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I need some advice on Satirical humour

harmless_little_f***harmless_little_f*** Posts: 8,005
edited November 2006 in A Moving Train
I've started a satirical comic blog, and a major theme is my life as a disabled person. But I've recently come across a slight issue in that my friends, when they've seen the cartoons, have been a bit embarrassed to laugh. I think satire only works when boundaries are pushed, a la Borat. But I'm just a BIT concerned that people aren't all that ready for the subject of disability to be covered, even if from a disabled person. I'm not the sort of person to worry about that - I'll draw the cartoons anyway. It's only my life we're talking about after all. I wonder whether people know how commonplace some of the incidences in the cartoons are. If they knew, I hardly think they'd see them as 'risky' at all.

My question: when do you find satire funny? Could you give me an example of something you felt uncomfortable to laugh at? Is it possible to make someone laugh and think at the same time? Do you have to appear 'tame' and give concessions to people's sensitivities in order to make them laugh?

I'm sure the majority of people who saw Borat were not ant-semitic, and yet the anti-semitic humour made people laugh their arses off. Why?
'We're learning songs for baby Jesus' birthday. His mum and dad were Merry and Joseph. He had a bed made of clay and the three kings bought him Gold, Frankenstein and Merv as presents.'

- the great Sir Leo Harrison
Post edited by Unknown User on
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Comments

  • Vedderlution_BabyVedderlution_Baby Posts: 2,535
    harmless_little_f*** wrote:
    I've started a satirical comic blog, and a major theme is my life as a disabled person. But I've recently come across a slight issue in that my friends, when they've seen the cartoons, have been a bit embarrassed to laugh. I think satire only works when boundaries are pushed, a la Borat. But I'm just a BIT concerned that people aren't all that ready for the subject of disability to be covered, even if from a disabled person. I'm not the sort of person to worry about that - I'll draw the cartoons anyway. It's only my life we're talking about after all. I wonder whether people know how commonplace some of the incidences in the cartoons are. If they knew, I hardly think they'd see them as 'risky' at all.

    My question: when do you find satire funny? Could you give me an example of something you felt uncomfortable to laugh at? Is it possible to make someone laugh and think at the same time? Do you have to appear 'tame' and give concessions to people's sensitivities in order to make them laugh?

    I'm sure the majority of people who saw Borat were not ant-semitic, and yet the anti-semitic humour made people laugh their arses off. Why?


    Just as long as you don't try to be edgy and call someone a racial slur over and over, I should laugh. You wouldn't happen to have any I could look at now do you?
  • harmless_little_f***harmless_little_f*** Posts: 8,005
    Vedderlution_Baby! wrote:
    Just as long as you don't try to be edgy and call someone a racial slur over and over, I should laugh. You wouldn't happen to have any I could look at now do you?

    Like I said, these aren't even risky IMO, but certain friends are all like, yeah, um, I like them, they're um, nice:

    http://lamechampion.blogspot.com
    'We're learning songs for baby Jesus' birthday. His mum and dad were Merry and Joseph. He had a bed made of clay and the three kings bought him Gold, Frankenstein and Merv as presents.'

    - the great Sir Leo Harrison
  • wendy1976wendy1976 Posts: 88
    i am a bit disabled myself(wil be getting worse in time)and my dad has been in a electric wheelchair for years....we make fun of ourselfs alot....but many people do not get that.They think it is a way for us to handle it.For my dad and myself that is not the case.I just do not think it is a big deal.I have some problems with my body...so what!I think that being satirical about being disabled and trying to make people get the humor is a though thing to do.Most feel sorry for disabled people and think we should be protected not made fun of even when we do it ourselves.But then again;there are many people with a handicap that really cannot laugh about it at all and i can relate to that ...took me some time to get where i am right know...i think that when people are at risk of getting hurt because of a joke it is better to not laugh unless you are sure that it is not a problem.
  • Vedderlution_BabyVedderlution_Baby Posts: 2,535
    Dude, I liked them!

    I couldnt stop laughing at the lion one.
  • harmless_little_f***harmless_little_f*** Posts: 8,005
    Vedderlution_Baby! wrote:
    Dude, I liked them!

    I couldnt stop laughing at the lion one.

    Cool, I'm glad. :) What did you mean by 'don't try to be edgy'? I'm intrigued...
    'We're learning songs for baby Jesus' birthday. His mum and dad were Merry and Joseph. He had a bed made of clay and the three kings bought him Gold, Frankenstein and Merv as presents.'

