In this case, we get really pissed off quickly by crap sounding audio signals, which is yet another reason to buy and own the best you can afford, preferably with lots of headroom.
Yup. Headroom is the key to this thread really. If you want distortion, you want an amp with low headroom (preferably a tube amp for tube distortion). If you want clean sounds and no distortion, you want a ton of headroom.
The cleaner the sound, the less likely people are to react to it as being loud. So ironically a 1 watt amp will anoy people more often than a louder more powerful one. Then again it will also distort more easily... and since the name of this thread was distortion without using a distortion pedal... that's the deal right there. If you want distortion without a distortion pedal... get an amp with low headroom.
Yeah, or get a multichannel amp with distortion channels built in that will break up early at low volumes. This is why I have my H&K Triamp, and I'm a Mesa loving freak. It's also why I am after a Mesa Triaxis.
Seeing as how these attenuators seem to run between $300-600, i think I'll buy a practice amp
Camden I '06, Camden II '06, Bonnaroo '08, Camden I '08, Camden II '08, Philly Spectrum II/III/IV '09, MSG I '10, MSG II '10, Made In America '12, Wrigley '13, Brooklyn II '13, Philly I '13, Philly II '13, ...
Seeing as how these attenuators seem to run between $300-600, i think I'll buy a practice amp
Yeah, trouble is, you are used to tubes now, and you probbaly aren't gonna like the tone or lack of feel in a cheap solid state practice amp, but hey, it's not a bad idea.
One thing I've been wondering about during this thread is if anyone has had a chance to check out those Fender Deluxe COSM Boss pedals yet? (There was a recent thread about them... These things: )
One thing I've been wondering about during this thread is if anyone has had a chance to check out those Fender Deluxe COSM Boss pedals yet? (There was a recent thread about them... These things: )
I mean... I know there's no way it's going to give "Insta Neil Young tone" but I'm still curious.
NO, cos'm not really into pedals or Fender for that matter, but you have to wonder how the tone of a "covetted tube amp" famous for it's touch responsiveness makes it's way into a little box like that. More magic of marketting perhaps, or maybe a close digital guess.
One thing I've been wondering about during this thread is if anyone has had a chance to check out those Fender Deluxe COSM Boss pedals yet? (There was a recent thread about them... These things: )
Of course you still won't have the wizzer, or the broken firebird pickup in the ancient Les Paul or the Tweed Deluxe, but you'll definately be soloing to down by the river.
The amp in a box thing is well done by the V-Stack line of pedals. They are intended for direct computer recording if that's your fancy.
My Girlfriend said to me..."How many guitars do you need?" and I replied...."How many pairs of shoes do you need?" She got really quiet.
Of course you still won't have the wizzer, or the broken firebird pickup in the ancient Les Paul or the Tweed Deluxe, but you'll definately be soloing to down by the river.
The amp in a box thing is well done by the V-Stack line of pedals. They are intended for direct computer recording if that's your fancy.
Dude you so rock! Two amazing looking pedal manufacturers I had not heard of before! Thanks!!!!
Hey, no-one got my joke ............."cos'm not into pedals"...............cmon, someone laugh !!!
I have an amp in a box, it's just a big heavy box !!
D'oh. Nice. Man... I feel brain dead. I actually read it a couple of times and was like ... "oh well... some kind of typo". Ouch. Feelin' kinda stiff and startchy now.
Hey this thread worked out really well for me. I went down to a local music store here in NYC... 30th street guitars to check out a Durham Crazy Horse. When I got there I noticed they had a used SIB Varidrive on hand. So I tried them both out. The Crazy Horse is a veeeerrry cool pedal. But the SIB is just a CLASSIC. So I picked it up. Awesome, awesome tone.
So why was it this thread was focused on distortion without pedals again?
Those SIB pedals are just amazing, and getting harder to find. I highly recommend checking them out on the off chance anyone here doesn't know them already. Honestly Neil tone isn't that much of stretch with the Varidrive. Now it's just a matter of getting that slightly screwy Firebird pick up...
NO, cos'm not really into pedals or Fender for that matter, but you have to wonder how the tone of a "covetted tube amp" famous for it's touch responsiveness makes it's way into a little box like that. More magic of marketting perhaps, or maybe a close digital guess.
