things i got from the Obama website

Thecure
Thecure Posts: 814
edited July 2008 in A Moving Train
here are some things that i saw on Obama website that makes me wonder how he will do it.

1) Amend the North American Free Trade Agreement: Obama believes that NAFTA and its potential were oversold to the American people. Obama will work with the leaders of Canada and Mexico to fix NAFTA so that it works for American workers.

how will he do this. if he thinks that the US is getting screwed does he think Canada or mexico will want to change that so they get screwed?

2) Sunlight Before Signing: Too often bills are rushed through Congress and to the president before the public has the opportunity to review them. As president, Obama will not sign any non-emergency bill without giving the American public an opportunity to review and comment on the White House website for five days.

what is a non-emergency bill?
3) Obama will immediately begin to remove our troops from Iraq. He will remove one to two combat brigades each month, and have all of our combat brigades out of Iraq within 16 months. Obama will make it clear that we will not build any permanent bases in Iraq. He will keep some troops in Iraq to protect our embassy and diplomats; if al Qaeda attempts to build a base within Iraq, he will keep troops in Iraq or elsewhere in the region to carry out targeted strikes on al Qaeda.

i just don't get this one. will he keep troops in Iraq or not. if he is going to keep troops there how many.

4) Diplomacy: Obama is the only major candidate who supports tough, direct presidential diplomacy with Iran without preconditions. Now is the time to pressure Iran directly to change their troubling behavior. Obama would offer the Iranian regime a choice. If Iran abandons its nuclear program and support for terrorism, we will offer incentives like membership in the World Trade Organization, economic investments, and a move toward normal diplomatic relations. If Iran continues its troubling behavior, we will step up our economic pressure and political isolation. Seeking this kind of comprehensive settlement with Iran is our best way to make progress.

does anyone believe that economic pressure and political isolation is something that Iran is not used to?

5) Remove Incentives to Enter Illegally
Obama will remove incentives to enter the country illegally by cracking down on employers who hire undocumented immigrants

what about small business? are you going to fine them because i have a feeling that big business will find a way around this. maybe not.

before anyone jumps on my back i wll be doing the same thing to all other people running. these are just questions that i have.
People demand freedom of speech to make up for the freedom of thought which they avoid."
- Soren Aabye Kierkegaard (1813-1855)

If you haven't got anything nice to say about anybody, come sit next to me."
- Alice Roosevelt Longworth (1884-1980)
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Comments

  • blackredyellow
    blackredyellow Posts: 5,889
    I'll take a stab at this one...


    1) Ya, I got nothin'. I don't know NAFTA nearly enough to really comment, but I would guess there would be some room in the language to change things a bit.

    2) I would guess that a non-emergency bill is pretty much anything short of bills to deal with immediate crisis... like natural disasters, some sort of attack, I honestly don't know.

    3) From what he has said, he will not keep combat troops there. A small security force for our embassy, or to continue training.

    4) This is where he could make progress... Iran's rulers can say what they want to their people about how bad the US treats them, because we never talk. If there can be direct communications between the countries, I think that some difference can be resolved without all of the posturing that is going on now. I'm not saying we will ever be allies, but I think we can scale back the rhetoric with actual diplomacy.

    5) Small business, big business, anyone should get fined for knowingly hiring illegals. I don't see the problem with that one.
    My whole life
    was like a picture
    of a sunny day
    “We can complain because rose bushes have thorns, or rejoice because thorn bushes have roses.”
    ― Abraham Lincoln
  • Abookamongstthemany
    Abookamongstthemany Posts: 8,209
    Thecure wrote:


    3) Obama will immediately begin to remove our troops from Iraq. He will remove one to two combat brigades each month, and have all of our combat brigades out of Iraq within 16 months. Obama will make it clear that we will not build any permanent bases in Iraq. He will keep some troops in Iraq to protect our embassy and diplomats; if al Qaeda attempts to build a base within Iraq, he will keep troops in Iraq or elsewhere in the region to carry out targeted strikes on al Qaeda.

    i just don't get this one. will he keep troops in Iraq or not. if he is going to keep troops there how many.
    .


    This is one that really bothers me. How is this different from Bush's stance. He has always said we're staying the course in Iraq to fight the terrorist based insurgency. How do we know Obama isn't going to use this same excuse and keep us there indefinitely? If Bush can sell it to the public that we need to fight them there or we'll be fighting them here at home, it isn't a stretch to think that Obama could use the same ploy to sell it to everyone that we have no choice but to stay in Iraq.

    For the first time in 14 years, weapons manufacturers are donating more to Democrats than to Republicans. The Democrats have received 52% of the defence industry’s political donations in this election cycle - up from a low of 32% in 1996.
    If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.

    Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
    -Oscar Wilde
  • El_Kabong
    El_Kabong Posts: 4,141
    Abookamongstthemany wrote:
    This is one that really bothers me. How is this different from Bush's stance. He has always said we're staying the course in Iraq to fight the terrorist based insurgency. How do we know Obama isn't going to use this same excuse and keep us there indefinitely? If Bush can sell it to the public that we need to fight them there or we'll be fighting them here at home, it isn't a stretch to think that Obama could use the same ploy to sell it to everyone that we have no choice but to stay in Iraq.

    For the first time in 14 years, weapons manufacturers are donating more to Democrats than to Republicans. The Democrats have received 52% of the defence industry’s political donations in this election cycle - up from a low of 32% in 1996.


    and what's the difference between combat and non-combat troops to him?

    here's a post of issues w/ his health plan i had

    http://forums.pearljam.com/showpost.php?p=5266293&postcount=21
    standin above the crowd
    he had a voice that was strong and loud and
    i swallowed his facade cos i'm so
    eager to identify with
    someone above the crowd
    someone who seemed to feel the same
    someone prepared to lead the way
  • Abookamongstthemany
    Abookamongstthemany Posts: 8,209
    Bump

    I'm curious to see if any Obama supporters could clarify how staying in Iraq if Al Qaeda is there is different from the Bush strategy?

    And what is the difference between combat troops and non combat troops if the non combat troops are there to fight off Al Qaeda?
    If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.

    Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
    -Oscar Wilde
  • Thecure
    Thecure Posts: 814
    Abookamongstthemany wrote:
    Bump

    I'm curious to see if any Obama supporters could clarify how staying in Iraq if Al Qaeda is there is different from the Bush strategy?

    And what is the difference between combat troops and non combat troops if the non combat troops are there to fight off Al Qaeda?

    so far what i have noticed i sthat not alot of people really are saying anthing when it comes to issues and questions. we seem to like discusss things that really are not important.
    People demand freedom of speech to make up for the freedom of thought which they avoid."
    - Soren Aabye Kierkegaard (1813-1855)

    If you haven't got anything nice to say about anybody, come sit next to me."
    - Alice Roosevelt Longworth (1884-1980)
  • Abookamongstthemany
    Abookamongstthemany Posts: 8,209
    Thecure wrote:
    so far what i have noticed i sthat not alot of people really are saying anthing when it comes to issues and questions. we seem to like discusss things that really are not important.

    Now that's the truth!
    If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.

    Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
    -Oscar Wilde
  • Thecure
    Thecure Posts: 814
    Abookamongstthemany wrote:
    Now that's the truth!

    and then people wonder why we get the leader we get. you know i have 2 other treads posted here abotu Hillary and Mccain stands and so far not one post. but if i post something that does not really matter poeple will go on for 9 pages.
    People demand freedom of speech to make up for the freedom of thought which they avoid."
    - Soren Aabye Kierkegaard (1813-1855)

    If you haven't got anything nice to say about anybody, come sit next to me."
    - Alice Roosevelt Longworth (1884-1980)
  • Abookamongstthemany
    Abookamongstthemany Posts: 8,209
    Thecure wrote:
    and then people wonder why we get the leader we get. you know i have 2 other treads posted here abotu Hillary and Mccain stands and so far not one post. but if i post something that does not really matter poeple will go on for 9 pages.


    I hear ya. I started that on the issues thread and it didn't get much attention either.
    If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.

    Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
    -Oscar Wilde
  • lazymoon13
    lazymoon13 Posts: 838
    Abookamongstthemany wrote:
    Bump

    I'm curious to see if any Obama supporters could clarify how staying in Iraq if Al Qaeda is there is different from the Bush strategy?

    And what is the difference between combat troops and non combat troops if the non combat troops are there to fight off Al Qaeda?

    are you ok with AL Qaeda being in the country unchallenged?
  • Thecure
    Thecure Posts: 814
    lazymoon13 wrote:
    are you ok with AL Qaeda being in the country unchallenged?

    that is not the question. the question is the difference between Obama and McCain or Bush on Iraq.
    People demand freedom of speech to make up for the freedom of thought which they avoid."
    - Soren Aabye Kierkegaard (1813-1855)

    If you haven't got anything nice to say about anybody, come sit next to me."
    - Alice Roosevelt Longworth (1884-1980)
  • lazymoon13
    lazymoon13 Posts: 838
    Thecure wrote:
    that is not the question. the question is the difference between Obama and McCain or Bush on Iraq.
    that was my question to Abook. is that ok with you? :)
  • Abookamongstthemany
    Abookamongstthemany Posts: 8,209
    lazymoon13 wrote:
    are you ok with AL Qaeda being in the country unchallenged?


