Does thinking Frank Zappa sucks mean that I'm uptight?

sponger

I apologize if this doesn't rest well with certain forum members, but I can't help but think his music is some of the lamest music I've ever heard. I don't understand the popularity.

I guess he's trying to be funny, and I can see how if someone were really, really coked up and otherwise had lived a sheltered life, there might be a fascination. I like to think that I have an open mind about things, but I honestly feel like I need to take a scalding hot shower so I can feel "clean" again after having just sat through his greatest hits album.

Or, maybe I'm just uptight, cranky, and closed-minded?

What are your thoughts?

MonsterOfTheMidway

It means that the music is obviously above you and you should just keep listening to Nirvana, PJ, and Alice In Chains cause it's probably more on your level.

Jack_C_Gregory

sponger wrote:

I need to take a scalding hot shower so I can feel "clean" again after having just sat through his greatest hits album.

I think that's your first problem. I don't think one greatest hits CD can capture the material or the sense of the man.(especially since there are close to 100 CDs of his material out there.)

On the other hand, he was titled, "King of the Wierdos" so I could see where the average joe might have difficult getting into it.

His music covered so many avenues, so for me personally it is very hit or miss. I would suggest listening to some of the albums instead of a greatest hits compilation.

But I wouldn't say you're uptight.

Mohab

horrible stuff. ill go back to listening to alice mud garden now.

the wolf

MonsterOfTheMidway wrote:

It means that the music is obviously above you and you should just keep listening to Nirvana, PJ, and Alice In Chains cause it's probably more on your level.

yeah cause singing about "yellow snow" is sooooo freaking deep !


i get it, i even like most of his stuff. but your comment was not needed.

Evacuation Rules

Zappa's greatest hits album isn't very comprehensive. It focuses on his most commercial and humorous stuff, which I find to be mostly stupid and unfunny. That's only a small aspect of his work though. You're talking about a guy who put out 73 albums, and a 12-track greatest hits album put out by his record company against his wishes just isn't gonna cut it. I personally listen mostly to his instrumental material and stuff from 72-75 (his "jazz-funk" period). His concerts are very fun if you're familiar with his catalog. Some tours he did the same setlist every night, others he totally mixed it up like Pearl Jam. It depended on the scope and skill of his band at the time. Any live material with Vinnie Colaiuta on drums is a must hear, such as "Shut Up And Play Yer Guitar", an album of live guitar solos. Grateful Dead and Phish fans should listen to that album if they want to hear some REAL jamming.

nothinghead

I don't know, I dig Zappa as a musician. Certainly respect him as an artist too. His instrumental stuff is pretty exceptional and worth checking out.

That said, I can't ever remember reaching for one of his records or thinking, "man, when I get home, I'm gonna throw some Zappa on."

Also, it's music. It's subjective. If one musician or band ain't your thing, there's a million others who just might be. I don't think you ever have to justify your taste, you know?

The Vacant

The only time Zappa didn't write intentionally dumb lyrics was when he was doing sociatal satire, and even then he dumbed it up. The beauty of Zappa isn't in the lyrics, it's in the music. Check out the album Hot Rats.

dunkman

uptight? no it doesnt mean that... it does mean you have full function of your hearing though.

Zappa is Crappa.

Evacuation Rules

dunkman wrote:

uptight? no it doesnt mean that... it does mean you have full function of your hearing though.

Zappa is Crappa.

Oh really, genius? Which of his 74 albums have you heard? (My guess is none.)

dunkman

JWBusher wrote:

Oh really, genius? Which of his 74 albums have you heard? (My guess is none.)

74? i thought he had released 90.. pffft call yourself a fan.

wcsmith

Zappa, by his own design, has a pretty limited audience. Granted, there are a multitude of styles represented in his catalogue, but his "Greatest Hits" do indeed play like a less-funny Weird Al with a pretentious spirit. But, if you go beyond that, you will find a razor-sharp satirist (Trouble Every Day, Flakes, the entire "Only In It For The Money", etc.), a first-rate guitarist (Black Napkins, Willie the Pimp, Shut Up and Play Yer Guitar, etc.), a well-respected jazz musician (Hot Rats, The Grand Wazoo, Waka/Jawaka), a talented composer, a terrific band leader, etc. Zappa was a genius - and a very involved voice politically (I can only dream about what his output would have been during the Bush years).

