Home› A Moving Train

An Introduction to Philosophy

AhnimusAhnimus Posts: 10,560
edited May 2007 in A Moving Train
Hi everyone, thought some of you would enjoy and bennefit from an introduction to the power of philosophical thought.

Stefan Molyneux gives a great introduction on his website http://www.freedomainradio.com and videos are available on youtube

This is part 1, you will find the rest on stefbot's page or freedomainradio.com
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NwkJteRu9Vg

P.s. Stefan is not a determinist, I'm working on that ;)
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
Post edited by Unknown User on

Comments

  • catefrancescatefrances Posts: 29,003
    thinking about thinking. :D
    hear my name
    take a good look
    this could be the day
    hold my hand
    lie beside me
    i just need to say
  • AhnimusAhnimus Posts: 10,560
    catefrances wrote:
    thinking about thinking. :D

    Yea, but ti's more involved than that.
    I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
  • catefrancescatefrances Posts: 29,003
    Ahnimus wrote:
    Yea, but ti's more involved than that.

    it always is ryan, it always is. :D
    hear my name
    take a good look
    this could be the day
    hold my hand
    lie beside me
    i just need to say
  • AhnimusAhnimus Posts: 10,560
    We are both Goners cate.
    I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
  • catefrancescatefrances Posts: 29,003
    Ahnimus wrote:
    We are both Goners cate.

    how so ryan?



    ah crap i just got it. sometimes my brain just isnt in gear. :D
    hear my name
    take a good look
    this could be the day
    hold my hand
    lie beside me
    i just need to say
  • jlew24asujlew24asu Posts: 10,118
    is dis one of dem threeds weres ya'll tink 2 alots?
  • ByrnzieByrnzie Posts: 21,037
    Ryan, have you considered studying a course in Philosophy somewhere? It seems to me that this is what you're mostly interested in. Why not put these ideas of yours to the test and also do something that you enjoy?
    In the meantime, I'd recommend trying your hand at reading an introduction to Kant, followed by Schopenhauer's 'The world as will and representation', followed by Nietzsche's Thus spoke Zarathustra, The genealogy of morals, and the anti-Christ.
    It's not easy, but if you can manage to read Kant, then you'll manage anyone - except maybe Hegel. :)
  • AhnimusAhnimus Posts: 10,560
    Byrnzie wrote:
    Ryan, have you considered studying a course in Philosophy somewhere? It seems to me that this is what you're mostly interested in. Why not put these ideas of yours to the test and also do something that you enjoy?
    In the meantime, I'd recommend trying your hand at reading an introduction to Kant, followed by Schopenhauer's 'The world as will and representation', followed by Nietzsche's Thus spoke Zarathustra, The genealogy of morals, and the anti-Christ.
    It's not easy, but if you can manage to read Kant, then you'll manage anyone - except maybe Hegel. :)

    hehe, honestly philosophy to me is a good way of analyzing truth statements. What I don't find particularly useful is out-dated conclusions by philosophers.

    I use philosophy to scrutinize science and make my own hypothesis. Like, it's no good for me to read about some Homuncular or Cartesean Theater, when it's not factually possible with today's knowledge.

    So.. while I'm sure some of it is interesting.. like Schopenhauer, he gets into "The world as will" and it's just either wrong or a fruity way of talking about reality. I'm not big on poetry, it either is or it isn't. When someone tries to butter up their theories and sound like Bruce Lee talking about water, it's fiction to me and it's an enormous amount of effort to discern any truth value from it. To me, there is no way the world is "will" since will is a distinctively biological term. If he said "The human as causal" which may mean the same thing, then at least it's obvious and easy to discern the truth value of it.

    I have read a lot of it, I just don't see much value in it. Like Leucippus had some great ideas in 600 B.C.E. but I wouldn't be interested in reading any books by him or even about him.
    I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
  • AhnimusAhnimus Posts: 10,560
    Oh.. I have been asked to attend a philosophy course in the fall to share my views and knowledge on determinism. Pending approval by the university. I'm supposed to be going for beer or something with the professor soon, so we'll see how that works out. My understanding is that this professor teaches God as factual and Free-will as an absolute truth. Which, in my mind, is an absolutely absurd position for a philosophy professor to preach in his class.
    I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
  • JeanieJeanie Posts: 9,446
    Ahnimus wrote:
    Oh.. I have been asked to attend a philosophy course in the fall to share my views and knowledge on determinism. Pending approval by the university. I'm supposed to be going for beer or something with the professor soon, so we'll see how that works out. My understanding is that this professor teaches God as factual and Free-will as an absolute truth. Which, in my mind, is an absolutely absurd position for a philosophy professor to preach in his class.

