Meteor injures hundreds in Russia

13

Comments

  • PJ_Soul
    PJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,668
    whgarrett wrote:
    Science is an educated guess. A hypothesis. And is always treated so until otherwise proven wrong. Oh yeah....it is merely OUR truth.
    Science is NOT an educated guess or a hypothesis. I think you're thinking of scientific theory?? Or the scientific process?
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • know1
    know1 Posts: 6,801
    PJ_Soul wrote:
    whgarrett wrote:
    Let me just say first off that I am much more of a scientific than a religious. It does however make me laugh when people boast about what WE "KNOW" due to science. Science is not an answer. It is an endless question. If 90% of the Universe is unaccounted for.....a mystery. Why is intelligent design looked down upon so often?
    Science isn't something that necessarily has answered all things, but not because it can't. Only because humans haven't managed to make it answer all things. And we do KNOW many things due to science. Just because we don't know most stuff yet doesn't mean that we don't know some stuff, nor does it mean that it COULDN'T answer all things, if only we could figure it out. Science is TRUTH. That doesn't change just because we don't know through science what the truth is yet. The truth is attainable through science - just not by us.

    Science is absolutely not truth. In fact, it's the opposite of it.

    Science leaves open the possibility that new evidence tomorrow could totally overthrow what we think we know today.

    That's why I find it interesting that people put faith in something that maintains a position that it will always be seeking more answers.

    And it is exactly an educated guess as someone said above.
    The only people we should try to get even with...
    ...are those who've helped us.

    Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
  • PJ_Soul
    PJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,668
    know1 wrote:
    PJ_Soul wrote:
    whgarrett wrote:
    Let me just say first off that I am much more of a scientific than a religious. It does however make me laugh when people boast about what WE "KNOW" due to science. Science is not an answer. It is an endless question. If 90% of the Universe is unaccounted for.....a mystery. Why is intelligent design looked down upon so often?
    Science isn't something that necessarily has answered all things, but not because it can't. Only because humans haven't managed to make it answer all things. And we do KNOW many things due to science. Just because we don't know most stuff yet doesn't mean that we don't know some stuff, nor does it mean that it COULDN'T answer all things, if only we could figure it out. Science is TRUTH. That doesn't change just because we don't know through science what the truth is yet. The truth is attainable through science - just not by us.

    Science is absolutely not truth. In fact, it's the opposite of it.

    Science leaves open the possibility that new evidence tomorrow could totally overthrow what we think we know today.

    That's why I find it interesting that people put faith in something that maintains a position that it will always be seeking more answers.
    Science is absolutely truth. It is people who don't necessarily know truth. Don't blame science. You act as though science is man made or something. It's not.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • rollings
    rollings unknown Posts: 7,127
    PJ_Soul wrote:
    You act as though science is man made or something. It's not.

    it actually is
  • PJ_Soul
    PJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,668
    rollings wrote:
    PJ_Soul wrote:
    You act as though science is man made or something. It's not.

    it actually is
    No. :)
    Obviously we've got different ideas of what science is, so let's agree to disagree (but I think you're mixing up people working to prove scientific fact with science itself... i understand science is the study of knowledge, but it is also what it is - the natural state of things, all happening through the processes of science... I think the study of science is separate from science itself... perhaps this is simply a disagreement over semantics).
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • rollings
    rollings unknown Posts: 7,127
    PJ_Soul wrote:
    rollings wrote:
    PJ_Soul wrote:
    You act as though science is man made or something. It's not.

    it actually is
    No. :)
    Obviously we've got different ideas of what science is, so let's agree to disagree (but I think you're mixing up people working to prove scientific fact with science itself... i understand science is the study of knowledge, but it is also what it is - the natural state of things, all happening through the processes of science... I think the study of science is separate from science itself... perhaps this is simply a disagreement over semantics).

    I think it is semantics too....I don't think that science = truth, however.

    science can only go to the edge of what we as humans know.

    And that's way too limited to be factual.
  • rollings
    rollings unknown Posts: 7,127
    In other words, we are smart enough to know that our brains are limited.

    Yet often not smart enough to render this fact into our thoughts and discussions about such things.

    :wtf: what did I just say?
  • PJ_Soul
    PJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,668
    rollings wrote:
    PJ_Soul wrote:
    rollings wrote:

    it actually is
    No. :)
    Obviously we've got different ideas of what science is, so let's agree to disagree (but I think you're mixing up people working to prove scientific fact with science itself... i understand science is the study of knowledge, but it is also what it is - the natural state of things, all happening through the processes of science... I think the study of science is separate from science itself... perhaps this is simply a disagreement over semantics).

    I think it is semantics too....I don't think that science = truth, however.

    science can only go to the edge of what we as humans know.

    And that's way too limited to be factual.
    I don't really understand what you mean. Just because what we know is limited doesn't mean that what we do know isn't fact and truth (or that which we don't know, for that matter, since there is always the potential to know it). There is an ultimate truth for everything, and humans are capable of finding it, and in many cases already have. What isn't known shouldn't make it so that nothing can be known.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • PJ_Soul
    PJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,668
    rollings wrote:
    In other words, we are smart enough to know that our brains are limited.

    Yet often not smart enough to render this fact into our thoughts and discussions about such things.

    :wtf: what did I just say?
    :think: :lol:
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • MotoDC
    MotoDC Posts: 947
    rollings wrote:
    In other words, we are smart enough to know that our brains are limited.

