US pulls out of UN human rights body

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Comments

  • RolandTD20Kdrummer
    RolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    reborncareerist wrote:
    Anytime you'd like to talk about politics, I'm game. As noted earlier, I am done with the fighting. Sorry if I struck a nerve. I don't think its worth it, making it worse by continuing to trade barbs.


    you didn't strike a nerve. you just keep saying stupid shit towards me while pretending you're not.

    I find it pretty funny how oblivious you are to your own actions.
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
    (")_(")
  • rebornFixer
    rebornFixer Posts: 4,901
    RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:
    you didn't strike a nerve. you just keep saying stupid shit towards me while pretending you're not.

    I find it pretty funny how oblivious you are to your own actions.

    Well, I'm sorry you feel that way.
  • RolandTD20Kdrummer
    RolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    reborncareerist wrote:
    Well, I'm sorry you feel that way.

    It has nothing to do with how I feel about it. It's just how it is.

    I've been through this scenario many many times with many different people.

    I say some thing controversial here that people don't want to believe or accept, and the slinging begins. It's old hat for me.
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
    (")_(")
  • rebornFixer
    rebornFixer Posts: 4,901
    RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:
    It has nothing to do with how I feel about it. It's just how it is.

    I've been through this scenario many many times with many different people.

    I say some thing controversial here that people don't want to believe or accept, and the slinging begins. It's old hat for me.

    And its up to you what you take away from that.
  • RolandTD20Kdrummer
    RolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    reborncareerist wrote:
    And its up to you what you take away from that.


    Thanks for the tip. I'll tuck it away for safe keeping.

    lol..
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
    (")_(")
  • rebornFixer
    rebornFixer Posts: 4,901
    For anyone still watching this thread, see? One side, unilaterally gives up "violence", and the conflict peters out.
    Doesn't matter which side, either.
    :)
  • RolandTD20Kdrummer
    RolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    reborncareerist wrote:
    For anyone still watching this thread, see? One side, unilaterally gives up "violence", and the conflict peters out.
    Doesn't matter which side, either.
    :)

    Perhaps one side has just discovered the truth through all the smokescreens and media manipulation. For that side, the fight still rages on stronger than ever.
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
    (")_(")
  • rebornFixer
    rebornFixer Posts: 4,901
    RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:
    Perhaps one side has just discovered the truth through all the smokescreens and media manipulation. For that side, the fight still rages on stronger than ever.

    Maybe Hamas would keep fighting even if Israel withdrew to pre-1967 borders ... Maybe they wouldn't. I lean a bit towards the former, but I'd like to be wrong on that.
  • RolandTD20Kdrummer
    RolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    reborncareerist wrote:
    Maybe Hamas would keep fighting even if Israel withdrew to pre-1967 borders ... Maybe they wouldn't. I lean a bit towards the former, but I'd like to be wrong on that.


    We'll never be allowed to find out unless Israel decides. Which, in all likelihood, will never happen.

    Money is money. Greed is greed.
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
    (")_(")
  • Byrnzie
    Byrnzie Posts: 21,037
    reborncareerist wrote:
    Maybe Hamas would keep fighting even if Israel withdrew to pre-1967 borders ... Maybe they wouldn't. I lean a bit towards the former, but I'd like to be wrong on that.

    Whether Hamas would keep on fighting or not has absolutely no bearing whatsoever on the fact that the occupied territories are illegal under International law. Israel has no right to occupy that land. It never did have the right. And won't ever have the right. Period.
  • Byrnzie
    Byrnzie Posts: 21,037
    reborncareerist wrote:
    Maybe Hamas would keep fighting even if Israel withdrew to pre-1967 borders ... Maybe they wouldn't. I lean a bit towards the former, but I'd like to be wrong on that.

    Maybe the issue isn't about Hamas fighting. Maybe the issue is about the illegal settlements in the occupied territories?



    Friday, 13 June 2008

    New Israeli homes are 'unlawful'
    By Wyre Davis
    BBC News, Jerusalem


    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/7453341.stm

    'Palestinian leaders have criticised Israeli plans to build more than 1,000 new Jewish homes on occupied land in East Jerusalem.

    The units, which have been approved by municipal planners, are in direct contravention of international law and the current peace process, they say.

    Israel says the plans represent the "natural growth" of existing communities.

    But there is growing international pressure to stop the expansion.

    At the US-sponsored Annapolis peace talks, at the end of 2007, demands were reiterated for Israel to stop all building and settlement expansion in occupied Palestinian areas.

    But since then almost 8,000 new Jewish homes have been built or approved in the occupied West Bank and East Jerusalem, areas internationally recognised as Palestinian.

    The latest approval, for more than one thousand units to be built near the settlement of Ramat Shlomo in an occupied area of East Jerusalem, has been criticised by Palestinian leaders as illegal.

    They say it proves that Israel is racing to establish more "facts on the ground", which would be difficult to remove in the event of a future peace agreement.

    The expansion of settlements in occupied land is one of the thorniest issues between the two sides and Israel is coming under increasing pressure, even from the United States, to stop the building programmes.'
  • chopitdown
    chopitdown Posts: 2,222
    RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:
    Bah..human rights...

    "In a State Department briefing on Friday, it was announced that the United States will no longer be regularly attending meetings held by the United Nations' Human Rights Council unless specifically compelled to, citing the Council's stance on relations between Israel and Palestine.

