Illiteracy: An Incurable Disease or Education Malpractice?

soulsinging

Ahnimus wrote:

There are things all of us can do to help, it starts with a less selfish approach to the issue. Parents can spend more time with their children, assisting in their child's development and offering compassion, love and constructive learning assistance.

i dont think anyone out there doesnt know this is important, but if people already clearly arent doing it, how do you get them to do so? you mention the miriad of stressors that deprive or interfere with this quality time. how do you reduce them?

Ahnimus

soulsinging wrote:

i dont think anyone out there doesnt know this is important, but if people already clearly arent doing it, how do you get them to do so? you mention the miriad of stressors that deprive or interfere with this quality time. how do you reduce them?

Well, maternity leave is one way, the U.S. has poor maternity leave compared to other nations.

Perhaps though, we should reevaluate our standards of living. 50 years ago a single income couple could raise 9 kids, now it takes two incomes to raise one child. What's going on here?

MahoganySouls

Oh come on! You can't be serious as to blame this too on "stressors" and "problems". I am so sick of hearing how Johnny can't do this and Latisha can't do that because their parents have a crappy life. BS! If these people cannot find 10 minutes each day to read with their children, then quite frankly, they don't deserve to have them. It is called prioritizing. Perhaps if mom and dad stopped playing video games and hanging out in the corner pub, they would actually have time to interact with their kids. Excuses is all this boils down to. Not reasons. Sure there are those small few who work horrible hours to make ends meet. But then, again the question comes up, what kind of environment are these kids living in. Why are they parents if they cannot properly take care of them? Which of course boils down to ethics. Just because you CAN have kids doesn't mean you SHOULD.

Ahnimus

MahoganySouls wrote:

Oh come on! You can't be serious as to blame this too on "stressors" and "problems". I am so sick of hearing how Johnny can't do this and Latisha can't do that because their parents have a crappy life. BS! If these people cannot find 10 minutes each day to read with their children, then quite frankly, they don't deserve to have them. It is called prioritizing. Perhaps if mom and dad stopped playing video games and hanging out in the corner pub, they would actually have time to interact with their kids. Excuses is all this boils down to. Not reasons. Sure there are those small few who work horrible hours to make ends meet. But then, again the question comes up, what kind of environment are these kids living in. Why are they parents if they cannot properly take care of them? Which of course boils down to ethics. Just because you CAN have kids doesn't mean you SHOULD.

Do you have children? And are these opinions based on fact?

MahoganySouls

Ahnimus wrote:

Do you have children? And are these opinions based on fact?

Yes I have children. Which facts would you like Ahnimus?

Ahnimus

MahoganySouls wrote:

Yes I have children. Which facts would you like Ahnimus?

How about the ones that support your opinions.

For example:

54% of children in female-headed homes, and 10% of children in two-parent homes are living in poverty (Eggebeen & Lichter, 1991) Most African-American children live at some point in poverty (Brooks-Gunn, Klebanov, & Duncan, 1996) 65% of whom spent time in single-parent homes. (Teegartin, 1994).

Ahnimus

Snippet:

Recent studies on the impact of economic hardship on children have demonstrated that some of the negative effects are mediated through changes in the parent-child relationship. Elder, Van Nguyen, and Caspi (1985) found that economic hardship increased children's socioemotional distress by increasing punitive and arbitrary parenting behaviors, especially of the father. Harold-Goldsmith, Radin, and Eccles (1988) found that, although unemployed fathers had more time for child care, they displayed fewer nurturing behaviors than did other fathers. Lempers et al. (1989) observed that under economic hardship, parental nurturance decreased and inconsistent discipline increased. Conger et al. (1992, 1993) showed that economic pressure had an effect on adolescent adjustment by increasing parents' depression, which was associated with less involved parenting. Findings by Galambmos and Silbereisen (1987), Flanagan, 1988), and Larson (1984) all have indicated that parents facing economic hardship felt more depressed about the future of their children, felt less competent in helping their children choose future careers, tended to lower their expectations for their children's education, and were less likely to encourage them to finish college. These lowered parental expectations were associated with decreased academic aspirations in the children, who expected to undergo vocational training instead of attending a four-year college (Isralowitz & Singer, 1986; McLoyd, 1990). Flanagan (1990) showed that adolescents in families experiencing job loss reported more conflict with their parents.

