In Search of a Church

Posts: 4,931
edited June 2008 in A Moving Train
I've seen it on here many times, people (Americans, mostly) who go out looking for a church.

Is this a social thing? You don't like the people in church A, so let's go over to church B and see if there are any pearl jam fans in there!

I read that Obama thread about how he'd have to find a new church, and I was again very confused by this whole church hunt.

So please, can some one explain la recherche de l’église?
THANK YOU, LOSTDAWG!


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Post edited by Unknown User on

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  • Posts: 16,263
    Do you pick the first doctor you see out of a phone book?

    There are lot of factors that go into decided what church to attend. The pastor is probably the main one. Even in the same denomination, pastors can have very different styles and beliefs. Some people like pastors who dig into a book of the Bible for 8 weeks in a row, while some like pastors who do topical preaching and preach on different topics every week. When a church changes pastors, it is not the same church. A pastor plays a large role in the church, and therefore it may take you a first church visits before you are comfortable with a pastor.

    If you have kids, you probably want a church that has a lot of people your age with kids as well. You probably are not going to want to have your kids being the only kids in Sunday School. So you may visit 4 or 5 churches and look at their childrens program. Worship styles are also important. Some folks like the conventional hymns with the organ, while younger folks like the churches that have guitars and drums. That's more their style of worship.

    I think growing up I went to about 5 churches. Pastors come and go, and the church can completely change, and stand for things you don't agree with.
  • Posts: 6,097
    i never heard of writing a letter of resignation to a church. kinda funny.
  • Posts: 4,931
    bootlegger10 wrote:
    Do you pick the first doctor you see out of a phone book?

    There are lot of factors that go into decided what church to attend. The pastor is probably the main one. Even in the same denomination, pastors can have very different styles and beliefs. Some people like pastors who dig into a book of the Bible for 8 weeks in a row, while some like pastors who do topical preaching and preach on different topics every week. When a church changes pastors, it is not the same church. A pastor plays a large role in the church, and therefore it may take you a first church visits before you are comfortable with a pastor.

    If you have kids, you probably want a church that has a lot of people your age with kids as well. You probably are not going to want to have your kids being the only kids in Sunday School. So you may visit 4 or 5 churches and look at their childrens program. Worship styles are also important. Some folks like the conventional hymns with the organ, while younger folks like the churches that have guitars and drums. That's more their style of worship.

    I think growing up I went to about 5 churches. Pastors come and go, and the church can completely change, and stand for things you don't agree with.

    I thought your entire post made a lot of sense except this last bit. But thanks for answering my question. Where I live people aren't very religious and there's just one church in a town (you might have a few different churches i.e. jehova's witnesses, protestant but it's mainly catholic churches here). The people who believe go to that church, there is no such thing as Sunday school here, so that's an interesting factor. Also, I don't think many churches have guitars and drums here. Young people aren't very religious here and if they are a lot of them don't go to church.
    THANK YOU, LOSTDAWG!


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  • Posts: 2,374
    I've spent most of my life avoiding churches, unless they have some interesting architecture or art work.

    Not going to change that now.
  • Posts: 460
    I just had an epiphany.
    How in the world do people know what the truth is? What do they have to line up these preachers with? How do they know?
    I mean, there are thousands of churches out there that teach different things, but which one preaches the truth? Are there thousands of truths? Do people go purely for society? Do they go to ease their conscience?

    No wonder there are so many atheists.

    I had a friend, well, more of a person I knew, we weren't really friends, who went to this church that preached that woman should remain silent. That just doesn't sound right. What a confusing mess.
    When life gives you lemons, throw them at somebody.
  • Posts: 6,038
    Collin wrote:
    I thought your entire post made a lot of sense except this last bit.
    I thought bootlegger referred to the fact that with all the changes that happen one may no longer agree with the current teachings of their church, and therefore might choose to look elsewhere.
    "The opposite of a fact is falsehood, but the opposite of one profound truth may very well be another profound truth." ~ Niels Bohr

    http://www.myspace.com/illuminatta

    Rhinocerous Surprise '08!!!
  • Posts: 16,263
    angelica wrote:
    I thought bootlegger referred to the fact that with all the changes that happen one may no longer agree with the current teachings of their church, and therefore might choose to look elsewhere.

    Right. My first church was just awesome. So many friends. One pastor retired and a new one came. Instead of preaching from the Bible, he started referencing more Christian books. He got away from the Bible and went more into the psychological, feel-good culture we have today.
  • Posts: 16,263
    ForestBrain wrote:
    I just had an epiphany.
    How in the world do people know what the truth is? What do they have to line up these preachers with? How do they know?
    I mean, there are thousands of churches out there that teach different things, but which one preaches the truth? Are there thousands of truths? Do people go purely for society? Do they go to ease their conscience?

