Palin article re environment in The Independent

IamTom

I read this article with horror and despair today.

It's hard to believe that intelligent people still think like this. And then I again need to remember that intelligence does not mean conscious.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/palin-the-real-scandal-920803.html

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We have been too kind to those who are destroying the planet. We have been inexcusably, unforgivably, insanely kind.

Derrick Jensen

gabers

This probably tops the list of reasons why I already fear this woman. Alaskans are the most conservative, gun crazy, pro oil bunch you'll ever see. Seriously, they make Texans look like a bunch of limp wristed, tea sippin' fruitcakes.

IamTom

I don't know about Alaska's inhabitants-the human ones that is.

I do know that this woman is dangerous.

tybird

This means that I won't vote for her or McCain....but I can't vote for Biden either, so hello again...Ralph Nader.

McJuicy

tybird wrote:

This means that I won't vote for her or McCain....but I can't vote for Biden either, so hello again...Ralph Nader.

ahhh, yet another ignorant american

jam_head

she seems mentally unstable

Brain of J.Lo

yikes.

fuck

McJuicy wrote:

ahhh, yet another ignorant american

why is voting for Nader ignorant?

CitizenRick

This woman is insane! She is a dissaster waiting to happen!

Who in their right mind would follow this crazy person?

keeponrockin

Anyone who thinks they're a big man or sportsman because they fly a plane to go shoot an animal really needs to get their head checked.

If you're really a big man, use a bow and arrow, now that I could almost consider a sport. Using a gun from a plan is being a coward.

MattyJoe

Global Warming is a MYTH. Maybe you guys think that makes me seem stupid and uninformed, but there is no evidence that Global Warming is a real thing. What the media doesn't tell you is that the South Pole's ice is GROWING, AND that, in documented history, the Arctic Shield has been the largest in the past 30 years than it has in the last 200. The fact that it's now shrinking doesn't mean there's something wrong. It could just be returning to normal.

There were a few scientists who speculated that maybe what they have been observing as an increase in global temperature could be an indication of Global Warming as caused by humans, a theory that had already existed since the 70s, by the way. It was SPECULATION. The media, in their usual sensationalist way, jumped all over it and blew it WAAAY out of proportion. There's no concrete evidence which leads to this conclusion. There was only evidence which lead to assumptions.

Read this:

http://www.nationalcenter.org/KyotoSingerTestimony2000.html

Indian Summer

_outlaw wrote:

why is voting for Nader ignorant?

It's not ignorant, just a wasted vote. Do us a favor and vote for Obama if you are considering Nader, then your vote will mean something.

Restless Soul

OMG, this is an unbelievably horrible horrible horrible woman - a real-life Cruella de Ville! This article has made my blood boil. Who does she think she is deciding the fate of the Alaskan wildlife like that? Oh I forgot, she's the wife of an alaskan oilman surprise surprise.

Oh and a classy move that, bribing the alaskan people with a measly grand each of the oil billions she hopes to get for herself.

I can't believe she wants to take polar bears off the endangered species list and shoot alaskan bears etc! I'd so wish that SHE could be forced to live out in the wild so we could set a bunch of blood-thirsty hunters on HER tail, who'd shoot her on sight. Won't be a big loss to the planet, stupid awful cow.

Stone Is God

CitizenRick wrote:

This woman is insane! She is a dissaster waiting to happen!

Who in their right mind would follow this crazy person?

All the Neo-Con's. They love shit like this.

This woman is whacked. We're all in deep shit if she gets to the White House. She's like a female Cheney.

Brain of J.Lo

keeponrockin wrote:

Anyone who thinks they're a big man or sportsman because they fly a plane to go shoot an animal really needs to get their head checked.

If you're really a big man, use a bow and arrow, now that I could almost consider a sport. Using a gun from a plan is being a coward.

The thought of shooting an animal from a plane gives me chills. I didn't even know that people DO that until this woman's 15 minutes of fame began.