    While not an official member, the United States had been an involved observer since the 47-seat Council's creation in March 2006 to replace the 53-member Commission on Human Rights.
    ""
    you're upset about the US pulling out of a group of which they aren't even an official member????
    make sure the fortune that you seek...is the fortune that you need
  • Specifics
    Specifics Posts: 417
    chopitdown wrote:
    you're upset about the US pulling out of a group of which they aren't even an official member????

    I think he made that clear, question is are you?
  • rebornFixer
    rebornFixer Posts: 4,901
    Byrnzie wrote:
    Whether Hamas would keep on fighting or not has absolutely no bearing whatsoever on the fact that the occupied territories are illegal under International law. Israel has no right to occupy that land. It never did have the right. And won't ever have the right. Period.

    Agreed, but continued violence means that they'll be that much more likely to flaunt the law. Governments violate all kinds of laws in the interests of "national security". Even putting aside legal issues for a moment: Why would Israel wish to change its behavior if they do not get any reciprocation? I am not optimistic that the occupation will end before Hamas does.
  • rebornFixer
    rebornFixer Posts: 4,901
    Byrnzie wrote:
    Maybe the issue isn't about Hamas fighting. Maybe the issue is about the illegal settlements in the occupied territories?



    Friday, 13 June 2008

    New Israeli homes are 'unlawful'
    By Wyre Davis
    BBC News, Jerusalem


    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/7453341.stm

    'Palestinian leaders have criticised Israeli plans to build more than 1,000 new Jewish homes on occupied land in East Jerusalem.

    The units, which have been approved by municipal planners, are in direct contravention of international law and the current peace process, they say.

    Israel says the plans represent the "natural growth" of existing communities.

    But there is growing international pressure to stop the expansion.

    At the US-sponsored Annapolis peace talks, at the end of 2007, demands were reiterated for Israel to stop all building and settlement expansion in occupied Palestinian areas.

    But since then almost 8,000 new Jewish homes have been built or approved in the occupied West Bank and East Jerusalem, areas internationally recognised as Palestinian.

    The latest approval, for more than one thousand units to be built near the settlement of Ramat Shlomo in an occupied area of East Jerusalem, has been criticised by Palestinian leaders as illegal.

    They say it proves that Israel is racing to establish more "facts on the ground", which would be difficult to remove in the event of a future peace agreement.

    The expansion of settlements in occupied land is one of the thorniest issues between the two sides and Israel is coming under increasing pressure, even from the United States, to stop the building programmes.'

    You'll get no excuses from me on this one ... The settlement expansion needs to stop. Like this article says, "even" the US opposes this move.
  • RolandTD20Kdrummer
    RolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    chopitdown wrote:
    you're upset about the US pulling out of a group of which they aren't even an official member????


    Eh...human rights....fuck em....

    who needs them....

    They always just get in the way most times.
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
    (")_(")
  • Byrnzie
    Byrnzie Posts: 21,037
    reborncareerist wrote:
    Why would Israel wish to change its behavior if they do not get any reciprocation? I am not optimistic that the occupation will end before Hamas does.

    Reciprocation? :confused:
    Last time I checked the Palestinians weren't illegally occupying Israeli land and subjecting the Israeli's to daily terrorism, torture, starvation, home demolitions e.t.c. Maybe I've been missing something?
  • rebornFixer
    rebornFixer Posts: 4,901
    Byrnzie wrote:
    Reciprocation? :confused:
    Last time I checked the Palestinians weren't illegally occupying Israeli land and subjecting the Israeli's to daily terrorism, torture, starvation, home demolitions e.t.c. Maybe I've been missing something?

    Well, the terrorism isn't daily anymore, and perhaps the wall and other measures have pretty much bottled up Hamas and related groups in Gaza, rendering them impotent. Don't lets pretend the terrorism doesn't exist, though. The ball may indeed be in Israel's court, but they won't do much without some commitment from moderate Palestinians to disarm militant groups. I'm not really trying to argue whether this is right or wrong ... It just is.
  • chopitdown
    chopitdown Posts: 2,222
    RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:
    Eh...human rights....fuck em....

    who needs them....

    They always just get in the way most times.

    you said that; I didn't. I just asked why you were upset with a nonmember of a group not going to that group meeting anymore? That would be like me getting mad at you for leaving my professional groups meeting, when you aren't a member. I never said anything about forget human rights; and be honest...if the UN actually had any relevance they'd do something about human rights violations that occur all the time. I mean, CHINA is on the human rights council...that's a laugh right there. The US should be very concerned with human rights; however, being a part of that group doesn't add any legitimacy to a human rights record.
    make sure the fortune that you seek...is the fortune that you need
  • RolandTD20Kdrummer
    RolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    chopitdown wrote:
    you said that; I didn't. I just asked why you were upset with a nonmember of a group not going to that group meeting anymore? That would be like me getting mad at you for leaving my professional groups meeting, when you aren't a member. I never said anything about forget human rights; and be honest...if the UN actually had any relevance they'd do something about human rights violations that occur all the time. I mean, CHINA is on the human rights council...that's a laugh right there. The US should be very concerned with human rights; however, being a part of that group doesn't add any legitimacy to a human rights record.

    It still applies. The US is that estranged emo kid sitting in the corner picking the wings off a butterfly, trying to help all butterflies.
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
    (")_(")

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