I totally disagree. If they didn't take offense there would be no use for the word to be used racially. Why do people call each other assholes? Usually because it's a general insult, it means virtually nothing in everyday context, it's used because it's hurtful. Even if they couldn't say "nigger" they would say "porchmonkey" or something equally as hurtful.
How is that different from what I said? People use the word to insult and hurt, and that is why it does.
you couldn't swing if you were hangin' from a palm tree in a hurricane.
How is that different from what I said? People use the word to insult and hurt, and that is why it does.
The difference being that you seem to think people won't insult each other if we ban all of the words associated with hurtful speech. The reality is, people will make up new words or use old dead words. First of all, you can't ban a word anyway. It's much simpler to control your own interpretations.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
The difference being that you seem to think people won't insult each other if we ban all of the words associated with hurtful speech. The reality is, people will make up new words or use old dead words. First of all, you can't ban a word anyway. It's much simpler to control your own interpretations.
I don't believe that, nor did I ever say that. You just put an opinion in my mouth. I have no idea why you think I believe that or said that, but neither is true.
I was saying, that in order for the word (or any other hateful word that exists now or was to be created) to no longer be hateful, or offensive, would only be, if all people were not hateful and did not intend to offend others.
I'm not sure why you thought I was saying anything to the contrary. Please be a little more careful reading someone else's posts before you tell them what they are thinking.
you couldn't swing if you were hangin' from a palm tree in a hurricane.
I don't believe that, nor did I ever say that. You just put an opinion in my mouth. I have no idea why you think I believe that or said that, but neither is true.
I was saying, that in order for the word (or any other hateful word that exists now or was to be created) to no longer be hateful, or offensive, would only be, if all people were not hateful and did not intend to offend others.
I'm not sure why you thought I was saying anything to the contrary. Please be a little more careful reading someone else's posts before you tell them what they are thinking.
Sorry, that was the impression I got, my bad.
Stil wouldn't it be easier for the individual to control their own interpretations?
Because even if no one used it with hurtful intent, another can still derive hurt from it based on their own interpretations. But if they ignore the bad definitions and respond like I mentioned before, it leaves the "racist" with nothing to say and feeling like a complete ass.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
The difference being that you seem to think people won't insult each other if we ban all of the words associated with hurtful speech. The reality is, people will make up new words or use old dead words. First of all, you can't ban a word anyway. It's much simpler to control your own interpretations.
I can't believe I'm agreeing the Ahnimus.:);)
By continually reacting to words like nigger, fag etc is giving those words strength. I know this sounds simplistic, but if everyone would stop being offended by offensive words, perhaps the words would stop being used.
I see what you're saying, but, it sounds like you're not acknowledging how hard and long a process it can be to not take offense to something (or someone) when they are intentionally offending you.
If you are acknowledging how hard of a process that is, than we are in agreement.
Of course it's hard!! Definitely agree there.
This analagoy isn't perfect, but I'll throw it out there anyway: A person does not want to be hurt when they are hit by someone, and if they are they are in someway "giving in" too. But, that is not always something that can be controlled. The same goes often when someone is offended the use of deragatory words directed at them.
I see where you're going here but it's not really true. The difference is -- when someone strikes you, you largely have no choice but to be hurt. When someone says something to you, that choice certainly exists. Furthermore, even those who strike you want something bigger than your pain -- they want your acceptance of that pain. And you can reject that too (***shout out to the Wachowski Brothers***)
I see where you're going here but it's not really true. The difference is -- when someone strikes you, you largely have no choice but to be hurt. When someone says something to you, that choice certainly exists. Furthermore, even those who strike you want something bigger than your pain -- they want your acceptance of that pain. And you can reject that too (***shout out to the Wachowski Brothers***)
Like I said, the anology was far from perfect. Sometimes though, an insult can hurt so much that even if there is a choice to feel the pain or not, and be insulted. The choice to not feel it is almost negligible.
--> Did that make sense?
you couldn't swing if you were hangin' from a palm tree in a hurricane.
it always baffled me that african americans despised the word, but go ahead and use it themselves to greet each other. it doesnt make any sense.
Yeah, I had this same conversation with a co-worker of mine. He said that it is different because of the intent when it is used. I say bullshit. Black people cannot simultaneously be offended when a white person says the word or when they call a black person it, and at the same time call each other that all the time as though it is a big joke.
Like I said, the anology was far from perfect. Sometimes though, an insult can hurt so much that even if there is a choice to feel the pain or not, and be insulted. The choice to not feel it is almost negligible.
