threat in Orlando.

    What's the over/under for your next mass shooting? One month? Two? Just hopefully nobody you know is impacted eh?

    * Off the top of my head... grandfather existing guns. Offer buy back program. Develop registry. Limit ammunition sales to licensed purchasers. Restrict assault rifle sales. Limit handgun sales. Make future gun owners take the courses you speak of before purchasing. Develop heavy penalties for selling guns/ammunition 'under the table'.

    Then... in 20 years... see how you're doing. There's no short term fix. For the time being... you're f**ked. But that's the fault of the last generation.
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • pjhawks
    pjhawks Posts: 12,911
    edited July 2016
    Yes
    PJPOWER said:

    pjhawks said:

    Godfather. said:


    there will never be a America without guns, the people will never allow it.

    Godfather.

    this is the narrative of the gun supporters i don't understand. no sane person has ever advocated getting rid of all guns or overturning the 2nd amendment. unfortunately the NRA and other gun groups have convinced many of the gun owners (and some people here) that even one regulation will eventually lead to a full on ban of all guns. it's just non sense rhetoric and some people eat it up. it's sad really considering there is no product in modern times we have done that to. i mean fuck we still let people buy cigarettes in this country.
    So you are saying it is insane to advocate getting rid of all guns or overturning the 2nd Amendment? I fully agree with this statement and hope that those mentioning it throughout this thread get the mental health treatment that they need.
    BTW, didn't we ban marijuana products and the growing of hemp? That still seems to be causing modern dilemmas.
    who has said we should get rid of all guns and overturn the 2nd amendment? i haven't seen talk of that at all. But yes i think anyone who advocates getting rid of all guns in America is not based in reality.

    marijuana has been illegal for over 100 years. i wouldn't call that modern times. nice try though.
    Post edited by pjhawks on
  • PJPOWER
    PJPOWER Posts: 6,499
    other
    Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

    PJPOWER said:

    Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

    PJPOWER said:

    myoung321 said:

    “The fact that we’re living in a country where 90 percent of the people want further gun laws — to maybe somehow put a dent in some of this insanity that’s happening — and yet there’s no further legislation taking place, it’s very frustrating and upsetting,” Vedder told Richards in a clip from the discussion, which HuffPost Entertainment is debuting above. “If I didn’t have music to kind of at least get some of the aggression out or take the edge off, you wouldn’t want me having a gun either.”

    “I get so angry that I almost wish bad things upon these people,” Vedder said. “But I don’t have to because it seems like they happen anyways. It seems like every week I’m reading about a 4-year-old either shooting their sister, their dad, their dog, their brother or themselves, because there’s fucking guns laying around. But I guess it’s ‘fun.’”

    Eddie Vedder

    Article link



    Sounds like a good reason to create laws that give people tax breaks for learning safe handling techniques. Or maybe be a true activist and teach a safe gun handling/storage class of your own for free to the public. Guns are here, but the more people that learn how to safely store firearms=less people's kiddos shooting their dogs, sister, dad, selves, because it would also=less guns lying around. Just because we don't agree with your laws does not mean we are not pushing for solutions and a safer society. That seems to be lost on some.
    You mean like safe injection sites for heroin users?

    What's lost here, sir, is the very basic correlation that is simply indisputable: more guns equals more deaths by guns.

    Defend your hobby any way you want, but don't try to dissuade intelligent people to dismiss common sense (gun courses for all and no problems!). You'd get more respect from me saying, "F**k all you wussies. I love my guns and you ain't ever getting them" versus trying to frame an argument that flies in the face of logic.
    Typical elitist response... If someone disagrees with your strategy, they are disrespectful and illogical. I just believe in education over regulation, plus it's something that can be done now, instead of waiting on politicians. You would gain my respect if you weren't so condescending. That's okay, I can ignore you from now on too...what a jerk... Go ahead an continue beating your head against a wall trying to make guns disappear and I'll continue pushing my realistic ideas of logical, common sense, change, "change you can believe in" lol.
    More guns equals more deaths by guns.

    This and other points such as how the odds of you dying by gunfire increase dramatically upon the introduction of a gun to your household are items you and others consistently fail to address.

    You're focused on the delivery of the message which I can admit to being poor (guy gets a little irritated some times- forgive me), but you should probably think of things such as the aforementioned items when responding. The 'common sense' things you speak of aren't really common sense- they're band aid solutions that won't achieve what people want. And no... people don't want to take all your guns... they want to make your country safer like all the other developed countries that don't sell assault rifles and hand guns to any cash or visa purchaser such as the terrorist threat in Orlando.

    What's the over/under for your next mass shooting? One month? Two? Just hopefully nobody you know is impacted eh?