There are several reasons why Zappa has a limited audience, despite his talent.

1) He was heavily influenced by Edward Varese, who was willfully obtuse and harsh.

2) He was influenced by Doo Wop music, as well as jazz, which when combined with his Varese influence, produced some really bizarre music.

3) He recorded and released almost every musical impulse he ever had, including dumb toilet humor.

4) That dumb toilet humor (with pretty awesome music supporting it) was the most accesible aspect of Zappa's music and appeals to a large portion of the general public, so "Yellow Snow" becomes the most well-known song and does damage to Zappa's reputation to some extent. If only Inca Roads had become the most popular...

I would suggest listening to Hot Rats or One Size Fits All as a way of getting into Zappa's more "serious" stuff...

catefrances

sponger wrote:

I apologize if this doesn't rest well with certain forum members, but I can't help but think his music is some of the lamest music I've ever heard. I don't understand the popularity.

I guess he's trying to be funny, and I can see how if someone were really, really coked up and otherwise had lived a sheltered life, there might be a fascination. I like to think that I have an open mind about things, but I honestly feel like I need to take a scalding hot shower so I can feel "clean" again after having just sat through his greatest hits album.

Or, maybe I'm just uptight, cranky, and closed-minded?

What are your thoughts?

im still getting over the fact that the man didnt do drugs.

Mike_Muse_Rage

I've only got the Greatest Hits and it blows my mind. The instrumental concepts are incredible. It's also quite funny.

keeponrockin

Go see the Zappa plays Zappa tour. I was not familiar with Frank's music, but was absolutley blown away with how amazing it was.

Jeremy1012

Some of his instrumental stuff, particularly his early stuff, is interesting from a compositional point-of-view although I'd much rather just listen to Varese and the jazz that Zappa was influenced by.

His poppy "funny" songs are best avoided like the plague.

And I've heard around 25-30 albums so is my opinion valid?

NewDamage

As a huge Zappa fan, I'll be the first to admit Frank had some ridiculous shit. At the same time, he is one of the most innovative musicians I have ever heard. Brilliant writer, amazing guitarist. Some of his music is dumb as hell lyrically, but at the same time its a musical mindfuck. It should be noted Frank did not care too much for singing, or putting lyrics to a song. He said in an interview that if people like to hear the human voice attached to music, he would write about what is relevant, or humourous, etc. to him. And people either get it or they don't.

One of his best "humourous" albums is Over-Nite Sensation. Crazy lyrics and over-the-top musicianship.

Zoot Allures has darker themes throughout, and is a good "more serious" Zappa record.

Someone mentioned Hot Rats...that is my fav. Zappa album and I recommend it to anyone.

Waka Jawaka and The Grand Wazoo are really good jazz-heavy instrumental albums.

But some people just can't get into Frank's music and that's fine. I've never liked Led Zeppelin

BinFrog

I am always torn on Zappa. I "get" him and his whole shtick. I've heard a ton of his material through friends. I own "Shut Up And Play Yer Guitar", and I listen to it occasionally. There's some interesting stuff on there and some cool jams, and the man is certainly a monster on guitar and a compositional master. I find it gets old after a couple of songs though. Unconventional compositions and song structures does not always translate to good music. And I really cannot stand 95% of his lyrical music. The whole "out there and goofy for the sake of bucking convention" gets old. It's like, we get it, you're "weird". He's not a novelty act (a la Weird Al) but he tries treading that line between goofy and artistic and rugged individualist and it just becomes tiresome. Much like some other bands, I "get" him but I don't dig him a whole lot. I do, however, respect the hell out of his "I do it my way" attitude. Yeah, his antics get old, but the man bowed to no-one. That I commend.

That being said, Trey Anastasio owes a lot of his sound and approach to Zappa, and I love Phish. Go figure. Phish just makes good music. And their jams take me places Zappa never can.

zircona1

For anyone curious about Zappa, I always recommend starting at Freak Out! and Absolutely Free. That's where I started, b/c I thought his song titles were funny, and both I think are pretty accessible. The You Can't Do That On Stage Anymore live albums (there are 6 volumes of em) are also a great introduction. I've got a lot of songs from those on my iPod.

