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"independent, unilateral reporting, free of official structures, is crucial"
Truthmonger
Posts: 559
Terry Lloyd, the British reporter for ITN, wasn't big on journalistic interference. While the American media was lapping up Centcom's drivel, Lloyd was out trying to get the stories. At least he was until U.S. Marines murdered him in 2003. Now an investigation by British authorities suggests he was criminally killed. And his widow has called her husband's death "despicable and deliberate".
Personally, I was always amazed at the sanitized version of events given about Iraq by the U.S. media, as compared to the various medias from places like the UK, Canada etc. which frequently gave very different accounts, and who weren't so beholden to the idea of Centcom or embedded reporting.
http://media.guardian.co.uk/site/story/0,,1921611,00.html
http://www.rawstory.com/showarticle.php?src=http%3A%2F%2Fapnews.myway.com%2Farticle%2F20061013%2FD8KNNIMG0.html
Personally, I was always amazed at the sanitized version of events given about Iraq by the U.S. media, as compared to the various medias from places like the UK, Canada etc. which frequently gave very different accounts, and who weren't so beholden to the idea of Centcom or embedded reporting.
http://media.guardian.co.uk/site/story/0,,1921611,00.html
http://www.rawstory.com/showarticle.php?src=http%3A%2F%2Fapnews.myway.com%2Farticle%2F20061013%2FD8KNNIMG0.html
Post edited by Unknown User on
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It sounds like he was caught in a crossfire, and had actually been shot in the back first by Iraqis. A very tragic and unfortunate event either way.
Peoples' use of terms leaves something to be desired ... Did the Marines go "Limey bastard!", and then kill him execution-style, or was it deliberate fire at the wrong target? Either is "murder", but one is a little more difficult to justify than the other.
Exactly. If they deliberately targetted a civilian bus and blew it up with tank fire, they should absolutely be held accountable. Truthmonger made it sound like the Marines knew who he was and fired a tank at him to shut him up. I think that's a bit on the fantastical side, but we get that here sometimes.
From what I just read, it sounds like U.S. tanks did knowingly fire on a civilian bus that was carrying this guy. I don't imagine they knew who exactly was in the bus, though. So yes ... These men should be tried for firing on civilians. But the bit about silencing journalists on purpose is a stretch.
The U.S. military didn't like independents b/c they couldn't control what they wrote/reported. Many stories about aberrant/repugnant U.S. behavior broke only b/c independent sources were able to report what actually happened - otherwise they would have been swept under the rug. The U.S. repeatedly stated it didn't want independents there, and that it would not guarantee their safety (wink, wink).
Did they know Lloyd was there ? I don't know, but the BBC article(other thread) seems to suggest that the U.S. was responsible for both shootings of him. One other article I read stated that Lloyd and the people he was with were clearly marked as ITN workers. If it wasn't intentional than it was still a flagrant misuse of power.
would you want someone following you around all day with a camera reporting it to the world? probably not. does that mean you would purposely kill them? probably not.
how can the US guarantee their safety in a war zone? isnt that called an oxy-moron.
You make some good points, but in all honesty, "independent" journalists are risking their lives in a big way. I respect their courage and dedication, but these guys are more likely to get killed doing what they do, and when someone does die, I am not sure that the best or most appropriate response should be to accuse U.S. troops of deliberate targeted killings. By all means, find the men responsible, question them, and charge them if appropriate.
The coroner has called it a criminal killing, and wants the prosecution to bring charges. Thats not good. He wouldn't do so unless he felt it was of a criminal nature.
Secondly, even when it was abundantly clear who Lloyd et al were, and that they posed absolutely no threat to the U.S. soldiers, those very same soldiers then went ahead and engaged in another round of shots at the vehicles in which Lloyd lay. Why would they do that ? And as one article stated, an excuse of defense can be ruled out.
Also, what about the comments made by his wife and daughter ? These are 2 people that probably know as much as anybody wrt what happened. His wife said it was a "vengeful" act......but to avenge what ? Was there some reason for the shooting ? And his daughter said it was basically murder. Her words, not mine.
The ruling of a coroner in the UK about the killing during a war in Iraq. May not be the best person to make that ruling. Hopefully we'll see further investigation and bring those responsible for any wrongdoing to justice.
They probably weren't firing at the bus in self-defense, but it sounds like there was crossfire between the Iraqis and the US forces. He was shot in the back by an Iraqi before the Marine fired from the Tank.
I'm sorry for their loss. But I'd hardly call them the most knowledgeable sources. Surely, and understandably, they're approaching this very emotionally, and using words to that effect.
"The NUJ general secretary, Jeremy Dear, said: "We welcome the coroner's decision to report his finding to the attorney general and the DPP and believe they should immediately commence proceedings to bring the perpetrators of what is nothing short of a war crime, to justice.
"The killing of journalists with impunity must never, ever go unpunished. Any attempt to silence journalists in this way must never succeed.
"We would also like to again express our deepest sympathy to the family for their tragic loss. The inquest verdict has confirmed what we always suspected: that Terry's death was not an accident in the theatre of war but a callous act of murder."