Infuriated by a PJ Vinyl auction!!! Need Input

Yellow Bedwetter

I'm really pissed off right now! This doesn't look like a normal auction. What's with this automatic bidding system?? Can somebody please describe this automated bidding system? Why does Hawkshore's date of bid not change even after I outbid him today? Shouldn't it change to Nov 10 even if it is automated?

hawkshore(15) US $76.00 Nov-06-08 17:02:36 PST

solaraguy128(44) US $75.00 Nov-10-08 11:43:28 PST

hawkshore(15) US $71.00 Nov-06-08 17:02:36 PST

solaraguy128(44) US $70.00 Nov-10-08 11:43:18 PST

hawkshore(15) US $66.00 Nov-06-08 17:02:36 PST

e***r(733) US $65.00 Nov-09-08 15:55:16 PST

hawkshore(15) US $50.00 Nov-06-08 17:02:36 PST

Starting Price US $50.00 Nov-05-08 11:43:30 PST

This looks really sketchy to me and I may have to ask eBay what this is all about. It seems like nobody had an honest chance at this auction no matter what anyone would have bid Hawkshore was going to take this or was just using this system to drive up the price. I really wanted this Sealed Lost Dogs vinyl and I feel completely ripped off.
Thanks.
YB

Mrs.Vedder78

it's because he put his max bid at $76 on that date, when you bid even if he bids $2000 the next bid will be the max increase, and the automatic happens when he is outbid unti his max bid has been reached..

I hope I made sense...

Yellow Bedwetter

I won this seller's Riot Act Sealed vinyl about 45min earlier and was holding off on shipping b/c I told him I was trying for the Lost Dogs too. He originally wanted $15 for shipping and I told him it cost me $5.05 to ship a Ten vinyl using USPS Media Mail and they give u the box for free. This is what he emails me:

"I mail everything via priority mail, it cost $9.30, I can put them both in the same package if you want me to"

I hate when sellers try and rip people off with shipping. Ask your buyers nicely if they'll give you more money to make up for your PayPal fees but don't charge them extra for shipping to make up the difference. Now I feel like shit for buying a Riot Act vinyl for $66 + $9.30 in shipping. Ahhhhhh

yoke

He probably has a Proxy bid(I think thats what they call it). Thats when he puts his MAX bid in and it only goes up when people try to outbid him. I do that all the time. Thats how I bid, I only put in what I am willing to spend, if it goes over that then oh well.

So lets say his first bid was $25 but he put a MAX of $75 well he will only show $25 until someone bids $26 and then it will automatically shoot to $26.50 or whatever. You get my drift?

G Force

Yeah...to me it looks like he bid more than $75 from the get.

Doesn't look like you ever outbid him.

Yellow Bedwetter

Mrs_Vedder78 wrote:

it's because he put his max bid at $76 on that date, when you bids even if he bids $2000 the next bid will be the max increase, and the automatic happens when he is outbid unti his max bid has been reached..

I hope I made sense...

not really...the whole thing looks kinda scammy to me...i still think the dates should change

Yellow Bedwetter

yoke wrote:

He probably has a Proxy bid(I think thats what they call it). Thats when he puts his MAX bid in and it only goes up when people try to outbid him. I do that all the time. Thats how I bid, I only put in what I am willing to spend, if it goes over that then oh well.

So lets say his first bid was $25 but he put a MAX of $75 well he will only show $25 until someone bids $26 and then it will automatically shoot to $26.50 or whatever. You get my drift?

I completely understand how max bidding works, etc. And I understand that if he/she made a max bid of even $100 on November 6th, but why doesn't the dates change - oh now I understand it jsut made sense in my own head.
Uggggghhhh

youngster

What pisses me off is sometimes a seller will post an item and have his buddy bid it up and if it ends up being "sold" to said buddy, it's a wash. Nobody has a chance unless they plan on spending huge $$ for something.

