And, for the record, "Last Kiss" was Pearl Jam's biggest "hit" in Hot 100 terms, peaking at #2. Oddly enough, "I Got Id/Long Road" was the band's next-biggest hit, peaking at #7.
The problem with looking at Pearl Jam's chart performance is that the eligibility requirements have changed over the years. When "Ten" and "Vs." were out, a song had to be commercially available as a single to chart on the Hot 100. Thus, even if "Daughter" were #1 in airplay, for example, it was not eligible to chart because there was no commercially available single in the U.S. (The early PJ "singles" were released in the U.S. much later, and several of the songs actually charted at the bottom end of the Hot 100 on the strength of sales alone.)
"I Got Id" was the exact opposite. It got very little airplay on pop stations, but the sales of "Merkin Ball," which were huge the first week, were enough to cause the song to debut in the top 10.
"Last Kiss" combined huge airplay with significant sales, but it was something of a novelty hit. You don't hear "Last Kiss" on the radio very much anymore (although, coincidentally, I heard it here in L.A. just yesterday on 100.3), but you still hear "Daughter" and "Jeremy." In Billboard terms, "Last Kiss" is PJ's biggest hit, but in non-chart terms-- i.e., what is the band's most well-known and well-loved song?-- it's probably "Daughter" or "Jeremy."
All of these are good and fair points. And I have thought all along that Just Breathe was the best choice as a second single. I also don't believe it will do what KOL or Green Day did, but it is still possible. In fact I think Unthougth Known also has a chance to cross over if released.
Now with all that said, and on the topic of 'admitting when you are wrong', If you are going to call people out, then perhaps you should admit you were wrong about what caused the dramatic spike over the Black Friday week.
It was the sale price, not alone, but as the most significant driving factor.
In a way you are right...
But, in my defense (I'll use emphasizing tools to get my point across)...
I still think that it was the release of Just Breathe, the success of The Fixer, AND the sales price decline. I never said the price decline didn't help to increase sales... I thought it did, I just valued the other parts more than others (such as yourself?) did. My argument was that people needed to 'want' the CD, regardless of it's price, because music is not interchangeable. In other words, I believe significant price declines on a CD don't affect increase demand (relative to other CDs) as much as a price decline on a brand of milk (which is much more easily interchangeable). I thought the fixer and just breathe, along with positive reviews, were the reason people wanted the CD.
But, to be fair, maybe I over-exaggerated the immediate success of Just Breathe. So, I'll admit, Just Breathe has moved slower into the visability than I thought it would. So, maybe the reason for the jump during the Thanksgiving holiday was a bit more due to price than I had previously believed....
All of these are good and fair points. And I have thought all along that Just Breathe was the best choice as a second single. I also don't believe it will do what KOL or Green Day did, but it is still possible. In fact I think Unthougth Known also has a chance to cross over if released.
Now with all that said, and on the topic of 'admitting when you are wrong', If you are going to call people out, then perhaps you should admit you were wrong about what caused the dramatic spike over the Black Friday week.
It was the sale price, not alone, but as the most significant driving factor.
In a way you are right...
But, in my defense (I'll use emphasizing tools to get my point across)...
I still think that it was the release of Just Breathe, the success of The Fixer, AND the sales price decline. I never said the price decline didn't help to increase sales... I thought it did, I just valued the other parts more than others (such as yourself?) did. My argument was that people needed to 'want' the CD, regardless of it's price, because music is not interchangeable. In other words, I believe significant price declines on a CD don't affect increase demand (relative to other CDs) as much as a price decline on a brand of milk (which is much more easily interchangeable). I thought the fixer and just breathe, along with positive reviews, were the reason people wanted the CD.
But, to be fair, maybe I over-exaggerated the immediate success of Just Breathe. So, I'll admit, Just Breathe has moved slower into the visability than I thought it would. So, maybe the reason for the jump during the Thanksgiving holiday was a bit more due to price than I had previously believed....
Fair enough. Now let's hope that I'm proven wrong and Just Breathe does better than KOL and Green Day.
All of these are good and fair points. And I have thought all along that Just Breathe was the best choice as a second single. I also don't believe it will do what KOL or Green Day did, but it is still possible. In fact I think Unthougth Known also has a chance to cross over if released.
Now with all that said, and on the topic of 'admitting when you are wrong', If you are going to call people out, then perhaps you should admit you were wrong about what caused the dramatic spike over the Black Friday week.
It was the sale price, not alone, but as the most significant driving factor.
In a way you are right...
But, in my defense (I'll use emphasizing tools to get my point across)...
