Vietnam

245

Comments

  • Byrnzie
    Byrnzie Posts: 21,037
    Some interesting articles from The Man....

    http://www.chomsky.info/articles/19750612.htm


    http://www.chomsky.info/articles/19720615.htm


    http://www.chomsky.info/articles/1972----.htm
  • farfromglorified
    farfromglorified Posts: 5,700
    fada wrote:
    Was the place full or opium?

    Sure. Vietnam has long been known as one big opium den!

    It's funny and sad to look at Vietnam now though through the lens of the Vietnam war. I know some vets who have been back there recently and talk about luxury hotels sitting on the beaches they came ashore on. Capitalism is slowly taking hold there as the single-party system deteriorates. The millions dead on both sides were the losers, and their deaths really accomplished nothing.
  • fada
    fada Posts: 1,032
    tybird wrote:
    If you ever get the chance to read Royko's book on Richard Daley Sr. (mayor of Chicago).....read it...great stuff about the DNC. The DNC is also where Dan Rather made his name.

    There is some truth to the Namath/Unitas thing......Unitas represented the spirit of the Eisenhower years where pro sports was only one of the players' jobs...Namath represented the Modern era of the Superstars, big contracts and players just being players (they did not work a "real" job in the off season).


    Namath/Unitas thing , don't know what people are referring to?
  • farfromglorified
    farfromglorified Posts: 5,700
    tybird wrote:
    If you ever get the chance to read Royko's book on Richard Daley Sr. (mayor of Chicago).....read it...great stuff about the DNC. The DNC is also where Dan Rather made his name.

    I'll have to check that out. I remember when I was living in Chicago my friend was working on a thesis revolving around the 68 DNC. Lots of wild stories...
    There is some truth to the Namath/Unitas thing......Unitas represented the spirit of the Eisenhower years where pro sports was only one of the players' jobs...Namath represented the Modern era of the Superstars, big contracts and players just being players (they did not work a "real" job in the off season).

    Exactly. Sideburns v Crewcut....tectonic plates of progress or some such bullshit!
  • fada
    fada Posts: 1,032
    As a man with sidies I'll have to support sideburns.
  • farfromglorified
    farfromglorified Posts: 5,700
    fada wrote:
    Namath/Unitas thing , don't know what people are referring to?

    Super Bowl III (American football)

    UNITAS
    http://www.pathguy.com/unitas-2.jpg

    NAMATH
    http://www.vintagesportsshoppe.com/na.jpg

    Namath was the quarterback of the underdog Jets. He was brash and guaranteed a victory, despite long odds. Unitas was the quarterback for the Colts and represented the predominant clean-cut American athelete of the time.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_Bowl_III

    I play a bit with history there because (as another poster indicated), Unitas actually didn't play much that season. But Morrall (the Colts other quarterback) was also pretty clean-cut ;)
  • farfromglorified
    farfromglorified Posts: 5,700
    fada wrote:
    As a man with sidies I'll have to support sideburns.

    Hehe....and sideburns carried the day.
  • tybird
    tybird Posts: 17,388
    fada wrote:
    Namath/Unitas thing , don't know what people are referring to?
    Man, I had a great reply going to this...........but pushed a wrong button somewhere.

    Namath and Unitas were professional (American) football players. Unitas was the older of the two by least a decade. They both played quarterback, which Unitas had helped to make into the marquee role on a team. They (along with others such as Jim Brown, etc.) were partially responible for making our version of football (on the professional level) the king of our sports. Prior to 1958, Baseball was the King of U.S. Sports. This shift is probably one of the reasons that we tend to be more accepting of violence in our entertainment and our lives.
    All the world will be your enemy, Prince with a thousand enemies, and whenever they catch you, they will kill you. But first they must catch you, digger, listener, runner, prince with the swift warning. Be cunning and full of tricks and your people shall never be destroyed.
  • fada
    fada Posts: 1,032
    How were the soldiers treated by the anti war folk after they returned home?
  • farfromglorified
    farfromglorified Posts: 5,700
    fada wrote:
    How were the soldiers treated by the anti war folk after they returned home?

    Depends. There are a lot of nasty stories out there of veterans being spit on or assaulted or generally harassed. But that's not to say that all anti-war folk engaged in such acts.

