The headline says superfans. They have nothing to do with the lyrics. I would also think that superfans don't buy up everything in site. Those are usually flippers, or people with a lot of friends to buy for. Either way, if that ruins a band for you, then you have the wrong reason for laying out all that money 55 times. It sounds more like a person looking for specific bragging points. "I was on the rail xx times". "I saw the band xx times". I think it's great that we follow a band that hasn't repeated a set list in maybe 24 years. I know I only have to see guns n roses 1 time this tour to see all the ones they are going to play
2006: Gorge 1
2009: Seattle 1
2013: Seattle
2016: Wrigley 1 & 2
2018: Seattle 1&2, Montana
2020: San Diego, LA 1&2, Oakland 1&2
2022: San Diego, LA 1&2, Fresno, Sacramento, Las Vegas, Denver
i really don't have much issue with PJ superfans. I suppose I've encountered some pretty bitchy fans over the years, but in general, my experiences with PJ fans have been good.
But honestly, if you are camping out all day just so you can get a spot on the rail, you really are missing out on a lot of good music. You are also signaling to the band that you will show up at every show possible even if you know there will be no new music played. Hence, I believe that the band now takes its fanbase for granted. and why not?
I can't help but agree with some of the criticism the author had for the band and mostly Vedder. It just doesnt feel like the guy is all into it anymore. That's a hard thing to say and accept. It's almost like we've reached that dreaded corner where PJ is just turning into a heritage act. I don't say these things lightly. It's a tough pill to swallow.
^ vedder not into it anymore^ that is funny cause i just saw 4 shows in canada and i couldn't disagree anymore with you say on that statement. he's still way WAY into it. i do agree with the nonsense of people lining up all day to see pj from the rail and missing out on a full day of music by other bands. that to me is totally whacked. my thoughts about roo is that mickey dosed ed's wine and ed had an "off" night....
^ vedder not into it anymore^ that is funny cause i just saw 4 shows in canada and i couldn't disagree anymore with you say on that statement. he's still way WAY into it. i do agree with the nonsense of people lining up all day to see pj from the rail and missing out on a full day of music by other bands. that to me is totally whacked. my thoughts about roo is that mickey dosed ed's wine and ed had an "off" night....
i suppose that feeling comes more from the lack of new material from the band. Perhaps Eddie is just in a bit of funk as far as song writing goes. Most of his contributions to Lightning Bolt were pretty weak imo. In contrast, I thought his work on Backspacer was some of his best ever.
Anyway, I think the author of the article had a good thesis, he just probably needed to edit and rewrite the article so it drove home his main point which is overall frustration with the band that he loves so much. I tend to share that frustration.
In this forum, it seems like few want to hear anything negative about the band. That's understandable. Trust me, I hate having to say anything negative. I just feel like if I don't, almost no one will and PJ will continue to move towards just being a live act like the Stones. Seems like most people here are okay with that. I am not. I like the combination of a new album followed with a tour. It really does bother me that the band seems to now just plan several years worth of mini tours after an album release.
^ vedder not into it anymore^ that is funny cause i just saw 4 shows in canada and i couldn't disagree anymore with you say on that statement. he's still way WAY into it. i do agree with the nonsense of people lining up all day to see pj from the rail and missing out on a full day of music by other bands. that to me is totally whacked. my thoughts about roo is that mickey dosed ed's wine and ed had an "off" night....
U2 fans are famous for leaving a show early to get back in line for the next nights show.
^ vedder not into it anymore^ that is funny cause i just saw 4 shows in canada and i couldn't disagree anymore with you say on that statement. he's still way WAY into it. i do agree with the nonsense of people lining up all day to see pj from the rail and missing out on a full day of music by other bands. that to me is totally whacked. my thoughts about roo is that mickey dosed ed's wine and ed had an "off" night....
U2 fans are famous for leaving a show early to get back in line for the next nights show.
Haven't heard yet about PJ fans doing that
I saw fans leave early from ga at brooklyn 1 just so they could line up for brooklyn 2.
^ vedder not into it anymore^ that is funny cause i just saw 4 shows in canada and i couldn't disagree anymore with you say on that statement. he's still way WAY into it. i do agree with the nonsense of people lining up all day to see pj from the rail and missing out on a full day of music by other bands. that to me is totally whacked. my thoughts about roo is that mickey dosed ed's wine and ed had an "off" night....
U2 fans are famous for leaving a show early to get back in line for the next nights show.
Haven't heard yet about PJ fans doing that
I saw fans leave early from ga at brooklyn 1 just so they could line up for brooklyn 2.
