Was it a scare tactic or something more?

melodious

I don't think I would be too happy if this happened in a classroom in which my child is in attendance.

Dallas science teacher, trying to solve theft, fingerprints students


Was it a scare tactic or something more?

A Dallas ISD teacher is under investigation for reportedly making students give their fingerprints to help solve a crime.
CSI DISD: Students fingerprinted by teacher


A science teacher at Comstock Middle School is accused of trying to use a little bit of science to track down her missing belongings.

"She said some of the students took her cell phone and credit cards but she didn't know who it was. She told us she was going to fingerprint us," said student Savannah Seal.

Savannah says the entire 7th grade class was told to fill out background check forms with their names, addresses and parent information.

Then the teacher went around with an ink pad and had students fingerprint the bottom of the form.

"She said 'I'm going to find out who did this and press charges against who did it,'" Savannah said.

"There's no way that they should go through a situation like that," said parent Lionel Hayden.

It upset Mr. Hayden to hear his daughter was treated like a criminal.

"I think they stepped over their boundaries. A teacher was doing too much. She's there to teach. She's not there to be a detective," he said.

DISD detectives are now involved.

They have the student fingerprints, and the teacher has reportedly been disciplined, as heard in this voicemail left for the family: "The principal, head principal was notified and appropriate actions were taken administratively against the teacher," an officer said.

The Haydens say administrators told them it was a scare tactic gone wrong.


http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/dn/latestnews/stories/100808dnmetDallas.ecb6893a.html

BetterThanYou

i wouldn't be too happy if one of my kids told me this happened in one of their classes.

Heineken Helen

BetterThanYou wrote:

i wouldn't be too happy if one of my kids told me this happened in one of their classes.

I would raise hell... so now the police have the fingerprints and background checks?? :eek: shouldn't they simply have been destroyed? :eek:

Gonzo1977

This sounds like a bad episode of 21 Jump Street.

inmytree

It's hard to say...

I think I'm ok with the teachers actions...she taught kids about possible consequences of stealing...

Heineken Helen

inmytree wrote:

It's hard to say...

I think I'm ok with the teachers actions...she taught kids about possible consequences of stealing...

Taking their fingerprints which were then confiscated by the cops is a HUGE no no.

My friend went nuts one time... her little sister went on a school tour of a police station (woo lol) and they took their prints :eek:

You don't mess with shit like this.

inmytree

Heineken Helen wrote:

Taking their fingerprints which were then confiscated by the cops is a HUGE no no.

My friend went nuts one time... her little sister went on a school tour of a police station (woo lol) and they took their prints :eek:

You don't mess with shit like this.

let's agree to disagree...

Heineken Helen

inmytree wrote:

let's agree to disagree...

Not on this one I've issues with having to give my prints in order to get through immigration in the states... so if my kid gave her prints cos her teachers mobile phone went missing :eek: I've BIG issues!

Anon

EXCLUSIVE: FINGERPRINT SCANDAL OF 700,000 KIDS
By Bob Roberts, Deputy Political Editor 3/07/2006

EXCLUSIVE Schools storing data triggers fears

FURY erupted yesterday after it emerged an estimated 700,000 children are being fingerprinted at school.

Systems in 3,500 primary school libraries allow pupils to take out books by scanning their thumb prints instead of using a card.

But campaigners warn the technology is a massive invasion of privacy and a step towards a "database state".

With an average primary school size of 200 pupils, pressure group No2ID says at least 700,000 pupils are regularly having their fingerprints scanned.

And there are fears schools having children's fingerprints could lead to the information being stored on government computers with DNA records and personal details.

It is also seen as "softening up" resistance before people are asked for biometric data such as eye-scans to put on compulsory identity cards.

Phil Booth of No2ID said: "Are we sending our kids to school or to prison? We wouldn't accept fingerprinting for adults without informed consent so it is utterly outrageous that children as young as five are being targeted."

Advertisement - article continues below »


But Andy O'Brien, managing director of Micro Librarian Systems which makes the fingerprint systems, insisted there was nothing sinister about the new scanning technology.

