Whats going wrong with the world? More shootings

PJ_Soul · August 2012

redrock wrote:

redrock wrote:

pandora wrote:

But not being a US citizen ......

Well, well... I see one edited her post to remove some stupid 'finger pointing elitism' (ie, you're not one of 'us' so you wouldn't know...), pretending it never happened.
But too late!.... it's been quoted!

Not the first time she's said that!

redrock · August 2012

PJ_Soul wrote:

Not the first time she's said that!

What made me laugh are the 'talking out of one's arse' and the assumptions made about me! (Please note: exclamation mark does not mean I am upset - thank you.).

But then again, this 'elitist' thinking is quite hilarious too...

dimitrispearljam · August 2012

redrock wrote:

PJ_Soul wrote:

Not the first time she's said that!

What made me laugh are the 'talking out of one's arse' and the assumptions made about me! (Please note: exclamation mark does not mean I am upset - thank you.).

But then again, this 'elitist' thinking is quite hilarious too...

even i know years now that you are American...

you have much European culture...

and ofcourse,all can have an opinion,where ever they coming from...

number 1 thing you learn at democracy....

democracy.....beautiful Greek word...

redrock · August 2012

dimitrispearljam wrote:

and ofcourse,all can have an opinion,where ever they coming from...

number 1 thing you learn at democracy....

democracy.....beautiful Greek word...

Indeed. You, me, Sian, Babs, Hinn, Michael, Fleur, Yvi, Marina, Hub, Gary, Al, Sandra.. only to name a few of our friends. All citizens of different countries, all equally entitled to an opinion on worldwide issues. Sometimes these might even be more 'learned' than 'local' opinion (though not automatically better. Disclaimer: I'm not saying this is the case in this thread).

dimitrispearljam · August 2012

redrock wrote:

dimitrispearljam wrote:

and ofcourse,all can have an opinion,where ever they coming from...

number 1 thing you learn at democracy....

democracy.....beautiful Greek word...

Indeed. You, me, Sian, Babs, Hinn, Michael, Fleur, Yvi, Marina, Hub, Gary, Al, Sandra.. only to name a few of our friends. All citizens of different countries, all equally entitled to an opinion on worldwide issues. Sometimes these might even be more 'learned' than 'local' opinion (though not automatically better. Disclaimer: I'm not saying this is the case in this thread).

exactly...you are right..
to tell u the truth,as it comes to this thread,i knew already how the non-americans opinion will be..
i know,its culture thing,how democracy build in europe,
im intresting alot of American opinions,cos they live with this..
for me is the most intresting thread at AMT forum the last years..

Edit...btw ..i really enjoy reading Zoso at this thread

Hugh Freaking Dillon · August 2012

pandora wrote:

Being unprepared can be equal to being weak.

I think that pretty much summed it up which I have said before in a couple of other posts.

what a ridiculous statement.

and you have said so little in so many pages it's mind boggling.

g under p · August 2012

Man I go away and AGAIN I have a book to read and that head banging the wall is ALL I can see.

Failure To Communicate

Peace

Cosmo · August 2012

PJ_Soul · August 2012

Cosmo wrote:

Ah, this brings back good memories of the days of internet yore.

hedonist · August 2012

dimitrispearljam wrote:

redrock wrote:

PJ_Soul wrote:

Not the first time she's said that!

What made me laugh are the 'talking out of one's arse' and the assumptions made about me! (Please note: exclamation mark does not mean I am upset - thank you.).

But then again, this 'elitist' thinking is quite hilarious too...

even i know years now that you are American...

you have much European culture...

and ofcourse,all can have an opinion,where ever they coming from...

number 1 thing you learn at democracy....

democracy.....beautiful Greek word...

Before she mentioned it, I didn't know that redrock is American - and it really doesn't matter to me. Wisdom and common sense viewpoints aren't exclusive to one country :P

ComeToTX · August 2012

Hey gun folks, you're fighting to keep guys like this armed and dangerous!

The crazed gun nut who allegedly killed a county constable and another person in a shooting near Texas A&M University on Monday was a "ticking time bomb" that was ready to blow, his family said.

"He was crazy as hell," Richard Weaver, gunman Thomas Caffall's stepfather, told Houston station KPRC television.
"At one point, we were afraid that he was going to come up here and do something to his mother and me," Weaver said.

Shawn Kemp, a local acquaintance of Caffall’s, told The Eagle newspaper that he “fits the profile of a dude who might snap.”
Caffall seemed depressed and often talked about guns and war, Kemp told the newspaper.
"I don’t know the guy well, but I’ve been around him enough to know, well, that I’m not surprised at all,” Kemp said, adding that he had heard that Caffall planned to pawn some of his guns to pay his rent.

pandora · August 2012

ComeToTX wrote:

Hey gun folks, you're fighting to keep guys like this armed and dangerous!

The crazed gun nut who allegedly killed a county constable and another person in a shooting near Texas A&M University on Monday was a "ticking time bomb" that was ready to blow, his family said.

"He was crazy as hell," Richard Weaver, gunman Thomas Caffall's stepfather, told Houston station KPRC television.
"At one point, we were afraid that he was going to come up here and do something to his mother and me," Weaver said.