Read the comment by a guy named Ben Bracey. It appears that the author was dishonest in how he characterized something that happened at the rail at Bonnaroo.
Ben Bracey is a friend of mine (member of Inforoo). The author is without a doubt the exact person he is crying about. His girlfriend had gotten into the secret 3rd Man Records show, because Ben told her to go there immediately. It was her 1st PJ show and was flipping out how excited she was. You know what happens when you go to something like that, you talk about it. ALOT. This guy must have had jealousy overcome him and decided she was bragging because he couldn't take that he wasn't there.
I swear, it is people like the author that give the majority of us PJ fans a bad rap. We are not all entitled pricks that think this band exists solely for us hardcore. A hits set is needed occasionally because we want to bring in new fans, new blood. And i am sure the delay messed up their set list plans a bit, and Eddie seemed to be on good behavior due to his wife and children standing on the sidelines the entire show. Yeah, I may not have heard Dirty Frank (and I unfortunately probably never will), but that show was just what it needed to be. It was was a little harder, faster, and general public oriented. The kids in the crowd with me were singing and yelling, and some even try to mosh (remember when we used to do that in the 90s...it was fun. I still do it occasionally at the right show. I hurt for longer afterwards, but that's the price you pay).
Every show we get is different. This was the most hits oriented setlist I have seen, and you know what, that is different. The band can play whatever the hell they want to play, and if I can make it, I will be there, because one day we won't have a show, and you wish you could just hear Even Flow live one more damned time.
Peace.
1995 Soldier Field, Chicago
1998 Alpine Valley, WI
2000 Indianapolis, IN
2011 PJ20 Alpine Valley
2013 Wrigley Field
2013 Voodoo Fest New Orleans, LA
2014 Moline, IL (No Code)
2014 Milwaukee, WI (Yield)
2016 Greenville, SC (Vs)
2016 Columbia, SC
2016 Bonnaroo
2016 Wrigley I & II
I was at this show. I wonder if the author does not normally attend Bonnaroo, because he's complaining about an experience that is normal for that festival. You can get on the rail for a headliner if you really sacrifice and skip other shows, but then, you've sacrificed and you have to live with those choices.
A setlist of mostly popular songs is typical for a Bonnaroo headliner. They know that they're going to have a much higher than usual percentage of casual fans and they want to play stuff the audience can relate too. It actually is pretty entitled to expect a setlist heavy on rarities and deep cuts from a headliner at a festival show.
What the author really doesn't seem to get is that as a festival goer, he is responsible for his experience. There was no way I'd choose to wait all day in 99F heat to get in the pit for a festival performance of popular cuts and crowd pleasers. I also wanted to see Clutch before Pearl Jam and I'm glad I did because A. they were tight, and B. Centeroo was evacuated before PJ anyway.
But if I had gone for the pit, or even the front of the field, I'd have expected it to be packed with sweaty bros with backpacks*, with nobody looking to pay respects to Pearl Jam's Biggest FanTM. That's just Bonnaroo.
*Virtually the only thing I agreed with in that piece was about backpacks. People can be really inconsiderate with these. Take the dumb thing off and put it between your feet, strap it on so it's in front of you, get a smaller** one, or get a locker (yes, they have lockers at Roo!) but get that infernal thing out of my f'n face.
**If you can't do Centeroo with a fanny pack, you're an amateur.
The kids of today should defend themselves against the Seventies Nineties.
"To the author of this article, YOU ARE THE EXACT FAN YOU'RE CRITICIZING! You talk about "humblebrags" and entitlement while mentioning over and over you've seen 55 PJ shows and that the setlist was "shockingly lackluster." What hypocrisy! And really...for someone who's been to 55 shows, you should know the difference between a festival setlist and a regular setlist. Give me a break."
The author also trashes their stage set up for being tired. I can see that, but if all these things bother you so much, take a tour or two off.
johnny polo? the wrestler?
edit: yep after looking at his avatar
Post edited by eeriepadave on
8/28/98- Camden, NJ
10/31/09- Philly
5/21/10- NYC
9/2/12- Philly, PA
7/19/13- Wrigley
10/19/13- Brooklyn, NY
10/21/13- Philly, PA
10/22/13- Philly, PA
10/27/13- Baltimore, MD
Tres Mts.- 3/23/11- Philly
Eddie Vedder- 6/25/11- Philly
I dont think there could be any outside factor that would ruin them for me. I may get annoyed by the guy that just passed out next to me and falls on me, but damn that doesn't mean they ruined PJ for me. Just means I have an even better story about the night
Pittsburgh 2013 Cincinnati 2014 Greenville 2016 (Raleigh 2016) Columbia 2016
I wasn't there either. However, Ed killed it at Jacksonville as did the rest of the band. I was GA, 4 people from the rail in front of Ed. So much energy, so much fun. Everyone in the band still seems to have it, and my pit buddies were all super cool!