Just wondering kind of guitars you play
Camden I '06, Camden II '06, Bonnaroo '08, Camden I '08, Camden II '08, Philly Spectrum II/III/IV '09, MSG I '10, MSG II '10, Made In America '12, Wrigley '13, Brooklyn II '13, Philly I '13, Philly II '13, ...
Those SIB pedals are just amazing, and getting harder to find. I highly recommend checking them out on the off chance anyone here doesn't know them already. Honestly Neil tone isn't that much of stretch with the Varidrive. Now it's just a matter of getting that slightly screwy Firebird pick up...
I never heard of those before... but now me wants one.
Eh, it's not going to sound any good through my Vox AD30VT anyway, so I should just leave it.
It's a town full of losers and I'm pulling out of here to win
I never heard of those before... but now me wants one.
Eh, it's not going to sound any good through my Vox AD30VT anyway, so I should just leave it.
Oh yes it is. The reason I felt comfortable just plunking down the dough on one of these was because I had a friend once who used one with a crate VC 15. Now that was actually a kind of underated amp. It had and has nice tubes, and he got it ... going back to some of the earlier posts here about trying to get tube distortion in the home... so he could... get it to break up and distort in his appartment since he couldn't crank his more powerful marshal...
Anyway... the dude was actually primarily a drummer, so he wasn't a great guitar player . But one night he used the Varidrive with his VC15 down low hile was just fooling around... One thing I forgot to mention is though he got the VC15 to so he could "crank it" ... just as everyone has been mentioning in this thread... he found he couldn't really turn it up because if he did he'd get evicted. So he had the amp down rather low, and he was kind of plinking notes while I was playing.... When he did I just stoped and looked at the Valvetronix because it was making his plinks sound like something off Neil's "Dead man" soundtrack.
So I always remembered that blue box, and instantly recognized it when I saw it behind glass today at the store.
Anyway today I tried it (and the Crazy horse) out with a Roland JC 90. That's a pretty great amp... but solid solid solid state. (as mentioned the crate vc15 was tube). Anyway when I plugged it in to the roland solid state today... same thing.as when I first heard my friend play it thru his crate. It just turned that small amp into a seething distorting tube machine.
Actually I just got done putting it thru it's paces this evening here in my pad. I played it to a stereo spliter, and part was going to a tube amp... but part was going to my roland jc 120 and it sounded... reeeaaallly nice. Even though I play on those amps i mentioned, they are both literally at about "1" ... anymore than that and I'll be evicted.
But the Valvedrive has a seperate volume and drive knobs... so you can peg the drive, and keep the volume low. I mean... it's still going to feel kind of neutered... because... it's not shakin' yer clothes when ya play... but still... in terms of making the best of reality... it sure is a solid improvement over cold tubes and solid state.
The only problem is they are discontinued... but really recently... so some places (online) still sell them.
I honestly think they will go up in value... but who knows.
Anyway they go for about the same as the crazy horse. So not cheap... but definately if you ever have the chance to at least hear one check it out.
Hey lucylespian... I remember stalking a few H&K Tubemans on ebay a few years ago... and dreaming about the Triaxis at the same time. I'd be curious to know what you play too if you don't mind sharing.
Varidrive.... score! I don't know if they are even making pedals right now.
I know a couple of years ago when the guys at Matchless got in a tift and split up Mark Samson worked with the SIB guy and they created the SMF (sonic machine factory) 15 watter. It was a pretty cool amp.
The varidrive is a really nice pedal.
Since we're talking about distortion not using pedals I kind of want to cheat a little bit and introduce the Stage Hog from stephenson amps in canada.
Varidrive.... score! I don't know if they are even making pedals right now.
I know a couple of years ago when the guys at Matchless got in a tift and split up Mark Samson worked with the SIB guy and they created the SMF (sonic machine factory) 15 watter. It was a pretty cool amp.
The varidrive is a really nice pedal.
Since we're talking about distortion not using pedals I kind of want to cheat a little bit and introduce the Stage Hog from stephenson amps in canada.
Enharmonic has one, it can be used as a tube pedal or an amplifier and it's got power scaling. It's a damn cool little box.
Wow... that thing looks really interesting. Thanks again so much for sharing. I've picked up a lot of info from you on this thread. I probably wouldn't have the valvedrive right now if I hadn't been looking to try the Crazy Horse... which I still might try to pick up some day when the financial batteries have recharged a bit.