    This is excellent news!! :)
    NOPE!!!

    *~You're IT Bert!~*

    Hold on to the thread
    The currents will shift
  • AbookamongstthemanyAbookamongstthemany Posts: 8,209
    Byrnzie wrote:
    Nietzsche's Thus spoke Zarathustra, The genealogy of morals, and the anti-Christ.

    I loved those!!! So many ideas on such a different level than anything I've ever read before! I found it amazing and I didn't agree with all he had to say but his vision of humanity was out of this world!
    If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.

    Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
    -Oscar Wilde
  • JeanieJeanie Posts: 9,446
    Abookamongstthemany wrote:
    I loved those!!! So many ideas on such a different level than anything I've ever read before! I found it amazing and I didn't agree with all he had to say but his vision of humanity was out of this world!

    Sounds interesting abook girl. And if you enjoyed them then perhaps I would too? Might have to take a little look. Thanks for the recommendation.:)
    NOPE!!!

    *~You're IT Bert!~*

    Hold on to the thread
    The currents will shift
  • ByrnzieByrnzie Posts: 21,037
    Ahnimus wrote:
    like Schopenhauer, he gets into "The world as will" and it's just either wrong or a fruity way of talking about reality.

    It also teaches you not to jump to conclusions. I guarantee that Schopenhauer's ideas re: will, are the opposite of what you presume them to be, and may actually fit in with your determinist scheme of things, in some way.
  • AhnimusAhnimus Posts: 10,560
    Byrnzie wrote:
    It also teaches you not to jump to conclusions. I guarantee that Schopenhauer's ideas re: will, are the opposite of what you presume them to be, and may actually fit in with your determinist scheme of things, in some way.

    Schopenhauer was a materialist in a way, but he also believed in some weird cosmic consciousness thing. "A man can surely do what he wills, but cannot choose what he wills." a nice quote by Schopenhauer, but by it's self does not prove anything.

    I am quite skeptical of everything. See, the belief in Free-will is common, but it is only one theory. If I deny the theory of free-will then I am a determinist. If you look at free-will as a theory, it has no basis, besides the claim that in some function of the human brain we make decisions which are independent of knowledge, morality, upbringing, genetics or any other factor which could determine the outcome of the decisions. Because a more suitable theory for that situation looks like a mathematical equation, maybe the algorithm is different for everyone by some other cause, but they are determinents within the system. There is absolutely no evidence what-so-ever besides the illusion some people have that they possess it. And ask yourself if you believe the earth is round, because when I look out on the horizon it appears flat. Or that the earth moves, because it doesn't feel like the earth is in motion. In ancient times people believed the stars were holes poked in a bowl that moved around the earth, because that is what first-person perspective makes it appear as. The illusion of free-will fits in nicely to evolution and the way a complex system like us would have to work. If I did not feel authorship then I could not function. I would be suffering from locked-in syndrome, schizophrenia or some other disassociation disorder, which we know is not functionally realistic.

    Determinism may not be all there is, but that is all we can observe. Every system has properties and methods. I could demonstrate the predictability of the hypothesis by stating "Your hand will raise up, beyond your will, when I count to five." I would then count to five and you would not raise your hand. I would have prepared an envelope with the prediction that you would not follow my order. This can be done to an infinite degree, as long as I know what you are expecting me to predict, then I can choose the opposite. If you know a person well enough, you can predict with a probability what they will say or do in any given situation. Try it, think of a question to ask someone you know really well and see if you can predict what they will say.

    When you get down to the perverse philosophical ideas that are out there. You can absolutely say that you have no idea how anything works or if anything even exists. But it does not prove anything since it's a claim of ignorance, not knowledge. Determinism is a working hypothesis. It has many ways it can be proven wrong, proving free-will, or even providing reasonable evidence for it will make it a lot easier.
    I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
  • decides2dreamdecides2dream Posts: 14,977
    philosophy was one of my most favorite classes during my undergrad days....great subject, great class...."thinking about thinking"...indeed! :)


    also where i got turned onto dostoyevsky.....with excerpts from the brothers karamosov...and was hooked from there......
    Stay with me...
    Let's just breathe...


    I am myself like you somehow


Sign In or Register to comment.