    - the great Sir Leo Harrison
  • Vedderlution_BabyVedderlution_Baby Posts: 2,535
    harmless_little_f*** wrote:
    Cool, I'm glad. :) What did you mean by 'don't try to be edgy'? I'm intrigued...


    I was talking about the kramer incident and how he was supposedly being "Edgy".




    You better keep that shit updated man!

    Just outta curiousity, how do you feel when people how aren't disabled joke about it with you? (or try to joke about it with you?)

    I can give you an example if you like but I'm pretty sure you don't need it.
  • redrockredrock Posts: 18,341
    Satire is funny, harmlesslittlef***. We don't laugh at ourselves enough, whether we're disabled, of different races, etc. There are lots of 'funny' things that are particular to a 'set' of individuals (disabled, fat, skinny....), to cultures and races. As long as there is no hatred and one can understand that it is meant to be funny, I think satire is great. It does make one think (eg your 'ramp to heaven'), etc. but without being heavy.

    You know the thread where you mentioned thinking of being a stand-up comedian, to which Dunkman responded you couldn't do stand-up because you were in a wheelchair? Well... it would seem that it got deleted. Dunk is thinking maybe it was his remark. I thought it was funny what he said (don't know how you took it)... but from one comedian to another (as you both are), it was funny.... someone might have thought it offensive......

    Difficult to say where to draw the line. But I believe because it is you, and your cartoons are your life, you can do what you want. Some people who are shown those cartoons (the not so tame ones?) and who don't know that the creator is disabled himself, may wonder how to react because they may feel sorry for a guy in a wheelchair and it is not PC to laugh about it. But I think most of us are OK at laughing with people who laugh about themselves!

    Continue with your stuff..... you never know... we might be asking autographs soon! :D:D
  • harmless_little_f***harmless_little_f*** Posts: 8,005
    Vedderlution_Baby! wrote:
    I was talking about the kramer incident and how he was supposedly being "Edgy".




    You better keep that shit updated man!

    Just outta curiousity, how do you feel when people how aren't disabled joke about it with you? (or try to joke about it with you?)

    I can give you an example if you like but I'm pretty sure you don't need it.

    Well I personally don't mind. I don't think 'being disabled is funny', but no-one can deny that little incidents that happen to us ARE funny. But I don't want to give away my next comic!

    I heard a story about a lady who was deaf went to the hairdressers. She took out her hearing aid and put it by the sink in front of her. The hairdresser crouched down in front of the hearing aid and spoke into it like it was a tiny microphone: 'What of haircut would you like?' True story.

    I don't mind people laughing at stuff that happens if it's out of respect for what shit really does happen in this world. Case in point: Borat. It's funny because we can't deny it happens.

    But no, go on. What was the example you were going to give? It'd be helpful to me.
    'We're learning songs for baby Jesus' birthday. His mum and dad were Merry and Joseph. He had a bed made of clay and the three kings bought him Gold, Frankenstein and Merv as presents.'

    - the great Sir Leo Harrison
  • harmless_little_f***harmless_little_f*** Posts: 8,005
    redrock wrote:
    Satire is funny, harmlesslittlef***. We don't laugh at ourselves enough, whether we're disabled, of different races, etc. There are lots of 'funny' things that are particular to a 'set' of individuals (disabled, fat, skinny....), to cultures and races. As long as there is no hatred and one can understand that it is meant to be funny, I think satire is great. It does make one think (eg your 'ramp to heaven'), etc. but without being heavy.

    You know the thread where you mentioned thinking of being a stand-up comedian, to which Dunkman responded you couldn't do stand-up because you were in a wheelchair? Well... it would seem that it got deleted. Dunk is thinking maybe it was his remark. I thought it was funny what he said (don't know how you took it)... but from one comedian to another (as you both are), it was funny.... someone might have thought it offensive......

    Difficult to say where to draw the line. But I believe because it is you, and your cartoons are your life, you can do what you want. Some people who are shown those cartoons (the not so tame ones?) and who don't know that the creator is disabled himself, may wonder how to react because they may feel sorry for a guy in a wheelchair and it is not PC to laugh about it. But I think most of us are OK at laughing with people who laugh about themselves!

