U.S. Weapons of Mass Destruction

surferdude

El_Kabong wrote:

he needs to "education himself"

But I is a univercity graduate. I am well educationed. Got the papaers to proof it.

El_Kabong

my2hands wrote:

thank you

no problem. the last article is a little long, the part i used as a reference for was...and he was a Master Sergeant in the special forces, taught military science and doctrine, tactics instructor at the Jungle Operations Training Center in Panama, and taught Military Science at West Point....



I have no idea why people aren't asking some very specific questions about the actions of Bush and company on the day of the attacks. Follow along:

Four planes get hijacked and deviate from their flight plans, all the while on FAA radar. The planes are all hijacked between 7:45 and 8:10 AM Eastern Daylight Time.

Who is notified?

This is an event already that is unprecedented. But the President is not notified and going to a Florida elementary school to hear children read.

By around 8:15 AM, it should be very apparent that something is terribly wrong. The President is glad-handing teachers.

By 8:45, when American Airlines Flight 11 crashes into the World Trade Center, Bush is settling in with children for his photo ops at Booker Elementary. Four planes have obviously been hijacked simultaneously, an event never before seen in history, and one has just dived into the worlds best know twin towers, and still no one notifies the nominal Commander in Chief.

No one has apparently scrambled any Air Force interceptors either.

At 9:03, United Flight 175 crashes into the remaining World Trade Center building. At 9:05, Andrew Card, the Presidential Chief of Staff whispers to George W. Bush. Bush "briefly turns somber" according to reporters.

Does he cancel the school visit and convene an emergency meeting? No.

He resumes listening to second graders read about a little girl's pet fucking goat, and continues this banality even as American Airlines Flight 77 conducts an unscheduled point turn over Ohio and heads in the direction of Washington DC.

Has he instructed Chief of Staff Card to scramble the Air Force? No.

An excruciating 25 minutes later, he finally deigns to give a public statement telling the United States what they already have figured out; that there's been an attack by hijacked planes on the World Trade Center.

There's a hijacked plane bee-lining to Washington, but has the Air Force been scrambled to defend anything yet? No.

At 9:30, when he makes his announcement, American Flight 77 is still ten minutes from its target, the Pentagon.

The Administration will later claim they had no way of knowing that the Pentagon might be a target, and that they thought Flight 77 was headed to the White House, but the fact is that the plane has already flown South and past the White House no-fly zone, and is in fact tearing through the sky at over 400 nauts.

At 9:35, this plane conducts another turn, 360 degrees over the Pentagon, all the while being tracked by radar, and the Pentagon is not evacuated, and there are still no fast-movers from the Air Force in the sky over Alexandria and DC.

Now, the real kicker. A pilot they want us to believe was trained at a Florida puddle-jumper school for Piper Cubs and Cessnas, conducts a well-controlled downward spiral, descending the last 7,000 feet in two-and-a-half minutes, brings the plane in so low and flat that it clips the electrical wires across the street from the Pentagon, and flies it with pinpoint accuracy into the side of this building at 460 nauts.

When the theory about learning to fly this well at the puddle-jumper school began to lose ground, it was added that they received further training on a flight simulator.

This is like saying you prepared your teenager for her first drive on I-40 at rush hour by buying her a video driving game. It's horse shit!

There is a story being constructed about these events. My crystal ball is not working today, so I can't say why.

But at the least, this so-called Commander-in-Chief and his staff that we are all supposed to follow blindly into some ill-defined war on terrorism is criminally negligent or unspeakably stupid. And at the worst, if more is known or was known, and there is an effort to conceal the facts, there is a criminal conspiracy going on.

Certainly, the Bush de facto administration was facing a confluence of crises from which they were temporarily rescued by this event. Whether they played a sinister role or not, there is little doubt that they have at the very least opportunistically pounced on this attack to overcome their lack of legitimacy, to shift the blame for the encroaching recession from capitalism to the September 11th terror attack, to legitimize their pre-existing foreign policy agenda, and to establish and consolidate repressive measures domestically and silence dissent. In many ways, September 11th pulled the Bush cookies out of the fire.

