Seriously, if little Sophie is being raped and wants to contact somebody... shouldn't the help BE THERE?
Why are they asking for £2 a month so she has help... isn't that what the police/teachers/etc. are there for? What are they doing? Why do they want charities to do their job for them? :?
???
Teachers and police officers, through no fault of their own, are already stretched too thin and underpaid. So...until that changes, if you care about little Sophie, just keep giving. I understand the distaste for needing private donations to fund programs that the public should fund, but don't blame teachers and police officers for it. That makes no sense.
I'm not BLAMING them... I'm just saying that if little Sophie tells either her teacher or a police officer, she'll be told there's nothing they can do? I HIGHLY doubt that Doesn't matter how stretched they are, if they tell her she needs to go to this charity for help, well they've got serious issues.
The Astoria??? Orgazmic!
Verona??? it's all surmountable
Dublin 23.08.06 "The beauty of Ireland, right there!"
Wembley? We all believe!
Copenhagen?? your light made us stars
Chicago 07? And love
What a different life
Had I not found this love with you
In order to improve services for children, they would have to cut other government-funded programs, or raise taxes. What other social services would you want to cut in order to give more dough to the kids? (Lets leave out military & foreign aid as answers!).
why leave out military and foreign aid??? :? cos they're too obvious?
The Astoria??? Orgazmic!
Verona??? it's all surmountable
Dublin 23.08.06 "The beauty of Ireland, right there!"
Wembley? We all believe!
Copenhagen?? your light made us stars
Chicago 07? And love
What a different life
Had I not found this love with you
Seriously, if little Sophie is being raped and wants to contact somebody... shouldn't the help BE THERE?
Why are they asking for £2 a month so she has help... isn't that what the police/teachers/etc. are there for? What are they doing? Why do they want charities to do their job for them? :?
In a perfect world I'm sure the help would be there.
I really can't speak to the situation in the U.K. where I understand the situation is different. Here in the States I spent 24 years working at nonprofits/social service agencies (the preferred terms to charities). They serve as an adjunct to the police and teachers whose jobs are supported by taxpayers and who are always overwhelmed, teachers in particular. The staff in social service agencies have specialized training for dealing with different kinds of issues pertaining to children or domestic violence or whatever the problem may be. More and more often those agencies work in collaborative arrangements with police departments and school districts. So they are all doing their jobs together to take care of the children.
But social service agencies are not government funded in the U.S. They may receive some grants from government sources but for the most part they rely on donations, fundraisers, and grants from foundations (usually set up by philanthropic people for just that purpose). Staff are not highly paid and do the work more out of a sense of caring then for financial reward.
But before you donate to any organization, ask questions. Ask to see an annual report. How much money do they spend on fundraising? Visit the organization. Talk to the staff. Volunteer there. You'll get an idea of what kind of work is being done and how great the need is.
Very good post and good advice. I haven't donated money to any organizations lately because of my own financial struggles but volunteering is something I've been really interested in doing. I'm not sure what kind of cause or organization, but I'll look into it. I'll probably be laidoff next week so I'll have some time research locally.
I guess I can somewhat see Helen's view there as indicating that money shouldn't be the determine factor to get help for these causes and fights. It should be the community and volunteers' efforts but like everyone said there's just not enough help.
In order to improve services for children, they would have to cut other government-funded programs, or raise taxes. What other social services would you want to cut in order to give more dough to the kids? (Lets leave out military & foreign aid as answers!).
why leave out military and foreign aid??? :? cos they're too obvious?
Seriously, if little Sophie is being raped and wants to contact somebody... shouldn't the help BE THERE?
Why are they asking for £2 a month so she has help... isn't that what the police/teachers/etc. are there for? What are they doing? Why do they want charities to do their job for them? :?
???
Teachers and police officers, through no fault of their own, are already stretched too thin and underpaid. So...until that changes, if you care about little Sophie, just keep giving. I understand the distaste for needing private donations to fund programs that the public should fund, but don't blame teachers and police officers for it. That makes no sense.