Totally agree with post a few above, can't take it for granted as the shows may stop one day. I try not to expect certain songs at a show and just really enjoy what I do get! (Had to suffer a 6 year show drought once, it sucks!)
I just like the music, I am trying to stay away from all the bullshit, I have only been to 14 shows, so I am hardly a Superfan, and I have no desire to try and prove I am any better a fan than anyone else, that is the one thing I see that makes me want to stay away. Some of us just like the music, and it's really that simple.
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hedonist
standing on the edge of forever Posts: 24,524
I just like the music, I am trying to stay away from all the bullshit, I have only been to 14 shows, so I am hardly a Superfan, and I have no desire to try and prove I am any better a fan than anyone else, that is the one thing I see that makes me want to stay away. Some of us just like the music, and it's really that simple.
Then don't bitch about the merchandise and those who may like it in addition to the music.
(and quit inviting the band over to get high with you! If that's not Super-fannish activity, then I don't know what)
^ vedder not into it anymore^ that is funny cause i just saw 4 shows in canada and i couldn't disagree anymore with you say on that statement. he's still way WAY into it. i do agree with the nonsense of people lining up all day to see pj from the rail and missing out on a full day of music by other bands. that to me is totally whacked. my thoughts about roo is that mickey dosed ed's wine and ed had an "off" night....
U2 fans are famous for leaving a show early to get back in line for the next nights show.
Haven't heard yet about PJ fans doing that
I saw fans leave early from ga at brooklyn 1 just so they could line up for brooklyn 2.
I was going to say the same thing. Yup folks left a perfectly good PJ concert to go and sit in the rain so that they could rail again the next day. It takes all kinds I guess, I have done the waiting all day(no overnights) thing once as it was a special occasion to me. Was it cool yes, is it worth doing every time - not to me.
Anything you lose from being honest You never really had to begin with.
Sometimes it's not the song that makes you emotional it's the people and things that come to your mind when you hear it.
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WhatYouTaughtMe
I have no idea what's going on right now! Posts: 4,957
I just like the music, I am trying to stay away from all the bullshit, I have only been to 14 shows, so I am hardly a Superfan, and I have no desire to try and prove I am any better a fan than anyone else, that is the one thing I see that makes me want to stay away. Some of us just like the music, and it's really that simple.
Then don't bitch about the merchandise and those who may like it in addition to the music.
Fuck that guy. I don't get the point of his article. Does PJ get every song perfect at every live performance? Obviously no but I've seen them for almost the last twenty years and I've never felt like it wasn't worth it. Some nights were better than others for sure but I think most of us "super fans" don't have to be on the rail, just in the building to know we are getting all they have on a given night. I think there is a difference with festival set lists but maybe I'm wrong. He's entitled to his opinion for sure but maybe he should just funnel his resources into seeing Justin Beiber.
Post edited by HH140540 on
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goldrush
everybody knows this is nowhere Posts: 7,277
The author is on the forums (as Firecloud), but he hasn't posted in a while I don't think. He writes for Antiquiet too, I usually enjoy his stuff but this article was a bit too up-his-own-ass for me!
“Do not postpone happiness”
(Jeff Tweedy, Sydney 2007)
Fuck that guy. I don't get the point of his article. Does PJ get every song perfect at every live performance? Obviously no but I've seen them for almost the last twenty years and I've never felt like it wasn't worth it. Some nights were better than others for sure but I think most of us "super fans" don't have to be on the rail, just in the building to know we are getting all they have on a given night.
Everyone in here has decided "superfan" must mean them...
I get what Johnny is on about. Eddie checks out at some shows, the author's no stranger to the band's live acts and probably has been putting off saying something about it for years.
There are also some whacked fans out there and there are some super-entitled fans, who, I swear to god, stand in GA and evaluate the show-in-progress like Comic Book Guy. Oh, they're playing that song? Yeah well, I was there when they played it at...
2008 Tampa - 2013 Buffalo - 2016 Tampa - 2016 Fenway II Audioslave 2005 MSG
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hedonist
standing on the edge of forever Posts: 24,524
Everyone in here has decided "superfan" must mean them...
I get what Johnny is on about. Eddie checks out at some shows, the author's no stranger to the band's live acts and probably has been putting off saying something about it for years.
