Environmentalism seems to be the religion of choice for urban atheists

AllNiteThing

Purple Hawk wrote:

And no, it is NOT possible that we can alter the planet in such a way it becomes incapable of supporting human life.

Are you serious? Don't you think THAT statement right there is 'faith' based as well? I think it's incredibly naive to make such an absolute statement like that.

AllNiteThing

Purple Hawk wrote:

And no, it is NOT possible that we can alter the planet in such a way it becomes incapable of supporting human life.

Contradicted your earlier post.....

Purple Hawk wrote:

and all the other stuff you're saying...about us destroying the planet, we can't. if our one objective was to destroy the planet, and put all of our resources towards it, we couldn't do it. we can kill ourselves, yes, but the planet? to think so is arrogance beyond belief.

Cosmo

Purple Hawk wrote:

He is saying that modern day environmentalism is a religion for the Godless. His point was that the Earth was never "prestine," it's always been an angry sunnuva bitch...that's all he's saying...

and all the other stuff you're saying...about us destroying the planet, we can't. if our one objective was to destroy the planet, and put all of our resources towards it, we couldn't do it. we can kill ourselves, yes, but the planet? to think so is arrogance beyond belief.

My point in posting this brilliant speech is that the environmental movement IS political, and not moral.

...
Here's my take on Environmentalism. It isn't about 'Saving the Planet', such as 'Saving the Soul' that religions preach. It's about making your life a little nicer and leaving the place a little nicer for the next person. I don't toss trash out my car window on the freeway for convenience. Also, you may argue, but I don't like breating in exhaust fumes or drinking water laced with DDT.
I don't see anything wrong with making the place a little nicer... a little cleaner.

AllNiteThing

MC should stick to fantasy/fiction.

- The environmental movement has caused 20-30 million deaths in 30 years?!?! Ok, proof!!! Oh wait, he demands scientific evidence for everything, yet provides zero in his argument.

- DDT? He says that it was a grave mistake to ban it and that environmentalists should be ashamed, right? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ddt Where's HIS evidence that says it's 100% clean, effective and safe???? Last I checked, there was still plenty of controversy surrounding its health effects. Call me stupid, but I'll err on the side of prudence when it comes to spraying chemicals all over the place. There are other effective ways to combat malaria. :rolleyes:

- His whole rant on tribal societies...are you kidding me??? Wtf does that have to do with the environment? He acts like people don't understand how harsh nature is. Please. What, anyone who wants a clean environment is a 10 year old? Give me a fucking break. Yes, humans fight. Animals fight. Nature is full of conflict. Humans decided to break away and circumvent Mother Nature/God/whatever. We took it upon ourselves to plant crops and ruin the soil, kill ALL the insects, kill ALL the wolves, hunt ALL the whales, etc etc, etc on a worldwide scale. It was never like that when we were in tribal societies. It is the worldwide scale of things that is hurting our ecosystem, and slowly seperating us from it.

Read Daniel Quinn's Ishmael .. check out his question/answer section http://www.ishmael.com/welcome.cfm for some profound insight on environmentalism, tribal societies and the human impact. It's not about killing bunnies and peaceful Indians. It's about how we are destroying OUR habitat. The world will go on, yes, any idiot knows that.

There are plenty of studies and arguments out there about human-impacted climate change. The majority of scientists have come to a consensus on this. A minority of scientists dispute our involvement in this phenomena, but most of them agree that climate change is occurring. A very, very small minority dispute all of it, completely. I have seen a list of most of them and who funds their research. Not a difficult guess what sector they come from.

surferdude

AllNiteThing wrote:

- DDT? He says that it was a grave mistake to ban it and that environmentalists should be ashamed, right? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ddt Where's HIS evidence that says it's 100% clean, effective and safe???? Last I checked, there was still plenty of controversy surrounding its health effects. Call me stupid, but I'll err on the side of prudence when it comes to spraying chemicals all over the place. There are other effective ways to combat malaria. :rolleyes:

Banning DDt in developpig has caused way more death than prevented potential harm. DDT was and still is the best imperfect solution we have.

polaris

surferdude wrote:

Banning DDt in developpig has caused way more death than prevented potential harm. DDT was and still is the best imperfect solution we have.

myth ... it's been debunked many times on this board ...

inmytree

this is great news....DDT, lead paint, and pollution for ALL!!! It's just a matter of faith...and if you believe pollution is good, then it won't harm you....

gue_barium

inmytree wrote:

this is great news....DDT, lead paint, and pollution for ALL!!! It's just a matter of faith...and if you believe pollution is good, then it won't harm you....