I agree with you on bow hunting...I think it takes real skill, and sort of levels the playing field somehow. I'm not anti-hunting. I love meat. I have a lot of family in MO that hunts. But shooting animals from a plane? That's amazing to me.

Rhinocerous Surprise

Indian Summer wrote:

It's not ignorant, just a wasted vote. Do us a favor and vote for Obama if you are considering Nader, then your vote will mean something.

Actually, voting for Nader has a lot of meaning. And part of that meaning is precisely that it's not a vote for Obama.

Indian Summer

Rhinocerous Surprise wrote:

Actually, voting for Nader has a lot of meaning. And part of that meaning is precisely that it's not a vote for Obama.

Nader is responsible for putting George W. Bush in the White House, if you want to vote for Nader, go ahead, it'll just give McCain a nice new home.

Rhinocerous Surprise

Indian Summer wrote:

Nader is responsible for putting George W. Bush in the White House, if you want to vote for Nader, go ahead, it'll just give McCain a nice new home.

I could have sworn it was the millions of people who *GASP* voted for Bush. Using Nader as a scapegoat everytime the Dems lose is just denial.

Anyway, on-topic: Palin is scary, and even scarier is the fact that she's got very real vote-winning potential.

Indian Summer

Rhinocerous Surprise wrote:

I could have sworn it was the millions of people who *GASP* voted for Bush. Using Nader as a scapegoat everytime the Dems lose is just denial.

Anyway, on-topic: Palin is scary, and even scarier is the fact that she's got very real vote-winning potential.

Gore won the popular vote. If Nader hadn't interfered, he would have stayed in the white house. Independents always pull from the democratic vote. Republicans never give anyone else a chance, they vote red no matter the candidate (obviously).

fuck

Indian Summer wrote:

Gore won the popular vote. If Nader hadn't interfered, he would have stayed in the white house. Independents always pull from the democratic vote. Republicans never give anyone else a chance, they vote red no matter the candidate (obviously).

if there's anyone ignorant in this thread, it's you. Clearly you don't know the difference between the popular vote and the electoral vote. go take a high school american government course or something.

to say that Nader is the reason Bush is in the white house is absurd. Gore and Kerry being horrendous candidates is the reason.

as for this election, it's a different story. I'm just sick of hearing all the Nader bashing because it seems like people forget all the good he's done and replace it with lame, far-fetched accusations.

it's funny, you guys are the reason people vote for Nader. Instead of trying to paint Obama as a good candidate, you call people who vote for Nader "ignorant" and tell them not to "waste their vote". If you were to just explain WHY they should vote Obama, rather than why they shouldn't vote Nader, maybe they'd actually consider it.

cubbieblue82

_outlaw wrote:

if there's anyone ignorant in this thread, it's you. Clearly you don't know the difference between the popular vote and the electoral vote. go take a high school american government course or something.

to say that Nader is the reason Bush is in the white house is absurd. Gore and Kerry being horrendous candidates is the reason.

as for this election, it's a different story. I'm just sick of hearing all the Nader bashing because it seems like people forget all the good he's done and replace it with lame, far-fetched accusations.

it's funny, you guys are the reason people vote for Nader. Instead of trying to paint Obama as a good candidate, you call people who vote for Nader "ignorant" and tell them not to "waste their vote". If you were to just explain WHY they should vote Obama, rather than why they shouldn't vote Nader, maybe they'd actually consider it.

I think everyone here understands the electoral process here, so lets not be condescending now... I swear to all these Nader supporters come accross as the most condescending arrogant bunch.

You all say that Nader had no effect on the 2000 election to make yourselves feel better for voting for him(speculating here!) . Say what you want about Gore and Kerry (the critiques are certainly valid) but the FACT is that if Nader did not run, Gore would have carried Florida, and thus the election. You cannot argue with that because that is the reality of the situation.