In the current study, depression and loneliness were selected as indicators of adolescent distress because of the previously documented effects of economic hardship on the parents and the parent-child relationship. Parents who, because of financial pressure, become more depressed, more irritable, and/or more self-preoccupied might be less nurturant and supportive in their daily interactions with their children, and perhaps more distant, uninvolved, and rejecting on a daily basis (Maccoby & Martin, 1983; Patterson, 1982). These stress-induced parental moods and behaviors, and the resulting negative parent-child interactions, may be related to their children feeling depressed, less wanted, and more lonely. Further, as Jones (1988) reported, children from economically deprived families tended to feel isolated, to have had conflictual relationships with peers, and to be suspicious of children from social classes different from their own. Hook (1990) found that adolescents lacked identification with peers as a result of their inability to discuss with 'anyone in their communities their families' financial status, for which they felt partly responsible.

Research also documents the negative effects of economic hardship on marital quality and stability (Voydanoff & Majka, 1988). Studies have noted the effects of the quality of the marital relationship on child outcomes (Emery, 1988; Reid & Crisafulli, 1990). Most studies have tended to support the generalization that a decrease in the quality of the marital relationship is correlated with an increase in child disturbances (Dadds, 1987). Several studies have indicated that the marital relationship mediates the effect of economic hardship on child outcomes (Conger et al., 1992, 1993; Ge et al., 1992). According to McLoyd (1989, 1990), financially pressed parents might be less likely to be affectionate with and respectful of each other and even be more hostile.

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2248/is_n126_v32/ai_19619414

Yoyoyo

"What your government pays for it gets. When we understand that, then we look at government financed institutions of education and see the kind of students and kind of education that is being turned out by these government financed schools. Logic will tell you, that if what is being turned out in those schools was not in accord with what the state and federal government wanted then it would change it. The bottom line is that the government is getting what they have ordered. They do not want your children to be educated. They do not want you to think too much. That is why our country and our world has become so proliferated with entertainments, mass media, television shows, amusement parks, drugs, alcohol and every kind of entertainment to keep the human mind entertained. So that you don't get in the way of important people by doing too much thinking. You had better wake up and understand that there are people that are guiding your life and you don't even know it."

Some guy

Ahnimus

Mestophar wrote:

"What your government pays for it gets. When we understand that, then we look at government financed institutions of education and see the kind of students and kind of education that is being turned out by these government financed schools. Logic will tell you, that if what is being turned out in those schools was not in accord with what the state and federal government wanted then it would change it. The bottom line is that the government is getting what they have ordered. They do not want your children to be educated. They do not want you to think too much. That is why our country and our world has become so proliferated with entertainments, mass media, television shows, amusement parks, drugs, alcohol and every kind of entertainment to keep the human mind entertained. So that you don't get in the way of important people by doing too much thinking. You had better wake up and understand that there are people that are guiding your life and you don't even know it."

Some guy

Sounds like Alex Jones.

gue_barium

MahoganySouls wrote:

Oh come on! You can't be serious as to blame this too on "stressors" and "problems". I am so sick of hearing how Johnny can't do this and Latisha can't do that because their parents have a crappy life. BS! If these people cannot find 10 minutes each day to read with their children, then quite frankly, they don't deserve to have them. It is called prioritizing. Perhaps if mom and dad stopped playing video games and hanging out in the corner pub, they would actually have time to interact with their kids. Excuses is all this boils down to. Not reasons. Sure there are those small few who work horrible hours to make ends meet. But then, again the question comes up, what kind of environment are these kids living in. Why are they parents if they cannot properly take care of them? Which of course boils down to ethics. Just because you CAN have kids doesn't mean you SHOULD.