I prefer his albums where he mixes songs he sings as well as instrumentals. I can only take so much of his instrumentals at one time, if he does a really long solo or several in a row I get bored. I respect him for his musicianship, his sense of humor and he seemed like a pretty interesting guy (read "The Frank Zappa Book" for more, it's great).

And did you know that he couldn't play guitar and sing at the same time? He had to do one or the other.

Evacuation Rules

Another thing about Zappa is that a surprisingly small amount of video exists from his concerts. It also doesn't help that in two of the most common Zappa videos (Halloween 81 and Jones Beach 84), he and his band look totally gay, which wasn't usually the case.

weekapaug19

go listen to Inca Roads and then make your judgement

Cob

It's amazing to me how many people on this BB seem to care what other people think about their taste in music, come on, if you don't like Zappa you don't like Zappa, not everyone likes every band or musician. It just like the "I am the only one who doesn't like My Morning Jacket and KOL" thread, listen to the bands you like and don't listen to the ones you don't like, seems pretty easy to me. Oh and BTW I've been a huge Zappa fan since Jr. High as my friends older brothers had several of his Lp's that we would listen to, it's an acquired taste for sure to say the least and there are plenty of people out there that don't care for him so you aren't alone.

Wobbie

The Vacant wrote:

Check out the album Hot Rats.

Hell, yeah!

Snake

WEll I dont think the greatest hits album is very good (aside from the muffin man, thats pure genius :cool: )

Some of the songs arent so great, but remember he also wrote orchestral music, and jazz music. Pick up Apostrophe' that is a great album. The title song is an awesome instrumental :cool:


Otherwise your just an uptight musically bland person jk

Bushleaguer28

First off, NO Zappa GH can do justice to his work as a musician and composer. In order to truly understand his work, you need to listen to each record start to finish.

Second, I dont think that not liking Zappa makes you "uptight." HIs music is not for everyone as it is an incredibly unique sound. But feeling "dirty" after listening does make you uptight. If you cant see the tongue in cheek humor of his music then you dont have a very good sense of humor. Very few of his lyrics are meant to be taken seriously.

His early solo work which includes a lot of unbelievable and timeless instrumental stuff such as Peaches en Regalia etc. is all about music and composition. Frank is probably one of the most underrated and underappreciated guitarists of all time. There are very few guitarists who can touch him. His later work is when his lyrics started getting pornographic - personally i think his instrumental stuff and guitar work are far superior to his later work but its still amazing nonetheless IMO.

Nobody will ever be able to replicate what Zappa did. As far as music and composition goes he is as close to a genius as the world of music has seen in a long time.

hoopinman

JWBusher wrote:

Any live material with Vinnie Colaiuta on drums is a must hear, such as "Shut Up And Play Yer Guitar", an album of live guitar solos. Grateful Dead and Phish fans should listen to that album if they want to hear some REAL jamming.

that has to be one of the dumbest things to ever read in here. Most Phish fans and deadheads understand Zappa and appreciate what he did for American music. Phish has always considered Frank Zappa as one of their biggest influences, and anyone who really listens to Phish can see and hear that in their music.


personally my fave era of Franks was the band that recorded Apostrophe with Napolean Murphy Brock, George Duke, Tom Fowler,Ruth Underwood and Ainsley Dunbar.

Im also a big Terry Bozzio fan so that gets me goin too!

Cob

Words can't even describe it to me anyway.........



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kBQPkLuwy80

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ybG_mXqTp7E


You can see Eddie Vedder and Neil Young on this clip

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H_McaUor0G0&feature=related

Strangest Tribe

it's hard to get into Zappa without context. A greatest hits album isn't the way to go. Some of it sounds cheesy now but back in the day Zappa was huge the way some indie bands are today. Some of the stuff was more relevant to the time it was recorded. Most of the Mothers albums are great and should be listened to completely.

R.I.P..... Jimmy Carl Black