No Gore and Kerry were not great candidates, I believe that Barack Obama IS a great candidate. I only hope that there are not enough Nader supporters out there to hand McCain the election (I don't think it will happen this time around)

fuck

cubbieblue82 wrote:

I think everyone here understands the electoral process here, so lets not be condescending now... I swear to all these Nader supporters come accross as the most condescending arrogant bunch.

If it were understood, the point of the 'popular vote' would not have been raised.
oh, and it's funny that you refer to me as a 'Nader supporter'. I'm actually supporting Obama this election. Just because I point out absurdity doesn't mean I'm a 'Nader supporter' (though I do think he's a better candidate than Obama is).

You all say that Nader had no effect on the 2000 election to make yourselves feel better for voting for him(speculating here!) .

keep speculating, but I'll tell you that so far it has not helped you.

Say what you want about Gore and Kerry (the critiques are certainly valid) but the FACT is that if Nader did not run, Gore would have carried Florida, and thus the election.

No one is denying that. There is a difference, however, in pointing out that useless fact, and to actually blame Nader (and his supporters) for how the world is now.

You cannot argue with that because that is the reality of the situation.

It's an irrelevant argument.

No Gore and Kerry were not great candidates, I believe that Barack Obama IS a great candidate.

see, this should be the main focus of your point... though, it'd be better if you were to actually say WHY you believe he's a great candidate. not a bad start, though.

I only hope that there are not enough Nader supporters out there to hand McCain the election (I don't think it will happen this time around)

again, weak point.

IamTom

Thanks to the time difference I wake up to this wonderful debate that's been going in whilst I've been asleep!

Lush!

So,

From where I sit I like the idea of Obama. Obviously he has the great advantage of not being Bush. This however shouldn't be enough to gain a vote(sadly it may well be.).

I love the idea of a black man in power. It shows that to a small degree there is more tolerance and acceptance. And surely this is great modeling for other marginalised groups.

The question I have is....

Is he the best person for the job? You're the superpower and with this comes great responsibility. A responsibility that hasn't recently been carried with any great courage by leaders who seem more interested in today's prifits,their friends getting wealthier and taking not giving. A legacy of destruction.

Can Obana turn things around? Does he want to? Has he the courage?

Does anyone want to? Or are we still collectively sticking our heads in the sand until someone else stands up?

I have no idea what the answer is.

ofthegirl75

Americans are hurting paying for gas and the cost of everything going up because of gas prices. She is what the narrow minded red state people want. As gas is going down home heating prices are skyrocketing. "Drill baby drill" They want oil.
They don't give a crap about the environment. More drilling will not promote cleaner renewable energy. Millions of jobs could be created by investing in solar and wind technologies as did the information technologies of the late 1990's.
Somone need to give a shit about the planet. McCain and Palin do not as much as they say they do.

chopitdown

Indian Summer wrote:

Independents always pull from the democratic vote. Republicans never give anyone else a chance, they vote red no matter the candidate (obviously).

ross perot

catch22

_outlaw wrote:

if there's anyone ignorant in this thread, it's you. Clearly you don't know the difference between the popular vote and the electoral vote. go take a high school american government course or something.

to say that Nader is the reason Bush is in the white house is absurd. Gore and Kerry being horrendous candidates is the reason.

as for this election, it's a different story. I'm just sick of hearing all the Nader bashing because it seems like people forget all the good he's done and replace it with lame, far-fetched accusations.

it's funny, you guys are the reason people vote for Nader. Instead of trying to paint Obama as a good candidate, you call people who vote for Nader "ignorant" and tell them not to "waste their vote". If you were to just explain WHY they should vote Obama, rather than why they shouldn't vote Nader, maybe they'd actually consider it.

what good has he done? aside from a book about seatbelts, what legislation and laws has he passed? even when i was campaigning for nader in 2000 i couldn't answer this question. all i know is what he says he would like to do.