I still think that it was the release of Just Breathe, the success of The Fixer, AND the sales price decline. I never said the price decline didn't help to increase sales... I thought it did, I just valued the other parts more than others (such as yourself?) did. My argument was that people needed to 'want' the CD, regardless of it's price, because music is not interchangeable. In other words, I believe significant price declines on a CD don't affect increase demand (relative to other CDs) as much as a price decline on a brand of milk (which is much more easily interchangeable). I thought the fixer and just breathe, along with positive reviews, were the reason people wanted the CD.
But, to be fair, maybe I over-exaggerated the immediate success of Just Breathe. So, I'll admit, Just Breathe has moved slower into the visability than I thought it would. So, maybe the reason for the jump during the Thanksgiving holiday was a bit more due to price than I had previously believed....
Everything indicates that the lower price point was the difference. The Prince album (another Target exclusive) had a similar sales spike the same week when it was discounted. Alice in Chains experienced the same thing two weeks later. All of these albums declined significantly the week after the discount.
Seriously not to be a d_ck, but I think a few of you peoples should admit that you were wrong about this song....
it continues to move up the charts... it's probably the most successful second single the band has ever released already.
I'm the one who started this thread, so I guess I better step up and admit I was wrong... well kind of wrong :? I would've predicted "Just Breathe" disappearing from radio long before now... I do admit that. It hasn't become a huge hit, but it has slowly crept up the rock charts and has had pretty good staying power. Some people attribute this to the very stale programming of commercial radio. Whatever the case, I'm happy that the song has had modest success so far. Yes, I would call the success of "Just Breathe" modest at this point, not huge. We're definitely not to the territory of "Boulevard of Broken Dreams" (Green Day) or "Use Somebody" (Kings of Leon). It is a success as far as second singles from Pearl Jam go, which isn't saying much.
What the song hasn't done (yet) is make Backspacer sales blow up. I think Backspacer sits at #80 on the latest Billboard charts with sales still under 500,000. Maybe without "Just Breathe", Backspacer would've completely stalled and dropped out of the top 200? I don't know. If the song does continue to climb up the charts and somehow manages to get Backspacer to platinum status (1 million sold), I will definitely belly up and eat my crow. Still don't see this happening.
As I stated earlier. When you started this thread. Just Breathe was is in its infancy. So it was premature. Also songs played on rock stations don't drive sales up that much. it'll have to crossover to pop stations to get sales up. The most audience impressions a song can get on a rock station is probably 12 million. And it'll take maybe a month or two if the song goes to number 1 on the rock charts. Compared to 70-80 million on top 40 stations. Where bands like Greemn Day, Linkin Park, KOL and Nickelback are played. If they get to that point every week. Sales will go up. But they're doing pretty well. With limited options to buy the album.
On the elevator screen at my work building, I saw Just Breathe listed as the 3rd top Adult Rock song. Of course, I think like Train was 2nd, and Norah Jones was 1st, but I think this is the type of crowd Pearl Jam wants to attract with the song, so its headed in the right direction!
Member Number: 437xxx
Pearl Jam:
Key Arena - Seattle, WA - Sep 21, 2009
Pacific Coliseum - Vancouver, BC - Sep 25, 2011
Key Arena - Seattle, WA - Dec 6, 2013
Eddie Vedder Solo:
Benaroya Hall - Seattle, WA - Jul 15, 2011
^^^ I'd say Alive or Better Man is their most universally loved tune.
Yes, "Better Man." Forgot "Better Man."
"Alive" does not have the same mainstream appeal as "Daughter," "Jeremy" or "Better Man," nor did it receive the same level of airplay.
I think you could make a pretty good case for Alive's mainstream appeal. It was pretty well known in 92 and it's probably the PJ song I hear the most on the radio nowadays, well that and Better Man depending on the station. Alive get alotta classic rock love and rightfully so.
Jeremy is really the only tune I remember gettin totally worn out on the radio, so I'd put it in a league by itself.
I still love it, and although I'd like it to be a success for the band, I remain unbothered by how it charts.
It proves nothing to me.
It's simple beautiful and performed perfectly, it presses all my buttons and does everything a song should. Probably my favourite song of last year, so fast forward Ireland - please bring the strings guys
so fast forward Ireland - please bring the strings guys
I wonder how Pearl Jam go about getting a local string quartet to play on stage with them. Nice on the quartets CV though...
"We played the Concert Hall Dublin, , Albert Hall London, La Scala Milan, Lincoln Centre NYC and oh yeah live with Pearl Jam! "
don't you think its a little stupid to compare Just Breathe to Use Somebody or Boulevard of Broken Dreams? those songs/bands had a marketing push behind them about 80 times greater than that of Just Breathe.
don't you think its a little stupid to compare Just Breathe to Use Somebody or Boulevard of Broken Dreams? those songs/bands had a marketing push behind them about 80 times greater than that of Just Breathe.
Which would make PJ's accomplishment 80 times greater if they do manage to cross over.