Really cool gear you've help shine a light on. Much appreciated.
Wow... that thing looks really interesting. Thanks again so much for sharing. I've picked up a lot of info from you on this thread. I probably wouldn't have the valvedrive right now if I hadn't been looking to try the Crazy Horse... which I still might try to pick up some day when the financial batteries have recharged a bit.
Really cool gear you've help shine a light on. Much appreciated.
no worries, very cool you found the SIB. It just goes to show the hundreds of ways we can get to the tone we love. Kind of cool really.
My Girlfriend said to me..."How many guitars do you need?" and I replied...."How many pairs of shoes do you need?" She got really quiet.
I've been thinkning about this thread and it ocurred to me that none of us have asked GIven tio CArve why he does not want to use a pedal. Personally I don't use em, cos I don't like the way they make your volume jump around and more junj to set up and manage, plus I am lucky to have amps that don't need em, and space to crank em in.
Is it just that you don't have one, don't want one, or just looking to get the best outa your new tubes, without polluting the signal with ss or digital processing ??
BTW IdGot I, iam am loading some pics on photobucket soon, I'll stat a new thread for some sharing so you can find it easy.
There is a Triaxis on ebay going off in afew hrs, BUT I went shopping yesterday and bought a new giut, so I'm probably gonna blow that. You would love the amp I was playing through yesterday.
I've been thinkning about this thread and it ocurred to me that none of us have asked GIven tio CArve why he does not want to use a pedal. Personally I don't use em, cos I don't like the way they make your volume jump around and more junj to set up and manage, plus I am lucky to have amps that don't need em, and space to crank em in.
Is it just that you don't have one, don't want one, or just looking to get the best outa your new tubes, without polluting the signal with ss or digital processing ??
BTW IdGot I, iam am loading some pics on photobucket soon, I'll stat a new thread for some sharing so you can find it easy.
There is a Triaxis on ebay going off in afew hrs, BUT I went shopping yesterday and bought a new giut, so I'm probably gonna blow that. You would love the amp I was playing through yesterday.
I considered getting a Fulltone OCD, but the reason I asked about this is because prior to buying my ycv40wr, i read a lot about the "classic rock-like" overdrive and the old fender type of sound, so i wanted to see what the amp itself has to offer. After some experimenting, I like what I hear from the amp and I'm not sure I'm going to get a pedal.
Camden I '06, Camden II '06, Bonnaroo '08, Camden I '08, Camden II '08, Philly Spectrum II/III/IV '09, MSG I '10, MSG II '10, Made In America '12, Wrigley '13, Brooklyn II '13, Philly I '13, Philly II '13, ...
I considered getting a Fulltone OCD, but the reason I asked about this is because prior to buying my ycv40wr, i read a lot about the "classic rock-like" overdrive and the old fender type of sound, so i wanted to see what the amp itself has to offer. After some experimenting, I like what I hear from the amp and I'm not sure I'm going to get a pedal.
Awesome, there ani't nothing like tube tone. MOst pedals are solid state of course.
I am gonna try changing the tubes in my "clean" amp to EL34 to get some more grit there. Is yours running 6V6 or EL84 ?
There are the specs. I didn't see anything about either EL84 or 6v6
Camden I '06, Camden II '06, Bonnaroo '08, Camden I '08, Camden II '08, Philly Spectrum II/III/IV '09, MSG I '10, MSG II '10, Made In America '12, Wrigley '13, Brooklyn II '13, Philly I '13, Philly II '13, ...
Believe me, when I was growin up, I thought the worst thing you could turn out to be was normal, So I say freaks in the most complementary way. Here's a song by a fellow freak - E.V
Cool, 6V6 is the lower power version of teh 6L6, with similar sound charatertistics. If you want a crunchier sound, you can change to EL84, which are teh lower power version of teh El34, which are teh classic Marshall/British tube. The amp will need to be re-biased but it's something to think about. It's kind of an easy econimical mod which doesn't materaily vchange the amp.
I think it's cool you found the sweet spot on your traynor!
Before you buy any overdrive or distortion pedals, you should put that amp through the test. You have to crank up the thing to five and above, then work around to find those sweet spots. That's where my favorite sounds are. Right at the edge where it grinds when you play harder, and cleans up when you back off a bit.