There are also some whacked fans out there and there are some super-entitled fans, who, I swear to god, stand in GA and evaluate the show-in-progress like Comic Book Guy. Oh, they're playing that song? Yeah well, I was there when they played it at...
Everyone in here? Nah.
I love this band.
I love their music.
I love who I've come to love via the music.
And I've seen them twice, last time...ten years ago.
There are some things to which I feel entitled (ie, earned in the true sense), but in this vein? Laughable.
Everyone in here has decided "superfan" must mean them...
I get what Johnny is on about. Eddie checks out at some shows, the author's no stranger to the band's live acts and probably has been putting off saying something about it for years.
There are also some whacked fans out there and there are some super-entitled fans, who, I swear to god, stand in GA and evaluate the show-in-progress like Comic Book Guy. Oh, they're playing that song? Yeah well, I was there when they played it at...
Yeah, I get it. There are 'annoying fans' of all sorts. So is true of our society as a whole. Another annoying fan is the kind who spends the entire show getting worked up about people around them for no reason. People aren't cheering enough, people are cheering only for Jeremy and Even Flow. People are on their phone too much. people are taking too many pictures. etc... I have started to learn to let it all slide and focus more on my own self. Of course there are times where people are inconsiderate and something needs to be said, done, or just ignore it.... but overall, I think the fan on fan judgement should be tempered.
Someone could probably sit there for a 3 hour show and stew and pass judgement on everyone around him/her... but what does that make him/her? Everyone enjoys this shit in their own way. You owe it to yourself to try to be positive about things (not you who I quoted, just people in general).
Yeah, you have to get your Zen on at concerts. Let the little annoying things just roll off of you. Getting irritated by that stuff when you're in the moment just isn't worth it. All it takes is an internal decision to calm the fuck down and not sweat it. It's pretty easy unless you are dealing with something truly egregious (which does happen, but rarely. I have only had someone bust through my concert Zen twice in my whole life. That's a pretty good record).
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
Maybe it's because I never had kids or because I'm a little off, but the only thing that can ruin a pj show for me is if my +1 sucks. I'm 41 now but at pj I'm 17 again.
Over 70+ shows, never felt I wasn't part of the wave of fire. If people around me suck I'm pumped enough it doesn't matter or I move.
Even at Uniondale with people next to me throwing things at my hero it was fucking epic. If your having a bad time imagine all those around you who your sucking the life out of. Stay home.
Comments
even if I look and act really crazy.
That's the most hypocritical essay I've ever read. It was so over the top I thought maybe he was being satirical or purposely ironic a la the Onion.
It's that kind of lack of self-awareness that makes super-fans annoying. It's always someone else who is the problem; never themselves.
But honestly, if you are camping out all day just so you can get a spot on the rail, you really are missing out on a lot of good music. You are also signaling to the band that you will show up at every show possible even if you know there will be no new music played. Hence, I believe that the band now takes its fanbase for granted. and why not?
I can't help but agree with some of the criticism the author had for the band and mostly Vedder. It just doesnt feel like the guy is all into it anymore. That's a hard thing to say and accept. It's almost like we've reached that dreaded corner where PJ is just turning into a heritage act. I don't say these things lightly. It's a tough pill to swallow.
that is funny cause i just saw 4 shows in canada and i couldn't disagree anymore with you say on that statement. he's still way WAY into it.
i do agree with the nonsense of people lining up all day to see pj from the rail and missing out on a full day of music by other bands. that to me is totally whacked.
my thoughts about roo is that mickey dosed ed's wine and ed had an "off" night....
Anyway, I think the author of the article had a good thesis, he just probably needed to edit and rewrite the article so it drove home his main point which is overall frustration with the band that he loves so much. I tend to share that frustration.
In this forum, it seems like few want to hear anything negative about the band. That's understandable. Trust me, I hate having to say anything negative. I just feel like if I don't, almost no one will and PJ will continue to move towards just being a live act like the Stones. Seems like most people here are okay with that. I am not. I like the combination of a new album followed with a tour. It really does bother me that the band seems to now just plan several years worth of mini tours after an album release.
Haven't heard yet about PJ fans doing that
I swear, it is people like the author that give the majority of us PJ fans a bad rap. We are not all entitled pricks that think this band exists solely for us hardcore. A hits set is needed occasionally because we want to bring in new fans, new blood. And i am sure the delay messed up their set list plans a bit, and Eddie seemed to be on good behavior due to his wife and children standing on the sidelines the entire show. Yeah, I may not have heard Dirty Frank (and I unfortunately probably never will), but that show was just what it needed to be. It was was a little harder, faster, and general public oriented. The kids in the crowd with me were singing and yelling, and some even try to mosh (remember when we used to do that in the 90s...it was fun. I still do it occasionally at the right show. I hurt for longer afterwards, but that's the price you pay).