I'm not BLAMING them... I'm just saying that if little Sophie tells either her teacher or a police officer, she'll be told there's nothing they can do? I HIGHLY doubt that Doesn't matter how stretched they are, if they tell her she needs to go to this charity for help, well they've got serious issues.
a teacher or cop is not going to tell a kid to go to a charity, that's nuts. they can only do so much with the resources they have.
is it fucked up? absolutely! as a society we should look after those that can't defend themselves (children, animals, handicapped). and just because it *should* be that way, doesn't mean that's how it is. all the more reason to have charities and people to champion those causes.
maybe the way you phrased the thread "why give money to childrens charities?" would be better stated as "why should children charities exist".
Seriously, if little Sophie is being raped and wants to contact somebody... shouldn't the help BE THERE?
Why are they asking for £2 a month so she has help... isn't that what the police/teachers/etc. are there for? What are they doing? Why do they want charities to do their job for them? :?
???
Teachers and police officers, through no fault of their own, are already stretched too thin and underpaid. So...until that changes, if you care about little Sophie, just keep giving. I understand the distaste for needing private donations to fund programs that the public should fund, but don't blame teachers and police officers for it. That makes no sense.
I'm not BLAMING them... I'm just saying that if little Sophie tells either her teacher or a police officer, she'll be told there's nothing they can do? I HIGHLY doubt that Doesn't matter how stretched they are, if they tell her she needs to go to this charity for help, well they've got serious issues.
"Why do they want charities to do their job for them?"
That sounds like blame to me.
As far as what a teacher can and cannot do for a victim of abuse, you have to realize that there *are* limits to how far they can go to intervene. It has nothing to do with their willingness, or lack thereof, to help a kid out.
Charities exist to fill in the gaps that the government can't handle, and often to provide some compassion that a large bureaucracy isn't capable of providing. They aren't meant to the the only option, or even the first option.
Very good post and good advice. I haven't donated money to any organizations lately because of my own financial struggles but volunteering is something I've been really interested in doing. I'm not sure what kind of cause or organization, but I'll look into it. I'll probably be laidoff next week so I'll have some time research locally.
I guess I can somewhat see Helen's view there as indicating that money shouldn't be the determine factor to get help for these causes and fights. It should be the community and volunteers' efforts but like everyone said there's just not enough help.
thank you :oops: this should definitely not depend on money :(
You should definitely volunteer... I hope ya don't get laid off... but if ya do, it's important for your resume to have something to put on it rather than say 'i took a break'
The Astoria??? Orgazmic!
Verona??? it's all surmountable
Dublin 23.08.06 "The beauty of Ireland, right there!"
Wembley? We all believe!
Copenhagen?? your light made us stars
Chicago 07? And love
What a different life
Had I not found this love with you
Seriously, if little Sophie is being raped and wants to contact somebody... shouldn't the help BE THERE?
Why are they asking for £2 a month so she has help... isn't that what the police/teachers/etc. are there for? What are they doing? Why do they want charities to do their job for them? :?
Well Helen... I agree completely with Al's post. The police have their job, they will catch (hopefully) the rapist. The teacher has her job, she/he educates - she/he is not a rape counsellor. They each have a part in the life of little Sophie. She can tell her teacher - her teacher will tell the police, the police will go after the guy. Little Sophie can tell her parents who will most likely be horrified and not know what to do besides give her lots of love and support. There are counsellors/social workers for the 'expert' advice.
These charities that we choose to give to or not do not replace the systems in place, they top them up/offer different and specialised support. You say that we should have these specialised support systems in place (which they are but obviously not enough) and they should offer ALL the support/help necessary via our taxes. Fair enough... I agree with that. Get ready to pay up then. Your taxes will increase massively. As others said, it is not just children's charities - we are then talking about ALL of them. Forget about Red Nose Day which raises an incredible amount of money for many different charities, forget people's altruism, generosity, wanting to help out in some way for something close to them. Let's just all have our taxes raised and forget about humanity. Remember, these charities are not only for little Sophie who got raped but are far more reaching than that.