Member Number: 437xxx
Pearl Jam:
Key Arena - Seattle, WA - Sep 21, 2009
Pacific Coliseum - Vancouver, BC - Sep 25, 2011
Key Arena - Seattle, WA - Dec 6, 2013
Eddie Vedder Solo:
Benaroya Hall - Seattle, WA - Jul 15, 2011
I actually think Just Breathe is starting to do really well. I hear it on XRT all the time and actually heard it on Q101 recently. After it was played on Q101 someone called up and said how great it was too. My girlfriend's friend was also asking about it, saying that she loved it. She is not a PJ fan.
"hear my name, take a good look, this could be the day."
Use Somebody and Boulevard of Broken Dreams are songs that build. Just Breath doesn't build at all. Stays flat. That's why I don't think it will ever catch on in a big way with staying power. It could be #2 on the rock charts now, but we won't hear it in a year like we'd hear a Nickleback #2 song.
Use Somebody and Boulevard of Broken Dreams are songs that build. Just Breath doesn't build at all. Stays flat. That's why I don't think it will ever catch on in a big way with staying power. It could be #2 on the rock charts now, but we won't hear it in a year like we'd hear a Nickleback #2 song.
Speaking of songs that build, I think Unthought Known definitely fits in that category. My hope is that Just Breathe has enough success to where Unthought Known can ride in on its coattails and become a bigger hit.
Member Number: 437xxx
Pearl Jam:
Key Arena - Seattle, WA - Sep 21, 2009
Pacific Coliseum - Vancouver, BC - Sep 25, 2011
Key Arena - Seattle, WA - Dec 6, 2013
Eddie Vedder Solo:
Benaroya Hall - Seattle, WA - Jul 15, 2011
Use Somebody and Boulevard of Broken Dreams are songs that build. Just Breath doesn't build at all. Stays flat. That's why I don't think it will ever catch on in a big way with staying power. It could be #2 on the rock charts now, but we won't hear it in a year like we'd hear a Nickleback #2 song.
It builds to the chorus, "Did I say that I need you?/Did I say that I want you?/Oh, if I didn’t, I’m a fool you see/No one knows this more than me," when the strings come in. That is the song's hook-- even though it's the part that many PJ fans think is mawkish, that is the part that resonates and grabs the average listener.
don't you think its a little stupid to compare Just Breathe to Use Somebody or Boulevard of Broken Dreams? those songs/bands had a marketing push behind them about 80 times greater than that of Just Breathe.
Which would make PJ's accomplishment 80 times greater if they do manage to cross over.
Use Somebody and Boulevard of Broken Dreams are songs that build. Just Breath doesn't build at all. Stays flat. That's why I don't think it will ever catch on in a big way with staying power. It could be #2 on the rock charts now, but we won't hear it in a year like we'd hear a Nickleback #2 song.
It builds to the chorus, "Did I say that I need you?/Did I say that I want you?/Oh, if I didn’t, I’m a fool you see/No one knows this more than me," when the strings come in. That is the song's hook-- even though it's the part that many PJ fans think is mawkish, that is the part that resonates and grabs the average listener.
i love that part. i didn't realize a lot of pjammers did not like it for that reason. in fact, i would have liked them to throw that chorus in there at the end and extend the song an extra 30 seconds or so
i liked the song when i heard it but i think the live versions are a lot better....either way it's a good singel to put out and it's obviously doin pretty decent in the charts. You can't compare a band like pearl jam to green day or kol...especially when it comes to their singles. Green day in particular is good at writing typical, simple pop "ballads" that get pushed by a big record company and are adored by 17 yr olds everywhere.
Comments
The problem with looking at Pearl Jam's chart performance is that the eligibility requirements have changed over the years. When "Ten" and "Vs." were out, a song had to be commercially available as a single to chart on the Hot 100. Thus, even if "Daughter" were #1 in airplay, for example, it was not eligible to chart because there was no commercially available single in the U.S. (The early PJ "singles" were released in the U.S. much later, and several of the songs actually charted at the bottom end of the Hot 100 on the strength of sales alone.)
"I Got Id" was the exact opposite. It got very little airplay on pop stations, but the sales of "Merkin Ball," which were huge the first week, were enough to cause the song to debut in the top 10.
"Last Kiss" combined huge airplay with significant sales, but it was something of a novelty hit. You don't hear "Last Kiss" on the radio very much anymore (although, coincidentally, I heard it here in L.A. just yesterday on 100.3), but you still hear "Daughter" and "Jeremy." In Billboard terms, "Last Kiss" is PJ's biggest hit, but in non-chart terms-- i.e., what is the band's most well-known and well-loved song?-- it's probably "Daughter" or "Jeremy."
In a way you are right...
But, in my defense (I'll use emphasizing tools to get my point across)...