He said: "Ultimately, this is completely optional.

"If parents object because they don't like the use of biometrics their children can still use a library card or pin number.

"But this can make libraries a really cool place to go for children.

"We have never had a single parent object to it, the children love it and it solves the problem of lost library cards."

Other schools are increasingly using fingerprints to allow pupils access to premises or even to get into canteens.
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/tm_objectid=17324161&method=full&siteid=94762&headline=fingerprint-scandal-of-700-000-kids--name_page.html

inmytree

Heineken Helen wrote:

Not on this one I've issues with having to give my prints in order to get through immigration in the states... so if my kid gave her prints cos her teachers mobile phone went missing :eek: I've BIG issues!

fine, let's disagree to disagree....

Heineken Helen

wow that's just sad :( and as long as people continue to be ok with it... it WILL just get worse. We need to speak out about personal rights being violated all the time... or they'll take our silence as a go-ahead! The kids like it cos it's cool... what the fuck????????? :mad:

Heineken Helen

inmytree wrote:

fine, let's disagree to disagree....

ok... but do ya wanna elaborate on why you think you're ok with this? If the teacher had spanked each of them... it would be MUCH less potentially disastrous than what the teacher actually did!

inmytree

Heineken Helen wrote:

wow that's just sad :( and as long as people continue to be ok with it... it WILL just get worse. We need to speak out about personal rights being violated all the time... or they'll take our silence as a go-ahead! The kids like it cos it's cool... what the fuck????????? :mad:

edit

inmytree

Heineken Helen wrote:

ok... but do ya wanna elaborate on why you think you're ok with this? If the teacher had spanked each of them... it would be MUCH less potentially disastrous than what the teacher actually did!

I already did: I think I'm ok with the teachers actions...she taught kids about possible consequences of stealing...

and spanking is not ok...and would be more harmful than the finger printing...

let's see...make kids put there fingers in ink or hit them....

gosh, that's a toughie....

Heineken Helen

inmytree wrote:

I already did: I think I'm ok with the teachers actions...she taught kids about possible consequences of stealing...

and spanking is not ok...and would be more harmful than the finger printing...

let's see...make kids put there fingers in ink or hit them....

gosh, that's a toughie....

The spanking would have no lasting effects... fuck KNOWS when these fingerprints could come back to bite their ass. The cops haven't destroyed them? What have they done with them?

There are plenty of ways to teach kids consequences of their actions... taking their fingerprints hardly seems like a reasonable way to do it... the kids probably thought it was cool. Now if she had a cop come into the classroom and start questioning them or telling them the consequences of stealing or something... or call them all to the principals office... there are PLENTY of ways.

inmytree

Heineken Helen wrote:

The spanking would have no lasting effects... fuck KNOWS when these fingerprints could come back to bite their ass. The cops haven't destroyed them? What have they done with them?

There are plenty of ways to teach kids consequences of their actions... taking their fingerprints hardly seems like a reasonable way to do it... the kids probably thought it was cool. Now if she had a cop come into the classroom and start questioning them or telling them the consequences of stealing or something... or call them all to the principals office... there are PLENTY of ways.

ok, I guess we're back to agreeing to disagree...or disagreeing to disagree, I can't keep up...

melodious

I know, if my child were in that classroom, I would raise a bit of caine...It's wrong and like I told the person who posted this, she should have realized she was dealing with middle-schoolers. She should have kept her personal items safely locked away in a cabinet or desk...and I feel she is trying to play victim to her own carelessness...

She should have never taken "an investigation" into her own hands..Wow..arrrogant...She should have contacted her administrators
and followed legal protocol under that school's policy.

Thanks for responding...

Good day, to you Jammers...
Sending wishes for prosperity and abundance..

and peace....

