93 Yr Old WW2 Vet freezes to death after company cuts power
SomethingCreative
Kazoo, MI Posts: 3,395
"Well, I think this band is incapable of sucking."
-my dad after hearing Not for You for the first time on SNL .
-my dad after hearing Not for You for the first time on SNL .
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however, quite honestly....this is the *fault* of the company? are utility companies now responsible for keeping tabs on all their clients, monitoring ages, checking all are ok, etc, etc. it is beyond tragic and terrible...but really, where were his family, friends or neighbors? in my mind, all are to some degree at 'fault' here...and pointing fingers, etc.....isn't helping. it just shows yet again, how disconnected we as a society have become. he had neighbors who knew him, some family, seemed like he had $$$, etc...sad no one noticed possible dementia, etc. it is terrible tragedy.
Let's just breathe...
I am myself like you somehow
my point was.....long before his power was cut off, someone who knows/cares about the man, i would have hoped would actually pay attention to him enough and realize, he needed help long before his power was cut off. someone who is mentally stable, fully possessing their faculties, would not have their power cut off without calling the power company, calling a neighbor...a friend...a family member...someone. the fact that it seems he had plenty of $$$ and yet didn't pay his bills, i would think is a sign there were other problems at hand.
so i don't think 'fault' lies soley with them, that is all.
Let's just breathe...
I am myself like you somehow
DEFINITELY. We're not talking about canceling the guy's cable here. Nice to know that what the Nazi's couldn't do a stupid corporation did. At the very least they're guilty of violating the basic laws of human decency and should be punished.
He's 93 with no kids. I imagine his family and friends are all dead... how many 93 year olds do you know? Who's supposed to check up on him? Do you go door to door with your neighbors to make sure everything is ok for no apparent reason?
i am asking questions...no need to get confrontational.
and i thought the article mentioned a nephew, thus why i asked. also, some of the neighbors sounded like they knew him. if i knew i had a neighbor that old and all alone...i would definitely check in from time to time. i guess too, it speaks close to home, b/c i often imagine that could well be me at 93. :oops: childless, youngest of my family, not many nieces/nephews and none close by....you bet i will get cozy with my neighbors so my dogs don't eat my face off. and actually, i know a good # of people over the age of 80. i am a lot older than you, i had older parents - i cared for my dad in old age/illness..... my own mother is 80, father-in-law 86....my bro-in-laws dad was 93, etc, etc. so i am really not that removed, at all, from elder care.
btw - i am not in any way saying the company is not at fault....just questioning the whole scenario. i think elders living alone is becoming a growing issue in general, and something we need to be aware/monitor...and sure.....figure out ways to accommodate this growing segment of our population. so i wasn't making excuses, merely questions does such responsibility soley rest with the utility. and even beyond that....not saying it may not....just asking for pov of others......
Let's just breathe...
I am myself like you somehow
What's elder care got to do with it? I didn't see anything mentioned in there about a nephew, and the neighbors sounded like token neighbors with random thoughts... the way everyone says "he was so quiet, but helped me with groceries" when the guy turns out to be a serial killer. I can understand it being alarming if you think one day you'll be in the same boat. But the fact is, blame for this falls squarely on the power company and it's a symptom of the dehumanizing way our corporations operate nowadays. You're not a person to them, you're a number on the screen with no value outside the "money-owed" column. It's shitty. Maybe optimstically we should all have communities where the neighbors watch each other like a 50s sitcom, but even considering that, the neighbors did not go cut his heat off and it's unlikely that anyone short of an in-home nurse could have prevented this... an in-home nurse and the power company.
from the article:
The medical examiner is looking into whether Schur suffered from dementia, particularly after police found enough cash lying around in the home to cover his bills. His nephew William Walworth said Schur told him two years ago he had $600,000 in savings.
as i said, i am simply looking at the 'bigger picture' of it all....that's all. i said the company bears blame....and i didn't say that it's not possible that 100% of said blame lie with them...thus why i posed the question. consider it thinking out loud. was simply my initial reaction...as in where are the people who care for this person? i know my father-in-law lives all alone, but he has good contact with neighbors, his children call to check-up, etc....and yes, we've been trying to get him, to no avail, get one of those life alert buttons, etc. however, his mental abilities are still sharp, so thus far, it's ok.
Let's just breathe...