    * Off the top of my head... grandfather existing guns. Offer buy back program. Develop registry. Limit ammunition sales to licensed purchasers. Restrict assault rifle sales. Limit handgun sales. Make future gun owners take the courses you speak of before purchasing. Develop heavy penalties for selling guns/ammunition 'under the table'.

    Then... in 20 years... see how you're doing. There's no short term fix. For the time being... you're f**ked. But that's the fault of the last generation.
    It's evident that we are not going to find a middle ground here. We are having problems enforcing the laws already on the books, so I do not see more as being helpful simply because there is such a division in the country on the issue. I believe in change from the bottom up and you believe in change from the top down and that is not going to lead to us agreeing with each other. Keep debating all you want and good luck, there are plenty here who agree with you. I'll keep doing the same...just not with you. Maybe we'll find common ground on another issue.
  • Thirty Bills Unpaid
    Thirty Bills Unpaid Posts: 16,881
    Yes
    PJPOWER said:

    Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

    PJPOWER said:

    Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

    PJPOWER said:

    myoung321 said:

    “The fact that we’re living in a country where 90 percent of the people want further gun laws — to maybe somehow put a dent in some of this insanity that’s happening — and yet there’s no further legislation taking place, it’s very frustrating and upsetting,” Vedder told Richards in a clip from the discussion, which HuffPost Entertainment is debuting above. “If I didn’t have music to kind of at least get some of the aggression out or take the edge off, you wouldn’t want me having a gun either.”

    “I get so angry that I almost wish bad things upon these people,” Vedder said. “But I don’t have to because it seems like they happen anyways. It seems like every week I’m reading about a 4-year-old either shooting their sister, their dad, their dog, their brother or themselves, because there’s fucking guns laying around. But I guess it’s ‘fun.’”

    Eddie Vedder

    Article link



    Sounds like a good reason to create laws that give people tax breaks for learning safe handling techniques. Or maybe be a true activist and teach a safe gun handling/storage class of your own for free to the public. Guns are here, but the more people that learn how to safely store firearms=less people's kiddos shooting their dogs, sister, dad, selves, because it would also=less guns lying around. Just because we don't agree with your laws does not mean we are not pushing for solutions and a safer society. That seems to be lost on some.
    You mean like safe injection sites for heroin users?

    What's lost here, sir, is the very basic correlation that is simply indisputable: more guns equals more deaths by guns.

    Defend your hobby any way you want, but don't try to dissuade intelligent people to dismiss common sense (gun courses for all and no problems!). You'd get more respect from me saying, "F**k all you wussies. I love my guns and you ain't ever getting them" versus trying to frame an argument that flies in the face of logic.
    Typical elitist response... If someone disagrees with your strategy, they are disrespectful and illogical. I just believe in education over regulation, plus it's something that can be done now, instead of waiting on politicians. You would gain my respect if you weren't so condescending. That's okay, I can ignore you from now on too...what a jerk... Go ahead an continue beating your head against a wall trying to make guns disappear and I'll continue pushing my realistic ideas of logical, common sense, change, "change you can believe in" lol.
    More guns equals more deaths by guns.

    This and other points such as how the odds of you dying by gunfire increase dramatically upon the introduction of a gun to your household are items you and others consistently fail to address.

    You're focused on the delivery of the message which I can admit to being poor (guy gets a little irritated some times- forgive me), but you should probably think of things such as the aforementioned items when responding. The 'common sense' things you speak of aren't really common sense- they're band aid solutions that won't achieve what people want. And no... people don't want to take all your guns... they want to make your country safer like all the other developed countries that don't sell assault rifles and hand guns to any cash or visa purchaser such as the terrorist threat in Orlando.

    What's the over/under for your next mass shooting? One month? Two? Just hopefully nobody you know is impacted eh?

    * Off the top of my head... grandfather existing guns. Offer buy back program. Develop registry. Limit ammunition sales to licensed purchasers. Restrict assault rifle sales. Limit handgun sales. Make future gun owners take the courses you speak of before purchasing. Develop heavy penalties for selling guns/ammunition 'under the table'.

    Then... in 20 years... see how you're doing. There's no short term fix. For the time being... you're f**ked. But that's the fault of the last generation.
    It's evident that we are not going to find a middle ground here. We are having problems enforcing the laws already on the books, so I do not see more as being helpful simply because there is such a division in the country on the issue. I believe in change from the bottom up and you believe in change from the top down and that is not going to lead to us agreeing with each other. Keep debating all you want and good luck, there are plenty here who agree with you. I'll keep doing the same...just not with you. Maybe we'll find common ground on another issue.
    We're more alike than not. I don't think you're a jerk and I think you do a credible job of defending gun ownership.