    We can't police the world. It is impossible to destroy terrorism and the methods we use only work to multiply the problem.

    Are you okay with paying for this war indefinitely? How can we flip the bill? At what price do we decide it isn't worth it to police the world and go around killing supposed terrorists anytime our gov't says they've popped up? This can't go on forever and the terrorist are only growing in numbers because of it.
    If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.

    Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
    -Oscar Wilde
  • Thecure
    Thecure Posts: 814
    lazymoon13 wrote:
    that was my question to Abook. is that ok with you? :)

    i am sorry abook for speaking on your behalf. to lazy, it is Ok with me.
    People demand freedom of speech to make up for the freedom of thought which they avoid."
    - Soren Aabye Kierkegaard (1813-1855)

    If you haven't got anything nice to say about anybody, come sit next to me."
    - Alice Roosevelt Longworth (1884-1980)
  • lazymoon13
    lazymoon13 Posts: 838
    Abookamongstthemany wrote:
    We can't police the world. It is impossible to destroy terrorism and the methods we use only work to multiply the problem.

    Are you okay with paying for this war indefinitely? How can we flip the bill? At what price do we decide it isn't worth it to police the world and go around killing supposed terrorists anytime our gov't says they've popped up? This can't go on forever and the terrorist are only growing in numbers because of it.

    thats cool, I mostly agree. I would support a president, however, who would support the Iraqi government on certain missions or something like that.

    thecure, you mind if I ask Abook a follow up question?
  • Flannel Shirt
    Flannel Shirt Posts: 1,021
    If I had to make a guess as to the difference....

    Bush went to overthrow Saddam, steal the oil, and got stuck in a civil war perpetuated by Al Qaeda. Now he is using American soldiers to stabalize a country in a civil war.

    Obama would leave, and if Al Qaeda were to then make a base where they train terrorists, he would send troops in to destroy the base and then leave.

    Thats my 5th grade answer.
    All that's sacred, comes from youth....dedications, naive and true.
  • Abookamongstthemany
    Abookamongstthemany Posts: 8,209
    Flannel Shirt wrote:
    If I had to make a guess as to the difference....

    Bush went to overthrow Saddam, steal the oil, and got stuck in a civil war perpetuated by Al Qaeda. Now he is using American soldiers to stabalize a country in a civil war.

    Obama would leave, and if Al Qaeda were to then make a base where they train terrorists, he would send troops in to destroy the base and then leave.

    Thats my 5th grade answer.

    When is Obama planning on leaving Iraq?

    How many troops and for how long could this take to destroy a base? What if Obama says bases keep popping up? How will we know if that's really the case? What about air strikes instead? Bush has been stringing us along for years saying how we're staying to fight the terrorists, how do we know Obama won't do the same?
    If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.

    Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
    -Oscar Wilde
  • Abookamongstthemany
    Abookamongstthemany Posts: 8,209
    lazymoon13 wrote:
    thats cool, I mostly agree. I would support a president, however, who would support the Iraqi government on certain missions or something like that.

    thecure, you mind if I ask Abook a follow up question?

    I'll tell you when you can ask me a follow up question! Wait for my command ;)

    And no probs, thecure :)
    If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.

    Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
    -Oscar Wilde
  • Thecure
    Thecure Posts: 814
    lazymoon13 wrote:
    thats cool, I mostly agree. I would support a president, however, who would support the Iraqi government on certain missions or something like that.

    thecure, you mind if I ask Abook a follow up question?

    thats funny, go ahead but please always ask permission.
    People demand freedom of speech to make up for the freedom of thought which they avoid."
    - Soren Aabye Kierkegaard (1813-1855)

    If you haven't got anything nice to say about anybody, come sit next to me."
    - Alice Roosevelt Longworth (1884-1980)
  • lazymoon13
    lazymoon13 Posts: 838
    Thecure wrote:
    thats funny, go ahead but please always ask permission.

    I was just bustin your chops :)
  • Flannel Shirt
    Flannel Shirt Posts: 1,021
    Abookamongstthemany wrote:
    When is Obama planning on leaving Iraq?

    How many troops and for how long could this take to destroy a base? What if Obama says bases keep popping up? How will we know if that's really the case? What about air strikes instead? Bush has been stringing us along for years saying how we're staying to fight the terrorists, how do we know Obama won't do the same?

    Good question. Hopefully someone asks him.
    All that's sacred, comes from youth....dedications, naive and true.

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