China...submarines....stalking US ships....ah, nvrmind........IRAQ! 9/11! BUSH!

truroute

http://www.upi.com/NewsTrack/view.php?StoryID=20061113-010013-1863r


Report: Chinese sub tailed U.S. ships
WASHINGTON, Nov. 13 (UPI) -- A Chinese submarine coming within firing range of U.S. ships before detection indicates China is preparing for conflict with the United States, a report said.

Defense officials said the Song-class diesel-powered attack submarine tailed the USS Kitty Hawk undetected, surfacing within five miles of the aircraft carrier Oct. 26 before being spotted during surveillance flights, the Washington Times said.

The sub reportedly followed the aircraft carrier battle group, surfacing within range of its missiles and torpedoes.

The disclosure came as Adm. Gary Roughead, commander of the U.S. Pacific fleet, visited China to meet senior Chinese military leaders, the Times said. Adm. William J. Fallon, commander of U.S. Pacific forces, is undertaking a military exchange program with China designed to improve relations between the two nation's militaries.

Critics said China denied U.S. military visitors access to key facilities while Chinese military visitors have been invited to U.S. military exercises and sensitive facilities.

"This is a harbinger of a stronger Chinese reaction to America's military presence in East Asia," Richard Fisher, a Chinese military specialist with the International Assessment and Strategy Center, told the Times.

farfromglorified

And where does US spying on China fit into this picture? Are we also preparing for war on China?

truroute

more interesting info.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_Chinese_espionage_against_the_U.S.

farfromglorified

truroute wrote:

more interesting info.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_Chinese_espionage_against_the_U.S.

There's actually some interesting stuff in there. Not sure why any of this is a big deal, but interesting nonetheless.

flywallyfly

U.S. submarines do this all the time with other nations' navies. We also fly surveillance planes off their coasts as well -- remember when our plane collided with the Chinese MIG in 2001 (?) and had to land at a Chinese base?

fragileblake

isn't exporting cheap shit to us a huge part of china's economy? I think theres too much codependence between us to start an armed conflict

gabers

Interesting but not worthy of front page news. Now if they take a shot that's something else.

Vedderlution_Baby

gabers wrote:

Interesting but not worthy of front page news. Now if they take a shot that's something else.

If a war broke out....would we be completely fucked? Or would the nukes save us (God I fucking hate nukes)

trappedinmyradio

Vedderlution_Baby! wrote:

If a war broke out....would we be completely fucked? Or would the nukes save us (God I fucking hate nukes)

if a war broke out between china and the u.s., the question would not be "would the nukes save us?" the question would be...where can we go to avoid fallout...assuming that the world wasn't demolished completely.

Vedderlution_Baby

trappedinmyradio wrote:

if a war broke out between china and the u.s., the question would not be "would the nukes save us?" the question would be...where can we go to avoid fallout...assuming that the world wasn't demolished completely.

Yea. I thought so.

jlew24asu

since when is china an enemy of the US?

jlew24asu

cooler heads will prevail in this. no one wants war with china.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20061114/pl_nm/defence_usa_china_dc


I still dont understand the title of this thread

Cosmo

I hope China doesn't unilaterally decide that America needs a regime change and intends to 'Spread Maoist Communism' to the U.S.
We would probably get electronic junk for really cheap prices... but, I definately think it would suck ass.

trappedinmyradio

Cosmo wrote:

I hope China doesn't unilaterally decide that America needs a regime change and intends to 'Spread Maoist Communism' to the U.S.
We would probably get electronic junk for really cheap prices... but, I definately think it would suck ass.

i have been a fan of maoist communism when administered appropriately. i, hereby, am a champion...please spare me.

Cosmo

trappedinmyradio wrote:

i have been a fan of maoist communism when administered appropriately. i, hereby, am a champion...please spare me.

...
I guess there no complaining as long as we can get iPods for $1.99.
I just hope them Chinese fuckers don't include Bird flu as part of the deal.