    You'll hear a lot of anti-war folks now go on and on about "we still support the troops", etc. That language is largely in response to the treatment of veterans post-Vietnam.
  • RockinInCanada
    RockinInCanada Posts: 2,016
    Regardless if one disgree's with the cause for war...one should also never ridicule and harass those that went to fight (especially under draft conditions). That treatment of Vietnam vet's. is very disturbing in my mind.

    I am adamant against Canada's involvement in Afganistan, yet I would never ridicule or harass a member of the military that is currently serving over there.
  • farfromglorified
    farfromglorified Posts: 5,700
    1970RR wrote:
    FYI: check here to verify your registration
    https://www4.sss.gov/regver/verification1.asp

    Ick. That gives me the fucking creeps.

    We really need to repeal SSI registration, even if it means I can no longer challenge overzealous feminists by asking to see their registration card ;)
  • farfromglorified
    farfromglorified Posts: 5,700
    fada wrote:
    How were the soldiers treated by the anti war folk after they returned home?

    BTW, if you ever get a chance visit the Vietnam Memorial in DC. It's completely overwhelming, even for someone like me that was not involved in any way.
  • fada
    fada Posts: 1,032
    I live in Ireland. Might check it out sometime. Always feel that most people coming back from war are traumatised
  • RockinInCanada
    RockinInCanada Posts: 2,016
    fada wrote:
    I live in Ireland. Might check it out sometime. Always feel that most people coming back from war are traumatised

    I believe they are permenatly scarred mentally.....I cannot wait (not literally of course) to see how the men and women from Iraq adjust on their return (whenever that will be) back home....they will make the scarred Vietnam vet's look normal....
  • farfromglorified
    farfromglorified Posts: 5,700
    Rockin'InCanada wrote:
    I believe they are permenatly scarred mentally.....I cannot wait (not literally of course) to see how the men and women from Iraq adjust on their return (whenever that will be) back home....they will make the scarred Vietnam vet's look normal....

    This conflict in no way compares to Vietnam, particularly for the average grunt. Go talk to someone who fought in the bush of Vietnam.

    Not that I think this war is "easy" or won't result in mental scars for the troops. But you're comparing apples and oranges here.
  • RockinInCanada
    RockinInCanada Posts: 2,016
    farfromglorified wrote:
    This conflict in no way compares to Vietnam, particularly for the average grunt. Go talk to someone who fought in the bush of Vietnam.

    Not that I think this war is "easy" or won't result in mental scars for the troops. But you're comparing apples and oranges here.

    Are you kidding me?

    I for one think this troop will be seriously messed up when they return.....
  • RockinInCanada
    RockinInCanada Posts: 2,016
    farfromglorified wrote:
    This conflict in no way compares to Vietnam, particularly for the average grunt. Go talk to someone who fought in the bush of Vietnam.

    Not that I think this war is "easy" or won't result in mental scars for the troops. But you're comparing apples and oranges here.

    I tend to view the matter like this...from my opinon I think violent and traumatic memories re-occur more highly when the person is in an environment that is similar to the one they were in when the event occured....therefore because Vietnam was fought primarily in the bush most of the hardcore memories would be linked to that type of environment...where on the otherhand Iraq is fought in urban populated areas.....meaning lots of noises/sounds commonly found in America may spurn old repressed memories of past warfare due to the vast urbanization of America......
  • farfromglorified
    farfromglorified Posts: 5,700
    Rockin'InCanada wrote:
    Are you kidding me?

    I for one think this troop will be seriously messed up when they return.....

    Many troops have returned and they are not necessarily "seriously messed up". A conflict with 1,500 casualties in 3 years does not compare to Vietnam.

    It's like suggesting that the aftermath of Vietnam was the same as World War I or the Civil War. It makes no sense.
  • farfromglorified
    farfromglorified Posts: 5,700
    Rockin'InCanada wrote:
    I tend to view the matter like this...from my opinon I think violent and traumatic memories re-occur more highly when the person is in an environment that is similar to the one they were in when the event occured....therefore because Vietnam was fought primarily in the bush most of the hardcore memories would be linked to that type of environment...where on the otherhand Iraq is fought in urban populated areas.....meaning lots of noises/sounds commonly found in America may spurn old repressed memories of past warfare due to the vast urbanization of America......

    This point has some merit but the underlying assumption is that the troops are experiencing "warfare". Relative to Vietnam, they are not.

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