Get_Right

Yellow Bedwetter wrote:

I completely understand how max bidding works, etc. And I understand that if he/she made a max bid of even $100 on November 6th, but why doesn't the dates change - oh now I understand it jsut made sense in my own head.
Uggggghhhh

you answered your own question, because the bid went in on Nov. 6th, not at a later date-simply someone bid more than your increased bids at an earlier point in time.

save yourself the anguish
1) determine how much you want to pay, seriously, for the item
2) then snipe it

Yellow Bedwetter

cropduster82 wrote:

What pisses me off is sometimes a seller will post an item and have his buddy bid it up and if it ends up being "sold" to said buddy, it's a wash. Nobody has a chance unless they plan on spending huge $$ for something.

ya...i was thinking this hawkshore was this seller's "other" account
there's nothing to stop ppl from doing as you said with friends or creating other accounts to drive up their auctions - it sucks sometimes

Goodfella1111

Not that this has anything to do with original gripe, butttttt, getting a sealed riot act vinyl for 75 is a bargain. If u feel bad about buying it u can sell it to me for 76 and you won't feel bad about it anymore! ... thanks

The Stugots

cropduster82 wrote:

What pisses me off is sometimes a seller will post an item and have his buddy bid it up and if it ends up being "sold" to said buddy, it's a wash. Nobody has a chance unless they plan on spending huge $$ for something.

This practice does suck, but at least the seller does get stuck with paying the listing fees at a percentage of the final sale price so it's not a complete wash, and not something a seller would want to do repeatedly.

mjb

The Stugots wrote:

This practice does suck, but at least the seller does get stuck with paying the listing fees at a percentage of the final sale price so it's not a complete wash, and not something a seller would want to do repeatedly.

Used to be pretty easy to manipulate the system that way - could then allege the buyer never paid and get back the seller fees. That said, I understand eBay has attempted to deal with users that abuse their auctions this way (which I imagine wouldn't be too difficult by tracking IP addresses etc.)

arq

A few weeks ago I was bidding and just a minute before the end the biding went bersek and I lost the bid, the wining big was $170, the next day the same item appeared on eBay again and I received an email giving me a secong chance, and a couple of days later I received a email from the seller offering me the item for $120. So what I'm suppose to think about it?

joeend

its called shill bidding
see this guideline form ebay website

''Shill bidding is bidding that increases an item’s price or apparent desirability artificially, or bidding by individuals with a level of access to the seller’s item information not available to the general Community. Shill bidding is prohibited on eBay.

Because family members, flatmates and employees of sellers have a level of access to item information which is not available to the general Community, they are not permitted to bid on items offered by the seller – even if their sole intent is to purchase the item. Family members, flatmates or employees may purchase items from a seller without breaching this policy simply by using purchase options – such as Buy It Now – which do not involve bidding.

We strongly encourage sellers with employees to ensure that their employees are aware of this policy and the possible consequences of breaching it.'

if you think that this seller is guilty of this, flag the sale to ebay and they should check it, dont leave it to late so the auction ends before they have time to investigate.

this sucks, so dont let them get away with it if they are doing it, ebay does check email address and associates with same address as the seller, and if somebody at the same address is bidding on that item they will do something about it....

HollisBrown

arq wrote:

A few weeks ago I was bidding and just a minute before the end the biding went bersek and I lost the bid, the wining big was $170, the next day the same item appeared on eBay again and I received an email giving me a secong chance, and a couple of days later I received a email from the seller offering me the item for $120. So what I'm suppose to think about it?

The seller has multiple copies and would accept a lower price for the others. If you feel that the item is worth it, then you buy it. However, if you think that $120 is too much, then pass and wait for other auctions.