    No wonder there are so many atheists.

    I had a friend, well, more of a person I knew, we weren't really friends, who went to this church that preached that woman should remain silent. That just doesn't sound right. What a confusing mess.

    Well, I think most Christians find their truth in the Bible. That's the only logical place. That and prayer. You make think it is funny and stupid, and you are entitled to that. But human beings are flawed, and if the Bible is supposedly the word of God, it is logical that one would rely on the Bible, and would attend those churches where the words preached in the pulpit are from the Bible.
  • Posts: 4,931
    bootlegger10 wrote:
    show previous quotes

    Well, I think most Christians find their truth in the Bible. That's the only logical place. That and prayer. You make think it is funny and stupid, and you are entitled to that. But human beings are flawed, and if the Bible is supposedly the word of God, it is logical that one would rely on the Bible, and would attend those churches where the words preached in the pulpit are from the Bible.

    When I said that I didn't quite understand you last statement ( that churches can stand for something you don't agree with) I was sort of thinking along the lines of what ForestBrain posted.

    I guess it all amounts to how one interprets the bible, and then consequently choosing a church that is closest to one's personal beliefs (not taking into account the pratical reasons, of course).

    And how do you view for instance a church you left and the people who go to that church? Are they still christians in your view? Are they wrong?
    THANK YOU, LOSTDAWG!


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  • Posts: 7,762
    ForestBrain wrote:
    I just had an epiphany.
    How in the world do people know what the truth is? What do they have to line up these preachers with? How do they know?
    I mean, there are thousands of churches out there that teach different things, but which one preaches the truth? Are there thousands of truths? Do people go purely for society? Do they go to ease their conscience?

    There's a song by a band named Pearl Jam called "Faithfull" that addresses these very questions. It's a very good song. ;)
    everybody wants the most they can possibly get
    for the least they could possibly do
  • Posts: 7,762
    Collin wrote:
    When I said that I didn't quite understand you last statement ( that churches can stand for something you don't agree with) I was sort of thinking along the lines of what ForestBrain posted.

    I guess it all amounts to how one interprets the bible, and then consequently choosing a church that is closest to one's personal beliefs (not taking into account the pratical reasons, of course).

    And how do you view for instance a church you left and the people who go to that church? Are they still christians in your view? Are they wrong?

    In your garden variety Christianity, there's only one non-negotiable tenet: You believe that you are a sinner, and that God sent his son to absolve you of your sins, and that by asking forgiveness and trusting God's direction for your life from here on out, you can be saved.

    So long as a church, or a person, believes that, they are considered to be Christians. Everything else is just details.

    You can leave a church because you'd prefer to be baptized by immersion, rather than sprinkling, but it doesn't really affect whether or not you are a Christian or other in the church are Christian.
    everybody wants the most they can possibly get
    for the least they could possibly do
  • Posts: 4,931
    slightofjeff wrote:
    In your garden variety Christianity, there's only one non-negotiable tenet: You believe that you are a sinner, and that God sent his son to absolve you of your sins, and that by asking forgiveness and trusting God's direction for your life from here on out, you can be saved.

    So long as a church, or a person, believes that, they are considered to be Christians. Everything else is just details.

    You can leave a church because you'd prefer to be baptized by immersion, rather than sprinkling, but it doesn't really affect whether or not you are a Christian or other in the church are Christian.

    Okay, I met a very friendly woman in the States and her church believed Jesus Christ was walking around on earth today, that the son of god, was just living among us mortals today.

    If that's acceptable, what about christians who believe Jesus will come back next year as a robot and cause mayhem on earth, killing all the infidels with his laser eyes. It's a bit extreme, I admit.

    What about that westboro baptist church?
    THANK YOU, LOSTDAWG!


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  • Posts: 13,066
    I've heard many a boring sermon from many a shitty pastor, so if you;re in the market for an out to appease your continual sinning for fear of burning to death...

    have at it....
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

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  • Posts: 16,263
    Collin wrote:
    When I said that I didn't quite understand you last statement ( that churches can stand for something you don't agree with) I was sort of thinking along the lines of what ForestBrain posted.

    I guess it all amounts to how one interprets the bible, and then consequently choosing a church that is closest to one's personal beliefs (not taking into account the pratical reasons, of course).

    And how do you view for instance a church you left and the people who go to that church? Are they still christians in your view? Are they wrong?

