to the God believers

CorporateWhore

Collin wrote:

What about all the horrible, vile and scurvy things he does?



That's great that your uncle was released with no problems, but millions of people pray everyday and millions of prayers aren't answered. Sometimes whole groups of people pray for the same thing, like a bit of rain? Yet god doesn't answer them, he lets the crops die, and lets the people starve to death.

Your perception of evil things that are allowed to happen is arbitrary. It could be a lot worse, but God does not allow it to be worse.

know1

deadnothingbetter wrote:

... and if atheists want to jump along, go ahead.

but this isn't to start another debate about science vs faith topics. i just wanna have one of those deep conceptual discussions about God and your ideas of him.... or as an atheist put it, her.

anyways... i was thinking at work today. i thought about how we as humans are wired to react in certain ways. meaning, our emotions are simply connected to chemicals that process inside of us. so i asked myself... does God have emotions? not necessarily the biblical God in that aspect. if God has emotions are his emotions programmed like ours, chemically manufactured? if he doesn't, then what kind of God is it? what does it function on, or how would we understand this other emotionless kind of God?

i asked this same question to a social worker if he believed God has emotions. he supposed he did. i then asked if his emotions function like ours do. he replied that it might be that maybe it's our emotions that cause our chemicals to function in certain ways. what do you think?

I believe God has emotions, but I'm not sure how they function. I don't know the exact passage, but somewhere in the bible God claims to be a jealous God.

know1

nickcat0 wrote:

Okay , I do believe in the Christian message .

As for God's brain and "his" emotions .

I suspect , we humans try to understand God by relating to "him" in human terms . I suspect the form of God is something we can't possibly understand , and to try to paint God as an old man with a big beard , in flowing white robes , with a brain , and emotions , is as realistic as a blade of grass trying to understand Albert Einstein .

I agree with all of this.

deadnothingbetter

know1 wrote:

I believe God has emotions, but I'm not sure how they function. I don't know the exact passage, but somewhere in the bible God claims to be a jealous God.

yes, certainly the biblical God has emotions. but if we're talking about how God isn't subject to the laws of nature and so on, then what kind of emotions does he have?

maybe we have a misconception about our own emotions... maybe our own emotions are not even fused by chemical reactions at all... maybe it's our emotions that cause our chemicals to react the way they do... maybe God's emotions work just like our own emotions... afterall, we were created in God's image.

Collin

CorporateWhore wrote:

Your perception of evil things that are allowed to happen is arbitrary. It could be a lot worse, but God does not allow it to be worse.

So is your perception of good things he does, it could be a whole lot better.

Saying we can't possibly understand god or that he works in mysterious ways is a cop-out.

You'd call me a fool if I followed and worshipped a man who kills dozens of people, who makes them suffer and if I told you you just don't understand, that he saved my life and he saved many other people as well... and he does it for the greater good you'd call me insane and have me locked up.

But when you talk about god, who kills daily, who sends beautiful, good people to hell to rot in eternity daily, it's ok. It's understandable, in fact it's the only true way to happiness and in fact this killing god is love itself.

Talk about arbitrary lines...

markymark550

nickcat0 wrote:

Okay , I do believe in the Christian message .

As for God's brain and "his" emotions .

I suspect , we humans try to understand God by relating to "him" in human terms . I suspect the form of God is something we can't possibly understand , and to try to paint God as an old man with a big beard , in flowing white robes , with a brain , and emotions , is as realistic as a blade of grass trying to understand Albert Einstein .

this is closely in line with what I believe about God

CorporateWhore

Collin wrote:

So is your perception of good things he does, it could be a whole lot better.

Saying we can't possibly understand god or that he works in mysterious ways is a cop-out.

You'd call me a fool if I followed and worshipped a man who kills dozens of people, who makes them suffer and if I told you you just don't understand, that he saved my life and he saved many other people as well... and he does it for the greater good you'd call me insane and have me locked up.

But when you talk about god, who kills daily, who sends beautiful, good people to hell to rot in eternity daily, it's ok. It's understandable, in fact it's the only true way to happiness and in fact this killing god is love itself.

Talk about arbitrary lines...

Well sure you can claim that I too am being arbitrary in my appreciation for God's goodness, but the thrust of your claim was that there is too much pain in the world. If God was truly good, he wouldn't allow all of that pain, according to you.

If I am being arbitrary in pegging the level of goodness, that is inconsequential to most people's lives. People would ALWAYS prefer more good things to happen to them. People NEVER want bad things to happen to themselves, but they happen. They could happen more frequently too.