That's why an attenuator can work fine at home. You get those power tubes working.
One thing I do now, is use a delay or looper pedal. You play what you want into it, then let it repeat and twiddle with the amp knobs. That way you just sit down and twiddle. It gets you close, then you can refine with your guitar and pickups feeding back, and bothering the neighbors.
THEN you look for effects after that.
The other thing that you have to remember to get good Neil Young sound is that he uses that bigsby and his finger vibrato very subtly, like a flanger, and that octave divider and a bit of delay add to some those big sounds, too.
Be kind, man
Don't be mankind. ~Captain Beefheart
__________________________________
Comments
Yup. Headroom is the key to this thread really. If you want distortion, you want an amp with low headroom (preferably a tube amp for tube distortion). If you want clean sounds and no distortion, you want a ton of headroom.
The cleaner the sound, the less likely people are to react to it as being loud. So ironically a 1 watt amp will anoy people more often than a louder more powerful one. Then again it will also distort more easily... and since the name of this thread was distortion without using a distortion pedal... that's the deal right there. If you want distortion without a distortion pedal... get an amp with low headroom.
Yeah, trouble is, you are used to tubes now, and you probbaly aren't gonna like the tone or lack of feel in a cheap solid state practice amp, but hey, it's not a bad idea.
I got my Weber MiniMass for $100. http://www.tedweber.com/atten.htm
BUT if you need a practice amp, I have a Vox Valvetronix 15w amp for sale.
http://www.bossus.com/index.asp?pg=1&tmp=163
I mean... I know there's no way it's going to give "Insta Neil Young tone" but I'm still curious.
NO, cos'm not really into pedals or Fender for that matter, but you have to wonder how the tone of a "covetted tube amp" famous for it's touch responsiveness makes it's way into a little box like that. More magic of marketting perhaps, or maybe a close digital guess.
It's cute marketing really, but they probably give a pretty decent fenderish tone if that's all you're looking for.
check out the lovepedal woodrow (5E3) http://www.lovepedal.com
and http://www.durhamelectronics.com/ the crazy horse for some instant neil young tones.
Of course you still won't have the wizzer, or the broken firebird pickup in the ancient Les Paul or the Tweed Deluxe, but you'll definately be soloing to down by the river.
The amp in a box thing is well done by the V-Stack line of pedals. They are intended for direct computer recording if that's your fancy.
Dude you so rock! Two amazing looking pedal manufacturers I had not heard of before! Thanks!!!!
I have an amp in a box, it's just a big heavy box !!
ha ha, I didn't read it too close, that was clever.
D'oh. Nice. Man... I feel brain dead. I actually read it a couple of times and was like ... "oh well... some kind of typo". Ouch. Feelin' kinda stiff and startchy now.
Hey this thread worked out really well for me. I went down to a local music store here in NYC... 30th street guitars to check out a Durham Crazy Horse. When I got there I noticed they had a used SIB Varidrive on hand. So I tried them both out. The Crazy Horse is a veeeerrry cool pedal. But the SIB is just a CLASSIC. So I picked it up. Awesome, awesome tone.
So why was it this thread was focused on distortion without pedals again?
Those SIB pedals are just amazing, and getting harder to find. I highly recommend checking them out on the off chance anyone here doesn't know them already. Honestly Neil tone isn't that much of stretch with the Varidrive. Now it's just a matter of getting that slightly screwy Firebird pick up...
Just wondering kind of guitars you play
I never heard of those before... but now me wants one.
Eh, it's not going to sound any good through my Vox AD30VT anyway, so I should just leave it.
Oh yes it is. The reason I felt comfortable just plunking down the dough on one of these was because I had a friend once who used one with a crate VC 15. Now that was actually a kind of underated amp. It had and has nice tubes, and he got it ... going back to some of the earlier posts here about trying to get tube distortion in the home... so he could... get it to break up and distort in his appartment since he couldn't crank his more powerful marshal...
Anyway... the dude was actually primarily a drummer, so he wasn't a great guitar player . But one night he used the Varidrive with his VC15 down low hile was just fooling around... One thing I forgot to mention is though he got the VC15 to so he could "crank it" ... just as everyone has been mentioning in this thread... he found he couldn't really turn it up because if he did he'd get evicted. So he had the amp down rather low, and he was kind of plinking notes while I was playing.... When he did I just stoped and looked at the Valvetronix because it was making his plinks sound like something off Neil's "Dead man" soundtrack.