    Continue with your stuff..... you never know... we might be asking autographs soon! :D:D

    Like I said, there is actually an English disabled standup who has used the joke of 'sit down comedian' already. And he's been plastered over the papers for it. It's funny, that's why. I think he said it to Prince Charles. 'What do you do?' 'I am a sit down comedian.' It's a shame the post was deleted; in no way was Dunkman being offensive. A little unoriginal maybe, but not offensive. :D
    'We're learning songs for baby Jesus' birthday. His mum and dad were Merry and Joseph. He had a bed made of clay and the three kings bought him Gold, Frankenstein and Merv as presents.'

    - the great Sir Leo Harrison
  • redrockredrock Posts: 18,341
    harmless_little_f*** wrote:
    ......in no way was Dunkman being offensive. A little unoriginal maybe, but not offensive. :D

    Nooooooooo!!!! :eek: Don't let Dunky see this!!!! :eek:
  • Vedderlution_BabyVedderlution_Baby Posts: 2,535
    harmless_little_f*** wrote:
    Well I personally don't mind. I don't think 'being disabled is funny', but no-one can deny that little incidents that happen to us ARE funny. But I don't want to give away my next comic!

    I heard a story about a lady who was deaf went to the hairdressers. She took out her hearing aid and put it by the sink in front of her. The hairdresser crouched down in front of the hearing aid and spoke into it: 'What sort of haircut would you like?' True story.

    I don't mind people laughing at stuff that happens if it's out of respect for what shit really does happen in this world. Case in point: Borat. It's funny because we can't deny it happens.

    But no, go on. What was the example you were going to give? It'd be helpful to me.


    Well I was going to tell you to keep your shit updated otherwise I was going to bust your kneecaps. Seeing how you wouldnt give a shit anyway, I'm just gonna have to put my trust in you.
  • redrockredrock Posts: 18,341
    harmless_little_f*** wrote:
    I heard a story about a lady who was deaf went to the hairdressers. She took out her hearing aid and put it by the sink in front of her. The hairdresser crouched down in front of the hearing aid and spoke into it like it was a tiny microphone: 'What of haircut would you like?' True story.

    That actually happened to my husband' grandmother!!!!!! Except she was holding her hearing aid in her hand while her hair was being shampoo'd! The young assistant was asking her clasped hands if the water wasn't too hot!

    I was there, I saw it!!! I nearly wet my pants laughing... so did my hubby's grandma (when she found out what this lady was doing!!!)
  • Vedderlution_BabyVedderlution_Baby Posts: 2,535
    redrock wrote:
    That actually happened to my husband' grandmother!!!!!! Except she was holding her hearing aid in her hand while her hair was being shampoo'd! The young assistant was asking her clasped hands if the water wasn't too hot!

    I was there, I saw it!!! I nearly wet my pants laughing... so did my hubby's grandma (when she found out what this lady was doing!!!)



    nice!


    (And I wouldnt be surprised if my comment, or perhaps the next few, get this thread closed down. Which I dont mean to happen. And really, shouldn't happen)
  • harmless_little_f***harmless_little_f*** Posts: 8,005
    Vedderlution_Baby! wrote:
    nice!


    (And I wouldnt be surprised if my comment, or perhaps the next few, get this thread closed down. Which I dont mean to happen. And really, shouldn't happen)

    I don't know about anyone else, but I would laugh at a cartoon about you busting my kneecaps. I'll leave a key under my doormat, and a landing light on.
    'We're learning songs for baby Jesus' birthday. His mum and dad were Merry and Joseph. He had a bed made of clay and the three kings bought him Gold, Frankenstein and Merv as presents.'

    - the great Sir Leo Harrison
  • Vedderlution_BabyVedderlution_Baby Posts: 2,535
    harmless_little_f*** wrote:
    I don't know about anyone else, but I would laugh at a cartoon about you busting my kneecaps. I'll leave a key under my doormat.


    I knew this girl in highschool that was in a wheelchair. We talked a little bit and always joked around with each other. Well, she was...rolling...?...down the hall one day and I stood to the side with my thumb out. She thought it was funny. Not many others did.

    (I still laugh about it)
  • harmless_little_f***harmless_little_f*** Posts: 8,005
    Vedderlution_Baby! wrote:
    I knew this girl in highschool that was in a wheelchair. We talked a little bit and always joked around with each other. Well, she was...rolling...?...down the hall one day and I stood to the side with my thumb out. She thought it was funny. Not many others did.

    (I still laugh about it)

    LOL yeah that's pretty good!
    'We're learning songs for baby Jesus' birthday. His mum and dad were Merry and Joseph. He had a bed made of clay and the three kings bought him Gold, Frankenstein and Merv as presents.'

