Convicted Abu Ghraib soldier sent back to Iraq

flywallyfly

Convicted Abu Ghraib soldier sent back to Iraq. And to top it off he is being sent to train Iraqi policemen. WTF ???


http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1554326-1,00.html

sponger

From a publicity standpoint, it's not a good idea. But, I don't think it really matters who gets sent over there to do that job because everybody is equally capable of abusing prisoners. In 1971 an experiment was conducted in a mock jail to study what happens when you put perfectly sane individuals in a prison guard role without any prison training. What ended up happening is that they eventually began to abuse and humiliate the prisoners. It's human behavior. It's not that these MP's were especially "sadistic"; it's just that they had no training on how to conduct themselves in a prison environment.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanford_prison_experiment

If anything, sending this guy back out there is probably a great idea because he at least knows how easy it is for people to suddenly turn into a sadistic abuser of prisoners. The MP's in Iraq typically have not been trained for prison duty, so they are all equally capable of becoming domineering pricks when put into the right situation.

Rushlimbo

sponger wrote:

If anything, sending this guy back out there is probably a great idea because he at least knows how easy it is for people to suddenly turn into a sadistic abuser of prisoners. The MP's in Iraq typically have not been trained for prison duty, so they are all equally capable of becoming domineering pricks when put into the right situation.

Using this logic, it would be a good thing to take a released pedophile and send him to work in an environment involving children because he already knows how easy it is to fondle them. Just doesnt make too much sense, IMO.

sponger

Rushlimbo wrote:

Using this logic, it would be a good thing to take a released pedophile and send him to work in an environment involving children because he already knows how easy it is to fondle them. Just doesnt make too much sense, IMO.

Your analogy works only if it is normal for a perfectly sane and emotionally balanced person to become a pedophile just from working with children.

By your attempt to use the "pedophile" analogy, you are trying to paint this soldier as "abnormal", which he isn't as far as we know.

According to the study I posted, it is normal and expected for a sane and emotionally balanced person to become a sadistic prick just from being in a situation where he's in charge of people in captivity. It is not normal for a person to become a pedophile just because he's placed in a situation where there are a lot of children around. At least, I wouldn't think it to be normal.

Dino283

I never understood why their was such a lotta moaning when the prison thing happend.those in the prison are criminals who tryed to kill or injure American's.They deserved everything they got.


He'll do a fine job training them to be policemen.He know's about disipline.

sponger

Actually, Dino283:

Most of the prisoners, however—by the fall there were several thousand, including women and teen-agers—were civilians, many of whom had been picked up in random military sweeps and at highway checkpoints. They fell into three loosely defined categories: common criminals; security detainees suspected of “crimes against the coalition”; and a small number of suspected “high-value” leaders of the insurgency against the coalition forces.

http://www.newyorker.com/fact/content/articles/040510fa_fact?040510fa_fact

How much more loosely defined does it get than "suspected of crimes against the coalition"? I have no doubt that there were many insurgent collaborators in there, but I think it can be also assumed that there probably people in there who were in the wrong place at the wrong time.

Imagine how many innocent people are in our domestic prisons as of this moment -and that's even with all of the checks and balances of our civilian judicial system.

Puck78

Dino283 wrote:

I never understood why their was such a lotta moaning when the prison thing happend.those in the prison are criminals who tryed to kill or injure American's.They deserved everything they got.
He'll do a fine job training them to be policemen.He know's about disipline.

Dino:
http://www.flintstonesvitamins.ca/fr/kids/colour/images/dino.gif

Puck78

sponger wrote:

Actually, Dino283:

http://www.newyorker.com/fact/content/articles/040510fa_fact?040510fa_fact

How much more loosely defined does it get than "suspected of crimes against the coalition"? I have no doubt that there were many insurgent collaborators in there, but I think it can be also assumed that there probably people in there who were in the wrong place at the wrong time.

because if instead they were insurgents it was nice to make pyramids with their naked bodies, torture them with electricity, etc, right?

sponger

Puck78 wrote:

because if instead they were insurgents it was nice to make pyramids with their naked bodies, torture them with electricity, etc, right?

That's not what I'm saying. I was merely pointing out a common misconception.

Dino283

sponger wrote:

Actually, Dino283:



http://www.newyorker.com/fact/content/articles/040510fa_fact?040510fa_fact

How much more loosely defined does it get than "suspected of crimes against the coalition"? I have no doubt that there were many insurgent collaborators in there, but I think it can be also assumed that there probably people in there who were in the wrong place at the wrong time.

Imagine how many innocent people are in our domestic prisons as of this moment -and that's even with all of the checks and balances of our civilian judicial system.

The united state's judical system is the best in the world.I doubt it that their are many innocent's in prison.

Derrick

So basically America's military leaders make stupid decisions. How exactly is this new to anyone?

Abuskedti

this is nuts ... when he gets targeted... what does the guy next to him get?

sponger

Dino283 wrote:

The united state's judical system is the best in the world.I doubt it that their are many innocent's in prison.

Wow.

Does nobody else want to field this one?

Truthmonger

Dino283 wrote:

I never understood why their was such a lotta moaning when the prison thing happend.those in the prison are criminals who tryed to kill or injure American's.They deserved everything they got.


He'll do a fine job training them to be policemen.He know's about disipline.

I don't know what to say here. I'm at a loss for words.

Evacuation Rules

Dino283 wrote:

The united state's judical system is the best in the world.I doubt it that their are many innocent's in prison.

I have a feeling that you should take a few more English/spelling lessons before immersing yourself in your civics book.

hippiemom

Dino283 wrote:

The united state's judical system is the best in the world.I doubt it that their are many innocent's in prison.

Are you somehow under the impression that the people imprisioned at Abu Ghraib were afforded hearings? Where the hell did you get THAT idea?

And incidentally, you might want to give this site a look.