Spoiling Votes

Hitch-Hiker

So, there's an election coming up in Ireland on the 24th of May. I'm looking forward to it. This'll be the first time I get to vote
Anyway I mod a forum hosted by Dublin city council, and someone started a topic encouraging people to spoil their votes on the grounds that the same party always wins, and even if they didn't, no matter who gets voted in to office, they won't keep their promises. Now I can't fathom this logic. You might as well not vote at all if you're going to spoil it. It amounts to the same thing.
Now, I doubt I'll vote for the favourites, but I'd like to think that my vote will gain an extra seat for the opposition and help keep the government in check.
Spoiling votes isn't going to change anything, although this person seems to think it will. if they want the politicians to keep their promises they can lobby the government, stage protests. If you don't agree with what any of the politicians are saying, why not run yourself and make your views known to the masses. There's a lot one can do, but spoiling their vote is a waste of time, a waste of a vote, and a waste of a chance to actually make a difference. Some people are so pig headed, it's shame they can't see it themselves.

jeffbr

What does "spoiling" mean? Knowingly voting for someone who can't win? I do that every election. One person's spoiled vote is another person's principled vote. While the candidate may not win, it can send a message.

Hitch-Hiker

jeffbr wrote:

What does "spoiling" mean? Knowingly voting for someone who can't win? I do that every election. One person's spoiled vote is another person's principled vote. While the candidate may not win, it can send a message.

Spoiling a vote is when you don't vote for anyone. You purposely fill out the voting slip wrongly so no vote can be taken from it.

Heineken Helen

Well, if you don’t spoil your vote people give out to you for not voting at all since people died for our right to do so and all that. I was considering spoiling mine for the reasons you’ve listed as I genuinely do not want to vote for ANYONE. FF are bad but Jesus, I can’t imagine what a mess Kenny & Rabbitte would make of the country :eek: . So then I decided fuck it, I’m not gonna vote at all. If campaigners call to the door I have two questions: ‘tell me why I should vote for you’ and when they’re finished: ‘tell me why I should believe any of that’

Hitch-Hiker

Heineken Helen wrote:

Well, if you don’t spoil your vote people give out to you for not voting at all since people died for our right to do so and all that.

I'm not going to use that argument against not voting, rather that if all the people who don't vote/spoil their votes listened to the politicians a little bit more closely and look at what they stand for, they would know who to vote for. Of course they're going to come out with alot of big promises at election time that they're never going to keep, but if you look deeper there will be promises made that they will keep, and will matter to you. If more people put some effort in, knew what they could vote for, and did so, real changes could be affected.

floyd1975

Heineken Helen wrote:

Well, if you don’t spoil your vote people give out to you for not voting at all since people died for our right to do so and all that. I was considering spoiling mine for the reasons you’ve listed as I genuinely do not want to vote for ANYONE. FF are bad but Jesus, I can’t imagine what a mess Kenny & Rabbitte would make of the country :eek: . So then I decided fuck it, I’m not gonna vote at all. If campaigners call to the door I have two questions: ‘tell me why I should vote for you’ and when they’re finished: ‘tell me why I should believe any of that’

This sounds like a great argument against compulsory voting.

Heineken Helen

Hitch-Hiker wrote:

I'm not going to use that argument against not voting, rather that if all the people who don't vote/spoil their votes listened to the politicians a little bit more closely and look at what they stand for, they would know who to vote for. Of course they're going to come out with alot of big promises at election time that they're never going to keep, but if you look deeper there will be promises made that they will keep, and will matter to you. If more people put some effort in, knew what they could vote for, and did so, real changes could be affected.

I hear what you're saying and trust me, I didn't make the decision to NOT vote lightly. This is the first time I've been registered in Dublin so for every other election I've took the 2 hour trip each way home JUST to vote... and I went for every one, even if I didn't like any of them I DID look into what each one stands for and chose which one I thought was the best. I even watch the Oireachtas report.