I'm not BLAMING them... I'm just saying that if little Sophie tells either her teacher or a police officer, she'll be told there's nothing they can do? I HIGHLY doubt that. Doesn't matter how stretched they are, if they tell her she needs to go to this charity for help, well they've got serious issues.
The teacher cant help Sophie because her bladder was torn out with a stick and the soldiers that are supposed to protect her raped and killed her mother and made her dad eat the corpse.
I spent my career working in a non-profit for abused and neglecteted children. The police and teachers send children to us when they become aware of these things.
As someone already wrote, we get grants from the government, but most money comes from donations. Kids just aren't a priority in government spending. And we are trained, cops and teachers aren't, or wouldn't even have the time if they were. Abused and neglected kids need a lot more than can be done by a teacher or cop.
There's a lot to it.
From reading the rest of your posts helen, I really dont see the point of this tread. Ultimately, Sophie shouldn't be raped in the first place so if there was no abuse in the world then we wouldn't have to worry...but there is, the govt cant afford to pay for the needs of all and there is no discussion about the mental consequences for "Sophie". I think you should ask the mods to delete this thread beacuse it serves as no benefit to the world...sorry
Everyone could pay more taxes and this could help resolve some of the issues but then the people would feel like the money was just being taken from them.
The people giving to charities give themselves a feeling of entitlement for giving. It makes them special and that's what they seek only an anonymous doner is actually doing it for others. People that have their names attached to the donations are really just promoting themselves.
Sure there is plenty of suffering in the world just as there is plenty of over indulgence.
From reading the rest of your posts helen, I really dont see the point of this tread. Ultimately, Sophie shouldn't be raped in the first place so if there was no abuse in the world then we wouldn't have to worry...but there is, the govt cant afford to pay for the needs of all and there is no discussion about the mental consequences for "Sophie". I think you should ask the mods to delete this thread beacuse it serves as no benefit to the world...sorry
Ok, I understand that this is something you and others feel strongly about... but ya know what, so do I! Of course it should not happen in the first place but I find it hard to agree that the help should not be there without resorting to charities. I think this is something that we ALL should be contributing to... it shouldn't be voluntary... like do I choose to help the kids who need help or do I help the starving people in Africa or do I try to help out people living on the street? It's disgusting that this simply depends on the generosity of people... cos it's the credit crunch. I've always had my own charities that I give to, until now... cos I'm almost a charity case myself... but how could I forgive myself for not helping a child rape victim cos I chose to save an African kid from starving instead? It's disgusting.
The Astoria??? Orgazmic!
Verona??? it's all surmountable
Dublin 23.08.06 "The beauty of Ireland, right there!"
Wembley? We all believe!
Copenhagen?? your light made us stars
Chicago 07? And love
What a different life
Had I not found this love with you
Ok, I understand that this is something you and others feel strongly about... but ya know what, so do I! Of course it should not happen in the first place but I find it hard to agree that the help should not be there without resorting to charities. I think this is something that we ALL should be contributing to... it shouldn't be voluntary... like do I choose to help the kids who need help or do I help the starving people in Africa or do I try to help out people living on the street? It's disgusting that this simply depends on the generosity of people... cos it's the credit crunch. I've always had my own charities that I give to, until now... cos I'm almost a charity case myself... but how could I forgive myself for not helping a child rape victim cos I chose to save an African kid from starving instead? It's disgusting.
Well since we're going to the lengths of just saying that government should offer every service that anyone ever asks for regardless of cost, why not just say that people should stop raping kids? Both are equally practical.
Ok, I understand that this is something you and others feel strongly about... but ya know what, so do I! Of course it should not happen in the first place but I find it hard to agree that the help should not be there without resorting to charities. I think this is something that we ALL should be contributing to... it shouldn't be voluntary... like do I choose to help the kids who need help or do I help the starving people in Africa or do I try to help out people living on the street? It's disgusting that this simply depends on the generosity of people... cos it's the credit crunch. I've always had my own charities that I give to, until now... cos I'm almost a charity case myself... but how could I forgive myself for not helping a child rape victim cos I chose to save an African kid from starving instead? It's disgusting.
