93 Yr Old WW2 Vet freezes to death after company cuts power

SomethingCreative · January 2009

http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/s ... ?hub=World

wow.

decides2dream · January 2009

what a terrible story......and the fact that he was a WWII vet really doesn't make a difference either. it is just beyond sad.

however, quite honestly....this is the *fault* of the company? are utility companies now responsible for keeping tabs on all their clients, monitoring ages, checking all are ok, etc, etc. it is beyond tragic and terrible...but really, where were his family, friends or neighbors? in my mind, all are to some degree at 'fault' here...and pointing fingers, etc.....isn't helping. it just shows yet again, how disconnected we as a society have become. he had neighbors who knew him, some family, seemed like he had $$$, etc...sad no one noticed possible dementia, etc. it is terrible tragedy.

Commy · January 2009

actually yes. yes it is the fault of the power company that cut his power. there should be some research if they are about to cut power to someones apartment in the middle of winter.

soulsinging · January 2009

That's sickening. It's incredibly sad that face-to-face customer service is nonexistent anymore... got to be cost-effective you know. Definitely not worth their time to make sure the cutomers know what's going on before you cut their power in the middle of the worst winter in years.

decides2dream · January 2009

Commy wrote:

actually yes. yes it is the fault of the power company that cut his power. there should be some research if they are about to cut power to someones apartment in the middle of winter.

my point was.....long before his power was cut off, someone who knows/cares about the man, i would have hoped would actually pay attention to him enough and realize, he needed help long before his power was cut off. someone who is mentally stable, fully possessing their faculties, would not have their power cut off without calling the power company, calling a neighbor...a friend...a family member...someone. the fact that it seems he had plenty of $$$ and yet didn't pay his bills, i would think is a sign there were other problems at hand.

so i don't think 'fault' lies soley with them, that is all.

DeLukin · January 2009

Commy wrote:

actually yes. yes it is the fault of the power company that cut his power. there should be some research if they are about to cut power to someones apartment in the middle of winter.

DEFINITELY. We're not talking about canceling the guy's cable here. Nice to know that what the Nazi's couldn't do a stupid corporation did. At the very least they're guilty of violating the basic laws of human decency and should be punished.

soulsinging · January 2009

decides2dream wrote:

Commy wrote:

actually yes. yes it is the fault of the power company that cut his power. there should be some research if they are about to cut power to someones apartment in the middle of winter.

my point was.....long before his power was cut off, someone who knows/cares about the man, i would have hoped would actually pay attention to him enough and realize, he needed help long before his power was cut off. someone who is mentally stable, fully possessing their faculties, would not have their power cut off without calling the power company, calling a neighbor...a friend...a family member...someone. the fact that it seems he had plenty of $$$ and yet didn't pay his bills, i would think is a sign there were other problems at hand.

so i don't think 'fault' lies soley with them, that is all.

He's 93 with no kids. I imagine his family and friends are all dead... how many 93 year olds do you know? Who's supposed to check up on him? Do you go door to door with your neighbors to make sure everything is ok for no apparent reason?

decides2dream · January 2009

soulsinging wrote:

decides2dream wrote:

Commy wrote:

actually yes. yes it is the fault of the power company that cut his power. there should be some research if they are about to cut power to someones apartment in the middle of winter.

my point was.....long before his power was cut off, someone who knows/cares about the man, i would have hoped would actually pay attention to him enough and realize, he needed help long before his power was cut off. someone who is mentally stable, fully possessing their faculties, would not have their power cut off without calling the power company, calling a neighbor...a friend...a family member...someone. the fact that it seems he had plenty of $$$ and yet didn't pay his bills, i would think is a sign there were other problems at hand.

so i don't think 'fault' lies soley with them, that is all.

He's 93 with no kids. I imagine his family and friends are all dead... how many 93 year olds do you know? Who's supposed to check up on him? Do you go door to door with your neighbors to make sure everything is ok for no apparent reason?

i am asking questions...no need to get confrontational.
and i thought the article mentioned a nephew, thus why i asked. also, some of the neighbors sounded like they knew him. if i knew i had a neighbor that old and all alone...i would definitely check in from time to time. i guess too, it speaks close to home, b/c i often imagine that could well be me at 93. :oops: childless, youngest of my family, not many nieces/nephews and none close by....you bet i will get cozy with my neighbors so my dogs don't eat my face off. and actually, i know a good # of people over the age of 80. i am a lot older than you, i had older parents - i cared for my dad in old age/illness..... my own mother is 80, father-in-law 86....my bro-in-laws dad was 93, etc, etc. so i am really not that removed, at all, from elder care.

btw - i am not in any way saying the company is not at fault....just questioning the whole scenario. i think elders living alone is becoming a growing issue in general, and something we need to be aware/monitor...and sure.....figure out ways to accommodate this growing segment of our population. so i wasn't making excuses, merely questions does such responsibility soley rest with the utility. and even beyond that....not saying it may not....just asking for pov of others......

