i appreciate the efforts of the original poster. thanks for posting the pics and taking care of that baby chick. i don't much appreciate the haters. how did i know that miller and jlew would be the first ones to make this thread into a joke?
probably because we are 2 of the smartest most rational people on this board. dont forget my boy speedy.
Your point isn't valid for the fact that there are also many humans with low iq's. How about mentally handicapped humans. People with brain damage. Babies. Should the rest of us "superior" humans be able to torture and kill them as well just because we are more intelligent? Of course not. It's just not a well thought out argument.
That's not true at all.
The least intelligent human being in the world is of greater value than any animal.
I'm amazed that I had to say that.
Human beings have inherent value because we are human.
All I know is that to see, and not to speak, would be the great betrayal.
-Enoch Powell
Your point isn't valid for the fact that there are also many humans with low iq's. How about mentally handicapped humans. People with brain damage. Babies. Should the rest of us "superior" humans be able to torture and kill them as well just because we are more intelligent? Of course not. It's just not a well thought out argument.
no, someone has to fix my toilet, wash my car, and press my suits...these are the reasons that unintelligent and mentally impaired (do we really have to be PC?) are useful to our society...when automation of those menial services can be done, then i will be a staunch supporter of ritual killings of the unintelligent and mentally impaired to stock the freezers of the kings and princes of the world. and, even then, i will continue to eat beef, poultry, pork, venison, bear, groundhog, squirrel, snake, bison, fish, etc. etc. etc.
I spent a fair amount of time a couple of farms, I've never seen a chicken shiver in the cold. Actually, I've never seen a chicken have emotions either.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
Yes, we are of greater nature than chickens, cows, or other animals.
But that doesn't give us an excuse to inhumanely torture them.
You people who don't care about this sort of thing make me sick. These are living beings we're talking about.
Kudos to the thread starter for at least trying to improve another living thing's quality of life.
All organisms are living beings.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
What are the prerequisites for a "Complex animal"?
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
What are the prerequisites for a "Complex animal"?
This isn't a hard concept.
Life is more precious as the natural complexity of it rises. An ant isn't very complex when compared to a human, so the preciousness of its life isn't as great as a human's would be. A chicken isn't as precious as a human either, but it's a hell of a lot closer than a white blood cell, or a sponge, or an ant, or what have you.
There is no set prerequisite for a "complex animal." The term was meant to be relative to other organisms.
It's a town full of losers and I'm pulling out of here to win
Life is more precious as the natural complexity of it rises. An ant isn't very complex when compared to a human, so the preciousness of its life isn't as great as a human's would be. A chicken isn't as precious as a human either, but it's a hell of a lot closer than a white blood cell, or a sponge, or an ant, or what have you.
There is no set prerequisite for a "complex animal." The term was meant to be relative to other organisms.
A microscopic worm has a nervous sytem of about 302 neurons. Fruit flys have brains as well. Short of bacteria, vegetables and fruits, you aren't likely to find a creature that doesn't have a nervous system.
Does that make it wrong to rid ourselves of pests, ants, cockroaches, fruit flys, tapeworms, etc... or is it ok to eat those?
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
A microscopic worm has a nervous sytem of about 302 neurons. Fruit flys have brains as well. Short of bacteria, vegetables and fruits, you aren't likely to find a creature that doesn't have a nervous system.
Does that make it wrong to rid ourselves of pests, ants, cockroaches, fruit flys, tapeworms, etc... or is it ok to eat those?
I'm honestly not a fan of killing bugs, but it doesn't bother me too much because they are much simpler animals than chickens, cows, etc. Didn't I make that clear?
It's a town full of losers and I'm pulling out of here to win
Sorry dudes, I just brutally murdered a spider, I didn't even think about the poor guys feelings :(
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
I'm honestly not a fan of killing bugs, but it doesn't bother me too much because they are much simpler animals than chickens, cows, etc. Didn't I make that clear?
But you haven't been able to determine what makes an animal "complex" enough to not kill it, or simple enough to kill it. So it's based solely on your intuition which doesn't mean much, since my intuition says "eat the chicken".
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
actually we aren't, in the wild we'd get eaten by lions and tigers and bears (oh my), especially polar bears, and a variety of other top level carnivores
Walking can be a real trip
***********************
"We've laid the groundwork. It's like planting the seeds. And next year, it's spring." - Nader
***********************
Prepare for tending to your garden, America.