Shawn Kemp, a local acquaintance of Caffall’s, told The Eagle newspaper that he “fits the profile of a dude who might snap.”
Caffall seemed depressed and often talked about guns and war, Kemp told the newspaper.
"I don’t know the guy well, but I’ve been around him enough to know, well, that I’m not surprised at all,” Kemp said, adding that he had heard that Caffall planned to pawn some of his guns to pay his rent.

I guess I'll start with the beginning of the thread...
make mental health care available to all not just the insured, not just 24 visits a year, but
enable people to get help for their family members before they hurt themselves or others.

Provide mental health options, have help readily available...
like free walk in clinics, places people can get help themselves
or go for answers for family members.

We have seen 3 shooters at least lately showing signs to someone
they were dangerous and no one did anything about it.
Hopefully people will get involved and stop a tragedy, we must make that easier to do.

Gun laws don't stop crazy sorry, I know many here think that is the answer.
Gun laws only keep responsible gun owners without
their rights intact.
All gun opponents want to do is take away guns from the law abiding.
Each time I ask what would you do to solve the problem the answer is
removing rights to own guns.
How many, what kind, how it's purchased. Pretty sure this will be fought
but even passed it will do nothing as long as people can get guns on the street.

Who Princess · August 2012

For those who like the car analogy, did anyone read the article I posted on p. 111?
viewtopic.php?f=13&t=192967&start=1650

I know it's kind of long and all, but did anybody read it and think about the example given?

In the mid 20th century, public health officials decided to take a multi-faceted approach to lowering the number of deaths in car accidents. And guess what--they succeeded. A few of the things that were implemented:

Improved road conditions to help avoid accidents or make them less lethal. Driver education for young people. It couldn't be required of every driver but if you begin teaching the youngest ones before they get on the road, over time there will be more drivers who are aware of how to drive safely. Then, the really big one--auto manufacturers began to make cars safer. Some of the changes were small, like seat belts to keep you from being thrown from a vehicle. Headrests, which keep your neck from breaking if your car is rear ended (you didn't really think they were for resting your head, did you?). Changes in design so that drivers were no longer impaled by the steering column during a collision. Later on, as the car makers started to realize that people actually like safety features, they started adding more things like air bags. I can remember in the 80s when NO cars had them. In a few years car makers were trying to outdo themselves with all the airbags they installed.
In other words, drivers no longer received the sole credit or blame for whether or not they survived an accident. Conditions were changed to make driving safer.

As I've said numerous times on this board, I'm old. Or at least older than most people here. I remember the car my family had when I was a child. It had no seat belts. The car we bought in 1964 had seat belts only in the front. My parents paid extra to have them installed in the back.

There are still a large number of deaths due to auto accidents when compared to say, the 1950s or 60s. But the U.S. population is larger and there are more cars on the road.

If you want to stick with that car analogy when comparing it to guns, try offering something a little better than making jokes about "let's ban all the cars, they kill more people than guns!" As the article said, our reality now is living in a society with guns. They're not going away. What can we do to make life safer in this reality.

chadwick · August 2012

say what?

pandora · August 2012

JonnyPistachio wrote:

pandora wrote:

JonnyPistachio wrote:

The car analogy is atrocious.
What do irresponsible people do when driving a car? Most do nothing besides arrive at their destination. I go over the speed limit every single day. That is irresponsible. I see many, many others: speeding, driving drunk, texting, cutting people off, going through stop signs and red lights, etc...and still arriving at destinations without a problem.

Now you got it ...it is exactly the very same with guns. People know who is responsible...
we see it and know it and know who isn't.

As I have said in previous posts, over my life I have known countless responsible gun owners.
They have children never once has any been injured, none never ever.
Yet I see everyday the shootings committed by the thoughtless.
Not the thoughtful.

Just as their are those who drive there whole lives like me
without being at fault. Thoughtful drivers.

Responsible speaks for itself, sorry some can't understand that.

No, people dont know in advance who's responsible, otherwise nobody would've sold those guns to Holmes, or the officer in TX wouldve called for backup...nobody knows. And, you can be extremely responsible and still have accidents. No one is perfect. Remember, I was nearly shot in the head by one of the most respected, responsible people I know.

I don't remember were they cleaning their gun? Target practice?
Bad guy around?

That is something that just doesn't usually happen unless someone
is untrained to some degree, unprepared with a gun.

pandora · August 2012

Hugh Freaking Dillon wrote:

pandora wrote:

Being unprepared can be equal to being weak.

I think that pretty much summed it up which I have said before in a couple of other posts.

what a ridiculous statement.

and you have said so little in so many pages it's mind boggling.

another way to say hindsight is 20/20 and most regret something

Do you know something of that yourself? Perhaps...

well what does that say about you spending soooo much time reading and then always replying

that is even more mind boggling wouldn't you say?

Snakeduck · August 2012

pandora wrote:

Gun laws don't stop crazy sorry, I know many here think that is the answer.
Gun laws only keep responsible gun owners without
their rights intact.
All gun opponents want to do is take away guns from the law abiding.
Each time I ask what would you do to solve the problem the answer is
removing rights to own guns.
How many, what kind, how it's purchased. Pretty sure this will be fought
but even passed it will do nothing as long as people can get guns on the street.