    Yeah, it does come to how one interprets the Bible. Generally I think a church would be okay if its main teaching tool is the Bible. Once you start to get into the Christian books written by man (flawed), and use those as your main teaching tools or inspiration, a church is likely going to fall of the track. Again, these statements are assuming one is Christian and believes the Bible is infallible. To understand evangelicals (the good ones - not the idiots on tv), you have to understand they see the Bible as infallible and the word of God. If you are a Christian, and the Bible says Jesus is the only way to heaven, and your sister was not a fan of Jesus, wouldn't you want to talk to her about Jesus? There are nice ways to do it (not like the TV evangelicals who preach hate more than anything). Anyway, back to the point.

    But as to your question"

    "And how do you view for instance a church you left and the people who go to that church? Are they still christians in your view? Are they wrong?"

    Yes, for the most part I think they are still Christians (each case is different). As someone said before, the main detail is that you realize you are sinner and that Jesus died for your sins. But a lot of churches are starting to get away from the Bible and truth. Instead of it being black and white, churches are using the Bible more as a way to live, and not a source of truth. In those churches they are starting to preach the message that there are many ways to get to Heaven, or that Heaven is just an idea. There might be a question then about these individuals being Christians. I'm not the one to tell them they are not Christians. On the other hand, some churches only preach the prosperity Gospel, where if you believe in Jesus and pray all over troubles will go away and you will have all of the money you need. This is the "feel good" church, and with this type of message there is no personal improvement, no advanced relationship with God, but just a me first agenda, that will likely lead to frustration when your prayer is not answered the way you want. These folks may be Christians, but it would not be a church I would attend.
  • Posts: 16,263
    Collin wrote:
    Okay, I met a very friendly woman in the States and her church believed Jesus Christ was walking around on earth today, that the son of god, was just living among us mortals today.

    If that's acceptable, what about christians who believe Jesus will come back next year as a robot and cause mayhem on earth, killing all the infidels with his laser eyes. It's a bit extreme, I admit.

    What about that westboro baptist church?

    Well, I would think that woman is wrong if she thinks Jesus is walking around in human form right now. The Bible teaches that pretty clearly Jesus died on the cross, came back from the dead, and went back to Heaven. I would say her thinking would be flawed. Maybe she meant that Jesus was around us in our hearts, not necessarily walking the earth. But believing that Jesus is walking the earth right, I would not think would preclude someone from being a Christian. That's just changing the location of where Jesus is right now. You didn't need to understand every last detail of Revelation and the end times to be a Christian, but you would need to acknowledge Jesus as your personal savior.

    Christianity is a very difficult concept I admit. I've gone to church all of my life, and yet two weeks agao at 27 years old I had a 1.5 hour debate with my parents about why God would create a world where suffering occurs. You've got to have faith in the end, and you need to spend time getting to know who God is. I've got a long way to go on that.
  • Posts: 2,222
    Collin wrote:
    What about that westboro baptist church?

    what about them...the only place in christian circles that you'll hear support for them is in their church. They've been condemned by everyone but themselves.

    It's interesting to debate the different points of denominations. But sleightofjeff nailed it perfectly when he talked about the basic christiandom beliefs
    make sure the fortune that you seek...is the fortune that you need
  • Posts: 1,867
    I have no idea what the Obama thing is about. I don't follow anything about him whatsoever.

    But as for your question about church, I think you find the one you are looking for when they match what they preach. I thought I did, but after my husband abused me and the kids, he still went their after he left and no one even called to see how the kids and I were doing.

    So, I figured that they were also full of shit and we do not go anywhere anymore. But God is still my God and Jesus is still my saviour and I think that He knows how we are in our hearts.
    Baby, You Wouldn't Last a Minute on The Creek......


    Together we will float like angels.........

    In the moment that you left the room, the album started skipping, goodbye to beauty shared with the ones that you love.........
  • Posts: 351
    I read an article in Newsweek about Americans and their church changing ways. It's not surprising in a country where we also have a divorce rate of greater than 50% that we aren't going to stick with one church for most of our lives. Americans don't do commitment really, really well, for better and worse, richer and poorer.
  • Posts: 321
    It's very easy for catholics. You just go to the church in your diocese. Most catholics trust that the pastor that the church picked for them is the right one for their community.

    There are some, however, who choose other churches to go to, although, they are still catholics. It may have something to do with what "class" of people go to one church vs. the other. See, us catholics love the poor, as long as we don't have to worship next to them. We'll do clothes drives, give money during collection, even give extra money when they repair (read remodel) the church.
  • Posts: 3,319
    Churches are businesses, and it's a free market.

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