And You Still Fall For It

onelongsong

as someone who is 100% solar; i'm sick of people saying that more money needs to be spent finding alternative fuel/energy sources. we've had the technology since the 1960's. want proof? what powers satellites; rockets; and the space shuttle? how long have we had solar powered satellites? is solar power that unreliable that we'll use it on billion dollar satellites and space probes?
stop listening to what you're told and look around you. oil is here because you're willing to buy it; not because we need it.

sonicreducer

my parents use solar energy to light up their yard at night, which i suppose is a start,... as soon as i get out of this apartment after i graduate, im looking to solar power to save money,...

polaris

uhhh ... i hear what yer saying and i'm in agreement however, those are horrible examples as they are no other options for energy plus, there is no cloud cover so access to the sun can only be blocked by planets and moons ...

Hartydog

It's a cost issue as well. Compared to other energy sources solar is more expensive per kilowatt hour. Although that is coming down.

onelongsong

polaris wrote:

uhhh ... i hear what yer saying and i'm in agreement however, those are horrible examples as they are no other options for energy plus, there is no cloud cover so access to the sun can only be blocked by planets and moons ...

if you check into green communities you'll see people have been using solar power for years. my neighbor put up a couple panels and a small wind generator so when it's cloudy; there's usually wind. in fact; as you drive accross the us you will see wind farms everywhere. the power company pays the land owners to put up the turbines on his land and the power companies use the technology to sell the power back to you. my neighbor paid $500 usd for his wind generator which is less than most HDTVs. it mounts on a piece of water pipe and he installed it himself. it only requires an 8 mph wind to start generating.
if you don't have sun or wind; you usually have streams for hydro electric generators. batteries have come a long way too.
http://www.treehugger.com/files/2006/10/new_nanotechnol.php

polaris

Hartydog wrote:

It's a cost issue as well. Compared to other energy sources solar is more expensive per kilowatt hour. Although that is coming down.

unless you're buying commercially - it's hard to determine what the cost is because it is primarily an upfront capital cost ... and your payback would be based on what the subsidized market rate is ...

and onelongsong - i don't disagree one bit just that the examples you use (space satellites and rockets) aren't great examples is all ...

onelongsong

Hartydog wrote:

It's a cost issue as well. Compared to other energy sources solar is more expensive per kilowatt hour. Although that is coming down.

my system paid for itself in 1 year. i use more power on this ranch so maybe a little sooner. my most expensive component was a propane generator which automatically kicks in if my batteries drop to a certain point. i need 2 full days of clouds for that to happen. i have a massive freezer to store the meat i sell and i also have a waterbed so i'm not scrimping on power usage.
at my old ranch i would lose power at least once a week. with solar i've never lost power so reliability is an important issue.
i've lived with solar power for well over a year and i'd never go back to the grid. well; except maybe to sell power back to the power company.

onelongsong

polaris wrote:

unless you're buying commercially - it's hard to determine what the cost is because it is primarily an upfront capital cost ... and your payback would be based on what the subsidized market rate is ...

and onelongsong - i don't disagree one bit just that the examples you use (space satellites and rockets) aren't great examples is all ...

i used those examples because the government uses it on billion dollar equipment that can't have problems. some of the older green communities have been using solar power since the 60's but there's really no documentation publicly available. so the only example that everyone is aware of is the governments use of solar power. i suppose you can use the information boards seen along the interstates and remote cell phone towers that opperate on solar power. and a lot of railroad equipment uses solar power too. in fact; if you look for them; you'll see many examples along the highway where several companies use solar power in remote locations where in most cases; bringing the grid in is just too expensive.

soulsinging

onelongsong wrote:

as someone who is 100% solar; i'm sick of people saying that more money needs to be spent finding alternative fuel/energy sources. we've had the technology since the 1960's. want proof? what powers satellites; rockets; and the space shuttle? how long have we had solar powered satellites? is solar power that unreliable that we'll use it on billion dollar satellites and space probes?
stop listening to what you're told and look around you. oil is here because you're willing to buy it; not because we need it.

living in the city doesn't give you much choice, esp when you're renting. the companies have a lock.

