Presidents do not make policy!!!!!

Abuskedti

They provide leadership.

why are we preoccupied with their policies or their economic plans? Congress can work on policies and laws.. the people can participate in that.

We need leadership in that position. Thats all.. the whole republican democrat thing is silly in choosing a president.. unless of course you republicans claim W as your model

slightofjeff

A strong president ... or an empowered president ... can use his position as a bully pulpit to force through his policy agenda.

Why do you think all those Democrats who oppose the war now voted for it in the first place? Bush had a highly favorable rating at the time and was able to make it politically neccesary for Congress to give him what he wanted.

Presidents can effect policy, if they have enough leverage. 9/11 gave GWB all kinds leverage out the asshole.

Abuskedti

slightofjeff wrote:

A strong president ... or an empowered president ... can use his position as a bully pulpit to force through his policy agenda.

Why do you think all those Democrats who oppose the war now voted for it in the first place? Bush had a highly favorable rating at the time and was able to make it politically neccesary for Congress to give him what he wanted.

Presidents can effect policy, if they have enough leverage. 9/11 gave GWB all kinds leverage out the asshole.

yes yes, they have a big impact.. but they don't develop policy. they don't intorduce it...

so why we have to muddle through these potential presidents current plan when they don't have near the staff to make a viable plan?

fuck

presidents definitely have a say... oh, not to mention the fact that they appoint many of the most important government appointees, like Attorney General, the cabinet, judges, etc...

know1

Abuskedti wrote:

They provide leadership.

why are we preoccupied with their policies or their economic plans? Congress can work on policies and laws.. the people can participate in that.

We need leadership in that position. Thats all.. the whole republican democrat thing is silly in choosing a president.. unless of course you republicans claim W as your model

There is some truth to this, which is why I always wonder why so many cry and complain about Bush.

Strangest Tribe

The President can send troops anywhere w/o congress approval. The President can't declare war w/o congressional approval but can enter a "state of war" legally which is why we wouldn't necessarily want a war monger in office.
So yeah, when the President can launch the nukes I'd say he's got quite a bit more power than given credit in this thread.

Plus, the congress usually follows the President by party lines willy nilly, so don't kid yourselves here.

beachdweller

slightofjeff wrote:

A strong president ... or an empowered president ... can use his position as a bully pulpit to force through his policy agenda.

Why do you think all those Democrats who oppose the war now voted for it in the first place? Bush had a highly favorable rating at the time and was able to make it politically neccesary for Congress to give him what he wanted.

Presidents can effect policy, if they have enough leverage. 9/11 gave GWB all kinds leverage out the asshole.

not to mention the bullying he did to his own party mates...hell some of the very moderate conservatives he strong handed to do as he said still lost their seats to Dem's in '06.

Abuskedti

know1 wrote:

There is some truth to this, which is why I always wonder why so many cry and complain about Bush.

It was not his policies that trouble.. its the hundreds of thousands of Iraqis he ordered murdered as Commander-in-Chief.

I am not concerned that either of today's candidates would be so brutal and ignorant

know1

Abuskedti wrote:

It was not his policies that trouble.. its the hundreds of thousands of Iraqis he ordered murdered as Commander-in-Chief.

I am not concerned that either of today's candidates would be so brutal and ignorant

Nah - it's not just that. You hear all kinds of ills that have nothing to do with the Iraq war that are attributed to him.

my2hands

slightofjeff wrote:

Why do you think all those Democrats who oppose the war now voted for it in the first place?

alot of democrats voted against the Iraq invasion... just not enough... the whole "democrats are the same as republicans" argument by some is just hilarious and dead wrong

A majority of house democrats voted against the resolution (republicans voted 215-6 in favor)

---

Y

---

N
Republican---215----6
Democratic---81---126
Independent--0

---

1
TOTALS

---

296--133

but a small majority of Senate Democrats did vote in favor of the Resolution... (but again the republicans overwhelmingly supported it 48-1)

---

Y

---

N
Republican

---

48---1
Democratic----29---21
Independent---0----1
TOTALS

---

77---23

Democratic Senators that voted against the resolution: Sens. Akaka (D-HI), Bingaman (D-NM), Boxer (D-CA), Byrd (D-WV), Conrad (D-ND), Corzine (D-NJ), Dayton (D-MN), Durbin (D-IL), Feingold (D-WI), Graham (D-FL), Inouye (D-HI), Kennedy (D-MA), Leahy (D-VT), Levin (D-MI), Mikulski (D-MD), Murray (D-WA), Reed (D-RI), Sarbanes (D-MD), Stabenow (D-MI), Wellstone (D-MN), Wyden (D-OR).

1 of 49 Republican Senators voted against the resolution: Sen. Chafee (R-RI). (good for him)

The only Independent Senator voted against the resoution: Sen. Jeffords (I-VT)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraq_Resolution

Abuskedti

know1 wrote:

Nah - it's not just that. You hear all kinds of ills that have nothing to do with the Iraq war that are attributed to him.

that is likely the result of exasperation when folks like you refer to what has become of Iraq as "just that"

slightofjeff

my2hands wrote:

alot of democrats voted against the Iraq invasion... just not enough... the whole "democrats are the same as republicans" argument by some is just hilarious and dead wrong

I know you used the qualifier "by some" in this post ... but since you quoted me in your response, I just wanted to be clear:

I never made such an argument.

OK, carry on.

know1

Abuskedti wrote:

that is likely the result of exasperation when folks like you refer to what has become of Iraq as "just that"

Whatever - don't give me that. You know that wasn't how I meant it.

Milestone

know1 wrote:

There is some truth to this, which is why I always wonder why so many cry and complain about Bush.

I cry and complain about Bush because he is the one who appoints people to office....like Rumsfeld, Alberto Gonzalez, Supreme Court justices, ect...

He's also the one now telling us that our 380 billion dollar deficit is largley because of the economic incentive stimulous checks.......yet he won't acknowledge the Iraq War and cutting taxes has anything to do with it.

raszputini

Some of you really need to pull out your civics books. Presidents ABSOLUTELY make policy.

The Monroe Doctrine?
FDR's New Deal?
Johnson's Great Society?
Shit....Abe Lincoln suspended habeas corpus as well as freed slaves, which was one of the biggest policy shifts in our history.
Those are just a few you should know about....

More recently.....
Clinton's Child Income tax Credit?
All of the executive orders that Bush used to collectively stomp on our civil liberties?
The Patriot Act?
The creation of the entire Department of Homeland Security?
The administration's position on torture?
The moratorium on oil drilling?

ALL of our policies towards foreign powers are determined largely by the President.