There ARE some decent ones out there but very very few. If ya look at the stupid bickering they do, it's ridiculous. Even in the Seanad, the only one who doesn't seem to CONSTANTLY look for a way of NOT dealing with something is Michael D Higgins. I've seen enough of the ones running in my constituency to know that I really absolutely cannot stand any of them. So I can see how it might look lazy and that I haven't done my homework but I really HAVE and I couldn't bring myself to vote for any of them. I don't understand the theory that I HAVE to vote for somebody... even if I don't like them

I mean it's all well and good FG promising us the best health services in the world and 2 million more gardai on the street and all that crap... but where are they gonna get the money for that?

zstillings... what?

mrwalkerb

I understand where you're coming from, but I just want to make one quick point, having worked a few elections here in Canada I feel you guys should know (at least here) there is a proper way to spoil your vote so it is counted as a "protest vote" rather than a "spoiled ballot" which just means the counters believed that the voter was either retarded or confused to the point of being retarded. If you are going to cast a "protest vote" for the sake of not agreeing with any of the parties stances or candidates than I would hope you do it right because if enough people do that then maybe the powers that be will see this, as opposed to a constituency of fucking morons who can't figure out a check mark. jeffbr said "One person's spoiled vote is another person's principled vote" but if done incorrectly the sad truth is one person's spoiled vote is another person's status quo.

dunkman

Hitch-Hiker wrote:

There's a lot one can do, but spoiling their vote is a waste of time, a waste of a vote, and a waste of a chance to actually make a difference. Some people are so pig headed, it's shame they can't see it themselves.

spoiling a vote is making a statement that you dont like any of the candidates... its a right to vote... people died for the 'right'..

and therefore its my right to NOT vote for anyone and the best way to do this is to spoil the vote... its creating a statement and also acknowledges the efforts of others that enabled us to have the right to vote.

its the people who dont even turn up i cant get my head around... but spoiling is part of the political merry go round.. i've never done it but i can understand why people do it


i'm voting SNP tomorrow in the Scottish Elections

Heineken Helen

mrwalkerb wrote:

I understand where you're coming from, but I just want to make one quick point, having worked a few elections here in Canada I feel you guys should know (at least here) there is a proper way to spoil your vote so it is counted as a "protest vote" rather than a "spoiled ballot" which just means the counters believed that the voter was either retarded or confused to the point of being retarded. If you are going to cast a "protest vote" for the sake of not agreeing with any of the parties stances or candidates than I would hope you do it right because if enough people do that then maybe the powers that be will see this, as opposed to a constituency of fucking morons who can't figure out a check mark. jeffbr said "One person's spoiled vote is another person's principled vote" but if done incorrectly the sad truth is one person's spoiled vote is another person's status quo.

So the powers at be will look at the spoils... and think 'ah fuck, I've been elected but only cos nobody likes any of us... so I'll step down'????? I don't think so. Sure you can protest and MAYBE the number of spoiled votes will be huge and the media will make a big deal of it but the election will still have been won by somebody... and we'll have another few years with them before we get a chance to protest through voting again.

So how would you suggest protest voting then? Write something on the ballot sheet?

Heineken Helen

dunkman wrote:

its the people who dont even turn up i cant get my head around... but spoiling is part of the political merry go round.. i've never done it but i can understand why people do it

It's the people who think it's better to turn up and not vote... than just not voting... that I can't get my head around

Oh what does everyone think of e-voting? We almost had it but then it was shown to be too easy to hack into... which is why I don't trust it at all. Even if hackers can't get into it, doesn't mean the makers can't if they're paid well enough by, say, the government. Paper voting is the only way to TRULY ensure that the voting is legit. Sure you may have one person counting who's trying to fix it but they're all double checked and ALL the votes can't be fixed.

Heineken Helen

Oh another point I want to make as to all the political bullshit and hypocrisy is further to my thread about the current abortion issue, when looking through the websites for the different parties, not ONE of them have commented on where they stand on the abortion issue

Obviously it's not a BIG deal anymore now that people can AFFORD to travel to England thanks to the Celtic Tiger... so does that mean we just accept it and forget about it? :mad: The fact that it's not mentioned means it really is not an issue but yet it hasn't gone away as far as I've noticed.

Bertie said after the last referendum that it would be up to the next government to deal with it, he was the next government and he didn't deal with it... all the other parties at the time said 'vote for us and we'll deal with it'