I'm sorry that you're getting these useless and also heartless replies to something you took the time go out and do then put together to share with us. It's obvious that you care deeply about this subject and I find it completely rude and disrespectful to act as some people here feel the need to.
That's because they are FUCKING CHICKENS not FUCKING HUMANS!!! We eat them and enjoy every minute of it! Things need to die in order for you to live. Plants are living things too, "vegans".
Now try to stop one of these "vegans" from having an abortion and watch the fur fly!
These photos were taken in the back alley of a chicken slaughterhouse in Vancouver Canada Thursday night. They are a bit out of order, but the baby chicken you will see in some of the photos was found standing beside 8 garbage barrels in the alley after a day of slaughter. These barrels were full of dead chickens. It is common practice for these slaughterhouses to simply throw sick or underdevoloped chickens into the trash to either die of exposure, suffocation, or crushed at the rendering plant. I've heard that this happens all the time, but to come across this tiny defenseless creature shivering in the alley surrounded by blood and death....it broke my heart. She is now at my house nice and warm, eating and drinking, finally away from the life of abuse which is all she has known up until now. She will be going to a farm sanctuary tommorow.
The rest of the photos were all taken from the alley. I did not need to enter the facility to get these, so you can imagine what it's like in the rooms I couldn't see. This "production" facility sends there chicken products to stores like Safeway and KFC. This is the true face of the meat industry and only a small portion of the horrible violence and abuse that goes on so people can get their "protien", which they could also get without this carnage.
oh my god. that the saddest thing ever. i dont think i can ever eat chicken agian.
I'm honestly not a fan of killing bugs, but it doesn't bother me too much because they are much simpler animals than chickens, cows, etc. Didn't I make that clear?
So you don't feel bad for killing stupid creatures? What about a retarded chicken. Would that be stupid enough on your scale to kill???
Halv?
chickens and cows are some of the stupidest animals in the Effing world.
Like, you could set up a tiny ass fence and a cow won't even bother to try to jump over it, even though it could if it wanted to.
.
You obviously have never had much to do with cattle. We had a bull that learned to open gates with his tongue. We had another one that had a busted leg and had to be handfed for a few weeks until it could be loaded onto a truck for sale. He prefered grain to hay, and would deliberately nudge you in the bum with his head if you only gave him hay.
Doesn't sound so stupid to me.
On the other hand, they're delicious, and I really enjoy eating them. If you must rationalise eating them, don't use that "They're too stupid to appreciate life" argument. In my experience they're just as smart as dogs.
It doesn't matter if you're male, female, or confused; black, white, brown, red, green, yellow; gay, lesbian; redneck cop, stoned; ugly; military style, doggy style; fat, rich or poor; vegetarian or cannibal; bum, hippie, virgin; famous or drunk-you're either an asshole or you're not!
A microscopic worm has a nervous sytem of about 302 neurons. Fruit flys have brains as well. Short of bacteria, vegetables and fruits, you aren't likely to find a creature that doesn't have a nervous system.
Don't make me do it Ahnimus. . . .
It doesn't matter if you're male, female, or confused; black, white, brown, red, green, yellow; gay, lesbian; redneck cop, stoned; ugly; military style, doggy style; fat, rich or poor; vegetarian or cannibal; bum, hippie, virgin; famous or drunk-you're either an asshole or you're not!
but don't you think that humans are animals who happened to be better evolved?
Think you're better evolved than a fish? Ever tried to breathe underwater?
I don't think so. Differently evolved would be a more appropriate choice of words. I don't think there's any rational argument that you can make about our evolution or biology or intelligence that makes a human life inherently more valuable than any other life.
To humans a human life is more valuable than an animal life, simply because we're human and we depend on each other. To an ant a human life is no more valuable than an ant's life is to a human. In fact, a dead human would be far more valuable to an ant, because it would be a source of food. . . See what I'm getting at?
It doesn't matter if you're male, female, or confused; black, white, brown, red, green, yellow; gay, lesbian; redneck cop, stoned; ugly; military style, doggy style; fat, rich or poor; vegetarian or cannibal; bum, hippie, virgin; famous or drunk-you're either an asshole or you're not!
