USA Patriot Act

I never fell for any of that business about how this was supposed to make us safe. A more reasonable approach in the first place would be to work on improving foreign relation so we would not be so hated in the first place. There's a lot that's good about America. Let's foster those good things and share them and create a more peaceful world. I'm not saying we will ever be without a military or there will never be those who are against us. But developing better relationships would allow us to scale back our military forces greatly. Smaller, more defensive oriented military forces, larger building of good will. Makes sense, doesn't it?

Go Beavers said:

mcgruff10 said:

rgambs said:

mcgruff10 said:

hey if the patriot act avoided another 9/11 i'm all for it. i think a lot of people forget what happened 14 years ago. hopefully we can have both houses come together and pass a few provisions of this to help.
i'd like these parts of the patriot act law again:

• Lesser-known powers under Section 215 also ended. While the mass collection of phone records by the NSA has been the focus of attention, this section of the law is also used by the FBI and CIA to collect other information. For example, the CIA uses it to track financial data, such as wire transfers, that can help expose terrorist networks. The FBI has used it to obtain companies' Internet business records.
• The "roving wiretap" provision has expired. This allows federal agencies to monitor a person rather than a specific phone or electronic device. The government can keep track of suspected terrorists regardless of how many cell phones they use and throw away. Approval for the surveillance must be obtained from a federal court.
• All investigations of phone records under Section 215 of the law will not stop immediately. A clause in the Patriot Act allows the NSA to continue investigations it has already started. The agency collects data that shows who made and received calls, how long those calls lasted, and when they happened. The data does not include the substance of those calls.

Except that the FBI, CIA, and NSA have never provided evidence that it has contributed to the prevention of a terrorist act, and have even made statements affirming that no such occurence has happened.

who cares? at least they have the means to possible prevent another terrorist attack. i have zero to hide. i'll give up a very tiny bit of my privacy to prevent another 9/11.

And that fear is how they manipulate others. There was enough intelligence in place prior to 9/11 to stop the attacks, it just wasn't acted on. Always be weary of someone peddling a message of fear.

This really says it well, Go Beavers.

mcgruff, I appreciate that you advocate for our safety. No one wants another 9/11. But the PA went to extremes and trashing what is good about basic freedoms and privacy is not the answer. I highly recommend checking out the movie "My Name Is Khan" to get an idea of how the PA encouraged wrongful profiling.

mcgruff10 said:

I ll check it out bud! I guess I m biased because like many I lost some friends on 9/11. I remember smelling the smoke from the towers since I live so close. Gotta be the darkest day in American history.

Even having seen the images on TV, I can't imagine having been there. I'm very sorry to hear that you lost friends there. That sucks hugely.

ITS GONE MOFOS