I am myself like you somehow
Neighbors often recognize it before those closest to the person. My mom had quite severe dementia and we had no idea for some time. She knew it and hid it. It was a neighbor who notified us as to what was really going on, even then we had trouble getting her help.
This is shameful. Most utility companies have special programs for the elderly and disabled so their power won't get cut off. I have a few ideas in my head as to how these people could be protected a bit more, but I doubt the companies would want to spend the money to get these things started, like NOT shutting off power to certain age groups until they can actually speak to someone about the situation. No 93 yr. old should ever have their power shut off, especially here in Michigan in the middle of winter.
I'd like to know more of the story before totally condemning the utility company. The article said that they never spoke face to face with him, but did they try? Maybe he didn't answer the phone repeatedly or didn't answer the door for utility workers? I don't know...
edit - I hate when the media throws in irrelevant things like "WW2 Veteran" purely to drum up sympathy for him or anger against the company.
was like a picture
of a sunny day
“We can complain because rose bushes have thorns, or rejoice because thorn bushes have roses.”
― Abraham Lincoln
see, i think this is where my mind immediately went, and questioning this.....thus my wonderment.
i agree! it makes for a better headline tho. but really, WWII ver or not, 93 or not....really should nkae ANY difference. no matter one's age, or vetern status, NO one should be freezing to death in their own home, period.
Let's just breathe...
I am myself like you somehow
Fair enough. Clearly, we've got different worries ingrained... my favorite novel is Catch-22. I think nothing has ever nailed the absurdly dehumanizing nature of our modern world as well as that book. People are just means to an end and the most remote decisions for convenience at the top can have the most horrifying consequences in human terms. So I read this and it's evidence once again that individual people mean nothing compared to the corporate bottom line. It's depressing. But I do see your point and it is a good- albeit potentially depressing- question.
Sweep the Leg Johnny.
Apparently, he owed the electric company like $1,000, but refused to pay, so they put a device on his meter that cut his power after it reached a certain level.
In the original article, it kind of made him sound like he couldn't afford to pay the bill and the big, bad electric company shut his power off because they were greedy, leaving a poor destitute old man to die in the cold.
Last night on the local news though, it was released that he left his estate to the Bay City Hospital. It was worth over $600,000!
Obviously he had enough money to pay the bill, but refused to.
It's a sad story, but to blame the electric company for his death seems excessive. If he was living in the cold, unwilling to call somebody (electric company, neighbor, the police even!), and unwilling to pay the bill when he had the money, you have to wonder what he was thinking. It suggests that he might not have been in his right mind, but to blame the electric company for his death seems wrong to me.
And it also seems to me that the company probably let things slide for awhile if his bill got up to $1,000. I live in an apartment in a comparable climate, and it would take me almost two years to get my electric bill up to that... However, I don't know the size of his place or other particulars. But it seems to me it would take a long time for somebody's electric account to become that delinquent.
the story doesn't say much for the power company. they cut off the power and someone died. that's the bottom line. it says less about our mental health facilities, if someone like this was left on his own. sad story, everyone fucked up. didn't have to be.
Oh and my bill would get to $1000 in about 3 months.
Actually the power company didn't cut off his power. They put a limiting device on his meter and once the meter hit a certain point, it shut the power off to the house. All the occupant had to do was go out and reset the device and power would be restored. This guy never went out to reset the device.
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Social awareness does not equal political activism!
5/23/2011- An utter embarrassment... ticketing failures too many to list.
That's why I prefer city living to suburban or rural. I like the anonymity. I don't want to have to talk to neighbors or lift a finger for someone else when I have my own shit to do.
Did he know that they put the limiting device on his power? That is the real question. if he did not know that he could turn it on, then its the responsibility of the power company to tell him- face to face- and how to work the device. If he knew, then ...
it may not say 'much' for the power company...but really, what is it one expects? i see 'balme' being given to the utility, to mental health care, etc......and what exactly are all to do? since when are utilities expected to be social service programs? how are mental helath facilities to just 'know' about someone possibly being mentally ill if he or she don't seek help, and no one in their life informs anyone? i think a wee bit of personal responsibilty, and perhaps family/friend/neighbors...people looking out for those around them.....a bit more to 'blame.' i understnad and agree it's a tragedy what happened, but even in the 'good ole days'...if no one is there watching, taking care, being involved in someone's life....i don't forsee a utlity company, or social service agencies...to just be going door to door checking on the mental health of all. it's a sad story, and many fucked up..you're right....but sometimes, sad and fucked up things just happen....and a lot of times...some people are their own worst enemies too. seems like this man needed help, didn't see it for himself, and didn't havbe anyone actively involved in his life to recognize it either. however, i don't expect a utlity company to figure this out. the man refused to pay, he was allowed to get $1000 in arears...they put a limiter on his meter. i really don't know what they 'should' do in such cases.