The power of language is under review either by us, written by us, or by the actions of Black Leaders discussed. Language can be a knife, a gift, or a group. I don't think I have much to add to the particular discussion presented herein, but rather to state the obvious that language is a powerful tool.
There is no such thing as leftover pizza. There is now pizza and later pizza. - anonymous The risk I took was calculated, but man, am I bad at math - The Mincing Mockingbird
Sure, let's do it. Let's just make sure that NO ONE can get away with it. Part of the current problem stems from the fact that black entertainers continue to use the word with impunity, while everyone else gets demonized for so much as using it in non-derogatory casual conversation. I understand that some of this comes from a desire to appropriate the word from racists ... But its still a bad idea. Micheal Richards used the word because its still so accessible ... to everyone.
Stil wouldn't it be easier for the individual to control their own interpretations?
Because even if no one used it with hurtful intent, another can still derive hurt from it based on their own interpretations. But if they ignore the bad definitions and respond like I mentioned before, it leaves the "racist" with nothing to say and feeling like a complete ass.
No problem. My only response to this is that is much easier said than done. Sure, that should be the ideal goal, but to achieve that state is rather more difficult than what you make it seem (although I'm sure you know that).
Just to be clear, this isn't an endorsement for banning the word. Just pointing out that the solution you are proposing doesn't seem realistic (just like a solution of eliminating hate is unrealistic), sadly.
you couldn't swing if you were hangin' from a palm tree in a hurricane.
No problem. My only response to this is that is much easier said than done. Sure, that should be the ideal goal, but to achieve that state is rather more difficult than what you make it seem (although I'm sure you know that).
Just to be clear, this isn't an endorsement for banning the word. Just pointing out that the solution you are proposing doesn't seem realistic (just like a solution of eliminating hate is unrealistic), sadly.
It would difficult, but I think it's more probable than banning hate.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
I personally don't believe either are possible (especially anywhere in the near future), but I'd love to be proven wrong.
Either would take a lot of societal evolution
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
Where I live, the word "nigger" is used to describe anybody who's "got game". I have black, white, asian, latino, serbian, and gay friends and we all refer to each other as "nigger" affectionately.
When John Lennon said "Woman Is The Nigger Of The World", he wasn't talking about black people.
Words can have different meanings and connotations.
Banning a word = a bad idea
Why aren't "black leaders" up in arms about *all* racial and sexual slurs?
Where I live, the word "nigger" is used to describe anybody who's "got game". I have black, white, asian, latino, serbian, and gay friends and we all refer to each other as "nigger" affectionately.
When John Lennon said "Woman Is The Nigger Of The World", he wasn't talking about black people.
Words can have different meanings and connotations.
Banning a word = a bad idea
Why aren't "black leaders" up in arms about *all* racial and sexual slurs?
So you're the reason Dave Chappelle doesn't do his show anymore. I can't stand it when people call each other niggers. It sounds so gay.
1/12/1879, 4/8/1156, 2/6/1977, who gives a shit, ...
the term "nigger" is really complicated with the connotations and the blah, blah, blah,...
don't say it. if one person thinks it is mean, don't say it. don't call fat people fat. don't call the short kid stubby. what is the big fucking deal? be nice,...
you're a real hooker. im gonna slap you in public.
~Ron Burgundy
Why aren't "black leaders" up in arms about *all* racial and sexual slurs?
Um,... because they're BLACK leaders. Their foremost job is to represent their community. It isn't that they're o.k. with "all slurs". If a school building catches fire, i'm getting MY son out first. When i know for sure My son is safe, then, and only then, can i concentrate on getting some other kids out. There is absolutely nothing wrong with that.
"When all your friends and sedatives mean well but make it worse... better find yourself a place to level out."
Um,... because they're BLACK leaders. Their foremost job is to represent their community. It isn't that they're o.k. with "all slurs". If a school building catches fire, i'm getting MY son out first. When i know for sure My son is safe, then, and only then, can i concentrate on getting some other kids out. There is absolutely nothing wrong with that.
So, if your kid is running around, fully capable of running outside and another kid is stuck under a table, you would make sure your son made it out safely before helping the kid under the table? Even though your kid can run outside himself.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
Where I live, the word "nigger" is used to describe anybody who's "got game". I have black, white, asian, latino, serbian, and gay friends and we all refer to each other as "nigger" affectionately.
When John Lennon said "Woman Is The Nigger Of The World", he wasn't talking about black people.
Words can have different meanings and connotations.
Banning a word = a bad idea
?