Amen, brother

inmytree

gue_barium wrote:

Amen, brother

I've got one Amen...canna get another...!!! wooo hooo...

pollution will save your soul...an a, DDT will save yo life...

you gots to believe...let that pollution rain upon thee...

hallelujah..!!!!

gue_barium

oh lordy!
the spirtit is-ah with me
let us pray-ah
for acid rain-ah

surferdude

inmytree wrote:

this is great news....DDT, lead paint, and pollution for ALL!!! It's just a matter of faith...and if you believe pollution is good, then it won't harm you....

Grow up and get educated. It's specifically about the use of DDT in AFrica to save lives and prevent the spread of malaria. The same malaria that has had a far more devastating effect than DDT could ever dream of having or ever did have. Sometimes it's about the lessor of two evils. If you can't take the time to educate yourself on the subject why pespond.

inmytree

surferdude wrote:

Grow up and get educated. It's specifically about the use of DDT in AFrica to save lives and prevent the spread of malaria. The same malaria that has had a far more devastating effect than DDT could ever dream of having or ever did have. Sometimes it's about the lessor of two evils. If you can't take the time to educate yourself on the subject why pespond.

a non-believa...!!

I'm a agree-in with ya...DDT is a good a....I'm having some for a dinner a...

And I'll prepond when I a wanna prespond a....!!!

ArmsinaV

surferdude wrote:

Grow up and get educated. It's specifically about the use of DDT in AFrica to save lives and prevent the spread of malaria. The same malaria that has had a far more devastating effect than DDT could ever dream of having or ever did have. Sometimes it's about the lessor of two evils. If you can't take the time to educate yourself on the subject why pespond.

Don't bother people with facts, man. Many lefties on this board are much more interested in snide responses, such as these people.

Crichton is right on in a lot of what he says, and I'm glad at least some people have noticed it.

Rushlimbo

ArmsinaV wrote:

Don't bother people with facts, man. Many lefties on this board are much more interested in snide responses, such as these people.

Crichton is right on in a lot of what he says, and I'm glad at least some people have noticed it.

How are those responses snide? Crichton himself calls environmentalism a religion -- it looks like preaching it as religious wackos do is the next logical step. Amen my christian soldiers !

AllNiteThing

ArmsinaV wrote:

Don't bother people with facts, man. Many lefties on this board are much more interested in snide responses, such as these people.

Crichton is right on in a lot of what he says, and I'm glad at least some people have noticed it.

Show me the proof that DDT is completely harmless and does not cause any disease/cancer. Show me these all mighty facts of yours. Irrefutable proof.

AllNiteThing

surferdude wrote:

Banning DDt in developpig has caused way more death than prevented potential harm. DDT was and still is the best imperfect solution we have.

Proof. Or is it more blind faith? :rolleyes:

surferdude

AllNiteThing wrote:

Proof. Or is it more blind faith? :rolleyes:

Let's see proof from the people who support the banning of what was a very effective tool in fighting malaria. I'mnot here to do research for the lazy.

RolandTD20Kdrummer

gue_barium wrote:

I finally saw An Inconvenient Truth, last night. Best movie I've seen all year.

Last night? .....what are you an inmate or do you live in the projects and finally got loaned the neighborhood TV and VCR or something?

I'm waiting for the part 2 noah's ark version...with gore in a yellow ducky suit...

btw...yes it was a good movie.

Jeanie

ClimberInOz wrote:

It is a really interesting scenario imagining the world without us in it. I mean, do we really care what the planet is like after we are extinct, when we are not here to appreciate the beauty of life? I am not sure how to answer that...

The only scenario that I can envisage destroying the earth so that it cannot sustain any life is either through a major nuclear event (think the majority of the world's weapons going off simultaneously) or some form of natural disaster suchg as a major asteroid strike. Both are a possability- only one is preventable- but more of an issue of politics then everyday environmentalism.

When we do go, I can see us having taken down a lot of other species with us... but imagine that even after our departure the majority of the world's species will still be existing, none the wiser at our brief 'flash in the pan'.

Anyway- it is all a temporary concern. In approximately 2 billion years our galaxy is set to collide with Andromeda, and when those two heavyweights rip each other apart, that will be the end of the earth...

I guess asteroid strike or galaxies colliding are things out of our control at this point. But seemingly in the meantime we do have a responsibility to protect our home. And I believe we do have a responsibility to use less, consume less and to leave the planet in a more healthy condition that we have done in the last 100 or so years. Who knows what will happen? I'll probably be dead long before the end of the earth, but I'm still going to do everything I can to lessen my footprint.

Jeanie

catefrances wrote:

oh and jeanie, are you aware that michael crichton graduated from medical school. and that after graduating from harvard he studied at the salk institute for biological studies. i am not saying that because of his medical training and post graduate work that he should be untouchable and not open to some amount of scepticism, i just think that perhaps you are dismissing him purely based on his works of fiction and his populist style of prose.

Yep, thanks cate, read that somewhere about him, but yours is a timely reminder.

And now that I have been reminded I must say that his article truly sucks.