Hey Obama people ... refute this for me (tax plan)

slightofjeff

Got this email today. Not trying to start shit with you guys. Just hoping someone with more info on Obama could help me confirm or refute this stuff:

INTERESTING DATA ON TAXES

Proposed changes in taxes after the 2008 General election:

CAPITAL GAINS TAX

MCCAIN
0% on home sales up to $500,000 per home (couples). McCain does not propose any change in existing home sales income tax.


OBAMA
28% on profit from ALL home sales

How does this affect you? If you sell your home and make a profit, you will pay 28% of your gain on taxes. If you are heading toward retirement and would like to down-size your home or move into a retirement community, 28% of the money you make from your home will go to taxes. This proposal will adversely affect the elderly who are counting on the income from their homes as part of their retirement income.

DIVIDEND TAX

MCCAIN 15% (no change)

OBAMA 39.6%

How will this affect you? If you have any money invested in stock market, IRA, mutual funds, college funds, life insurance, retirement accounts, or anything that pays or reinvests dividends, you will now be paying nearly 40% of the money earned on taxes if Obama becomes president. The experts predict that 'Higher tax rates on dividends and capital gains would crash the stock market, yet do absolutely nothing to cut the deficit.'

INCOME TAX

MCCAIN (no changes)

Single making 30K - tax $4,500
Single making 50K - tax $12,500
Single making 75K - tax $18,750
Married making 60K- tax $9,000
Married making 75K - tax $18,750
Married making 125K - tax $31,250

OBAMA (reversion to pre-Bush tax cuts)

Single making 30K - tax $8,400
Single making 50K - tax $14,000
Single making 75K - tax $23,250
Married making 60K - tax $16,800
Married making 75K - tax $21,000
Married making 125K - tax $38,750

Under Obama, your taxes could almost double!

INHERITANCE TAX

MCCAIN 0% (No change, Bush repealed this tax)

OBAMA Restore the inheritance tax

Many families have lost businesses, farms, ranches, and homes that have been in their families for generations because they could not afford the inheritance tax. Those willing their assets to loved ones will only lose them to these taxes.


NEW TAXES PROPOSED BY OBAMA

New government taxes proposed on homes that are more than 2400 square feet.

New gasoline taxes (as if gas weren't high enough already)

New taxes on natural resources consumption (heating gas, water, electricity)

New taxes on retirement accounts, and last but not least....

New taxes to pay for socialized medicine so we can receive the same level of medical care as other third-world countries!!!

Its Evolution Baby

Whats really crazy is my co-worker just got the same email and was going over it with me.

I'm not an economics expert by any means so I will let some others confirm or refute the email.

The fact that its being spread around so fast makes me think its propaganda but we will see.

MrBrian

You know what, at the end of the day, I believe in change, and Obama means change! I believe,I believe...take me away aliens, I believe!
---
I don't know about this tax thing,

Obama '08, (bitches)

velogator

Perhaps you should provide a source to this "information" then maybe it can be refuted or explained. But here is a bit of actual information on his platform, from the Boston Globe,

"Taxes and Budget issues: Obama supports repeal of tax cuts for upper income earners to pay for health care. Opposes repeal of the estate tax." He supports health care for unisured, not a natinoal health care system.

I'm a budget officer for a federal gov't agency so I know a bit about taxes and spending. I can't however, give a reasoned response to "information" that certainly has an agenda (yes, I do support Obama). I will tell you that under this current regime, we have gone from a budget surplus in the last few Clinton years to a budget deficit of over $200 billion per year. As a % of GDP it is still low, however, the national debt is approaching $10 trillion, that is $31k plus for every person in this country, and growing. So, we have a choice, we either cut back on govt services (most likely pork barrel) or we raise more money (have rich pay more). I suspect a combo of both is the way to go...and since in this country the tax burden is heavily weighted toward the lower and middle middle class, I'd rather the upper middle and upper classes pay more of the freight as they BY FAR reap the rewards of govt policy.

JOEJOEJOE

Its pretty simple...the Republicans enacted most of their tax breaks to help higher-income taxpayers, and, not withstanding whether or not this is actually a legit email, the new plan is to make EVERYONE pay the price now in forms of higher taxes across the board.

I don't totally agree with the new proposal, but we do need to help fund the mop-up operations for the mess that has been made for the past 8 years.

The abolishment of the inheritance tax HEAVILY favored the rich. The gift/estate tax in not levied on dollar one of the monies involved, so the boo-hoo story of people losing farms/businesses is a bit extreme.

slightofjeff

Its Evolution Baby wrote:

Whats really crazy is my co-worker just got the same email and was going over it with me.

I'm not an economics expert by any means so I will let some others confirm or refute the email.

The fact that its being spread around so fast makes me think its propaganda but we will see.

As a matter of full disclosure, I got this from my 80-year-old grandpa, who forwards everything he can get his hands on about everything. He was the one sending me the "Obama is a Muslim" and "Obama won't sing the national anthem" emails that were obviously bs.