The only reason I can think of for someone to believe humans are inherently more important than animals - even just inherently different to animals - is religious. 'God created us unique', etc.. The Bible says so. The Quran says so, etc... religious people base this assertion on their holy books.
I cannot see for the life of me why an atheist would believe we are more important than animals. For an atheist, there are no objective grounds for such an idea.
'We're learning songs for baby Jesus' birthday. His mum and dad were Merry and Joseph. He had a bed made of clay and the three kings bought him Gold, Frankenstein and Merv as presents.'
I think certain methods of slaughtering these animals are wrong, not to mention that slaughterhouse seems very unhygienic.
Here's a quote:
It is an important and popular fact that things are not always what they seem. For instance, on the planet Earth, man had always assumed that he was more intelligent than dolphins because he had achieved so much -- the wheel, New York, wars and so on -- whilst all the dolphins had ever done was muck about in the water having a good time. But conversely, the dolphins had always believed that they were far more intelligent than man -- for precisely the same reasons.
I think certain methods of slaughtering these animals are wrong, not to mention that slaughterhouse seems very unhygienic.
Here's a quote:
It is an important and popular fact that things are not always what they seem. For instance, on the planet Earth, man had always assumed that he was more intelligent than dolphins because he had achieved so much -- the wheel, New York, wars and so on -- whilst all the dolphins had ever done was muck about in the water having a good time. But conversely, the dolphins had always believed that they were far more intelligent than man -- for precisely the same reasons.
Isn't that quote from the Hitch Hiker's Guide to the Galaxy?
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
I cannot see for the life of me why an atheist would believe we are more important than animals. For an atheist, there are no objective grounds for such an idea.
Well for one thing there is the law.
Then there is your family, your education, and your emotions (if seeing a man get tortured doesn't bother you more than seeing a fly get its wings ripped off... he).
My grandmother lived on a farm in Ireland and she grew up with cows, chickens, and pigs. Anytime someone starts up about animal rights, she's quick to inform them that chickens and cows are some of the stupidest animals in the Effing world.
Like, you could set up a tiny ass fence and a cow won't even bother to try to jump over it, even though it could if it wanted to.
Chickens are so "advanced" that when you chop their heads off, their bodies go running around without the head. Primitive.
The point is: no you shouldn't wantonly and viciously kill animals and cause them pain on purpose. But, animals are fucking stupid. That's why they're animals and we're humans. We run the show and we can eat them.
Animals have no rights except that which common decency procures for them.
That's funny, a relative of mine lived in a farm and used to do farm chores with her mother wich included killing chicken, rabbits and pigs. But talk to her about uncorrect treatment on animals and she's quick to inform humans are generally the most sadistic creatures around.
Oh, and if I (or anyone for that matter) were to chop your head off your body would keep moving without the head to. As for any animal with a nervous system.
We can eat animals it's true, and technically since we're on top we should be able to eat any of them (that includes dogs, cats and primates) but mass killing leads to inhumane (yes) treatment and a lot of waste.
Comments
probably because we are 2 of the smartest most rational people on this board. dont forget my boy speedy.
save the chickens!!!!!
That's not true at all.
The least intelligent human being in the world is of greater value than any animal.
I'm amazed that I had to say that.
Human beings have inherent value because we are human.
-Enoch Powell
no, someone has to fix my toilet, wash my car, and press my suits...these are the reasons that unintelligent and mentally impaired (do we really have to be PC?) are useful to our society...when automation of those menial services can be done, then i will be a staunch supporter of ritual killings of the unintelligent and mentally impaired to stock the freezers of the kings and princes of the world. and, even then, i will continue to eat beef, poultry, pork, venison, bear, groundhog, squirrel, snake, bison, fish, etc. etc. etc.
from my window to yours
I spent a fair amount of time a couple of farms, I've never seen a chicken shiver in the cold. Actually, I've never seen a chicken have emotions either.
But that doesn't give us an excuse to inhumanely torture them.
You people who don't care about this sort of thing make me sick. These are living beings we're talking about.
Kudos to the thread starter for at least trying to improve another living thing's quality of life.
Funny, I could say the same thing of you.
All organisms are living beings.
Complex animals, then.
Interested in a human kidney for dinner?
What are the prerequisites for a "Complex animal"?
This isn't a hard concept.