soulsinging · January 2009

decides2dream wrote:

i am asking questions...no need to get confrontational.
and i thought the article mentioned a nephew, thus why i asked. also, some of the neighbors sounded like they knew him. if i knew i had a neighbor that old and all alone...i would definitely check in from time to time. i guess too, it speaks close to home, b/c i often imagine that could well be me at 93. :oops: childless, youngest of my family, not many nieces/nephews and none close by....you bet i will get cozy with my neighbors so my dogs don't eat my face off. and actually, i know a good # of people over the age of 80. i am a lot older than you, i had older parents - i cared for my dad in old age/illness..... my own mother is 80, father-in-law 86....my bro-in-laws dad was 93, etc, etc. so i am really not that removed, at all, from elder care.

What's elder care got to do with it? I didn't see anything mentioned in there about a nephew, and the neighbors sounded like token neighbors with random thoughts... the way everyone says "he was so quiet, but helped me with groceries" when the guy turns out to be a serial killer. I can understand it being alarming if you think one day you'll be in the same boat. But the fact is, blame for this falls squarely on the power company and it's a symptom of the dehumanizing way our corporations operate nowadays. You're not a person to them, you're a number on the screen with no value outside the "money-owed" column. It's shitty. Maybe optimstically we should all have communities where the neighbors watch each other like a 50s sitcom, but even considering that, the neighbors did not go cut his heat off and it's unlikely that anyone short of an in-home nurse could have prevented this... an in-home nurse and the power company.

decides2dream · January 2009

soulsinging wrote:

decides2dream wrote:

i am asking questions...no need to get confrontational.
and i thought the article mentioned a nephew, thus why i asked. also, some of the neighbors sounded like they knew him. if i knew i had a neighbor that old and all alone...i would definitely check in from time to time. i guess too, it speaks close to home, b/c i often imagine that could well be me at 93. :oops: childless, youngest of my family, not many nieces/nephews and none close by....you bet i will get cozy with my neighbors so my dogs don't eat my face off. and actually, i know a good # of people over the age of 80. i am a lot older than you, i had older parents - i cared for my dad in old age/illness..... my own mother is 80, father-in-law 86....my bro-in-laws dad was 93, etc, etc. so i am really not that removed, at all, from elder care.

What's elder care got to do with it? I didn't see anything mentioned in there about a nephew, and the neighbors sounded like token neighbors with random thoughts... the way everyone says "he was so quiet, but helped me with groceries" when the guy turns out to be a serial killer. I can understand it being alarming if you think one day you'll be in the same boat. But the fact is, blame for this falls squarely on the power company and it's a symptom of the dehumanizing way our corporations operate nowadays. You're not a person to them, you're a number on the screen with no value outside the "money-owed" column. It's shitty. Maybe optimstically we should all have communities where the neighbors watch each other like a 50s sitcom, but even considering that, the neighbors did not go cut his heat off and it's unlikely that anyone short of an in-home nurse could have prevented this... an in-home nurse and the power company.

from the article:

The medical examiner is looking into whether Schur suffered from dementia, particularly after police found enough cash lying around in the home to cover his bills. His nephew William Walworth said Schur told him two years ago he had $600,000 in savings.

as i said, i am simply looking at the 'bigger picture' of it all....that's all. i said the company bears blame....and i didn't say that it's not possible that 100% of said blame lie with them...thus why i posed the question. consider it thinking out loud. was simply my initial reaction...as in where are the people who care for this person? i know my father-in-law lives all alone, but he has good contact with neighbors, his children call to check-up, etc....and yes, we've been trying to get him, to no avail, get one of those life alert buttons, etc. however, his mental abilities are still sharp, so thus far, it's ok.

Heatherj43 · February 2009

Lots of times family members and freinds don't realize how demented an elderly perosn in their lives are, or they minimize it. Lots of denial! There is adult protective services for these people, but first someone has recognize they are in danger.
Neighbors often recognize it before those closest to the person. My mom had quite severe dementia and we had no idea for some time. She knew it and hid it. It was a neighbor who notified us as to what was really going on, even then we had trouble getting her help.
This is shameful. Most utility companies have special programs for the elderly and disabled so their power won't get cut off. I have a few ideas in my head as to how these people could be protected a bit more, but I doubt the companies would want to spend the money to get these things started, like NOT shutting off power to certain age groups until they can actually speak to someone about the situation. No 93 yr. old should ever have their power shut off, especially here in Michigan in the middle of winter.

stevehomeair · February 2009

His son haD the money to pay blame him...He lost his patriot father...so sad

blackredyellow · February 2009

Very sad story...