as to cars... you cant buy a car that is not sold. id be happy to buy a solar car if i could find one. as is, ill buy a hybrid once i get to the point where i want a new one.

onelongsong

soulsinging wrote:

living in the city doesn't give you much choice, esp when you're renting. the companies have a lock.

as to cars... you cant buy a car that is not sold. id be happy to buy a solar car if i could find one. as is, ill buy a hybrid once i get to the point where i want a new one.

we've had dual fuel cars and hybrids here for a long time. the bloke that installed my array builds units on trailers for people who rent or builders working on sites without electricity. there's always a way.

tybird

onelongsong wrote:

i used those examples because the government uses it on billion dollar equipment that can't have problems. .

Satellites and the Space Shuttle (in orbit) don't have the atmosphere to deal with, and the sun shines 24 hours a day.

onelongsong

tybird wrote:

Satellites and the Space Shuttle (in orbit) don't have the atmosphere to deal with, and the sun shines 24 hours a day.

my ranch is on earth and i generate 12 kwh every day for 18 months so far.

tybird

onelongsong wrote:

my ranch is on earth and i generate 12 kwh every day for 18 months so far.

Not doubting you....just noting that comparing solar power use inside the atmosphere to solar power use outside the atmosphere is kind of an apples to oranges argument.

onelongsong

tybird wrote:

Not doubting you....just noting that comparing solar power use inside the atmosphere to solar power use outside the atmosphere is kind of an apples to oranges argument.

technology is still technology whether it's on earth or not.

jlew24asu

onelongsong wrote:

as someone who is 100% solar; i'm sick of people saying that more money needs to be spent finding alternative fuel/energy sources. we've had the technology since the 1960's. want proof? what powers satellites; rockets; and the space shuttle? how long have we had solar powered satellites? is solar power that unreliable that we'll use it on billion dollar satellites and space probes?
stop listening to what you're told and look around you. oil is here because you're willing to buy it; not because we need it.

solar power is going to power our cars? all 200,000,000 million of them?

tybird

onelongsong wrote:

technology is still technology whether it's on earth or not.

I am not calling the technology into question.....the availability and the efficiency of the power source makes it an apples to oranges comparison.

69charger

onelongsong wrote:

as someone who is 100% solar; i'm sick of people saying that more money needs to be spent finding alternative fuel/energy sources. we've had the technology since the 1960's. want proof? what powers satellites; rockets; and the space shuttle? how long have we had solar powered satellites? is solar power that unreliable that we'll use it on billion dollar satellites and space probes?
stop listening to what you're told and look around you. oil is here because you're willing to buy it; not because we need it.

Solar power is used in the space program because it doesn't require the vehicle to carry additional fuel. Also, the Space Shuttle gets power on orbit from fuel cells, the Space Station does get it's power from the Sun.

Scubascott

So rockets and the space shuttle are solar powered now? Huh. You learn something new everyday. I guess that enourmous red tank full of liquid hydrogen on the space shuttle is just for decoration then. . .

my2hands

onelongsong wrote:

as someone who is 100% solar; i'm sick of people saying that more money needs to be spent finding alternative fuel/energy sources. we've had the technology since the 1960's. want proof? what powers satellites; rockets; and the space shuttle? how long have we had solar powered satellites? is solar power that unreliable that we'll use it on billion dollar satellites and space probes?
stop listening to what you're told and look around you. oil is here because you're willing to buy it; not because we need it.

so this is the "experiment" huh

:rolleyes:

jeffbr

my2hands wrote:

so this is the "experiment" huh

:rolleyes:

I was thinking the same thing. It is tough to get positive posts when the OP start out by talking about "falling for it" and "sick of people who..."

That will immediately cause people to get defensive. Even when people were agreeing with him in principle he was mildly antagonistic.

So I'm not really sure what kinds of responses he hoped to illicit. I like OLS's evangelizing about alternate energy, and he has a lot of good experience, but I don't really think this was a particularly valid experiment.

gue_barium

The environment was the only topic I wouldn't take good old OLS up on. I couldn't find any disagreement there, regardless of his approach.