You seem more pessimistic about God's actions. You assume that He should step in more frequently to help us, if He were real. The problem with that is you can't see as far into the future as God can so you don't know the end result of His choices or decisions. Perhaps when God sends "beautiful, good people" to hell daily, it tells us a lot about how "beautiful and good" we really are. Perhaps we fail to be as good as we think we are because of a corrupted sense of morality. God's morality does not change though.

gue_barium

CorporateWhore wrote:

God's morality does not change though.

Yes it does.

CorporateWhore

gue_barium wrote:

Yes it does.

Nah.

Collin

CorporateWhore wrote:

Well sure you can claim that I too am being arbitrary in my appreciation for God's goodness, but the thrust of your claim was that there is too much pain in the world. If God was truly good, he wouldn't allow all of that pain, according to you.

If I am being arbitrary in pegging the level of goodness, that is inconsequential to most people's lives. People would ALWAYS prefer more good things to happen to them. People NEVER want bad things to happen to themselves, but they happen. They could happen more frequently too.

You seem more pessimistic about God's actions. You assume that He should step in more frequently to help us, if He were real. The problem with that is you can't see as far into the future as God can so you don't know the end result of His choices or decisions. Perhaps when God sends "beautiful, good people" to hell daily, it tells us a lot about how "beautiful and good" we really are. Perhaps we fail to be as good as we think we are because of a corrupted sense of morality. God's morality does not change though.

If that's your view of god, that he sees into the future further than any human can, so that his evil deeds aren't bad, than I think in all fairness that you can't call his good deeds good.

deadnothingbetter

corporatewhore and collin should go some place else to dispute their arguments... i don't mean it in a bad way, just that the thread has nothing to do with your arguments

Collin

deadnothingbetter wrote:

corporatewhore and collin should go some place else to dispute their arguments... i don't mean it in a bad way, just that the thread has nothing to do with your arguments

You're right. Sorry to hijack your thread.

If you believe in god as an entity a bodyless entity, then I don't think his emotions, if he had any, could be triggered by chemicals. Perhaps they could be triggered by electricity or some thing...

CorporateWhore

Collin wrote:

If that's your view of god, that he sees into the future further than any human can, so that his evil deeds aren't bad, than I think in all fairness that you can't call his good deeds good.

I like to think of Lost in this situation. You know the TV show? The characters must make myriad ethical decisions and some have more information than others, so there are misunderstandings that result.

Anyway, suppose I have more information about a person than you do. I know that person is a murderer and they are likely to murder again at any moment. You don't know that and you're best friends with them.

I lock your friend up in jail because he was lunging at you with a knife while you were asleep. You didn't know that happened. You ask me why I locked up your friend for no reason.

This is like us asking God why He insists on carrying out his will in the universe. We cannot know the end result of His decisions, you can only take His word for it. That is trust, and it is essential to all relationships. Religious people call that trust "faith."

CorporateWhore

deadnothingbetter wrote:

corporatewhore and collin should go some place else to dispute their arguments... i don't mean it in a bad way, just that the thread has nothing to do with your arguments

sorry

angelica

We are God manifest. God is in and behind/underneath/above absolutely everything. God Is. God is All. Therefore we as our God-selves experience the emotions of God--we are God. God is the potential of everything, and we as God-selves actualize this potential. There is no separation between us and God, except in our awareness. We act out God's dream. God is us and so much more than we are as individuals.

deadnothingbetter

Collin wrote:

You're right. Sorry to hijack your thread.

If you believe in god as an entity a bodyless entity, then I don't think his emotions, if he had any, could be triggered by chemicals. Perhaps they could be triggered by electricity or some thing...

could be, some form of highpowered energy...

perhaps blackholes and wormholes are the answer to this??

even flow?

So to a believer it is not global warming but a flood of epic proportions again?

Drowned Out

It amazes me that people can defend an insane war on drugs while turning a blind eye to a common sense approach, talk down to people that are concerned about personal freedoms, mock speculation about 9/11 being an inside job etc etc…..then sit and have a straight faced, speculative discussion on whether the little all-seeing, all-powerful man in the clouds has a brain? Wtf?

Cosmo

deadnothingbetter wrote:

...does God have emotions?

...
Short answer: I don't know.
Long answer: I don't pretend to know.

RolandTD20Kdrummer

Jesus built my hotrod...