since when is it expected to get FACE-TO-FACE service? seriously? you get a letter, maybe a phone call. it's YOU responsibility to be aware. i realize we are talking about a man's life...but let's also be real, no one is 'owed' services. utilites are businesses like any other. and i imagine in such businesses, they actually give their clients a LOT more slack than others due to the pertinent nature of their business, but 'expecting' face-to-face service, especially nowadays, i think is just...ridiculous? and even if they did infomr him face-toface...so what? how would that make ANY difference? i think issues with the elderly, especially such as this man....childless, widower, alone...are only going to grow. and no, i don't put the burden on the utility, but more on social service programs. perhaps we DO need some sort of registration of elderly who live alone? idk......but people who live alone, especially with little contacts...this is always a problem, no matter their age.
Let's just breathe...
I am myself like you somehow
maybe it was darwinism. maybe this guy, or his family or friends, maybe they should have done something, maybe there was nothing to be done.
but it still comes down to profit. profit over people. the power company cut a man's power in the middle of winter and he died. because they wanted a check and didn't get it. so he paid that bill with his life. that's it.
in reality, what do you seriously expect a business to do? the utility is not a charitable organization...and he also received a few months grace period, being able to build up to $1000 owed, a notice was put on his door, or in the mail?..i don't remember the article fully now, about the meter restricter.....so honestly, what else is to be done? seriously? when does personal responsibility and choice come into it? the man HAD the $$$, but refused to pay. when it did get restricted, he could've turned it back on, but he didn't...he could've called the utility, a friend, family, social services...but HE didn't. and yes, i personally believe he must've had some form of dementia, mentall illness....something.....but i don't hold the utility responsible for that. it's a business, of COURSe it comes down to profit. i cannot honestly think of any compnay that doesn't...even the best, most generous companies....b/c to remian in business, one must make a profit. i think mixing up for-profit business with the idea of charitable organizations, social services, etc....is a bit much imo. the real tragedy is that this man apparently had NO ONE at all in his life enough to realize he needed help. was my first impression when i first read the article, it seems to hold true now that further info has come out.
Let's just breathe...
I am myself like you somehow
I think the point you're missing is that it is a bit depressing that we all think any sort of personal service or face-to-face business contact is an absurd expectation, and that there is something wrong with a business's pursuit of its profit costing someone their life, regardless of the circumstances.
You probably don't believe me, but I completely agree with you.
I have to say that I do believe the energy company is at fault. More effort should be made with elderly customers, they DON'T understand everything and do get confused easily. Someone should have explained the new system to him, someone should have come to see him about his outstanding debt... I know in this country energy companies take your date of birth so they are fully aware of your age.
I'm sure the old boy planned to pay what he owed but damn, someone at the company should have noticed that his power had ceased to work. Surely they have some sort of indication that the trip system has kicked in and not been reset?!
This could have so easily been avoided... but then why would they care? As some have already said, it's all about profit. :evil:
... and I still think Drive-By Truckers are better.
i am not 'missing' that point. in fact, if they did put a notice on his door...who knows? perhaps they knocked first, and didn't get a response. i simply think the point is, too many like to point fingers elsewhere, and oftentimes in the wrong direction. yes, this man would more than likely be alive to day if not for a restricter being put on his meter. i understand that, and i do sympathize. however, beyond that there are a LOT of varibles, least of which...this many apparently had no one in his life, he had the ability to pay......and there is other responsibility in the mix here outside the utility company imo. btw - i DO agree "that there is something wrong with a business's pursuit of its profit costing someone their life, regardless of the circumstances"...but i also see, it's not just that simple. what cost this man his life...was his own refusal to pay, and/or to seek out help, etc. it is not solely the responsibilty and burden of the utility imo.
my utility co. knocks on my door once a month to read our gas meter b/c it is inside our home. we rarely are home to let him in, so we read it ourselves and mail or phone it in. someone put the notice on his front door about the restricter and i would imagine they would've knocked too. i don't know how much else one expects. that's all.
Let's just breathe...
I am myself like you somehow