BetterThanYou

inmytree wrote:

I already did: I think I'm ok with the teachers actions...she taught kids about possible consequences of stealing....

i don't know for sure, but i'm willing to bet that's not what she was hired to do. hey, how about this: alert the authorities to deal with it. or even better: call your fucking cell phone and when you hear it ring....whoomp! there it is.

Kel Varnsen

What exactly would taking these fingerprints prove? I mean unless one of the kids broke into the teacher's house or car and stole the stuff fingerprints won't prove anything. For example say this stuff was stolen off of her desk, you would expect a bunch of kids to have touched the teachers desk and left their fingerprints so matching fingerprints their wouldn't prove theft. Plus you need a computer and/or at least some high level training to match fingerprints (especially since most prints are partial prints), and I highly doubt that Dallas PD is going to offer up their services on the case of the stolen cell phone and credit card.

inmytree

BetterThanYou wrote:

whoomp! there it is.

damn...kickin' it old school....straight out of 1993...

boy eeee....!!!

BetterThanYou

inmytree wrote:

damn...kickin' it old school....straight out of 1993...

boy eeee....!!!

my "moments" are few and far between.

Skitch Patterson

I am not a fan of the invasion of privacy aspect as the Police took it.

However, the teacher was teaching a lesson. A lesson about crime and such. Give a teacher a right to teach their class as they see fit. It doesnt harm anyone.


Again, let me say i am not a fan of the fact these childrens information was run through the system... but, how does it actually HURT anything that their information is now on file? ITS WORSE THAN A SPANKING?!!!! how? Really? Overdramatic much?

inmytree

Skitch Patterson wrote:

I am not a fan of the invasion of privacy aspect as the Police took it.

However, the teacher was teaching a lesson. A lesson about crime and such. Give a teacher a right to teach their class as they see fit. It doesnt harm anyone.


Again, let me say i am not a fan of the fact these childrens information was run through the system... but, how does it actually HURT anything that their information is now on file? ITS WORSE THAN A SPANKING?!!!! how? Really? Overdramatic much?

well said...

Heineken Helen

Skitch Patterson wrote:

Again, let me say i am not a fan of the fact these childrens information was run through the system... but, how does it actually HURT anything that their information is now on file? ITS WORSE THAN A SPANKING?!!!! how? Really? Overdramatic much?

:eek: Are you serious? You think a spanking would have bigger and longer term implications than having fingerprints of KIDS put on file for NO reason?????? Yep, You just keep letting them do this and see where we end up don't say you weren't warned... but hey... it's the whole boiling frog thing... you won't even notice!

Skitch Patterson

Heineken Helen wrote:

:eek: Are you serious? You think a spanking would have bigger and longer term implications than having fingerprints of KIDS put on file for NO reason?????? Yep, You just keep letting them do this and see where we end up don't say you weren't warned... but hey... it's the whole boiling frog thing... you won't even notice!

Please tell me a possible (at first ill even go for far fetched) ramification of having a fingerprint on file?

melodious

Hi skitch:

I sort of think there might still possibly be people out there who live under the wire.

Besides, aren't student records supposed to be private unless the student is involved in a crime. Certainly one or a couple of her students were involved in this heist, but what about the kids who weren't. I mean it seems to me a viewpoint that supports this action is indoctrinating children to accept actions that may be against what he/she may stand for as an adult.

And yes, I know if a subpeona is involved, student records become public knowledge.

If any student is to be put in an investigation, it should be with cause, not just because that student was among a group of people at the wrong time and place. I continue to feel this teacher was wrong and her rush to judgement was also wrong.

She should have had support from her board of directors and then she should have sent home parental permission slips as they do for any activities these days...

And what if one of the students has an allergic reaction to the ink or some other unforeseen event would occur...

When a student's locker is searched, it's not because of a random whim but more so because a board of directors has passed a measure...She was simply wrong.

melodious

Dear Gary,

I'd like to share an experience I had with my little son. He is seven years old (in 2nd grade) and has always loved math. But a couple of weeks ago he somehow lost his ability to do even simple calculations. I was puzzled and had no explanation. After a while I had the idea to ask him if his teacher had said anything. It turned out that she got angry with him one day and said "Nobody could do worse at math than you do".