Evolution6579

Try your luck with a "best offer" on this:

http://cgi.ebay.com/PEARL-JAM-LOST-DOGS-TRIPLE-LP-SET-VINYL-SEALED-RARE-OOP_W0QQitemZ200271133323QQcmdZViewItemQQptZMusic_on_Vinyl?hash=item200271133323&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1205%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318

zolstice

Yellow Bedwetter wrote:

ya...i was thinking this hawkshore was this seller's "other" account
there's nothing to stop ppl from doing as you said with friends or creating other accounts to drive up their auctions - it sucks sometimes

Speaking as a formerly dirtbag ebay seller (what can I say, I had a messed up moral compass when I was younger, but have gladly learned the error of my ways), ebay has actually gotten pretty good at weeding out people who conduct shill bidding like this. They have software that automatically watches all of the auctions and who is bidding on them, so if someone has a bunch of auctions listed, and they get one of their friends to use their account to keep raising the bid, or if they have multiple accounts and do it themself, the auctions automatically get flagged, investigated, and if you can't prove that the bids are legit they usually revoke your selling privileges.

celebration

i wouldn't pay $75+ for lost dogs. it's just a record.

unless i can get it at cost or below cost, i ain't buying.

ever scalped a scalper? it feels real good.

Yellow Bedwetter

celebration wrote:

i wouldn't pay $75+ for lost dogs. it's just a record.

unless i can get it at cost or below cost, i ain't buying.

ever scalped a scalper? it feels real good.

ya but its hard when these records are OOP...if u happen to be at the record store and the original pressings are there then by all means grab them but it's tough to find RVM, Lost Dogs, Yield, and Binaural out there still sealed

celebration

Yellow Bedwetter wrote:

ya but its hard when these records are OOP...if u happen to be at the record store and the original pressings are there then by all means grab them but it's tough to find RVM, Lost Dogs, Yield, and Binaural out there still sealed

it's ok to not have them

arq

HollisBrown wrote:

The seller has multiple copies and would accept a lower price for the others. If you feel that the item is worth it, then you buy it. However, if you think that $120 is too much, then pass and wait for other auctions.

I wasn't complaining, I bought it but I thought it was a little bit weird, but don't tell me you wouldn't be a little bit skeptical.

bootlegger10

I've fallen for shill bidding once for a VFC poster. Obviously didn't know it at the time, but when you get outbid on an item, and then get an email from the seller that the buyer didn't pay and the seller wants to sell it to you at your last bid, you are probably getting scammed.

If you really want the item, you should look back at the bidding history and counter-offer with the bid price before the "fake buyer" started bidding (or the last bid price of an independent bidder).

southerngarden

zolstice wrote:

Speaking as a formerly dirtbag ebay seller (what can I say, I had a messed up moral compass when I was younger, but have gladly learned the error of my ways), ebay has actually gotten pretty good at weeding out people who conduct shill bidding like this. They have software that automatically watches all of the auctions and who is bidding on them, so if someone has a bunch of auctions listed, and they get one of their friends to use their account to keep raising the bid, or if they have multiple accounts and do it themself, the auctions automatically get flagged, investigated, and if you can't prove that the bids are legit they usually revoke your selling privileges.

yeah ebay is pretty good at stopping this...you cant just sign up for two accounts and expect to get away with shill bidding. they have software to specifically root this shit out...

encompassing trip

I can't see paying $199 for a record. But good luck to those who will.

Given to...

Get_Right wrote:

you answered your own question, because the bid went in on Nov. 6th, not at a later date-simply someone bid more than your increased bids at an earlier point in time.

save yourself the anguish
1) determine how much you want to pay, seriously, for the item
2) then snipe it

You know you just opened up a can of worms there? Now you are going to have to give a disertation on sniping and auto-snipe programs.

Get_Right

jaamfaan wrote:

You know you just opened up a can of worms there? Now you are going to have to give a disertation on sniping and auto-snipe programs.

they will have to do their own homework


edit: or they can buy my tapes explaining it

heather_honey

The converse to this shill bidding is when people end their auctions early because the price is too low! This happened to me TWICE in the last week or so. They were different items but one was relisted literally a few minutes after the auction 'ended early' for a BIN of $99. My 'winning bid' was $12 at the time. Go figure....

I made note of the seller and will not be bidding on any of their future auctions, no matter what they have that I may want!

bashba

Don't buy any PJ vinyl on ebay unless you are a completeist and must have a first pressing.

bashba

There will be new "official" pressings.

TransplantedNewf

I can't say anything about eBay but i can't definitely vouch for Hawkshore's character (assuimg it's the same guy from the Pit) He would never be involved in anything underhanded or scammy.