Well since we're going to the lengths of just saying that government should offer every service that anyone ever asks for regardless of cost, why not just say that people should stop raping kids? Both are equally practical.
well yes, they are equally practical.
c'mon though... the thought of a CHILD being raped.. (I don't even like typing it again :oops: ) well it's pretty much the worst imaginable thought and I simply think the help should BE there for something like this. I don't understand how people can disagree. Cos I mentioned the credit crunch, charities are gonna struggle too cos people just can't afford to give at the mo... so what happens then? Nothing? Poor little Sophie just has to put up with it? :(
The Astoria??? Orgazmic!
Verona??? it's all surmountable
Dublin 23.08.06 "The beauty of Ireland, right there!"
Wembley? We all believe!
Copenhagen?? your light made us stars
Chicago 07? And love
What a different life
Had I not found this love with you
Well since we're going to the lengths of just saying that government should offer every service that anyone ever asks for regardless of cost, why not just say that people should stop raping kids? Both are equally practical.
well yes, they are equally practical.
c'mon though... the thought of a CHILD being raped.. (I don't even like typing it again :oops: ) well it's pretty much the worst imaginable thought and I simply think the help should BE there for something like this. I don't understand how people can disagree. Cos I mentioned the credit crunch, charities are gonna struggle too cos people just can't afford to give at the mo... so what happens then? Nothing? Poor little Sophie just has to put up with it? :(
1. I'm reasonably sure things will happen and government does have resources to deal with this sort of thing, but that they aren't always perfect and charities fill in the holes. I'm not even sure what charity is doing for "Sophie" that government is not.
2. What happens then is what has happened in every human society since the beginning of civilization: cruelty, pain, death, suffering, and bad shit happening to good and innocent people. Welcome to reality.
The question is how much of your salary are you willing to give up to the govt? Not all your monies are going to things that you may want it to go to. Helping charities is a way to direct where you want your money to go.
Most people are not willing to give up 30% or more to the govt. they got bills and lives to pay for.
The best you can do it give what you can , and hope for the best
I regularly give to St. Jude's Children Hospital. The families who go there cannot afford the medical treatment their children need and I feel good that I can help, as little as it is..at least I care.
These cuts are leaving creases. Trace the scars to fit the pieces, to tell the story, you don't need to say a word.
Helen, I dont think you're getting the points that are being made here, people arent attacking you, they are just saying that unfortunately govt cannot provide all the answers (be they monitary or not), and thus people who care, feel the desire to try and give a little extra to help. Yes in an ideal world all our taxes would cover the cost of providing all the needs of the people but they dont. Govt put a lot of money both directly and indirectly to provide necessary facilities but it will never be enough. If every person gave their full wage packet to the govt, people, sadly, will still be abused and hurt, I wish there was some way to prevent this but there isnt. The structure of our society ensures the need for charities....so lets support them.
Everyone agrees that children should not be harmed but they are and charities are needed...end of :roll:
Comments
Verona??? it's all surmountable
Dublin 23.08.06 "The beauty of Ireland, right there!"
Wembley? We all believe!
Copenhagen?? your light made us stars
Chicago 07? And love
What a different life
Had I not found this love with you
Verona??? it's all surmountable
Dublin 23.08.06 "The beauty of Ireland, right there!"
Wembley? We all believe!
Copenhagen?? your light made us stars
Chicago 07? And love
What a different life
Had I not found this love with you
I guess I can somewhat see Helen's view there as indicating that money shouldn't be the determine factor to get help for these causes and fights. It should be the community and volunteers' efforts but like everyone said there's just not enough help.
EV- 08/09,10/2008.06/08,09/2009
Exactly!
is it fucked up? absolutely! as a society we should look after those that can't defend themselves (children, animals, handicapped). and just because it *should* be that way, doesn't mean that's how it is. all the more reason to have charities and people to champion those causes.
maybe the way you phrased the thread "why give money to childrens charities?" would be better stated as "why should children charities exist".
"Why do they want charities to do their job for them?"
That sounds like blame to me.