Life is more precious as the natural complexity of it rises. An ant isn't very complex when compared to a human, so the preciousness of its life isn't as great as a human's would be. A chicken isn't as precious as a human either, but it's a hell of a lot closer than a white blood cell, or a sponge, or an ant, or what have you.
There is no set prerequisite for a "complex animal." The term was meant to be relative to other organisms.
A microscopic worm has a nervous sytem of about 302 neurons. Fruit flys have brains as well. Short of bacteria, vegetables and fruits, you aren't likely to find a creature that doesn't have a nervous system.
Does that make it wrong to rid ourselves of pests, ants, cockroaches, fruit flys, tapeworms, etc... or is it ok to eat those?
I'm honestly not a fan of killing bugs, but it doesn't bother me too much because they are much simpler animals than chickens, cows, etc. Didn't I make that clear?
Clever. Keep ignoring what I'm saying please, I really appreciate it.
But you haven't been able to determine what makes an animal "complex" enough to not kill it, or simple enough to kill it. So it's based solely on your intuition which doesn't mean much, since my intuition says "eat the chicken".
There are plenty of times/places each year that humans, out & about without weapons, fall from the top of the food chain.
Like here: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-6651413045806084048&q=india+tiger+man+elephant
***********************
"We've laid the groundwork. It's like planting the seeds. And next year, it's spring." - Nader
***********************
Prepare for tending to your garden, America.
A man without a weapon is not a man at all.
Man invented weapons which made him into what he is.
-Enoch Powell
That's because they are FUCKING CHICKENS not FUCKING HUMANS!!! We eat them and enjoy every minute of it! Things need to die in order for you to live. Plants are living things too, "vegans".
Now try to stop one of these "vegans" from having an abortion and watch the fur fly!
That's hypocracy at it's finest.
But somehow humans managed to rise to the top of the evolutionary ladder despite all the dangerous animals around them.
We rock!
oh my god. that the saddest thing ever. i dont think i can ever eat chicken agian.
you'll be eating it for lunch on monday
You obviously have never had much to do with cattle. We had a bull that learned to open gates with his tongue. We had another one that had a busted leg and had to be handfed for a few weeks until it could be loaded onto a truck for sale. He prefered grain to hay, and would deliberately nudge you in the bum with his head if you only gave him hay.
Doesn't sound so stupid to me.
On the other hand, they're delicious, and I really enjoy eating them. If you must rationalise eating them, don't use that "They're too stupid to appreciate life" argument. In my experience they're just as smart as dogs.
-C Addison
Don't make me do it Ahnimus. . . .
-C Addison
Think you're better evolved than a fish? Ever tried to breathe underwater?
I don't think so. Differently evolved would be a more appropriate choice of words. I don't think there's any rational argument that you can make about our evolution or biology or intelligence that makes a human life inherently more valuable than any other life.
To humans a human life is more valuable than an animal life, simply because we're human and we depend on each other. To an ant a human life is no more valuable than an ant's life is to a human. In fact, a dead human would be far more valuable to an ant, because it would be a source of food. . . See what I'm getting at?
-C Addison
I cannot see for the life of me why an atheist would believe we are more important than animals. For an atheist, there are no objective grounds for such an idea.
- the great Sir Leo Harrison
Here's a quote:
It is an important and popular fact that things are not always what they seem. For instance, on the planet Earth, man had always assumed that he was more intelligent than dolphins because he had achieved so much -- the wheel, New York, wars and so on -- whilst all the dolphins had ever done was muck about in the water having a good time. But conversely, the dolphins had always believed that they were far more intelligent than man -- for precisely the same reasons.
naděje umírá poslední
Isn't that quote from the Hitch Hiker's Guide to the Galaxy?
Well for one thing there is the law.
Then there is your family, your education, and your emotions (if seeing a man get tortured doesn't bother you more than seeing a fly get its wings ripped off... he).
That's funny, a relative of mine lived in a farm and used to do farm chores with her mother wich included killing chicken, rabbits and pigs. But talk to her about uncorrect treatment on animals and she's quick to inform humans are generally the most sadistic creatures around.
Oh, and if I (or anyone for that matter) were to chop your head off your body would keep moving without the head to. As for any animal with a nervous system.
We can eat animals it's true, and technically since we're on top we should be able to eat any of them (that includes dogs, cats and primates) but mass killing leads to inhumane (yes) treatment and a lot of waste.