think Foley's bad?? maybe his behavior is nothing new in Washington..

DPrival78

hadn't heard too much about this before..
http://www.thelawparty.org/FranklinCoverup/WashingtonTimes.htm

this 1989 article from the washington times uncovers an alleged "homosexual prostitution ring" involving high ranking members of the bush/reagan administrations.

the sub headline: "call boys took midnight tours of white house"

the article starts out: A homosexual prostitution ring is under investigation by federal and District authorities and includes among its clients key officials of the Reagan and Bush administrations, military officers, congressional aides and U.S. and foreign businessmen with close ties to Washington's political elite.

this makes me wonder even more about the jeff gannon situation. you remember him, the gay prostitute who used a fake name and posed as a news reporter, lobbing softball questions to bush all the time. "gannon" had visited the white house 200 times over a two year span, including times when no press briefings were being held. what is a gay prostitute doing in the white house?

floyd1975

It's definitely nothing new. There was Stubbs, who was only stripped of a chairmanship for actually having sex with a 17 year-old male page. Then there was Barney Frank who, if the Democrats regain Congress, will have only been rewarded with a chairmanship for having a prostitution ring run out of his house.

Vedderlution_Baby

Kinda off topic but would people be as upset or surprised if it was hetrosexual prostitution ring or is homosexual just really that bad?

floyd1975

I actually wondered that myself.

surferdude

zstillings wrote:

It's definitely nothing new. There was Stubbs, who was only stripped of a chairmanship for actually having sex with a 17 year-old male page. Then there was Barney Frank who, if the Democrats regain Congress, will have only been rewarded with a chairmanship for having a prostitution ring run out of his house.

If the age of consent is 16 why is this an issue at all?

floyd1975

surferdude wrote:

If the age of consent is 16 why is this an issue at all?

I don't think the age is much of an issue like I said yesterday. When you have a relationship with a subordinate as these two did though, I find that to be an issue and breaking the trust. Neither of the page scandals seem to be likely illegal on the surface but both are equally inappropriate.

Ahnimus

Did anyone ever watch that video about pedophiles in washington, called Conspiracy of Silence?

http://video.google.ca/videoplay?docid=3395321338401208062&q=washington+pedophile

surferdude

zstillings wrote:

I don't think the age is much of an issue like I said yesterday. When you have a relationship with a subordinate as these two did though, I find that to be an issue and breaking the trust. Neither of the page scandals seem to be likely illegal on the surface but both are equally inappropriate.

If it's not Foley's page I'm not sure if it's even unethical.

floyd1975

surferdude wrote:

If it's not Foley's page I'm not sure if it's even unethical.

I see any relationship between a Member and a subordinate in a House program (page or intern) to be unethical.

surferdude

zstillings wrote:

I see any relationship between a Member and a subordinate in a House program (page or intern) to be unethical.

I guess my question is do the pages report to Senators? Or do they report to some Head of Pages, while providing services to Senators?

If it is the latter then it is no more distasteful than dating your waitress. If it is the former then it is wrong.

floyd1975

surferdude wrote:

I guess my question is do the pages report to Senators? Or do they report to some Head of Pages, while providing services to Senators?

If it is the latter then it is no more distasteful than dating your waitress. If it is the former then it is wrong.

I understand what you're asking now and can honestly say, I'm not sure. That is a very good question though. I still would not excuse Foley for his behavior because I see this as a betrayal of trust just like I would with any intern program.

surferdude

zstillings wrote:

I understand what you're asking now and can honestly say, I'm not sure. That is a very good question though. I still would not excuse Foley for his behavior because I see this as a betrayal of trust just like I would with any intern program.

Personally I think his behavior is an abuse of trust, and would feel the same way if it was a 17 yr old female intern. But in the end I don't think there's much we can and/or possibly should do if interns report to someone other than Senators. Other than take into account what Foley's character is and vote acordingly.

floyd1975

surferdude wrote:

Personally I think his behavior is an abuse of trust, and would feel the same way if it was a 17 yr old female intern. But in the end I don't think there's much we can and/or possibly should do if interns report to someone other than Senators. Other than take into account what Foley's character is and vote acordingly.

That is not a bad analysis. This is why earlier I agreed that I wondered if there would be a difference if this was a female intern as opposed to a male one. I think the outcry from both the right and left would be much more silent.

surferdude

zstillings wrote:

That is not a bad analysis. This is why earlier I agreed that I wondered if there would be a difference if this was a female intern as opposed to a male one. I think the outcry from both the right and left would be much more silent.

As a parent I'm digusted that an adult of Foley's age would hit on a minor. Reagrdless of legality or ethics. I don't care that it was a male page. It goes to show that Foley has no idea of trust, appropriate behavior or being able to empathize.

floyd1975

surferdude wrote:

As a parent I'm digusted that an adult of Foley's age would hit on a minor. Reagrdless of legality or ethics. I don't care that it was a male page. It goes to show that Foley has no idea of trust, appropriate behavior or being able to empathize.

I agree 100%.

1970RR

surferdude wrote:

If the age of consent is 16 why is this an issue at all?

Because there very law Foley helped pass (Adam Walsh Child Protection and Safety Act of 2006: http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billtext.xpd?bill=h109-4472) sets the definition of minor as anyone under the age of 18 and overides the local consent age.

floyd1975

1970RR wrote:

Because there very law Foley helped pass (Adam Walsh Child Protection and Safety Act of 2006: http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billtext.xpd?bill=h109-4472) sets the definition of minor as anyone under the age of 18 and overides the local consent age.

The alleged offenses were committed before that law was enacted.

surferdude

1970RR wrote:

Because there very law Foley helped pass (Adam Walsh Child Protection and Safety Act of 2006: http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billtext.xpd?bill=h109-4472) sets the definition of minor as anyone under the age of 18 and overides the local consent age.

99% of the bill is geared towards registered sex offenders. I'm not sure how anything Foley may have done falls into this category.

1970RR

zstillings wrote:

The alleged offenses were committed before that law was enacted.

You are right.
How about this one: http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/uscode18/usc_sec_18_00002251----000-.html

floyd1975

1970RR wrote:

You are right.
How about this one: http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/uscode18/usc_sec_18_00002251----000-.html

That one seems to have to do with visual depictions and commerce between states instead of any act itself under state laws.

Cosmo

surferdude wrote:

If the age of consent is 16 why is this an issue at all?

...
Imagine a 54 year old man cornholing your 16 year old son... would that be an issue?