    Yet often not smart enough to render this fact into our thoughts and discussions about such things.

    :wtf: what did I just say?
    That we are arrogant as a species. And quite well, at that. :ugeek:
  • PJ_Soul
    PJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,668
    MotoDC wrote:
    rollings wrote:
    In other words, we are smart enough to know that our brains are limited.

    Yet often not smart enough to render this fact into our thoughts and discussions about such things.

    :wtf: what did I just say?
    That we are arrogant as a species. And quite well, at that. :ugeek:
    I thought that was just a given. I mean, look at religion.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • whgarrett
    whgarrett Posts: 574
    Is science your religion PJ_Soul? ;)
  • PJ_Soul
    PJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,668
    whgarrett wrote:
    Is science your religion PJ_Soul? ;)
    I suppose it is, yeah! :lol: .... But no. It's not. :| I think you're calling me arrogant because of my thoughts on science? Is that what's going on?? because if so, I don't think you're reading what I'm saying carefully.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • whgarrett
    whgarrett Posts: 574
    I'm just messing with you. I totally believe in science. I do not believe in religion. Unfortunately I think science and applied science/technology is the tool MAN wields to destroy all that is beautiful.
  • PJ_Soul
    PJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,668
    whgarrett wrote:
    I'm just messing with you. I totally believe in science. I do not believe in religion. Unfortunately I think science and applied science/technology is the tool MAN wields to destroy all that is beautiful.
    Okay.... I probably knew you were kidding... I'm in a pissy mood. :roll:
    Man certainly does fuck a lot of shit up with technology, that's for sure (although makes a lot of things a whole lot better with it too!).
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • Cosmo
    Cosmo Posts: 12,225
    know1 wrote:
    So basically, you're saying that science doesn't really have any true answers, but rather that it is continually seeking more knowledge?

    If so, I agree with that and it's what I've been saying for years. People put a lot of faith in science when true science should never say that its answers are absolute. In other words, people are believing in something that says itself that it doesn't know.
    ...
    Nope. Sorry.
    Science HAS come up with answers... such as the Earth is NOT the center of the Universe and planets to NOT spin around in little mini orbits to explain their movements across the night sky to fit the church's view of the geocentric Universe. Science has also provided the answer to gravity, plate tectonics and human genetics... AND... that meteors are just giant clusters of rocks and ice that adhere to the laws of physics and are NOT signs from God that the end of days is upon us. Yes... someday, one of those giant rocks will actually strike the planet and end all of humanity... but guesss what? The Earth will still be here. The End of humans is not the end of the Universe.
    Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
    Hail, Hail!!!
  • Jeanwah
    Jeanwah Posts: 6,363
    know1 wrote:

    Science is absolutely not truth. In fact, it's the opposite of it.

    Science leaves open the possibility that new evidence tomorrow could totally overthrow what we think we know today.

    That's why I find it interesting that people put faith in something that maintains a position that it will always be seeking more answers.

    And it is exactly an educated guess as someone said above.

    Let me guess, you don't believe in climate science, do you. So if science doesn't ascertain your beliefs, than you can claim that it's all hogwash. Uh-huh.
  • know1
    know1 Posts: 6,801
    Jeanwah wrote:
    know1 wrote:

    Science is absolutely not truth. In fact, it's the opposite of it.

    Science leaves open the possibility that new evidence tomorrow could totally overthrow what we think we know today.

    That's why I find it interesting that people put faith in something that maintains a position that it will always be seeking more answers.

    And it is exactly an educated guess as someone said above.

    Let me guess, you don't believe in climate science, do you. So if science doesn't ascertain your beliefs, than you can claim that it's all hogwash. Uh-huh.

    That's totally not what I'm saying.

    I'm saying that science does not call itself infallible, so why do people put so much faith in it.

    Science acknowledges that any of its conclusions could be overturned tomorrow with new evidence/observations.
    The only people we should try to get even with...
    ...are those who've helped us.

    Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
  • know1
    know1 Posts: 6,801
    Cosmo wrote:
    know1 wrote:
    So basically, you're saying that science doesn't really have any true answers, but rather that it is continually seeking more knowledge?

    If so, I agree with that and it's what I've been saying for years. People put a lot of faith in science when true science should never say that its answers are absolute. In other words, people are believing in something that says itself that it doesn't know.
    ...
    Nope. Sorry.
    Science HAS come up with answers... such as the Earth is NOT the center of the Universe and planets to NOT spin around in little mini orbits to explain their movements across the night sky to fit the church's view of the geocentric Universe. Science has also provided the answer to gravity, plate tectonics and human genetics... AND... that meteors are just giant clusters of rocks and ice that adhere to the laws of physics and are NOT signs from God that the end of days is upon us. Yes... someday, one of those giant rocks will actually strike the planet and end all of humanity... but guesss what? The Earth will still be here. The End of humans is not the end of the Universe.

    None of that has even the remotest relation to what I was saying.

    But I do believe that science hasn't really proven anything. Proof is a man-made convention anyway.
    The only people we should try to get even with...
    ...are those who've helped us.

    Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
  • Cosmo
    Cosmo Posts: 12,225
    know1 wrote:
    Proof is a man-made convention anyway.
    ...
    And so is the concept of God.
    So, it's a wash, right?
    Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
    Hail, Hail!!!

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