Obviously, he got kind of hypnotized by that statement and fulfilled the "command". We tapped with the teacher's sentence for about 5 minutes. All blocks were gone immediately. Now at school, he taps the karate chop point from time to time whispering: "I'm super and I'll show her!" (his own words). It works. No more problems!

Warm regards,

Angelika Rinderle-Tessa

dontloseyourheat

I think the teacher overstepped her boundaries but i don't see why people are getting so upset about the fingerprints.

Many parents have their kids fingerprinted in case anything ever happens to the child.
And the only way the prints would be used against the child is if he/she commits a crime. If someone stole your stuff, wouldn't you appreciate it if the cops could determine who did it by matching fingerprints?

Commy

dontloseyourheat wrote:

I think the teacher overstepped her boundaries but i don't see why people are getting so upset about the fingerprints.

Many parents have their kids fingerprinted in case anything ever happens to the child.
And the only way the prints would be used against the child is if he/she commits a crime. If someone stole your stuff, wouldn't you appreciate it if the cops could determine who did it by matching fingerprints?

what if you were an enemy of someone in power, and they had your prints on file? they could use them for whatever purposes they wanted...


to give them things like this requires trust, and I do not trust politicians, or the authorities.

Heineken Helen

Commy wrote:

what if you were an enemy of someone in power, and they had your prints on file? they could use them for whatever purposes they wanted...


to give them things like this requires trust, and I do not trust politicians, or the authorities.

I think people who need to ask the question... are never gonna get it :( which is where the problem lies. They'll keep asking 'what's the problem unless you do something wrong'. The problem should be that they shouldn't HAVE any of your personal details UNLESS you do something wrong. There are endless ramifications of what can be done. It may be hard to understand living in countries like we do... but the fact is nobody knows who is going to be in charge in ten years time or what's going to have happened in the meantime to change things and how countries are run. Once they have your details, you can't take them back :eek: There ARE countries in the world where your fingerprint alone could probably have you put to death for something you didn't do. And who knows if/when governments are going to share their files with other countries. If you VISIT another country now after being to the US... this country should have your details on file and the INDIVIDUALS dealing with it can do whatever the hell they want with it. That's ONE small issue.

BetterThanYou

melodious wrote:

Dear Gary,

I'd like to share an experience I had with my little son. He is seven years old (in 2nd grade) and has always loved math. But a couple of weeks ago he somehow lost his ability to do even simple calculations. I was puzzled and had no explanation. After a while I had the idea to ask him if his teacher had said anything. It turned out that she got angry with him one day and said "Nobody could do worse at math than you do".

Obviously, he got kind of hypnotized by that statement and fulfilled the "command". We tapped with the teacher's sentence for about 5 minutes. All blocks were gone immediately. Now at school, he taps the karate chop point from time to time whispering: "I'm super and I'll show her!" (his own words). It works. No more problems!

Warm regards,

Angelika Rinderle-Tessa

nice teacher your son has. reminds me of my biology teacher in 10th grade. she said at the beginning of the year "don't be afraid to ask questions. there are no stupid questions." pretty generic teacher statement, i know. but about a quarter of the way through the year, i asked a question (can't remember what it pertained to) that she didn't have an answer for. 10 minutes later i asked a similar question and her reply was "i don't know! why do you keep asking me these stupid questions?!" she was extremely agitated. i went on to not ask anymore questions in that class, and ended up failing. i don't think it was because of that exchange that i failed, i was just lazy. but it really pissed me off that when i tried to show motivation, she comes back to me with a response like that.

ok, didn't mean to derail. back on topic: someone said they didn't see the big deal because parents get their kids fingerprinted in case of emergencies. key point: the parents had it done, not a teacher without parental consent.

i'm wondering if the people that don't see a problem with this would have the same attitude if an entire group protesting at a convention were taken in for fingerprinting and questioning because someone in the center of the group threw a rock at a police officer.