And given them the green light to begin constructing a long-term scenario within which to establish fascistic control measures at home and abroad as a citadel for the ruling class in the catastrophic conjuncture that we are entering based on the end of oil.
......

no reason for it to take so long for a response. there should've been a reaction before the first plane hit, let alone 3

my2hands

El_Kabong wrote:

no reason for it to take so long for a response. there should've been a reaction before the first plane hit, let alone 3

i agree with that

NCfan

my2hands wrote:

i agree with that

You guys don't even attempt to hide your contempt for the US. This thread didn't even have shit to do with 911, but since you couldn't make your point about the nukes used on Japan, you have to resort to another conspiracy theory.

I'll ask you again to answer my two previous questions.

my2hands

El_Kabong wrote:

he needs to "education himself"

not so quick my friend


i think the atomic attacks on japan are quite horrendous in the long history of world atrocities...

it wasnt a long drawn out genocide, it was quite quick and final... 2 cities gone in almost an instant

it was instant world news...reaching far corners of the globe in hours (again instant)

and it was cheered by the masses, as if their team had just scored the winning touchdown in the superbowl

and most importantly, it ushered in the most dangerous times of this planets history... the nuclear/atomic age... which is quite frankly the greatest threat to human survival we have ever faced, creating a weapons race and a nuclear buildup that can only be defined as psychotic and self destructive... so unlike a massive genocide, it actually has lead to the possible future extinction of the human race as we know it, instead of a particular race, or religious group (etc.)

my2hands

NCfan wrote:

You guys don't even attempt to hide your contempt for the US. This thread didn't even have shit to do with 911, but since you couldn't make your point about the nukes used on Japan, you have to resort to another conspiracy theory.

I'll ask you again to answer my two previous questions.

having a objective view of the world and its events does not equal contempt for a particular country... just call it how i see it?

ok, what are the 2 questions

ps... i hijacked my own thread, and apologized for it

so back to japan and nuclear/atomic weapons

NCfan

my2hands wrote:

not so quick my friend


i think the atomic attacks on japan are quite horrendous in the long history of world atrocities...

it wasnt a long drawn out genocide, it was quite quick and final... 2 cities gone in almost an instant

it was instant world news...reaching far corners of the globe in hours (again instant)

and it was cheered by the masses, as if their team had just scored the winning touchdown in the superbowl

and most importantly, it ushered in the most dangerous times of this planets history... the nuclear/atomic age... which is quite frankly the greatest threat to human survival we have ever faced, creating a weapons race and a nuclear buildup that can only be defined as psychotic and self destructive... so unlike a massive genocide, it actually has lead to the possible future extinction of the human race as we know it, instead of a particular race, or religious group (etc.)

Can you imagine the atrocities that would have been commited had the US been forced to invade main land Japan????? Can you even consider that in your biased analysis?

Besides, what happened in Japan is, in essence, what needs to happen in the Middle East - extremist need to be anhialated and humiliated. They need total defeat!

my2hands

NCfan wrote:

Can you imagine the atrocities that would have been commited had the US been forced to invade main land Japan????? Can you even consider that in your biased analysis?

Besides, what happened in Japan is, in essence, what needs to happen in the Middle East - extremist need to be anhialated and humiliated. They need total defeat!

if you have never seen "fog of war" i suggest that you chekc it out...blockbuster usually has a copy...if you really want i will ship you my copy to borrow

there was no need to invade, they were thoroughly defeated and isolated

my2hands

whats the 2 questions chief?

my2hands

argue with dwight eisenhower

"The Japanese were ready to surrender, and it wasn't necessary to hit them with that awful thing" -- General Dwight D. Eisenhower

sourdough

The bomb was used to intimidate the Russians wasn't it? A precurser to the cold war?