In all due respect, it sounds like where you live people are either insensitive to or completely ignorant of the history of this word. a person who's "got game"!? Excuse me for saying so, but, you've got to be fucking kidding me. No one, that includes you, fitty cent, or John Lennon, should be throwing this word around lightly.
Furthermore, and i honestly and sincerely am not trying to be disrespectful here, but, if i ever heard a white kid "affectionately " refer to another white kid as "N----r", i honestly think i would laugh my ass off.
"When all your friends and sedatives mean well but make it worse... better find yourself a place to level out."
So, if your kid is running around, fully capable of running outside and another kid is stuck under a table, you would make sure your son made it out safely before helping the kid under the table? Even though your kid can run outside himself.
C'mon dude, that is about the stupidest thing i've read today. To answer your question... YES! Hes My son! If you don't understand that analogy, you don't have children, and probably never should. i don't care if my son is wearing a fireproof Nascar style racing suit and can fucking fly. It is my job, and my honor, to make sure he is safe first.
"When all your friends and sedatives mean well but make it worse... better find yourself a place to level out."
C'mon dude, that is about the stupidest thing i've read today. To answer your question... YES! Hes My son! If you don't understand that analogy, you don't have children, and probably never should. i don't care if my son is wearing a fireproof Nascar style racing suit and can fucking fly. It is my job, and my honor, to make sure he is safe first.
So, you prioritize situationally. Not everyone is the same. I'd tell me kid to run like the wind and help the kid who is trapped.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
Whatever. You obviously don't get it. i guess thats what a 152 IQ gets ya. Do a kid a favor and have yourself neutered.
Well, I just asked a father of 4, 3 girls and 1 boy, he said he would either:
A) Help the person under the rubble with his son, or Tell his son to get out of the building and stay to help the kid under the rubble.
Anything but take his kid out and leave the other one to die.
Edit: What would a firefighter do?
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
So, you prioritize situationally. Not everyone is the same. I'd tell me kid to run like the wind and help the kid who is trapped.
I situationally prioritize all of my actions every day. I discriminate between choices all day long. And at the end of the day, my family comes first, my friends and neighbors next, and strangers after that. You're goddam right I'd protect my family first at the expense of strangers. I'd do it every time and without question.
"I'll use the magic word - let's just shut the fuck up, please." EV, 04/13/08
Well, I just asked a father of 4, 3 girls and 1 boy, he said he would either:
A) Help the person under the rubble with his son, or Tell his son to get out of the building and stay to help the kid under the rubble.
Anything but take his kid out and leave the other one to die.
Edit: What would a firefighter do?
Its an ANALOGY, braniac! Let me ask you this. In YOUR version of the analogy, just who are the people under the rubble while Black folks are doing all this running, and flying and shit?
"When all your friends and sedatives mean well but make it worse... better find yourself a place to level out."
Its an ANALOGY, braniac! Let me ask you this. In YOUR version of the analogy, just who are the people under the rubble while Black folks are doing all this running, and flying and shit?
I had never considered their ethnic origins. Skin pigmentation plays no role in my decision making.
It's clear that your decisions are centered around your personal gain. Everything that directly affects you takes priority. Although it sounds like you doubt your sons abilities and feel that you need to protect him in situations where he should be otherwise capable.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but a person who has no emotional attachment to either individual and therefor nothing personal to lose, will make one of the alternate decisions.
This is seemingly off-topic, but it's relevant, because typically people that have an issue with the word Nigger have no issues with the word Cracker, Gringo, Spic, Chink, and so on.. there only issue is with the words that affect them. And the only reason it affects them is because they allow it.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
Comments
How is that different from what I said? People use the word to insult and hurt, and that is why it does.
The difference being that you seem to think people won't insult each other if we ban all of the words associated with hurtful speech. The reality is, people will make up new words or use old dead words. First of all, you can't ban a word anyway. It's much simpler to control your own interpretations.
I don't believe that, nor did I ever say that. You just put an opinion in my mouth. I have no idea why you think I believe that or said that, but neither is true.
I was saying, that in order for the word (or any other hateful word that exists now or was to be created) to no longer be hateful, or offensive, would only be, if all people were not hateful and did not intend to offend others.
I'm not sure why you thought I was saying anything to the contrary. Please be a little more careful reading someone else's posts before you tell them what they are thinking.
Sorry, that was the impression I got, my bad.
Stil wouldn't it be easier for the individual to control their own interpretations?
Because even if no one used it with hurtful intent, another can still derive hurt from it based on their own interpretations. But if they ignore the bad definitions and respond like I mentioned before, it leaves the "racist" with nothing to say and feeling like a complete ass.