I've been mostly staying out of this debate because I don't want to wind up crushing my forehead against a wall in frustration. You do realize that the evil boogieman you call "gun control" already exists, right? It does. That's a fact. So, knowing that, do you think "gun control" as it currently exists (reminding you once again that it does already exist) is flawless? You don't think anything could possibly be done to better "gun control" in our society? Not even the slightest tweak here or there? Or, would you recommend we get rid of all current "gun control" laws on the book? I don't see you railing against the "gun control" already in place, so I have to assume you are, in fact, okay with "gun control" at least as it currently exists... I've also heard you suggest that we the people should have equal access to the same weaponry used by police and the government. Really? It's not like I trust those entities much, but should I have access to surface-to-air missiles, nuclear warheads, lazer shooting sharks, etc.?

"Gun control" doesn't mean your law abiding citizens can't have guns, it just means we need to screen folks a whole lot better and have some sane discussion of what level of firepower your average Joe really needs and how quickly they truly need this access.

pandora · August 2012

PJ_Soul wrote:

redrock wrote:

redrock wrote:

Well, well... I see one edited her post to remove some stupid 'finger pointing elitism' (ie, you're not one of 'us' so you wouldn't know...), pretending it never happened.
But too late!.... it's been quoted!

Not the first time she's said that!

Don't you love it when people talk about you like you're not here?

pandora · August 2012

Snakeduck wrote:

pandora wrote:

Gun laws don't stop crazy sorry, I know many here think that is the answer.
Gun laws only keep responsible gun owners without
their rights intact.
All gun opponents want to do is take away guns from the law abiding.
Each time I ask what would you do to solve the problem the answer is
removing rights to own guns.
How many, what kind, how it's purchased. Pretty sure this will be fought
but even passed it will do nothing as long as people can get guns on the street.

I've been mostly staying out of this debate because I don't want to wind up crushing my forehead against a wall in frustration. You do realize that the evil boogieman you call "gun control" already exists, right? It does. That's a fact. So, knowing that, do you think "gun control" as it currently exists (reminding you once again that it does already exist) is flawless? You don't think anything could possibly be done to better "gun control" in our society? Not even the slightest tweak here or there? Or, would you recommend we get rid of all current "gun control" laws on the book? I don't see you railing against the "gun control" already in place, so I have to assume you are, in fact, okay with "gun control" at least as it currently exists... I've also heard you suggest that we the people should have equal access to the same weaponry used by police and the government. Really? It's not like I trust those entities much, but should I have access to surface-to-air missiles, nuclear warheads, lazer shooting sharks, etc.?

"Gun control" doesn't mean your law abiding citizens can't have guns, it just means we need to screen folks a whole lot better and have some sane discussion of what level of firepower your average Joe really needs and how quickly they truly need this access.

I would rather see gun laws we have enforced and have stricter penalties for criminals and
work on getting illegal guns off the streets. This works.

Need ... who decides what someone needs?
How many abortions does one woman need in her lifetime?
How much baby blood on her hands?

When it comes to rights who decides that?

It will be a draw no one wants to give up rights.
The woman who uses abortion as birth control or the person who wants to own
300 guns. Some might think one is wrong some might think both are wrong,
some neither.

I fight to keep people having their rights to choose, even when I think it is wrong.

Snakeduck · August 2012

pandora wrote:

Snakeduck wrote:

pandora wrote:

Gun laws don't stop crazy sorry, I know many here think that is the answer.
Gun laws only keep responsible gun owners without
their rights intact.
All gun opponents want to do is take away guns from the law abiding.
Each time I ask what would you do to solve the problem the answer is
removing rights to own guns.
How many, what kind, how it's purchased. Pretty sure this will be fought
but even passed it will do nothing as long as people can get guns on the street.

I've been mostly staying out of this debate because I don't want to wind up crushing my forehead against a wall in frustration. You do realize that the evil boogieman you call "gun control" already exists, right? It does. That's a fact. So, knowing that, do you think "gun control" as it currently exists (reminding you once again that it does already exist) is flawless? You don't think anything could possibly be done to better "gun control" in our society? Not even the slightest tweak here or there? Or, would you recommend we get rid of all current "gun control" laws on the book? I don't see you railing against the "gun control" already in place, so I have to assume you are, in fact, okay with "gun control" at least as it currently exists... I've also heard you suggest that we the people should have equal access to the same weaponry used by police and the government. Really? It's not like I trust those entities much, but should I have access to surface-to-air missiles, nuclear warheads, lazer shooting sharks, etc.?

"Gun control" doesn't mean your law abiding citizens can't have guns, it just means we need to screen folks a whole lot better and have some sane discussion of what level of firepower your average Joe really needs and how quickly they truly need this access.

I would rather see gun laws we have enforced and have stricter penalties for criminals and
work on getting illegal guns off the streets. This works.

See, you do support gun control. Excellent.

Whats going wrong with the world? More shootings

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