I'd like to know more of the story before totally condemning the utility company. The article said that they never spoke face to face with him, but did they try? Maybe he didn't answer the phone repeatedly or didn't answer the door for utility workers? I don't know...

edit - I hate when the media throws in irrelevant things like "WW2 Veteran" purely to drum up sympathy for him or anger against the company.

decides2dream · February 2009

Heatherj43 wrote:

Lots of times family members and freinds don't realize how demented an elderly perosn in their lives are, or they minimize it. Lots of denial! There is adult protective services for these people, but first someone has recognize they are in danger.
Neighbors often recognize it before those closest to the person. My mom had quite severe dementia and we had no idea for some time. She knew it and hid it. It was a neighbor who notified us as to what was really going on, even then we had trouble getting her help.
This is shameful. Most utility companies have special programs for the elderly and disabled so their power won't get cut off. I have a few ideas in my head as to how these people could be protected a bit more, but I doubt the companies would want to spend the money to get these things started, like NOT shutting off power to certain age groups until they can actually speak to someone about the situation. No 93 yr. old should ever have their power shut off, especially here in Michigan in the middle of winter.

see, i think this is where my mind immediately went, and questioning this.....thus my wonderment.

blackredyellow wrote:

edit - I hate when the media throws in irrelevant things like "WW2 Veteran" purely to drum up sympathy for him or anger against the company.

i agree! it makes for a better headline tho. but really, WWII ver or not, 93 or not....really should nkae ANY difference. no matter one's age, or vetern status, NO one should be freezing to death in their own home, period.

soulsinging · February 2009

decides2dream wrote:

from the article:

The medical examiner is looking into whether Schur suffered from dementia, particularly after police found enough cash lying around in the home to cover his bills. His nephew William Walworth said Schur told him two years ago he had $600,000 in savings.

as i said, i am simply looking at the 'bigger picture' of it all....that's all. i said the company bears blame....and i didn't say that it's not possible that 100% of said blame lie with them...thus why i posed the question. consider it thinking out loud. was simply my initial reaction...as in where are the people who care for this person? i know my father-in-law lives all alone, but he has good contact with neighbors, his children call to check-up, etc....and yes, we've been trying to get him, to no avail, get one of those life alert buttons, etc. however, his mental abilities are still sharp, so thus far, it's ok.

Fair enough. Clearly, we've got different worries ingrained... my favorite novel is Catch-22. I think nothing has ever nailed the absurdly dehumanizing nature of our modern world as well as that book. People are just means to an end and the most remote decisions for convenience at the top can have the most horrifying consequences in human terms. So I read this and it's evidence once again that individual people mean nothing compared to the corporate bottom line. It's depressing. But I do see your point and it is a good- albeit potentially depressing- question.

acoustic guy · February 2009

This story is so sad. It really bothered me when I heard about it.

milarso · February 2009

I live here in Michigan, and they have updated the story.
Apparently, he owed the electric company like $1,000, but refused to pay, so they put a device on his meter that cut his power after it reached a certain level.
In the original article, it kind of made him sound like he couldn't afford to pay the bill and the big, bad electric company shut his power off because they were greedy, leaving a poor destitute old man to die in the cold.
Last night on the local news though, it was released that he left his estate to the Bay City Hospital. It was worth over $600,000!
Obviously he had enough money to pay the bill, but refused to.
It's a sad story, but to blame the electric company for his death seems excessive. If he was living in the cold, unwilling to call somebody (electric company, neighbor, the police even!), and unwilling to pay the bill when he had the money, you have to wonder what he was thinking. It suggests that he might not have been in his right mind, but to blame the electric company for his death seems wrong to me.

And it also seems to me that the company probably let things slide for awhile if his bill got up to $1,000. I live in an apartment in a comparable climate, and it would take me almost two years to get my electric bill up to that... However, I don't know the size of his place or other particulars. But it seems to me it would take a long time for somebody's electric account to become that delinquent.

Commy · February 2009

milarso wrote:

I live here in Michigan, and they have updated the story.
Apparently, he owed the electric company like $1,000, but refused to pay, so they put a device on his meter that cut his power after it reached a certain level.
In the original article, it kind of made him sound like he couldn't afford to pay the bill and the big, bad electric company shut his power off because they were greedy, leaving a poor destitute old man to die in the cold.
Last night on the local news though, it was released that he left his estate to the Bay City Hospital. It was worth over $600,000!
Obviously he had enough money to pay the bill, but refused to.
It's a sad story, but to blame the electric company for his death seems excessive. If he was living in the cold, unwilling to call somebody (electric company, neighbor, the police even!), and unwilling to pay the bill when he had the money, you have to wonder what he was thinking. It suggests that he might not have been in his right mind, but to blame the electric company for his death seems wrong to me.