EvilToasterElf

NCfan wrote:

I'm sorry that you are so miss-guided.

Your reason that both nukes were dropped is compeltely and utterly false. The reason two nukes were dropped is because Japan didn't surrender after the first one. We waited a full three days for them to surrender, but they did not.

Do you think we would have dropped the second bomb if Japan had surrenedered already? Seriously, I would like you to answer that question.

Wouldn't it be more plausible that if our true intentions were to test the two different types of bombs, that we would have dropped them simultaneously - therefore not taking the risk that Japan might surrender and therefore we could not test the second bomb? Seriously, I would like you to answer that question as well.

What do you mean the nukes were fired at Russia???? It looks as if they were dropped on Japan, but maybe I'm wrong.

And lastly, this one made me laugh.... what do you mean we made unrealistic terms for unconditional surrender? Isn't that an oxymoron or something???

Sorry you are so jaded.

http://www.ncesa.org/html/hiroshima.html

Well here is a pretty thorough document, read it or don't, your opinions obviously aren't going to change my mind, since I've done a lot of reading on it. Being two hours from Hiroshima these days is pretty good motivation.

What I mean when I say the nukes were fired at Russia is that the nukes were completely inconsequential in our war with Japan. The only reason those two cities had any industry left is because we deliberately did not bomb them conventionally. We literally had almost run out of anything resembling a military or industrial target.

Those weapons were fired to show Russia what it would cost them for further incursions into Europe after the fall of the Nazis.

The blockade's and air campaign of the USA made a land invasion not only implausible, but completely unnecessary in any sense. It wasn't the people of Japan who refused to surrender, it was a tiny minority of generals clinging to samurai and bushido codes of honor, who thought honor far outweighed life. The cabinet votes in Japan well before Hiroshima were 12-3 in favor of surrender, but not unanimous.

Japan also clung to the hope, that their quasi-ally in neutrality, Russia could step in and pursuade the USA to let them keep their Emperor. That hope was completely dashed when Russia invaded manchuria.

I'm sorry if my ability to read anything but my tenth grade history text book has made me question the cooker cutter rationale for what amounts to civilian genocide.

But no I am not jaded, because despite those horrific bombings, the USA has done what not many, if any countries have done as successfully since. Take an utterly defeated enemy, forgetting their own hatred for their enemies, and helped shape and build Japan into an industrial miracle. The USA stuck by Japan and now has an economic superpower for an ally in Asia. If Europe had not been so careless at Versailles, maybe World War II could have been avoided completely.

If the allies hadn't left the middle east to run itself in the aftermath of both World Wars maybe we wouldn't have half the problems we have in that region today.

All I'm saying is we should learn from all of these things.

I also notice that you had no response to the small diatribe I wrote about Depleted Uranium. If Hiroshima and Nagasaki, which I will admit, are debatable points to this day, represent a correct decision. What does the 400,000 Nagasaki bombs, or their direct weight in plutonium, fired by the USA and UK since 1992 spell? Necessities for victory - or a constantly shifting smoke, a permanently mobile ground zero, sweeping across the populations of our allies and enemies and causing an endless string of mind blowingly catastrophic fatalities.?

El_Kabong

my2hands wrote:

not so quick my friend


i think the atomic attacks on japan are quite horrendous in the long history of world atrocities...

it wasnt a long drawn out genocide, it was quite quick and final... 2 cities gone in almost an instant

it was instant world news...reaching far corners of the globe in hours (again instant)

and it was cheered by the masses, as if their team had just scored the winning touchdown in the superbowl

and most importantly, it ushered in the most dangerous times of this planets history... the nuclear/atomic age... which is quite frankly the greatest threat to human survival we have ever faced, creating a weapons race and a nuclear buildup that can only be defined as psychotic and self destructive... so unlike a massive genocide, it actually has lead to the possible future extinction of the human race as we know it, instead of a particular race, or religious group (etc.)

it was a joke

my2hands

El_Kabong wrote:

it was a joke

i know