The Fallacy of Patriotism
he still stands
Posts: 2,835
I was reading through the thread about the pledge of allegiance and it got me thinking -- the reason that other people think it may be "strange" is because they don't understand why children are asked to recite it. Things you don't understand I guess is a good definition of "strange" or "weird." At the same time, those who support the pledge in the classroom find nothing "stange" about it because they truly understand why it is recited, and agree with the principles behind it. These people understand that it is about supporting your country in good times and bad, being tuned into the ideals of our society and supporting those ideals, and most of all being a Patriot.
To tell you the truth I fucking hate Patriotism. I think it is a stupid concept. And I will explain why, and probably end up being called a "terrorist."
Patriotism implies that citizens of a country owe a greater allegiance to each other, and to their own country than to foreigners and foreign countries. Patriotism assumes that our globe is divided into little spots, each one surrounded by an "iron gate". Personally I have a hard time going along with these concepts. The globe is round, everyone is created equal, and I love my brothers and sisters in Paris, Moscow, Kuala Lumpur, or wherever, as much as my brothers and sisters down the street. I don't have a stronger allegiance to the guy down the street, or to my country, than my allegiance to foreigners and foriegn countries. Why? Because I am not patriotic. My moral duties apply EQUALLY to all members of the world.
I think Patriotism robs the intellectual faculty necessary to judge the morality and to have a fact-based decision of policies. Throughout history, many men have been unjustly slain by a patriot who is fighting for what he has been told is the moral and right way, rather than using morals and logic developed on his own accord. Most "patriots" will follow their country or brothers and sisters through any decision, even decisions which he may find immoral under normal conditions (without patriotism).
Patriotism is also dangerous because politicians use it to appeal to the emotions of those who are patriotic. (See George W. Bush) So instead of making fact-based decisions and having reasoned views on policies, we blindly believe what we are told because to do otherwise would be "unpatriotic" or even **gasp** "treason."
So I'm not a good writer, and these are kind of loosely connected thoughts, but I just thought I would throw this out there and see if I get crucified.
“Patriotism ... for rulers is nothing else than a tool for achieving their power-hungry and money-hungry goals, and for the ruled it means renouncing their human dignity, reason, conscience, and slavish submission to those in power. ... Patriotism is slavery.” —Leo Tolstoy, in his pamphlet Christianity and Patriotism
To tell you the truth I fucking hate Patriotism. I think it is a stupid concept. And I will explain why, and probably end up being called a "terrorist."
Patriotism implies that citizens of a country owe a greater allegiance to each other, and to their own country than to foreigners and foreign countries. Patriotism assumes that our globe is divided into little spots, each one surrounded by an "iron gate". Personally I have a hard time going along with these concepts. The globe is round, everyone is created equal, and I love my brothers and sisters in Paris, Moscow, Kuala Lumpur, or wherever, as much as my brothers and sisters down the street. I don't have a stronger allegiance to the guy down the street, or to my country, than my allegiance to foreigners and foriegn countries. Why? Because I am not patriotic. My moral duties apply EQUALLY to all members of the world.
I think Patriotism robs the intellectual faculty necessary to judge the morality and to have a fact-based decision of policies. Throughout history, many men have been unjustly slain by a patriot who is fighting for what he has been told is the moral and right way, rather than using morals and logic developed on his own accord. Most "patriots" will follow their country or brothers and sisters through any decision, even decisions which he may find immoral under normal conditions (without patriotism).
Patriotism is also dangerous because politicians use it to appeal to the emotions of those who are patriotic. (See George W. Bush) So instead of making fact-based decisions and having reasoned views on policies, we blindly believe what we are told because to do otherwise would be "unpatriotic" or even **gasp** "treason."
So I'm not a good writer, and these are kind of loosely connected thoughts, but I just thought I would throw this out there and see if I get crucified.
“Patriotism ... for rulers is nothing else than a tool for achieving their power-hungry and money-hungry goals, and for the ruled it means renouncing their human dignity, reason, conscience, and slavish submission to those in power. ... Patriotism is slavery.” —Leo Tolstoy, in his pamphlet Christianity and Patriotism
Everything not forbidden is compulsory and eveything not compulsory is forbidden. You are free... free to do what the government says you can do.
Post edited by Unknown User on
0
Comments
Now, were it not for our brave and fearless military, the lifestyle that I enjoy and sometimes take for granted would cease to exist. And other than for the guaranteed paycheck and other benefits, the men women who serve in that military do so because they want to fulfill their patriotic obligation to their fellow countrymen. So, regardless of how hypocritical the concept of patriotism may appear within the context of a so-called "free" society, I tend to not complain too much about it for the reason that I could drive a hour and half south of me and see a way of life that is much, much worse. I am, of course, referring to Mexico, where a healthy dose of patriotism might actually do that country some good.
http://forums.pearljam.com/showthread.php?t=272825
and I love my country
because my country
is all I know
I wanna be with my family
people who understand me
I got no place left to go
i agree with you here. i don't care about you anymore than someone from south africa or japan or anywhere. and patriotism allows us to turn our backs on other countries who need our help. we know there are people dying from civil wars, starvation, aids, etc. in other countries, but b/c here in america we have our own problems, we don't lose sleep over what is happening outside our borders. and that's sad to me.
i think maybe patriotism starts from how natural it is for people of a certain country to have a special bond with their fellow citizens. americans grow up with the same government and traditions and general way of life (though it does differ from place to place, and home to home) that only other americans know. it's the same for any country. i don't know where i'm going with this, just random thoughts i guess
keep in mind the original idea for patriotism is Nationalism which is directly linked to Romanticism. These ideas influence the idea of 'One' ....one love...one country...one people... and I think they failed to understand...you can never achieve this romantic idea without the entire globe being 'One' ...so nationalism at a smaller scale like.. Countries, cities... SUCKS!
unless we can find a way to spread it to the world
weird how these thoughts come back around... so long ago is still so much like today
R.i.p. My Dad - May 28, 2007
R.i.p. Black Tail (cat) - Sept. 20, 2008
Thanks, JaneNY. To me my thoughts are kind of mumbled and confused because I am making the transition from being a good ol' republican to... something else, I'm not sure yet (right now I'd say I'm a raging socialist.) This happened for a plethora of reasons, starting with George W, the realization that the republican party has become something very different versus what it is supposed to be, a couple of Orwell and Huxley books, among others.
Anyways, thanks for the responses. Peace.
dude..you check out something by immanuel kant...or john locke