And it also seems to me that the company probably let things slide for awhile if his bill got up to $1,000. I live in an apartment in a comparable climate, and it would take me almost two years to get my electric bill up to that... However, I don't know the size of his place or other particulars. But it seems to me it would take a long time for somebody's electric account to become that delinquent.

damn. if the last few months are any guide I'de be at a $1000 in 3 months.

the story doesn't say much for the power company. they cut off the power and someone died. that's the bottom line. it says less about our mental health facilities, if someone like this was left on his own. sad story, everyone fucked up. didn't have to be.

Heatherj43 · February 2009

milarso wrote:

I live here in Michigan, and they have updated the story.
Apparently, he owed the electric company like $1,000, but refused to pay, so they put a device on his meter that cut his power after it reached a certain level.
In the original article, it kind of made him sound like he couldn't afford to pay the bill and the big, bad electric company shut his power off because they were greedy, leaving a poor destitute old man to die in the cold.
Last night on the local news though, it was released that he left his estate to the Bay City Hospital. It was worth over $600,000!
Obviously he had enough money to pay the bill, but refused to.
It's a sad story, but to blame the electric company for his death seems excessive. If he was living in the cold, unwilling to call somebody (electric company, neighbor, the police even!), and unwilling to pay the bill when he had the money, you have to wonder what he was thinking. It suggests that he might not have been in his right mind, but to blame the electric company for his death seems wrong to me.

And it also seems to me that the company probably let things slide for awhile if his bill got up to $1,000. I live in an apartment in a comparable climate, and it would take me almost two years to get my electric bill up to that... However, I don't know the size of his place or other particulars. But it seems to me it would take a long time for somebody's electric account to become that delinquent.

WOW! I'm here in Michign too. I hadn't heard that part. He sounds like he was eccentric. With that said, he obviously has mental issues, so he still needed protection. I am not sure it should had come from the electric company, but somehow nobody caught the fact he needed protection and this was the end result. To me, its just a sign of how we don't look out for each other. These days a lot of people don't even know who their neighbors are. I live in a place that my neighbors and me all know each other, thank God. The elderly are looked after by the rest of us. Their snow gets shoveled. they get looked in on, etc.
Oh and my bill would get to $1000 in about 3 months.

Heatherj43 · February 2009

soulsinging wrote:

decides2dream wrote:

Commy wrote:

actually yes. yes it is the fault of the power company that cut his power. there should be some research if they are about to cut power to someones apartment in the middle of winter.

my point was.....long before his power was cut off, someone who knows/cares about the man, i would have hoped would actually pay attention to him enough and realize, he needed help long before his power was cut off. someone who is mentally stable, fully possessing their faculties, would not have their power cut off without calling the power company, calling a neighbor...a friend...a family member...someone. the fact that it seems he had plenty of $$$ and yet didn't pay his bills, i would think is a sign there were other problems at hand.

so i don't think 'fault' lies soley with them, that is all.

My dad is 91. My neighbor is in her 90's too. We do look out for her. Maybe in the middle of winter the power company should not shut off power at all. I don't know. Too bad either way.

He's 93 with no kids. I imagine his family and friends are all dead... how many 93 year olds do you know? Who's supposed to check up on him? Do you go door to door with your neighbors to make sure everything is ok for no apparent reason?

chromiam · February 2009

Commy wrote:

milarso wrote:

I live here in Michigan, and they have updated the story.
Apparently, he owed the electric company like $1,000, but refused to pay, so they put a device on his meter that cut his power after it reached a certain level.
In the original article, it kind of made him sound like he couldn't afford to pay the bill and the big, bad electric company shut his power off because they were greedy, leaving a poor destitute old man to die in the cold.
Last night on the local news though, it was released that he left his estate to the Bay City Hospital. It was worth over $600,000!
Obviously he had enough money to pay the bill, but refused to.
It's a sad story, but to blame the electric company for his death seems excessive. If he was living in the cold, unwilling to call somebody (electric company, neighbor, the police even!), and unwilling to pay the bill when he had the money, you have to wonder what he was thinking. It suggests that he might not have been in his right mind, but to blame the electric company for his death seems wrong to me.

And it also seems to me that the company probably let things slide for awhile if his bill got up to $1,000. I live in an apartment in a comparable climate, and it would take me almost two years to get my electric bill up to that... However, I don't know the size of his place or other particulars. But it seems to me it would take a long time for somebody's electric account to become that delinquent.

damn. if the last few months are any guide I'de be at a $1000 in 3 months.

the story doesn't say much for the power company. they cut off the power and someone died. that's the bottom line. it says less about our mental health facilities, if someone like this was left on his own. sad story, everyone fucked up. didn't have to be.

Actually the power company didn't cut off his power. They put a limiting device on his meter and once the meter hit a certain point, it shut the power off to the house. All the occupant had to do was go out and reset the device and power would be restored. This guy never went out to reset the device.

93 Yr Old WW2 Vet freezes to death after company cuts power

Comments

Categories