    The world would be pretty vanilla without contrary views. I respect your position as you articulate it as much as I disagree with it.
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • PJPOWER
    PJPOWER Posts: 6,499
    other
    Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

    PJPOWER said:

    Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

    PJPOWER said:

    Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

    PJPOWER said:

    myoung321 said:

    “The fact that we’re living in a country where 90 percent of the people want further gun laws — to maybe somehow put a dent in some of this insanity that’s happening — and yet there’s no further legislation taking place, it’s very frustrating and upsetting,” Vedder told Richards in a clip from the discussion, which HuffPost Entertainment is debuting above. “If I didn’t have music to kind of at least get some of the aggression out or take the edge off, you wouldn’t want me having a gun either.”

    “I get so angry that I almost wish bad things upon these people,” Vedder said. “But I don’t have to because it seems like they happen anyways. It seems like every week I’m reading about a 4-year-old either shooting their sister, their dad, their dog, their brother or themselves, because there’s fucking guns laying around. But I guess it’s ‘fun.’”

    Eddie Vedder

    Article link



    Sounds like a good reason to create laws that give people tax breaks for learning safe handling techniques. Or maybe be a true activist and teach a safe gun handling/storage class of your own for free to the public. Guns are here, but the more people that learn how to safely store firearms=less people's kiddos shooting their dogs, sister, dad, selves, because it would also=less guns lying around. Just because we don't agree with your laws does not mean we are not pushing for solutions and a safer society. That seems to be lost on some.
    You mean like safe injection sites for heroin users?

    What's lost here, sir, is the very basic correlation that is simply indisputable: more guns equals more deaths by guns.

    Defend your hobby any way you want, but don't try to dissuade intelligent people to dismiss common sense (gun courses for all and no problems!). You'd get more respect from me saying, "F**k all you wussies. I love my guns and you ain't ever getting them" versus trying to frame an argument that flies in the face of logic.
    Typical elitist response... If someone disagrees with your strategy, they are disrespectful and illogical. I just believe in education over regulation, plus it's something that can be done now, instead of waiting on politicians. You would gain my respect if you weren't so condescending. That's okay, I can ignore you from now on too...what a jerk... Go ahead an continue beating your head against a wall trying to make guns disappear and I'll continue pushing my realistic ideas of logical, common sense, change, "change you can believe in" lol.
    More guns equals more deaths by guns.

    This and other points such as how the odds of you dying by gunfire increase dramatically upon the introduction of a gun to your household are items you and others consistently fail to address.

    You're focused on the delivery of the message which I can admit to being poor (guy gets a little irritated some times- forgive me), but you should probably think of things such as the aforementioned items when responding. The 'common sense' things you speak of aren't really common sense- they're band aid solutions that won't achieve what people want. And no... people don't want to take all your guns... they want to make your country safer like all the other developed countries that don't sell assault rifles and hand guns to any cash or visa purchaser such as the terrorist threat in Orlando.

    What's the over/under for your next mass shooting? One month? Two? Just hopefully nobody you know is impacted eh?

    * Off the top of my head... grandfather existing guns. Offer buy back program. Develop registry. Limit ammunition sales to licensed purchasers. Restrict assault rifle sales. Limit handgun sales. Make future gun owners take the courses you speak of before purchasing. Develop heavy penalties for selling guns/ammunition 'under the table'.

    Then... in 20 years... see how you're doing. There's no short term fix. For the time being... you're f**ked. But that's the fault of the last generation.
    It's evident that we are not going to find a middle ground here. We are having problems enforcing the laws already on the books, so I do not see more as being helpful simply because there is such a division in the country on the issue. I believe in change from the bottom up and you believe in change from the top down and that is not going to lead to us agreeing with each other. Keep debating all you want and good luck, there are plenty here who agree with you. I'll keep doing the same...just not with you. Maybe we'll find common ground on another issue.
    We're more alike than not. I don't think you're a jerk and I think you do a credible job of defending gun ownership.

    The world would be pretty vanilla without contrary views. I respect your position as you articulate it as much as I disagree with it.
    Word :)
  • Godfather.
    Godfather. Posts: 12,504
    No
    PJPOWER said:

    Bentleyspop said:

    Godfather. said:

    somebody call whaaaaaabulance.

    Godfather.

    “I get so angry that I almost wish bad things upon these people,” Vedder said. “But I don’t have to because it seems like they happen anyways. It seems like every week I’m reading about a 4-year-old either shooting their sister, their dad, their dog, their brother or themselves, because there’s fucking guns laying around. But I guess it’s ‘fun.’”

    Eddie Vedder
    Does having armed security make celebrities safer or less safe? Too bad we cannot all afford our own armed security everywhere we go...

    HAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAH everybody needs a gun in some way, some how or somewhere....even if they don't want to admit it.

    Godfather.

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