So I'm disinclined to believe this one, too. I'd just like to know if there are any facts to refute it.

slightofjeff

velogator wrote:

Perhaps you should provide a source to this "information" then maybe it can be refuted or explained. But here is a bit of actual information on his platform, from the Boston Globe

Here are the "sources" provided with the email I got, if anyone is interested:

http://money.cnn.com/news/specials/election/2008/index.html <http://money.cnn.com/news/specials/election/2008/indexhtml&gt;



http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2008/issues/issues.taxes.html


http://elections.foxnews.com/?s=proposed+taxes <http://elections.foxnews.com/?s=proposed+taxes&gt;


http://bulletin.aarp.org/yourworld/politics/articles/mccain_obama_offer_different_visions_on_taxes.html <http://bulletin.aarp.org/yourworld/politics/articles/mccain_obama_offer_different_visions_on_taxes.html&gt;

http://blog.washingtonpost.com/fact-checker/candidates/barack_obama/ <http://blog.washingtonpost.com/fact-checker/candidates/barack_obama/&gt;


http://blog.washingtonpost.com/fact-checker/candidates/john_mccain/ <http://blog.washingtonpost.com/fact-checker/candidates/john_mccain/&gt;

slightofjeff

JOEJOEJOE wrote:

Its pretty simple...the Republicans enacted most of their tax breaks to help higher-income taxpayers,

If this is true, it scares me. Because I got a shitload of tax breaks in the past eight years, and I don't consider myself "higher income." I'm certainly not higher income enough to be able to absorb a tax hit.

JOEJOEJOE

slightofjeff wrote:

If this is true, it scares me. Because I got a shitload of tax breaks in the past eight years, and I don't consider myself "higher income." I'm certainly not higher income enough to be able to absorb a tax hit.

You may have gotten what you consider a shitload, but the higher networth people got much more by comparison.

slightofjeff

JOEJOEJOE wrote:

You may have gotten what you consider a shitload, but the higher networth people got much more by comparison.

That could be true.

That said, I'm holding onto my economic stimulus check. Just in case I have to give it back in January.

JOEJOEJOE

slightofjeff wrote:

That could be true.

That said, I'm holding onto my economic stimulus check. Just in case I have to give it back in January.

smart man!

Its as if we all took a huge cash advance on the national credit card!

unsung

The inheritance tax is the biggest government scam there is. Obama does want it reinstated.

know1

I don't understand what is wrong with tax breaks - even if they are for the more wealthy.

Instead of talking taxes, they should be talking about reforming government spending.

inmytree

here's a good place to check about stances on taxes...

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/subjects/taxes/

RainDog

http://www.factcheck.org/askfactcheck/would_obama_tax_my_profits_if_i.html

blackredyellow

I'm calling bullshit on this e-mail....

Based on the source cited, (http://money.cnn.com/2008/06/27/news/economy/obama_wealthy_taxes/index.htm)
for income tax, "under Obama's tax plan, married couples with at least $250,000 in gross income are likely to see their taxes go up if Obama is elected president." All of those numbers listed are for people well below that number.

The inheritance tax part is sorta bullshit, and only adds that part about loved ones because they can't really back up the claim. Again, fro the CNN source:

"When it comes to family wealth, for instance, Obama favors maintaining the estate tax, which is scheduled to be repealed in 2010 for one year. But he would limit its reach.

Obama would freeze the estate tax exemption amount at $3.5 million - up from its current $2 million level and the $1 million level it's set to revert to in 2011. He would also keep the current top rate of 45%, which is below the 55% it is set to revert to in 2011."

So, if your estate is worth over $3.5 million (higher than it is now), you would be taxed (at the rate you would be now for over $2 million)


And the "claims" at the end are a joke... The gas tax claim is based on a comment that Obama made while an Illinois senator about possibly supporting a state gas tax increase, I can't find anything about the 2400+ sq/ft thing anywhere except in the comment parts of articles where people claim this, and same with the energy and retirement new taxes. And the socialized medicine line is so biased and loaded that you can't even take it seriously.


edit: thanks inmytreeRaindog, politifact (http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/403/) already addressed most of this chain e-mail when it had Clinton included in it.

cincybearcat

know1 wrote:

I don't understand what is wrong with tax breaks - even if they are for the more wealthy.

Instead of talking taxes, they should be talking about reforming government spending.

Why should they operate a fiscally responsible government?

Everyone complains about the "wealthy" getting a bigger tax break...duh, it's called math people, if you pay more already, and your taxes are reduced by the same %...a wealthy person would get more back. Seriously, I think a lot of our problems coudl be solved if people in the US actually learned how to add, subtract, multiply, divide and use %.

Oh well, that's enough sensible talk...it's always easier to take and spend someone else's money.

anotherclone

Try not to let your head explode as all the conflicting information goes in at once.

http://money.cnn.com/2008/06/11/news/economy/candidates_taxproposals_tpc/index.htm?cnn=yes

I'm a big fan of charts and graphs. This one has a side by side comparison of "how the average tax bill could change".

slightofjeff

anotherclone wrote:

Try not to let your head explode as all the conflicting information goes in at once.

http://money.cnn.com/2008/06/11/news/economy/candidates_taxproposals_tpc/index.htm?cnn=yes

I'm a big fan of charts and graphs. This one has a side by side comparison of "how the average tax bill could change".

That is actually very interesting. So I'm better off under McCain, but not by that much.

I feel sorry for the people in the upper brackets when Obama is elected though. Holy fuck!

I know it's popular to castigate the rich for being rich, but damn ... some of them already pay close to 40% of their income in income tax. And now we want them to pay more?

It kind of isn't fair. I guess I'm glad I'm not rich

Shawn Smith Collective

As posted above from Fact Check, this is FALSE:

http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/taxes.asp

slightofjeff

Shawn Smith Collective wrote:

As posted above from Fact Check, this is FALSE:

http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/taxes.asp

Well, there you have it.

I feel sorry for all these old people who think Obama is some Muslim, flag-burning tax-raiser ... because you know old people take any email sent to them as fact.