Do we deserve this?

orig_long red

anyone else feeling betrayed by our two parties for making us choose between these two second rate politicians? It's a sad and sobering realization they were the best options out of that pool of candidates. A majority of Americans have fucked up royally.

And no, neither Hillary, nor Huckabee, nor Richardson, nor etc, would have been a better choice. The really dismal part is that there was no good choice.

There are no more qualified leaders in this country. It's over.

We survived 8 years of Bush Rule, and this is our reward?

Abookamongstthemany

Very much so. Time for people to start looking elsewhere.

LikeAnOpeningBandForTheSun

short answer: yes, yes we do deserve this.

unsung

Well I'm voting for Ron Paul and I'm surprised more people here are not. Everyone seems to have Iraq as their main complaint and he was the only GOP member to vote against it in the first place.

It is too bad big business and big media control everything. Ron Paul can out-debate just about everyone yet it didn't get invited to some and the last main GOP debate it was basically a tennis match between McCain and Romney. Personally, as a taxpaying citizen, I love his policies of cutting spending and defending this country against the illegal alien invasion and the assault our own country is doing to the dollar. I believe in sovereignty, these two fools that are going to get the nominations don't.

Pacomc79

Oh I think there are plenty of qualified leaders... they just don't have the connections and can't raise the money.

ForestBrain

Yes, it is deserved because it was allowed to happen.

LikeAnOcean

Meh, who needs leaders anyways. I follow no one.

chopitdown

long red wrote:

anyone else feeling betrayed by our two parties for making us choose between these two second rate politicians? It's a sad and sobering realization they were the best options out of that pool of candidates. A majority of Americans have fucked up royally.

And no, neither Hillary, nor Huckabee, nor Richardson, nor etc, would have been a better choice. The really dismal part is that there was no good choice.

There are no more qualified leaders in this country. It's over.

We survived 8 years of Bush Rule, and this is our reward?

there are plenty of qualified leaders; however, with the system we have in place...the qualified leaders don't want to endure 2 years of having your name, family, ideas dragged through the mud. It takes a special person (read: egomaniac) to want to endure that. Plus, how much can they really lead once they are in control; with all the bureaucracy and politiking that must be done it's a wonder they do anything at all. You can't lead when the system isn't set up for you to lead. The system is set up for you to continue "winning", as long as you pander to those who donate the most. I posted this quote in the "quotes thread" and I think it hits the nail on the head.... Every two years the American politics industry fills the airwaves with the most virulent, scurrilous, wall-to-wall character assassination of nearly every political practitioner in the country - and then declares itself puzzled that America has lost trust in its politicians. ~Charles Krauthammer

edit: and the only ones who can truly make a change are the people we put in those positions. if we want honesty in washington, we have to hold people accountable for their actions (or inaction)

decides2dream

i thought the choices much, much worse in 2004! i am actually pleased this time around, feel like i actually get to vote FOR a candidate rather than simply trying at all costs to get an idiot out of office.

ledvedderman

unsung wrote:

Ron Paul can out-debate just about everyone

Really? I thought besides Fred Thompson, Ron Paul was clearly the worst debater out of both parties. He presents himself as almost a lunatic (which none of us would agree with, but that is how he presents himself in debates).

The only thing I think of when watching Ron Paul debate is, "PLAYOFFS!?!?!"
http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i2/ksp113/JimMoraRant1.jpg

MrBrian

Pacomc79 wrote:

Oh I think there are plenty of qualified leaders... they just don't have the connections and can't raise the money.

That's exactly it.

Its Evolution Baby

decides2dream wrote:

i thought the choices much, much worse in 2004! i am actually pleased this time around, feel like i actually get to vote FOR a candidate rather than simply trying at all costs to get an idiot out of office.

This is how I feel actually. I think this is the best two candidates we have had in the last 20 years, only because unlike most people here I have some respect for McCain as a person:

1988: Bush Sr. Vs. Dukakis

1992:Bush Sr. Vs Clinton Vs. Perot

1996: Clinton Vs. Dole

2000: Gore Vs. W. Bush Vs. Nader

2004: W. Bush Vs. Kerry

2008: McCain Vs. Obama

decides2dream

Its Evolution Baby wrote:

This is how I feel actually. I think this is the best two candidates we have had in the last 20 years, only because unlike most people here I have some respect for McCain as a person:

1988: Bush Sr. Vs. Dukakis

1992:Bush Sr. Vs Clinton Vs. Perot

1996: Clinton Vs. Dole

2000: Gore Vs. W. Bush Vs. Nader

2004: W. Bush Vs. Kerry

2008: McCain Vs. Obama

well i'd not personally say that. just that 2004 sucked. although i had not thought so far back to 1988....my first presidential election actually. perhaps why i don't look at it negatively, being my first time to vote...but yea....kinda crap choices then too. it's just that with sooooo MUCH at stake in 2004, i could NOT believe we couldn't do better with better candidates, better choices. i think we also had a lot of interesting candidates up to nomination time, period.

Abookamongstthemany

Pacomc79 wrote:

Oh I think there are plenty of qualified leaders... they just don't have the connections and can't raise the money.

That's it plain and simple.

blackredyellow

Pacomc79 wrote:

Oh I think there are plenty of qualified leaders... they just don't have the connections and can't raise the money.

And as someone mentioned before, it's about ego...

All of the people who I consider great leaders that I've personally come across with in my life (playing sports, at school, at work, etc.), none of them went out of their way to get into a leadership role. They went about their business, but naturally stepped up when the opportunity/situation arised.