Staceb10

jlew24asu wrote:

I still dont understand the title of this thread

I think its in reference to the fact that nothing is discussed on this board other than Bush, 9/11 and Iraq.. even in threads that aren't about any of those subjects. I could be wrong though.

jlew24asu

Staceb10 wrote:

I think its in reference to the fact that nothing is discussed on this board other than Bush, 9/11 and Iraq.. even in threads that aren't about any of those subjects. I could be wrong though.

ah ok. in that case he/she is right. although I dont think this china thing is a big deal

catefrances

jlew24asu wrote:

since when is china an enemy of the US?

since the minute washington decides so.(not saying that's the case presently with china though) just like it does with other 'friends' when their usefulness wears thin enough to spin it.
i find it amusing that the submarine got so close. great detection skills there sailors.

jlew24asu

catefrances wrote:

since the minute washington decides so.(not saying that's the case presently with china though) just like it does with other 'friends' when their usefulness wears thin enough to spin it.
i find it amusing that the submarine got so close. great detection skills there sailors.

ok well, like you mentioned, thats not the case. and 5 miles away isnt all that close. its a big ocean.

Cosmo

jlew24asu wrote:

ok well, like you mentioned, thats not the case. and 5 miles away isnt all that close. its a big ocean.

...
5 miles in the range of an anti-ship missile or torpedo is seconds. Large Naval ships cannot stop or turn on a dime.
I'm just surprized that our Navy was unable to detect a diesel powered sub... that is the basic rule of fleet defense. It should have been detected well outside its striking range. Someone isn't doing their job very well out there.

catefrances

jlew24asu wrote:

ok well, like you mentioned, thats not the case. and 5 miles away isnt all that close. its a big ocean.

then what's the problem?

Scratchin a Letter

war with China would be the end of the USA. however stupid they have been, i am certain the administration would do everything in its power to prevent something like this.

jlew24asu

Scratchin a Letter wrote:

war with China would be the end of the USA. however stupid they have been, i am certain the administration would do everything in its power to prevent something like this.

end of the USA? what are you nuts?

that is not the reason we wouldnt go to war with china. the reason is simply. we arent enemies.

trappedinmyradio

jlew24asu wrote:

end of the USA? what are you nuts?

that is not the reason we wouldnt go to war with china. the reason is simply. we arent enemies.

why are the u.s. and china not enemies? because no one would ever win in that situation.

jlew24asu

trappedinmyradio wrote:

why are the u.s. and china not enemies? because no one would ever win in that situation.

ok you want to use that as a reason, ok. I agree.

there are many other more obvious reasons.

lets try, no threat to each other. or very good business partners.

Commy

jlew24asu wrote:

ok you want to use that as a reason, ok. I agree.

there are many other more obvious reasons.

lets try, no threat to each other. or very good business partners.

In America's quest for global dominance any country that doesn't allow
US corporations access to their cheap labor and plentiful resources is a potential enemy. china seems to be towing the line...

catefrances

Commy wrote:

In America's quest for global dominance any country that doesn't allow
US corporations access to their cheap labor and plentiful resources is a potential enemy. china seems to be towing the line...

and in all honesty washington doesn't particularly want to piss off beijing. the size of the chinese market is what allows them to invade tibet and no one say anything about it. washington understands the potential for china to become a huge economic power at their expense.

Pearl Jam and toast

China needs us and we need them. Both of us are screwed without the other at the moment.

No worries.

Interesting though.

Scratchin a Letter

Commy wrote:

In America's quest for global dominance any country that doesn't allow
US corporations access to their cheap labor and plentiful resources is a potential enemy. china seems to be towing the line...

That's a good point.

But China has abused human rights past and present. The regulations that are imposed on its citizens are unfair, it contributes a high percent of carbon emissions and not to mention the-shock horror-communist regime.... why would the supposed do-gooders the USA allow all this? Because they have no choice.

There are two countries on this world that the USA would stand no chance against in a war. China is one of them.

catefrances

Scratchin a Letter wrote:

That's a good point.

But China has abused human rights past and present. The regulations that are imposed on its citizens are unfair, it contributes a high percent of carbon emissions and not to mention the-shock horror-communist regime.... why would the supposed do-gooders the USA allow all this? Because they have no choice.

There are two countries on this world that the USA would stand no chance against in a war. China is one of them.

who's the other one? and what do you base this opinion on, knowing that in the past a country such as vietnam managed not to be defeated by the USA?

Scratchin a Letter

catefrances wrote:

who's the other one? and what do you base this opinion on, knowing that in the past a country such as vietnam managed not to be defeated by the USA?

I was thinking along the lines of Russia. Of course, there may be others, but as jlew has said I doubt any one of them would initiate a war on the USA.

Vietnam is a dodgy issue. Whilst the US did not defeat them, they did not defeat the USA. It were fought in 'nam only, defeating the objectives of, rather than the nation that attacked it.