    - the great Sir Leo Harrison
  • Riot_RainRiot_Rain Posts: 348
    I like your cartoons! They made me smile. The people who were uncomfortable with them, were they physically there when you showed them? Maybe it's being right there that makes it a bit awkward; everyone can laugh when it's online, as there are no witnesses I guess :)

    Something that I didn't find funny: some stand-up by a lady who kept taking the piss out of her Muslim family. It wasn't clear whether she upheld the same beliefs as her family and the jokes were downright racist. However, most people in the audience were pissing themselves, they found it so funny. I didn't laugh. If those jokes had been told by me, I would have been sued probably... That was a very strange experience. (By the way, I didn't buy a ticket to see her, it was part of a bigger event at my work. She was one of the speakers and as such did a bit of her routine)

    Your cartoons are satirical, but in themselves, they are respectful. You are highlighting painful issues, rather than pointlessly taking the piss. I guess that's the difference!
    Like a cloud dropping rain
    I'm discarding all thought
    I'll dry up, leaving puddles on the ground
    I'm like an opening band for the sun
  • dunkmandunkman Posts: 19,646
    harmless_little_f*** wrote:
    Could you give me an example of something you felt uncomfortable to laugh at?

    no... i can laugh at anything and anyone.

    my "ask me anything thread" was deleted and on it i said to you you couldnt do stand-up as you were in a wheelchair... someone obviously thought was to insulting rather than slightly comical and they obviousy reported that thread and it was deleted.

    thats what your up against... people dont think its right to laugh at disabled people, whereas in my experience, disabled people want nothing more in life than to be treated with the same respect and disrespect afforded to able bodied people.

    i'll laugh at a disabled guy taking the piss out of himself just as much as i laugh at Billy Connolly verbally flogging himself onstage at his lack of sexual prowess... both can be funny and both are people taking the piss out of their respective "faults"

    :)
    oh scary... 40000 morbidly obese christians wearing fanny packs invading europe is probably the least scariest thing since I watched an edited version of The Care Bears movie in an extremely brightly lit cinema.
  • dunkmandunkman Posts: 19,646
    harmless_little_f*** wrote:
    It's a shame the post was deleted; in no way was Dunkman being offensive. A little unoriginal maybe, but not offensive. :D

    he copied me ;)

    I said it to a guy called Stephen Jack in Design College on 17th Oct 1991... thats exactly 3 days after wheelchairs were invented.. so i win :cool:
    oh scary... 40000 morbidly obese christians wearing fanny packs invading europe is probably the least scariest thing since I watched an edited version of The Care Bears movie in an extremely brightly lit cinema.
  • dunkmandunkman Posts: 19,646
    Vedderlution_Baby! wrote:
    I knew this girl in highschool that was in a wheelchair. We talked a little bit and always joked around with each other. Well, she was...rolling...?...down the hall one day and I stood to the side with my thumb out. She thought it was funny. Not many others did.

    (I still laugh about it)


    you should have thrown out those spikey rope things that the police use to halt speeding joyriders..... ok maybe not :o
    oh scary... 40000 morbidly obese christians wearing fanny packs invading europe is probably the least scariest thing since I watched an edited version of The Care Bears movie in an extremely brightly lit cinema.
  • harmless_little_f***harmless_little_f*** Posts: 8,005
    dunkman1974 wrote:
    he copied me ;)

    I said it to a guy called Stephen Jack in Design College on 17th Oct 1991... thats exactly 3 days after wheelchairs were invented.. so i win :cool:

    And you were rejected by the BBC WHY?? It's a scandal.
    'We're learning songs for baby Jesus' birthday. His mum and dad were Merry and Joseph. He had a bed made of clay and the three kings bought him Gold, Frankenstein and Merv as presents.'

    - the great Sir Leo Harrison
  • dunkmandunkman Posts: 19,646
    harmless_little_f*** wrote:
    And you were rejected by the BBC WHY?? It's a scandal.


    ooohhhh the sarcasm... ;) you must be good!!!

    cos some fucker in a wheelchair had written a script as well... and due to equal opportunities and all that pc shite they rubber stamped his.. there you go...
    oh scary... 40000 morbidly obese christians wearing fanny packs invading europe is probably the least scariest thing since I watched an edited version of The Care Bears movie in an extremely brightly lit cinema.
  • harmless_little_f***harmless_little_f*** Posts: 8,005
    dunkman1974 wrote:
    ooohhhh the sarcasm... ;) you must be good!!!

    cos some fucker in a wheelchair had written a script as well... and due to equal opportunities and all that pc shite they rubber stamped his.. there you go...

