WOW the Stock Market just fell under 10,000
mammasan
Posts: 5,656
So much for the $700 billion bail out restoring confidence.
"When one gets in bed with government, one must expect the diseases it spreads." - Ron Paul
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The global bailouts are affecting investing now. That and people don't have a lot to spend, because again, we're based on nothing. We sell AIR and Protection. Insurance companies are among the most profitable in the nation and they sell fucking risk.
I couldn't agree more, that is why I thought the bail out was a bad idea because it doesn't address the problem. It merely sweeps it under the rug.
The economy has polarized to the point where the wealthiest 10% now own 85% of the nation’s wealth. Never before have the bottom 90% been so highly indebted, so dependent on the wealthy.
I'm officially back to undecided 08.
Sure they have, and my gripe with them is that they aren't content with just making heaploads of money consistantly, they want to scheme and lobby and get people they want elected so bill lumbergs stock can go up another .25% The massaging of the system is what is so fucking disgusting.
I don't begrudge profits, I hate class warfare. What our large companies and our politicians try to do is play both sides, so no one is checked. It's fucking bullshit and I'm pissed off about it.
Congrats to all of us Americans though, we now own 700 Billion dollars worth of bad paper so we can keep creating billions more dollars worth of bad paper. Did it have to happen.. I guess, sure, but it's only going to extend the next bubble to be burst.
So you think we should put Houses or Hotels on Baltic Avenue after we get out of Jail?
I don't think manufacturing is the answer. We simply can't compete with the cheap labor abroad. We are a service economy and IMHO there's nothing wrong with that. We have very large shares of information, professional and business services, and financial activities industries. But, yea, these industries are exposed to the current downturn.
The dollar is rising fast, as this seeps into international markets. That means.... they are considering the dollar safe. If you think the U.S. is falling fast, watch foreign markets. Emerging Markets, like China, are going to have thier bubble burst if this continues.
The "world" will be in a complete mess if the U.S. sinks.
Well demand, I believe is down and the dollar is at a high.
next move: .50 basis rate cut.
bad news: its already priced in, if it DOESN'T happen, we have even worse problems.
as far as the bailout goes: well, lets give it a couple of weeks and see how the credit markets react. I'm quite certain that little if any of that $700 billion has actually been used to buy up that nasty paper yet.
Either way, none of this should really come as a suprise to folks now.
Right?
Deleveraging is a bitch.
At least we aren't staring down the barrell of a fresh bank failure today.
If I opened it now would you not understand?
I think the next move is a united global central bank rate cut. This is no joke, I think they should cut by 100 bps. They got to act fast./
The $700 billion will buy up the bad debt here but what about foreign markets. How is the bail out going to affect them?
That is fine outside the US but the FED has already blown their load and really can't do much more than the 50 bps that is already priced in.
The US is on the verge of being the Japan economy.
That's true, when your biggest purchaser can't afford the goods. Down goes frazier.
Obviously the 700 dollar bailout was like putting makeup on a corpse.
The Fed just increased their TAF inejctions (AGAIN) from 400 some billion this time up to 900 billion.
(And like i said, last week they announced it would go from 300 to 400).
That should help too, although it pisses me off at the same time.
Keep in mind these are NOT treasury auctions, these are essentialy diguised emergency loans to banks, exchanged for clollateral. And fortunately for the banks the "collateralization requirements" have been so severely reduced in the last year that now they are allowed to give the Fed things like mortages and investment paper ... and i think the terms went from overnight to 28 days, and then to 6 months, and now its like "eh, just repay it when you can".
But we'll see if it helps a lick.
Add ANOTHER trillion to the books.
If I opened it now would you not understand?
That money is not at work yet.
The government still has to work to price assets at firms,
and then get those firms to make offers to them for a sale.
I have no idea how long that will take, but i would have hoped that someone with authority would be on top of this from the word "jump".
We'll see.
Either way, folks you can expect this to remain brutal for a while.
When i said we were going to 7,500 a while ago, i wasn't joking.
Sorry for those who thought it was just fearmongering.
If I opened it now would you not understand?
You are right on top of where my prediction was although I thought we would have been closer to that by now. As usual the equity market was dreaming while fixed income had this called awhile ago.
The problem are going to be really bad in the short run as Q3 numbers are coming due with projections for remainder of year.
You know we are not at bottom becuause Commercial Real Estate has not started thier declines nor are delinquency numbers up. With bank failures, very low holiday season projections beginning and holiday traveling most likely to suffer, we should see that worm turn in Q1 09.
I think if the US citizens can bankrupt the future via bailouts, the greedy companies which caused this mess should have the same fate. Down with DOW!
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
don't forget military support...
a couple more wars and the cash will come rolling in.
and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
over specific principles, goals, and policies.
http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg
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Oh yes...
Can't forget our other wonderful export...WAR...BOMBS...DEATH
If I opened it now would you not understand?
60 minutes had a great segment on the shadow trading that was the underlying reason of the failure, they were trading 60 trillion dollars worth of insurance bonds that they changed the name to, so they weren't regulated as insurance, and so no one was actually required to have capital to back up the insurance. Of course the insurance bonds were issued to talk people into purchasing junk bonds that physists and mathmaticians created and no one understood.
It's seriously some illegal shit that they many people need to go to jail for.
Stop by:
http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=14678777351&ref=mf
Technical trade after rally failed to break trendline from Friday.
Markets at -728 DOW right now. 9598 is current read.
Art also said the floor is expecting a major event in Europe over night which would prompt a sharp and significant sell off tomorrow morning at the NYSE, and HOPEFULLY a snap back rally just before lunch.
But don't hold your breath for any significant up move, imho.
I think we could lose 2000 points this week, to be honest.
Although i IMAGINE such downside volatility would prompt emergency Fed action -- ie. rate cut.
If I opened it now would you not understand?
I am in mining/manufacturing (soda ash) and I see layoffs in the not so distant future if thing dont at the very least stabilize.
http://forums.pearljam.com/showthread.php?t=272825
2012 is weird.
:eek:
If I opened it now would you not understand?