I still think that it was the release of Just Breathe, the success of The Fixer, AND the sales price decline. I never said the price decline didn't help to increase sales... I thought it did, I just valued the other parts more than others (such as yourself?) did. My argument was that people needed to 'want' the CD, regardless of it's price, because music is not interchangeable. In other words, I believe significant price declines on a CD don't affect increase demand (relative to other CDs) as much as a price decline on a brand of milk (which is much more easily interchangeable). I thought the fixer and just breathe, along with positive reviews, were the reason people wanted the CD.
But, to be fair, maybe I over-exaggerated the immediate success of Just Breathe. So, I'll admit, Just Breathe has moved slower into the visability than I thought it would. So, maybe the reason for the jump during the Thanksgiving holiday was a bit more due to price than I had previously believed....
<object height="81" width="100%"> <param name="movie" value="https://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http://api.soundcloud.com/tracks/28998869"></param> <param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param> <embed allowscriptaccess="always" height="81" src="https://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http://api.soundcloud.com/tracks/28998869" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="100%"></embed> </object> <span><a href=" - In the Fire (demo)</a> by <a href="
Fair enough. Now let's hope that I'm proven wrong and Just Breathe does better than KOL and Green Day.
Nothing would make me happier!
Yes, "Better Man." Forgot "Better Man."
"Alive" does not have the same mainstream appeal as "Daughter," "Jeremy" or "Better Man," nor did it receive the same level of airplay.
Everything indicates that the lower price point was the difference. The Prince album (another Target exclusive) had a similar sales spike the same week when it was discounted. Alice in Chains experienced the same thing two weeks later. All of these albums declined significantly the week after the discount.
As I stated earlier. When you started this thread. Just Breathe was is in its infancy. So it was premature. Also songs played on rock stations don't drive sales up that much. it'll have to crossover to pop stations to get sales up. The most audience impressions a song can get on a rock station is probably 12 million. And it'll take maybe a month or two if the song goes to number 1 on the rock charts. Compared to 70-80 million on top 40 stations. Where bands like Greemn Day, Linkin Park, KOL and Nickelback are played. If they get to that point every week. Sales will go up. But they're doing pretty well. With limited options to buy the album.
Pearl Jam:
Key Arena - Seattle, WA - Sep 21, 2009
Pacific Coliseum - Vancouver, BC - Sep 25, 2011
Key Arena - Seattle, WA - Dec 6, 2013
Eddie Vedder Solo:
Benaroya Hall - Seattle, WA - Jul 15, 2011
I think you could make a pretty good case for Alive's mainstream appeal. It was pretty well known in 92 and it's probably the PJ song I hear the most on the radio nowadays, well that and Better Man depending on the station. Alive get alotta classic rock love and rightfully so.
Jeremy is really the only tune I remember gettin totally worn out on the radio, so I'd put it in a league by itself.
The whole world will be different soon the whole world will be RELIEVED
#resistgezi #resistturkey #resisttaksim #direnturkiye #direngezi
#standingman #duranadam
It proves nothing to me.
It's simple beautiful and performed perfectly, it presses all my buttons and does everything a song should. Probably my favourite song of last year, so fast forward Ireland - please bring the strings guys
"We played the Concert Hall Dublin, , Albert Hall London, La Scala Milan, Lincoln Centre NYC and oh yeah live with Pearl Jam!
I second Alive.
Los Angeles 10.7.2009
Just read a thread about Ten back in the day and over half the people point to it as the song that made them take notice
#10 on Alternative--big rotation uptick this week
Awesome!
Pearl Jam:
Key Arena - Seattle, WA - Sep 21, 2009
Pacific Coliseum - Vancouver, BC - Sep 25, 2011
Key Arena - Seattle, WA - Dec 6, 2013
Eddie Vedder Solo:
Benaroya Hall - Seattle, WA - Jul 15, 2011
it's doing pretty well for a bad idea.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yEKsLNheO8o
Pearl Jam:
Key Arena - Seattle, WA - Sep 21, 2009
Pacific Coliseum - Vancouver, BC - Sep 25, 2011
Key Arena - Seattle, WA - Dec 6, 2013
Eddie Vedder Solo:
Benaroya Hall - Seattle, WA - Jul 15, 2011
It builds to the chorus, "Did I say that I need you?/Did I say that I want you?/Oh, if I didn’t, I’m a fool you see/No one knows this more than me," when the strings come in. That is the song's hook-- even though it's the part that many PJ fans think is mawkish, that is the part that resonates and grabs the average listener.
Great discussion, great infos and inputs from all you guys
...is it so wrong to think that love can keep us safe?
INDEED!
i love that part. i didn't realize a lot of pjammers did not like it for that reason. in fact, i would have liked them to throw that chorus in there at the end and extend the song an extra 30 seconds or so