    So do you reckon my situation means I could get a footplate in the door?

    By the way, sorry, edit: Have you seen 'I'm with Stupid'? I really think it's rubbish and could have been a lot more.
    'We're learning songs for baby Jesus' birthday. His mum and dad were Merry and Joseph. He had a bed made of clay and the three kings bought him Gold, Frankenstein and Merv as presents.'

    - the great Sir Leo Harrison
  • redrockredrock Posts: 18,341
    harmless_little_f*** wrote:
    So do you reckon my situation means I could get a footplate in the door?

    If that's the case, Dunky's gonna ask Vedderlution to pay him a visit!
  • harmless_little_f***harmless_little_f*** Posts: 8,005
    redrock wrote:
    If that's the case, Dunky's gonna ask Vedderlution to pay him a visit!

    What is more ethical? Me asking Vedderlution for her services in order to ENHANCE my comedy, or Dunkman going to her because he never even had an act in the first place?
    'We're learning songs for baby Jesus' birthday. His mum and dad were Merry and Joseph. He had a bed made of clay and the three kings bought him Gold, Frankenstein and Merv as presents.'

    - the great Sir Leo Harrison
  • redrockredrock Posts: 18,341
    Tough one little f***. But you using vedderlution to enhance your chances could be viewed as you using your disability to get somewhere.. ie people taking pity on you... Now.. on the other hand... Dunky being Scottish could also use this as a disability thing (especially at the BBC) so maybe the playing field could be levelled!!!!! :D
  • dunkmandunkman Posts: 19,646
    harmless_little_f*** wrote:
    What is more ethical? Me asking Vedderlution for her services in order to ENHANCE my comedy, or Dunkman going to her because he never even had an act in the first place?

    what you on about....???

    I've written two sitcoms, contributed material to bbc's comedy department for use in sketch shows and generally taken the piss all my life

    what have you done... 6 fucking etch-a-sketch's on your own blog.


    i bow to your comedic knowledge






    p.s. all of the above was me taking the piss... but in a non-edgy way :D
    oh scary... 40000 morbidly obese christians wearing fanny packs invading europe is probably the least scariest thing since I watched an edited version of The Care Bears movie in an extremely brightly lit cinema.
  • dunkmandunkman Posts: 19,646
    redrock wrote:
    Tough one little f***. But you using vedderlution to enhance your chances could be viewed as you using your disability to get somewhere.. ie people taking pity on you... Now.. on the other hand... Dunky being Scottish could also use this as a disability thing (especially at the BBC) so maybe the playing field could be levelled!!!!! :D


    you dont get pity for being scottish though red... you get money from Westminster though... :cool: dumb english taxpayers!!! I get free eye tests...nah nah de nah nah :cool:
    oh scary... 40000 morbidly obese christians wearing fanny packs invading europe is probably the least scariest thing since I watched an edited version of The Care Bears movie in an extremely brightly lit cinema.
  • harmless_little_f***harmless_little_f*** Posts: 8,005
    dunkman1974 wrote:
    what you on about....???

    I've written two sitcoms, contributed material to bbc's comedy department for use in sketch shows and generally taken the piss all my life

    what have you done... 6 fucking etch-a-sketch's on your own blog.


    i bow to your comedic knowledge






    p.s. all of the above was me taking the piss... but in a non-edgy way :D

    I'm offended. This thread needs closing down, post-haste!

    Seriously though Dunk, I'm pretty interested in stuff you've done. Anything I might've seen? I'm new to this comedy malarkey. People have always said I'm pretty funny, but I have the self-confidence of a barnacle.
    'We're learning songs for baby Jesus' birthday. His mum and dad were Merry and Joseph. He had a bed made of clay and the three kings bought him Gold, Frankenstein and Merv as presents.'

    - the great Sir Leo Harrison
  • dunkmandunkman Posts: 19,646
    harmless_little_f*** wrote:
    I'm offended. This thread needs closing down, post-haste!


    I agree...

    I'm offended that you're offended at me
    oh scary... 40000 morbidly obese christians wearing fanny packs invading europe is probably the least scariest thing since I watched an edited version of The Care Bears movie in an extremely brightly lit cinema.
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