So I always remembered that blue box, and instantly recognized it when I saw it behind glass today at the store.
Anyway today I tried it (and the Crazy horse) out with a Roland JC 90. That's a pretty great amp... but solid solid solid state. (as mentioned the crate vc15 was tube). Anyway when I plugged it in to the roland solid state today... same thing.as when I first heard my friend play it thru his crate. It just turned that small amp into a seething distorting tube machine.
Actually I just got done putting it thru it's paces this evening here in my pad. I played it to a stereo spliter, and part was going to a tube amp... but part was going to my roland jc 120 and it sounded... reeeaaallly nice. Even though I play on those amps i mentioned, they are both literally at about "1" ... anymore than that and I'll be evicted.
But the Valvedrive has a seperate volume and drive knobs... so you can peg the drive, and keep the volume low. I mean... it's still going to feel kind of neutered... because... it's not shakin' yer clothes when ya play... but still... in terms of making the best of reality... it sure is a solid improvement over cold tubes and solid state.
The only problem is they are discontinued... but really recently... so some places (online) still sell them.
I honestly think they will go up in value... but who knows.
Anyway they go for about the same as the crazy horse. So not cheap... but definately if you ever have the chance to at least hear one check it out.
Hey lucylespian... I remember stalking a few H&K Tubemans on ebay a few years ago... and dreaming about the Triaxis at the same time. I'd be curious to know what you play too if you don't mind sharing.
I know a couple of years ago when the guys at Matchless got in a tift and split up Mark Samson worked with the SIB guy and they created the SMF (sonic machine factory) 15 watter. It was a pretty cool amp.
The varidrive is a really nice pedal.
Since we're talking about distortion not using pedals I kind of want to cheat a little bit and introduce the Stage Hog from stephenson amps in canada.
http://www.stephensonamps.com/stagehog.htm
Enharmonic has one, it can be used as a tube pedal or an amplifier and it's got power scaling. It's a damn cool little box.
Wow... that thing looks really interesting. Thanks again so much for sharing. I've picked up a lot of info from you on this thread. I probably wouldn't have the valvedrive right now if I hadn't been looking to try the Crazy Horse... which I still might try to pick up some day when the financial batteries have recharged a bit.
Really cool gear you've help shine a light on. Much appreciated.
no worries, very cool you found the SIB. It just goes to show the hundreds of ways we can get to the tone we love. Kind of cool really.
Is it just that you don't have one, don't want one, or just looking to get the best outa your new tubes, without polluting the signal with ss or digital processing ??
BTW IdGot I, iam am loading some pics on photobucket soon, I'll stat a new thread for some sharing so you can find it easy.
There is a Triaxis on ebay going off in afew hrs, BUT I went shopping yesterday and bought a new giut, so I'm probably gonna blow that. You would love the amp I was playing through yesterday.
I considered getting a Fulltone OCD, but the reason I asked about this is because prior to buying my ycv40wr, i read a lot about the "classic rock-like" overdrive and the old fender type of sound, so i wanted to see what the amp itself has to offer. After some experimenting, I like what I hear from the amp and I'm not sure I'm going to get a pedal.
I am gonna try changing the tubes in my "clean" amp to EL34 to get some more grit there. Is yours running 6V6 or EL84 ?
There are the specs. I didn't see anything about either EL84 or 6v6
Before you buy any overdrive or distortion pedals, you should put that amp through the test. You have to crank up the thing to five and above, then work around to find those sweet spots. That's where my favorite sounds are. Right at the edge where it grinds when you play harder, and cleans up when you back off a bit.
That's why an attenuator can work fine at home. You get those power tubes working.
One thing I do now, is use a delay or looper pedal. You play what you want into it, then let it repeat and twiddle with the amp knobs. That way you just sit down and twiddle. It gets you close, then you can refine with your guitar and pickups feeding back, and bothering the neighbors.
THEN you look for effects after that.
The other thing that you have to remember to get good Neil Young sound is that he uses that bigsby and his finger vibrato very subtly, like a flanger, and that octave divider and a bit of delay add to some those big sounds, too.
Don't be mankind. ~Captain Beefheart
__________________________________