By continually reacting to words like nigger, fag etc is giving those words strength. I know this sounds simplistic, but if everyone would stop being offended by offensive words, perhaps the words would stop being used.
Of course it's hard!! Definitely agree there.
I see where you're going here but it's not really true. The difference is -- when someone strikes you, you largely have no choice but to be hurt. When someone says something to you, that choice certainly exists. Furthermore, even those who strike you want something bigger than your pain -- they want your acceptance of that pain. And you can reject that too (***shout out to the Wachowski Brothers***)
Like I said, the anology was far from perfect. Sometimes though, an insult can hurt so much that even if there is a choice to feel the pain or not, and be insulted. The choice to not feel it is almost negligible.
--> Did that make sense?
Nigga please!
Yes, that makes sense.
The risk I took was calculated, but man, am I bad at math - The Mincing Mockingbird
No problem. My only response to this is that is much easier said than done. Sure, that should be the ideal goal, but to achieve that state is rather more difficult than what you make it seem (although I'm sure you know that).
Just to be clear, this isn't an endorsement for banning the word. Just pointing out that the solution you are proposing doesn't seem realistic (just like a solution of eliminating hate is unrealistic), sadly.
It would difficult, but I think it's more probable than banning hate.
I personally don't believe either are possible (especially anywhere in the near future), but I'd love to be proven wrong.
Either would take a lot of societal evolution
~Ron Burgundy
When John Lennon said "Woman Is The Nigger Of The World", he wasn't talking about black people.
Words can have different meanings and connotations.
Banning a word = a bad idea
Why aren't "black leaders" up in arms about *all* racial and sexual slurs?
So you're the reason Dave Chappelle doesn't do his show anymore. I can't stand it when people call each other niggers. It sounds so gay.
don't say it. if one person thinks it is mean, don't say it. don't call fat people fat. don't call the short kid stubby. what is the big fucking deal? be nice,...
~Ron Burgundy
Um,... because they're BLACK leaders. Their foremost job is to represent their community. It isn't that they're o.k. with "all slurs". If a school building catches fire, i'm getting MY son out first. When i know for sure My son is safe, then, and only then, can i concentrate on getting some other kids out. There is absolutely nothing wrong with that.
So, if your kid is running around, fully capable of running outside and another kid is stuck under a table, you would make sure your son made it out safely before helping the kid under the table? Even though your kid can run outside himself.
In all due respect, it sounds like where you live people are either insensitive to or completely ignorant of the history of this word. a person who's "got game"!? Excuse me for saying so, but, you've got to be fucking kidding me. No one, that includes you, fitty cent, or John Lennon, should be throwing this word around lightly.
Furthermore, and i honestly and sincerely am not trying to be disrespectful here, but, if i ever heard a white kid "affectionately " refer to another white kid as "N----r", i honestly think i would laugh my ass off.
from my window to yours
C'mon dude, that is about the stupidest thing i've read today. To answer your question... YES! Hes My son! If you don't understand that analogy, you don't have children, and probably never should. i don't care if my son is wearing a fireproof Nascar style racing suit and can fucking fly. It is my job, and my honor, to make sure he is safe first.
So, you prioritize situationally. Not everyone is the same. I'd tell me kid to run like the wind and help the kid who is trapped.
Whatever. You obviously don't get it. i guess thats what a 152 IQ gets ya. Do a kid a favor and have yourself neutered.
Well, I just asked a father of 4, 3 girls and 1 boy, he said he would either:
A) Help the person under the rubble with his son, or
Anything but take his kid out and leave the other one to die.
Edit: What would a firefighter do?
I situationally prioritize all of my actions every day. I discriminate between choices all day long. And at the end of the day, my family comes first, my friends and neighbors next, and strangers after that. You're goddam right I'd protect my family first at the expense of strangers. I'd do it every time and without question.
Its an ANALOGY, braniac! Let me ask you this. In YOUR version of the analogy, just who are the people under the rubble while Black folks are doing all this running, and flying and shit?
I had never considered their ethnic origins. Skin pigmentation plays no role in my decision making.
It's clear that your decisions are centered around your personal gain. Everything that directly affects you takes priority. Although it sounds like you doubt your sons abilities and feel that you need to protect him in situations where he should be otherwise capable.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but a person who has no emotional attachment to either individual and therefor nothing personal to lose, will make one of the alternate decisions.
This is seemingly off-topic, but it's relevant, because typically people that have an issue with the word Nigger have no issues with the word Cracker, Gringo, Spic, Chink, and so on.. there only issue is with the words that affect them. And the only reason it affects them is because they allow it.