Every show we get is different. This was the most hits oriented setlist I have seen, and you know what, that is different. The band can play whatever the hell they want to play, and if I can make it, I will be there, because one day we won't have a show, and you wish you could just hear Even Flow live one more damned time.
Peace.
1998 Alpine Valley, WI
2000 Indianapolis, IN
2011 PJ20 Alpine Valley
2013 Wrigley Field
2013 Voodoo Fest New Orleans, LA
2014 Moline, IL (No Code)
2014 Milwaukee, WI (Yield)
2016 Greenville, SC (Vs)
2016 Columbia, SC
2016 Bonnaroo
2016 Wrigley I & II
A setlist of mostly popular songs is typical for a Bonnaroo headliner. They know that they're going to have a much higher than usual percentage of casual fans and they want to play stuff the audience can relate too. It actually is pretty entitled to expect a setlist heavy on rarities and deep cuts from a headliner at a festival show.
What the author really doesn't seem to get is that as a festival goer, he is responsible for his experience. There was no way I'd choose to wait all day in 99F heat to get in the pit for a festival performance of popular cuts and crowd pleasers. I also wanted to see Clutch before Pearl Jam and I'm glad I did because A. they were tight, and B. Centeroo was evacuated before PJ anyway.
But if I had gone for the pit, or even the front of the field, I'd have expected it to be packed with sweaty bros with backpacks*, with nobody looking to pay respects to Pearl Jam's Biggest FanTM. That's just Bonnaroo.
*Virtually the only thing I agreed with in that piece was about backpacks. People can be really inconsiderate with these. Take the dumb thing off and put it between your feet, strap it on so it's in front of you, get a smaller** one, or get a locker (yes, they have lockers at Roo!) but get that infernal thing out of my f'n face.
**If you can't do Centeroo with a fanny pack, you're an amateur.
edit:
8/28/98- Camden, NJ
10/31/09- Philly
5/21/10- NYC
9/2/12- Philly, PA
7/19/13- Wrigley
10/19/13- Brooklyn, NY
10/21/13- Philly, PA
10/22/13- Philly, PA
10/27/13- Baltimore, MD
Tres Mts.- 3/23/11- Philly
Eddie Vedder- 6/25/11- Philly
http://www.rollingstone.com/music/lists/25-best-things-we-saw-at-bonnaroo-2016-20160613
for the least they could possibly do
Cincinnati 2014
Greenville 2016
(Raleigh 2016)
Columbia 2016
Totally agree with post a few above, can't take it for granted as the shows may stop one day. I try not to expect certain songs at a show and just really enjoy what I do get! (Had to suffer a 6 year show drought once, it sucks!)
(and quit inviting the band over to get high with you! If that's not Super-fannish activity, then I don't know what)
Green grass and tie-dyed forever
You never really had to begin with.
Sometimes it's not the song that makes you emotional it's the people and things that come to your mind when you hear it.
(Jeff Tweedy, Sydney 2007)
“Put yer good money on the sunrise”
(Tim Rogers)
I get what Johnny is on about. Eddie checks out at some shows, the author's no stranger to the band's live acts and probably has been putting off saying something about it for years.
There are also some whacked fans out there and there are some super-entitled fans, who, I swear to god, stand in GA and evaluate the show-in-progress like Comic Book Guy. Oh, they're playing that song? Yeah well, I was there when they played it at...
2008 Tampa - 2013 Buffalo - 2016 Tampa - 2016 Fenway II
Audioslave 2005 MSG
I love this band.
I love their music.
I love who I've come to love via the music.
And I've seen them twice, last time...ten years ago.
There are some things to which I feel entitled (ie, earned in the true sense), but in this vein? Laughable.
Nice Comic Book Guy reference, by the way!
Someone could probably sit there for a 3 hour show and stew and pass judgement on everyone around him/her... but what does that make him/her? Everyone enjoys this shit in their own way. You owe it to yourself to try to be positive about things (not you who I quoted, just people in general).
Over 70+ shows, never felt I wasn't part of the wave of fire. If people around me suck I'm pumped enough it doesn't matter or I move.
Even at Uniondale with people next to me throwing things at my hero it was fucking epic. If your having a bad time imagine all those around you who your sucking the life out of. Stay home.