You're not anyone to be giving advice on illiteracy. I think you may be among the illiterate. I posted a link to an article to begin this topic. It has lots of useful information and a lots of links to further the understanding of illiteracy in America.
This topic isn't about how you hate ghetto folk parenting.

MahoganySouls

Ahnimus wrote:

How about the ones that support your opinions.

For example:

54% of children in female-headed homes, and 10% of children in two-parent homes are living in poverty (Eggebeen & Lichter, 1991) Most African-American children live at some point in poverty (Brooks-Gunn, Klebanov, & Duncan, 1996) 65% of whom spent time in single-parent homes. (Teegartin, 1994).

Income level has no bearing on the ability to read. Children who go to school, do homework and have involved parents learn how to read just fine. It has nothing to do with how much money their parents make.

MahoganySouls

Mestophar wrote:

"What your government pays for it gets. When we understand that, then we look at government financed institutions of education and see the kind of students and kind of education that is being turned out by these government financed schools. Logic will tell you, that if what is being turned out in those schools was not in accord with what the state and federal government wanted then it would change it. The bottom line is that the government is getting what they have ordered. They do not want your children to be educated. They do not want you to think too much. That is why our country and our world has become so proliferated with entertainments, mass media, television shows, amusement parks, drugs, alcohol and every kind of entertainment to keep the human mind entertained. So that you don't get in the way of important people by doing too much thinking. You had better wake up and understand that there are people that are guiding your life and you don't even know it."

Some guy

Exactly, education has taken a back seat to entertainment. These same kids who cannot read can certainly quote their favorite musical stars verbatim. They have no trouble emulating what they find interesting. If the parents actually took the time to instill the value of learning into their children we wouldnt' be having this discussion.

Saying the govt. doesnt want kids to learn is absurd. The education system in our country is just fine. Kids who apply themselves have no problems learning and getting productive employment. The problems are with those who are not using the system to it's full.

gue_barium

MahoganySouls wrote:

Income level has no bearing on the ability to read. Children who go to school, do homework and have involved parents learn how to read just fine. It has nothing to do with how much money their parents make.

That's true, however the other parts of the studies Ahnimus presented show that some of the stresses in a low-income home life can hinder a child's learning ability.

Ahnimus

gue_barium wrote:

That's true, however the other parts of the studies Ahnimus presented show that some of the stresses in a low-income home life can hinder a child's learning ability.

Yea, it was a prerequisite to how low-socialeconimic strata affects the home environment. You know what though, it's difficult to have a complete understanding without having all the facts.

I recommend this book
http://www.amazon.com/Developmental-Psychology-Childhood-Adolescence-Advantage/dp/0534632521/ref=sr_1_11/002-6873279-5196009?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1192066374&sr=1-11

MahoganySouls

gue_barium wrote:

That's true, however the other parts of the studies Ahnimus presented show that some of the stresses in a low-income home life can hinder a child's learning ability.

I don't believe it hinders "ability" but rather utilization of that ability.

Ahnimus

MahoganySouls wrote:

I don't believe it hinders "ability" but rather utilization of that ability.

Sounds like your suggesting that "ability" is an innate trait, something that is acquired at birth.

It certainly can't be true for reading comprehension and probably isn't true for anything else, especially of high-order cognition.

fanch75

by gawd, i'll lern ye!

MahoganySouls

Ahnimus wrote:

Sounds like your suggesting that "ability" is an innate trait, something that is acquired at birth.

It certainly can't be true for reading comprehension and probably isn't true for anything else, especially of high-order cognition.

definitely. One doesn't need to have a high IQ to read. Of course we all have different levels of ability, it doesn't mean that we cannot aquire basic knowledge.

soulsinging

Ahnimus wrote:

Well, maternity leave is one way, the U.S. has poor maternity leave compared to other nations.

Perhaps though, we should reevaluate our standards of living. 50 years ago a single income couple could raise 9 kids, now it takes two incomes to raise one child. What's going on here?

economic factors that determinism can't solve.

Ahnimus

soulsinging wrote:

economic factors that determinism can't solve.

You really dislike determinism. Well, I think your stuck with it bud.