As far as what a teacher can and cannot do for a victim of abuse, you have to realize that there *are* limits to how far they can go to intervene. It has nothing to do with their willingness, or lack thereof, to help a kid out.
Charities exist to fill in the gaps that the government can't handle, and often to provide some compassion that a large bureaucracy isn't capable of providing. They aren't meant to the the only option, or even the first option.
You should definitely volunteer... I hope ya don't get laid off... but if ya do, it's important for your resume to have something to put on it rather than say 'i took a break'
Verona??? it's all surmountable
Dublin 23.08.06 "The beauty of Ireland, right there!"
Wembley? We all believe!
Copenhagen?? your light made us stars
Chicago 07? And love
What a different life
Had I not found this love with you
Well Helen... I agree completely with Al's post. The police have their job, they will catch (hopefully) the rapist. The teacher has her job, she/he educates - she/he is not a rape counsellor. They each have a part in the life of little Sophie. She can tell her teacher - her teacher will tell the police, the police will go after the guy. Little Sophie can tell her parents who will most likely be horrified and not know what to do besides give her lots of love and support. There are counsellors/social workers for the 'expert' advice.
These charities that we choose to give to or not do not replace the systems in place, they top them up/offer different and specialised support. You say that we should have these specialised support systems in place (which they are but obviously not enough) and they should offer ALL the support/help necessary via our taxes. Fair enough... I agree with that. Get ready to pay up then. Your taxes will increase massively. As others said, it is not just children's charities - we are then talking about ALL of them. Forget about Red Nose Day which raises an incredible amount of money for many different charities, forget people's altruism, generosity, wanting to help out in some way for something close to them. Let's just all have our taxes raised and forget about humanity. Remember, these charities are not only for little Sophie who got raped but are far more reaching than that.
some parts of the world DO have serious issues.. http://congolesechildren.org.uk/
Here's a video if you can stomach it. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3nd0LCdBAQU
The teacher cant help Sophie because her bladder was torn out with a stick and the soldiers that are supposed to protect her raped and killed her mother and made her dad eat the corpse.
As someone already wrote, we get grants from the government, but most money comes from donations. Kids just aren't a priority in government spending. And we are trained, cops and teachers aren't, or wouldn't even have the time if they were. Abused and neglected kids need a lot more than can be done by a teacher or cop.
There's a lot to it.
The people giving to charities give themselves a feeling of entitlement for giving. It makes them special and that's what they seek only an anonymous doner is actually doing it for others. People that have their names attached to the donations are really just promoting themselves.
Sure there is plenty of suffering in the world just as there is plenty of over indulgence.
Verona??? it's all surmountable
Dublin 23.08.06 "The beauty of Ireland, right there!"
Wembley? We all believe!
Copenhagen?? your light made us stars
Chicago 07? And love
What a different life
Had I not found this love with you
Well since we're going to the lengths of just saying that government should offer every service that anyone ever asks for regardless of cost, why not just say that people should stop raping kids? Both are equally practical.
c'mon though... the thought of a CHILD being raped.. (I don't even like typing it again :oops: ) well it's pretty much the worst imaginable thought and I simply think the help should BE there for something like this. I don't understand how people can disagree. Cos I mentioned the credit crunch, charities are gonna struggle too cos people just can't afford to give at the mo... so what happens then? Nothing? Poor little Sophie just has to put up with it? :(
Verona??? it's all surmountable
Dublin 23.08.06 "The beauty of Ireland, right there!"
Wembley? We all believe!
Copenhagen?? your light made us stars
Chicago 07? And love
What a different life
Had I not found this love with you
1. I'm reasonably sure things will happen and government does have resources to deal with this sort of thing, but that they aren't always perfect and charities fill in the holes. I'm not even sure what charity is doing for "Sophie" that government is not.
2. What happens then is what has happened in every human society since the beginning of civilization: cruelty, pain, death, suffering, and bad shit happening to good and innocent people. Welcome to reality.
Most people are not willing to give up 30% or more to the govt. they got bills and lives to pay for.
The best you can do it give what you can , and hope for the best
Everyone agrees that children should not be harmed but they are and charities are needed...end of :roll: