i've been reading the story of B, which is another book by daniel quinn (Ishmael). its kind of a continuation of Ishmael - which i should read again because i read it so long ago things are a bit vague.
anyways, its an awesome read so far. one idea or point that quinn puts out there, that has really stood out for me some reason, is this:
"If the world is saved, it will be saved by people with changed minds, people with a new vision. It will not be saved by people with old minds and new programs. It will not be saved by people with the old vision but a new program."
it's so true. we can make as many recycling programs or save the trees programs or lower emissions programs as we want, but unless we start living in a society with changed minds then we're really going to start getting a move on in the right direction. and that's whats kind of scary in a way, because i think so many people are set in their ways.
The police have been killing bears by me too. Recently one poor sow who had two young cubs was killed for trying to get in to someone's garage. I'm sure the cubs died too as they were left to fend for themselves and were only born this past Winter. The homeowner was known to leave their trash out. So damn sad.
oxc
~*LIVE~LOVE~LAUGH*~
*May the Peace of the Wilderness be with YOU*
He is your friend, your partner, your defender, your dog. You are his life, his love, his leader. He will be yours, faithful and true, to the last beat of his heart. You owe it to him to be worthy of such devotion.
— Unknown
The police have been killing bears by me too. Recently one poor sow who had two young cubs was killed for trying to get in to someone's garage. I'm sure the cubs died too as they were left to fend for themselves and were only born this past Winter. The homeowner was known to leave their trash out. So damn sad.
oxc
what the fuck? they left hte cubs to die???!!!
how is that even allowed???!!!!!!!!!
we raise the cubs in conservation habitats or sanctuaries (or at least try)...which is still sad that some bears dont get released back for various reasons, and they spend their lives in captivity. some are released back if they're able to sustain themselves though...
what is the local media saying about all this? I guess I'll be in town next week so I'll get the scoop then.
well first off, the first incident they would the report the news making the bear out to be a monster. you know, they'd uses pauses and descriptive words like "VICIOUSLY mauled" for effect. basically pumping fear into everyone.
also they keep showing pictures of the driveway covered with dried blood, and footage of the victim. she goes on to call the guy who drove into th bear with his car a hero.
in my opinion, if you're stupid enough to spot a bear and then throw rocks at it when its cornered, then you deserve to get mauled.
This is from my area. I see bears all the time, latest one....last night at 5:30pm, he ran down my side yard. I also see them in the woods while hiking. I love bears.
oxc
~*LIVE~LOVE~LAUGH*~
*May the Peace of the Wilderness be with YOU*
He is your friend, your partner, your defender, your dog. You are his life, his love, his leader. He will be yours, faithful and true, to the last beat of his heart. You owe it to him to be worthy of such devotion.
— Unknown
This is from my area. I see bears all the time, latest one....last night at 5:30pm, he ran down my side yard. I also see them in the woods while hiking. I love bears.
This is from my area. I see bears all the time, latest one....last night at 5:30pm, he ran down my side yard. I also see them in the woods while hiking. I love bears.
oxc
I wuv bears
Walking can be a real trip
***********************
"We've laid the groundwork. It's like planting the seeds. And next year, it's spring." - Nader
***********************
Prepare for tending to your garden, America.
A B.C. man bludgeoned a black bear to death with a stick after it attacked him near Green Lake in the Cariboo.
"She put me down twice. I knew if she put me down again, chances are I wouldn't get up," Jim West, 45, said Tuesday.
"It wasn't fight or flight. It was live or die."
West, a resident of 70 Mile House, and his two dogs were out scouting for moose when he crossed the path of an angry mama bear last Saturday afternoon.
He was walking into the wind watching his black labs, Shadow and Chopper, happily flushing out grouse when he heard a loud growl.
"All of a sudden I heard a loud huff and growl to my right and I turned and there was a bear six feet away," he said.
"I realized I had no time to do the smart thing -- to hit the ground, put my arms behind my head and play dead.
"I had only one option and that was to stop that bear from putting me down on the ground."
He kicked at the bear as its claws came crashing down on his upper lip, splitting it.
Seconds later the bear's heavy paws were on his shoulders and West was on the ground.
Quickly flipping over, he covered his head with his hands just as the bear took a couple of "good chews" out of the rear of his skull and left arm.
The dogs came back, distracting the bear long enough for West to take cover behind a small tree.
But the mama bear, whose cubs were on the other side of West, came back for a second round, knocking West back to the ground, biting him and slashing his right arm.
The dogs came back again to help, distracting the bear who pawed one of the dogs.
"I heard a yelp and my first thought was, 'you're not killing my dog,' " West said.
Grabbing a nearby stick that was about eight centimetres in diameter and a 1.5 metres long, West turned to see the bear running at him.
He lifted the stick just as she came up on him, hitting her smack-dab between the ears.
"She stopped in her tracks. I had stunned her and she shook her head.
"My mind immediately turned to driving in 10-inch spikes with a sledgehammer and I hit her until I crushed her skull," he said.
West whacked the bear five times before she hit the ground.
He whacked her another three times until he saw blood coming out of her nose.
He wrapped his head with his shirt, gathered himself and the dogs and headed to a nearby restaurant to call paramedics.
"He came in and his hands were covered in blood and he had a bloody shirt wrapped around his head," said Ellie Scott of Little Horse Lodge, who patched him up while waiting for the ambulance.
"He was so calm. And I honestly thought he would be bleeding more."
West received a total of 60 stitches to his skull, upper lip and left arm and is already back at home and back in the woods.
Conservation officers who found the dead bear told him it was unnaturally, overly aggressive.
The mama bear's two cubs had to be put down in case the aggression had been passed down in their genes, he said.
"I feel great regret for having to kill that bear and even more that her cubs were put down. But it was her or me," said West.
As for West's dogs? They got their reward Tuesday -- a steak dinner.
THIS PISSES ME OFF
if you're gonna go out hunting moose, you should accept the fact you are in wild territory. why should the bear have to die because you're too ignorant to realise going out into bear territory runs the risk of you being attacked or mauled.
A B.C. man bludgeoned a black bear to death with a stick after it attacked him near Green Lake in the Cariboo.
"She put me down twice. I knew if she put me down again, chances are I wouldn't get up," Jim West, 45, said Tuesday.
"It wasn't fight or flight. It was live or die."
West, a resident of 70 Mile House, and his two dogs were out scouting for moose when he crossed the path of an angry mama bear last Saturday afternoon.
He was walking into the wind watching his black labs, Shadow and Chopper, happily flushing out grouse when he heard a loud growl.
"All of a sudden I heard a loud huff and growl to my right and I turned and there was a bear six feet away," he said.
"I realized I had no time to do the smart thing -- to hit the ground, put my arms behind my head and play dead.
"I had only one option and that was to stop that bear from putting me down on the ground."
He kicked at the bear as its claws came crashing down on his upper lip, splitting it.
Seconds later the bear's heavy paws were on his shoulders and West was on the ground.
Quickly flipping over, he covered his head with his hands just as the bear took a couple of "good chews" out of the rear of his skull and left arm.
The dogs came back, distracting the bear long enough for West to take cover behind a small tree.
But the mama bear, whose cubs were on the other side of West, came back for a second round, knocking West back to the ground, biting him and slashing his right arm.
The dogs came back again to help, distracting the bear who pawed one of the dogs.
"I heard a yelp and my first thought was, 'you're not killing my dog,' " West said.
Grabbing a nearby stick that was about eight centimetres in diameter and a 1.5 metres long, West turned to see the bear running at him.
He lifted the stick just as she came up on him, hitting her smack-dab between the ears.
"She stopped in her tracks. I had stunned her and she shook her head.
"My mind immediately turned to driving in 10-inch spikes with a sledgehammer and I hit her until I crushed her skull," he said.
West whacked the bear five times before she hit the ground.
He whacked her another three times until he saw blood coming out of her nose.
He wrapped his head with his shirt, gathered himself and the dogs and headed to a nearby restaurant to call paramedics.
"He came in and his hands were covered in blood and he had a bloody shirt wrapped around his head," said Ellie Scott of Little Horse Lodge, who patched him up while waiting for the ambulance.
"He was so calm. And I honestly thought he would be bleeding more."
West received a total of 60 stitches to his skull, upper lip and left arm and is already back at home and back in the woods.
Conservation officers who found the dead bear told him it was unnaturally, overly aggressive.
The mama bear's two cubs had to be put down in case the aggression had been passed down in their genes, he said.
"I feel great regret for having to kill that bear and even more that her cubs were put down. But it was her or me," said West.
As for West's dogs? They got their reward Tuesday -- a steak dinner.
THIS PISSES ME OFF
if you're gonna go out hunting moose, you should accept the fact you are in wild territory. why should the bear have to die because you're too ignorant to realise going out into bear territory runs the risk of you being attacked or mauled.
fucker should have died and not the bear.
I hate that the bear died as well but you can't expect a person to not defend themselves when being attacked. You can't stop yourself from reacting when an animal is gnawing on you.
Idaho's Premier Outdoor Writer
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I hate that the bear died as well but you can't expect a person to not defend themselves when being attacked. You can't stop yourself from reacting when an animal is gnawing on you.
very true point!
i guess what bugged me was that the guy went out there too shoot moose. the root of the problem was he put himself out there and a bear is dead because of it.
we're having a very big issue with animals here... our bear populations are starting to dwindle... like i read today they estimate its down to 500 and once it hits 300 the population will become extremely dangered because of interbreeding causing problems.
plus our salmon stock is depleting and our orcas are starving.
it all just gets me frustrated on the whole i suppose!!!!!!
i guess what bugged me was that the guy went out there too shoot moose. the root of the problem was he put himself out there and a bear is dead because of it.
we're having a very big issue with animals here... our bear populations are starting to dwindle... like i read today they estimate its down to 500 and once it hits 300 the population will become extremely dangered because of interbreeding causing problems.
plus our salmon stock is depleting and our orcas are starving.
it all just gets me frustrated on the whole i suppose!!!!!!
I'm with you all the way. It breaks my heart.
Idaho's Premier Outdoor Writer
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The mama bear's two cubs had to be put down in case the aggression had been passed down in their genes, he said.
They killed the cubs too? WTF? How do you determine if a dead bear was "overly aggressive"? Dude, if someone was standing between me and my cubs and I was a bear, I'd try to kill them too.
That's just sick and wrong.
Chicago 2000 : Chicago 2003 : Chicago 2006 : Summerfest 2006 : Lollapalooza 2007 : Chicago 2009 : Noblesville (Indy) 2010 : PJ20 (East Troy) 2011 : Wrigley Field 2013 : Milwaukee (Yield) 2014 : Wrigley Field 2016
They killed the cubs too? WTF? How do you determine if a dead bear was "overly aggressive"? Dude, if someone was standing between me and my cubs and I was a bear, I'd try to kill them too.
That's just sick and wrong.
its funny how things work isnt it :rolleyes:
fucking society.
there's gotta be a better solution than killing off (5 is it now?) in the past week.
i particularly like the latest one in vancouver, 'police said the bear wasnt aggressive but decided it needed to be destroyed anyways'
edit: i think its only 3 they've killed... oops!
fuck that.
just an update
i was up on grouse mountain near the grizzly bear sanctuary when i got involved in a conversation between a few tourists and one of the bear keepers, it turns out the lady who got mauled (the first bear incident that the media has sparked paranoia about bears all over the province) wasn't just minding her own business gardening. the media portrayed the incident as this: a lady was gardening when, without warning, she was attacked by a black bear and viciously mauled in her driveway. neighbours heard her screaming and came to her rescue, her hero was a man who drove his car into the bear to scare it off.
what actually happened was this: the woman's neighbour had been feeding the bear blueberry muffins... the bear had come back to get more when the lady who got mauled spotted him and started shrieking. she then started throwing rocks at the poor thing, which made it run into the backyard. later 5 neighbours cornered it on the side of the house and were throwing things at the bear. the lady was in the way of the bear's only escape route, so the bear went through her and thats when she got attacked.
did your momma have any kids that lived? what about the chickens you eat, or the rabbits and geese, or how about them fat cows and those pesky pink pigs.. or are you a vegetarian..so would you vote on killing the bears or to be viciously attacked by a bear.. or suppose a bear grabbed one of your kids?
No point in just getting angry about the bears. All over the world, certain species of animal are being pushed into extinction. Elephants, Tigers, Gorillas and apes.
No point in just getting angry about the bears. All over the world, certain species of animal are being pushed into extinction. Elephants, Tigers, Gorillas and apes.
humans will be next on the list.. then the earth can breathe again.
population control, survival of the fittest.. if your kids are dumb enough to be where a bear can grab them, then that bear has earned his tasty meal, EDIT: I mean, tasty snack.
No point in just getting angry about the bears. All over the world, certain species of animal are being pushed into extinction. Elephants, Tigers, Gorillas and apes.
they might should wanna concider shootin this ball-less fucker.
do you have a college education on the english language or are you a welfarer learning how to be a human.. you really suck in your vocabulary.. it surely shows the good morals you had when growing up and puts a strain on your own race in having to deal with you, white or black.. your pathetic.. now wise up, speak correctly and quit trying to portray yourself as a loser even if you are one.. go to church..
population control, survival of the fittest.. if your kids are dumb enough to be where a bear can grab them, then that bear has earned his tasty meal, EDIT: I mean, tasty snack.
another good father.. where do these people get their brains.. when God called you to come get your brains, you thought he said trains and you stayed home..huh..
do you have a college education on the english language or are you a welfarer learning how to be a human.. you really suck in your vocabulary.. it surely shows the good morals you had when growing up and puts a strain on your own race in having to deal with you, white or black.. your pathetic.. now wise up, speak correctly and quit trying to portray yourself as a loser even if you are one.. go to church..
That has to be the most arrogant, condescending and unnecesarily snotty remark I have ever read on this board, and there is an awful lot of those flying around this board!
That has to be the most arrogant, condescending and unnecesarily snotty remark I have ever read on this board, and there is an awful lot of those flying around this board!
I like it!!
A really good personal attack and smacktalk on the use of the English language, all the while igoring the grammar, spelling and punctuation rules of that very same language!
do you have a college education on the english language or are you a welfarer learning how to be a human.. you really suck in your vocabulary.. it surely shows the good morals you had when growing up and puts a strain on your own race in having to deal with you, white or black.. your pathetic.. now wise up, speak correctly and quit trying to portray yourself as a loser even if you are one.. go to church..
do you have a college education on the english language or are you a welfarer learning how to be a human.. you really suck in your vocabulary.. it surely shows the good morals you had when growing up and puts a strain on your own race in having to deal with you, white or black.. your pathetic.. now wise up, speak correctly and quit trying to portray yourself as a loser even if you are one.. go to church..
do you have a college education on the english language or are you a welfarer learning how to be a human.. you really suck in your vocabulary.. it surely shows the good morals you had when growing up and puts a strain on your own race in having to deal with you, white or black.. your pathetic.. now wise up, speak correctly and quit trying to portray yourself as a loser even if you are one.. go to church..
your 4th post and you jump all over me like this is what leads me to believe
that you are using a different name than you normally use.
i have a few guesses as to who you are.
I like it!!
A really good personal attack and smacktalk on the use of the English language, all the while igoring the grammar, spelling and punctuation rules of that very same language!
Comments
anyways, its an awesome read so far. one idea or point that quinn puts out there, that has really stood out for me some reason, is this:
"If the world is saved, it will be saved by people with changed minds, people with a new vision. It will not be saved by people with old minds and new programs. It will not be saved by people with the old vision but a new program."
it's so true. we can make as many recycling programs or save the trees programs or lower emissions programs as we want, but unless we start living in a society with changed minds then we're really going to start getting a move on in the right direction. and that's whats kind of scary in a way, because i think so many people are set in their ways.
oxc
*May the Peace of the Wilderness be with YOU*
He is your friend, your partner, your defender, your dog. You are his life, his love, his leader. He will be yours, faithful and true, to the last beat of his heart. You owe it to him to be worthy of such devotion.
— Unknown
how is that even allowed???!!!!!!!!!
we raise the cubs in conservation habitats or sanctuaries (or at least try)...which is still sad that some bears dont get released back for various reasons, and they spend their lives in captivity. some are released back if they're able to sustain themselves though...
also they keep showing pictures of the driveway covered with dried blood, and footage of the victim. she goes on to call the guy who drove into th bear with his car a hero.
in my opinion, if you're stupid enough to spot a bear and then throw rocks at it when its cornered, then you deserve to get mauled.
This is from my area. I see bears all the time, latest one....last night at 5:30pm, he ran down my side yard. I also see them in the woods while hiking. I love bears.
oxc
*May the Peace of the Wilderness be with YOU*
He is your friend, your partner, your defender, your dog. You are his life, his love, his leader. He will be yours, faithful and true, to the last beat of his heart. You owe it to him to be worthy of such devotion.
— Unknown
I wuv bears
***********************
"We've laid the groundwork. It's like planting the seeds. And next year, it's spring." - Nader
***********************
Prepare for tending to your garden, America.
http://www.canada.com/topics/news/national/story.html?id=0500b987-620a-44d4-8009-1ef8fc437437
A B.C. man bludgeoned a black bear to death with a stick after it attacked him near Green Lake in the Cariboo.
"She put me down twice. I knew if she put me down again, chances are I wouldn't get up," Jim West, 45, said Tuesday.
"It wasn't fight or flight. It was live or die."
West, a resident of 70 Mile House, and his two dogs were out scouting for moose when he crossed the path of an angry mama bear last Saturday afternoon.
He was walking into the wind watching his black labs, Shadow and Chopper, happily flushing out grouse when he heard a loud growl.
"All of a sudden I heard a loud huff and growl to my right and I turned and there was a bear six feet away," he said.
"I realized I had no time to do the smart thing -- to hit the ground, put my arms behind my head and play dead.
"I had only one option and that was to stop that bear from putting me down on the ground."
He kicked at the bear as its claws came crashing down on his upper lip, splitting it.
Seconds later the bear's heavy paws were on his shoulders and West was on the ground.
Quickly flipping over, he covered his head with his hands just as the bear took a couple of "good chews" out of the rear of his skull and left arm.
The dogs came back, distracting the bear long enough for West to take cover behind a small tree.
But the mama bear, whose cubs were on the other side of West, came back for a second round, knocking West back to the ground, biting him and slashing his right arm.
The dogs came back again to help, distracting the bear who pawed one of the dogs.
"I heard a yelp and my first thought was, 'you're not killing my dog,' " West said.
Grabbing a nearby stick that was about eight centimetres in diameter and a 1.5 metres long, West turned to see the bear running at him.
He lifted the stick just as she came up on him, hitting her smack-dab between the ears.
"She stopped in her tracks. I had stunned her and she shook her head.
"My mind immediately turned to driving in 10-inch spikes with a sledgehammer and I hit her until I crushed her skull," he said.
West whacked the bear five times before she hit the ground.
He whacked her another three times until he saw blood coming out of her nose.
He wrapped his head with his shirt, gathered himself and the dogs and headed to a nearby restaurant to call paramedics.
"He came in and his hands were covered in blood and he had a bloody shirt wrapped around his head," said Ellie Scott of Little Horse Lodge, who patched him up while waiting for the ambulance.
"He was so calm. And I honestly thought he would be bleeding more."
West received a total of 60 stitches to his skull, upper lip and left arm and is already back at home and back in the woods.
Conservation officers who found the dead bear told him it was unnaturally, overly aggressive.
The mama bear's two cubs had to be put down in case the aggression had been passed down in their genes, he said.
"I feel great regret for having to kill that bear and even more that her cubs were put down. But it was her or me," said West.
As for West's dogs? They got their reward Tuesday -- a steak dinner.
kmercer@theprovince.com
© The Vancouver Province 2008
THIS PISSES ME OFF
if you're gonna go out hunting moose, you should accept the fact you are in wild territory. why should the bear have to die because you're too ignorant to realise going out into bear territory runs the risk of you being attacked or mauled.
fucker should have died and not the bear.
I hate that the bear died as well but you can't expect a person to not defend themselves when being attacked. You can't stop yourself from reacting when an animal is gnawing on you.
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i guess what bugged me was that the guy went out there too shoot moose. the root of the problem was he put himself out there and a bear is dead because of it.
we're having a very big issue with animals here... our bear populations are starting to dwindle... like i read today they estimate its down to 500 and once it hits 300 the population will become extremely dangered because of interbreeding causing problems.
plus our salmon stock is depleting and our orcas are starving.
it all just gets me frustrated on the whole i suppose!!!!!!
I'm with you all the way. It breaks my heart.
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They killed the cubs too? WTF? How do you determine if a dead bear was "overly aggressive"? Dude, if someone was standing between me and my cubs and I was a bear, I'd try to kill them too.
That's just sick and wrong.
fucking society.
they might should wanna concider shootin this ball-less fucker.
"Hear me, my chiefs!
I am tired; my heart is
sick and sad. From where
the sun stands I will fight
no more forever."
Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
i am confused by your comment.
"Hear me, my chiefs!
I am tired; my heart is
sick and sad. From where
the sun stands I will fight
no more forever."
Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
That has to be the most arrogant, condescending and unnecesarily snotty remark I have ever read on this board, and there is an awful lot of those flying around this board!
A really good personal attack and smacktalk on the use of the English language, all the while igoring the grammar, spelling and punctuation rules of that very same language!
it should be 'you're pathetic'
what is your problem?
"Hear me, my chiefs!
I am tired; my heart is
sick and sad. From where
the sun stands I will fight
no more forever."
Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
your 4th post and you jump all over me like this is what leads me to believe
that you are using a different name than you normally use.
i have a few guesses as to who you are.
"Hear me, my chiefs!
I am tired; my heart is
sick and sad. From where
the sun stands I will fight
no more forever."
Chief Joseph - Nez Perce