Are Gibson necks really THIS weak??

stylo17

http://www.edroman.com/rants/les_paul_necks.htm

just asking

Julien

I've only seen one broken neck in my life and it was the one of a friend's gibson

PearlJamaholic

well if thats true im glad i bought a fender as my first guitar, cause i sure was hard on it. doesnt seem like a les paul would have been able to take that abuse.

ianvomsaal

stylo17 wrote:

Are Gibson necks really THIS weak??
http://www.edroman.com/rants/les_paul_necks.htm
just asking

Yeah Build-Wise . . .
Gibson guitars (compared to other makes) are fairly crappy - Agreeing with the article, yes Gibson are way overpriced and incorrectly
made. Now I won't say that I don't own a few Les Paul's & SG's myself (yes I do own quite a few of each & I LOVE my Gibson's), but
I wouldn't pay over $3k or $4k for either make anymore (it's a widely known reality that Gibson makes some of the most overpriced
crap on the market - and especially their acoustic guitars - and Gibson's quality controle, my goodness it's ALL really bad news).

Most Pro players that play Gibson on a fairly regular basis are actually given their guitar by Gibson as a marketing tool, because it helps
fule that Gibson fire for desire (or it's a fairly old Gibson with great sounding pickups that's worth a ton of money). It was funny to read
that Rick Turner worked for Gibson and saved the company from bankruptcy by basically signing Slash up as a Gibson Endorser "Without
Slash, Gibson would have finally gone the way of the dodo" - But I'll add this to the equation, Slash's original Les Paul (that he used to
record "Appetite For Destruction") wasn't a real Gibson LP - it was NOT an RI - it was actually a "custom built" knock-off of a '59 Les Paul).
Speaking of RI's, on to those Gibson Custom-Shop Re-Issues - Take a hard look at the prices of all those Re-Issues (ridiculous) - the RI's
are basically status symbols for people with money to burn (more-so than anything else). For that kind of money you can actually get a
real custom-built guitar, or maybe even a PRS that's actually hand signed by Mr. Paul Reed Smith himself (it'll honestly be a much better
built & a much better playing guitar all around). Now I'm not saying that I don't like the looks of some of those Gibson Re-Issues - the RI
that lucylespian has is a really beautiful guitar, but would I pay that kind of money for it? NEVER!!! As I said, all of those RI's are seriously
overpriced, and as I've said, there are much better instruments on the market today for that kind of money.

This is why I recently said that I've been lusting after a PRS SC-245 - this PRS SC has the same basic look as a Gibson Les Paul, but it's a
much better guitar all around (better wood, better design, better build, better balance, better playability, etc), and costs less than an RI.
Now I don't take to much stock in Ed Roman or his opinions about Gibson, but I do agree with some of what he says - Since this is coming
from me, what I've said can't be to much of a shocker (especially since my opinions lately seem to be exceedingly blunt and controversial).
But you asked - Cheers . . .

- Ian

8/14 UPDATE
I've personally had a couple issues with a few of my Gibson necks and headstocks getting hairline cracks from plain, old everyday use.
Also, the actual fretboard on an older '72 SG that I own has started to crack for no-good reason (I've never had any humidity issues,
and it's never taken a fall) - this is just a little heads up to fellow Gibson owners (not that Gibson's are the only makes prone to this).
I take very good care of all my guitars because I use them for studio work, but I've still developed some issues with a couple of mine.
It can happen no matter how well you treat your guitar (one little bump in the wrong place can develop a crack) - If it hasn't happened
to you yet, hopefully it won't, but I'd recommend keeping your fingers tightly crossed because it really sucks if it actually happens to you.

Piper At The Gates

Ed Roman is a Vegas huckster who basically had to leave Connecticut for many reasons I wont go into here. He owns several off-brand guitar names that he passes off as these great "Hand Built, Custom Guitars" that he sells for premium prices. He constantly puts down Gibson, Fender, and even the much worshiped Paul Reed Smith guitars, and builds up his "Far Superior", instruments. Don't believe it. I have been playing Gibsons for 36 years and have never had a neck break.

Django

I have a gibson les paul standard for a few years now and have had no trouble at all with it, (touch mahogany). I would always use one because they sound great.

I do agree, they are overpriced, and there are things gibson could change easily that would improve the design.

But that guy on the link is obviously trying to sell those other guitars...good luck to him.

exhausted

i had an 06 SG standard develop a hairline crack in the lacquer that seemed to be a harbinger of worse things to come. it wasn't a typical lacquer check, this was at the headstock on a guitar with no other checking.

but i have an 01 SG standard and a 96 LP custom that have been fine.

but when i was playing out and jamming etc, i will admit to being much rougher on my fenders because i was never worried about them going tits up.

i've heard tons of stories of SGs falling off guitar stands etc. and breaking at the headstock.

bootlegger10

exhausted wrote:

i had an 06 SG standard develop a hairline crack in the lacquer that seemed to be a harbinger of worse things to come. it wasn't a typical lacquer check, this was at the headstock on a guitar with no other checking.

but i have an 01 SG standard and a 96 LP custom that have been fine.

but when i was playing out and jamming etc, i will admit to being much rougher on my fenders because i was never worried about them going tits up.

i've heard tons of stories of SGs falling off guitar stands etc. and breaking at the headstock.

Yep. Had my Gibson studio crack towards the headstock twice. I'll give myself the benefit of the doubt on the first one because I did not know about strap locks. Second time, I should have bought strap locks.

All Those Yesterdays

I've always had concerns with the thinner neck joint gibsons, Juniors, SG's etc... But do not know. I have bigger problems with Gibson and how they threat mom and pa music stores.

JonnyPistachio

After this rocking, kick ass jam one day, I took my gibson by the neck and drilled it into my drummers bass drum. Right through the muthafucka! cut it in half...and my gibson was scratchless, shiney and just like outta the box.

JSP552003

never had a problem with the necks on my LP special (1997) or my SG (guessing mid 70's, not sure of the actual date, dad bought it used in 78)

kitfoo

What are you guys doing to your guitars to make the neck crack? It shouldn't just crack from playing it!

seanw1010

ed roman is a jackass. dont believe any of the shit on his website. he should never be allowed to talk about guitars.

and yes, the neck is the most poorly designed part of the les paul, but it isnt terrible. itcould use some work, but it isnt a defect that should be weighed against it if you are thinking of buying one. ive never actually talked to anyone in real life who's les paul neck broke.

12345AGNST1

My sister has a gibson. The neck broke on hers from carelessly dropping it. She then got it fixed and it broke again. One last time it was fixed. Guess what happened next? It broke again. How? from sitting in her guitar case for a year. One day she decided to play it for a change and it broke again just by picking it up.

MLC2006

I have a Les Paul Standard and an SG and have had no problems. however, I can't afford to replace a multi-thousand dollar guitar, so I don't throw them around like they were hammers. it probably has a lot to do with how you abuse them.

lucylespian

Norlin fixed the neck weakness by adding a volute, but everybody screamed blue-bloody murder, so they dropped the volute. Dunno why, my KH-2 has a lovely volute and it's very comfy to play. Damn purists !!
LP's only break when you drop them.
My old Ibanez acoustic has the same neck design as an LP. It broke once going through the windscreen of my car when I fell asleep at the wheel. I glued it back together with Araldite. A few years later, I was hitching with it, got out after a ride and leaned it against the car while I sorted my backpack, and the guy drove off, leaving my guitar to do a slo-mo dive to the ground, for another break. I glued it up again. That was 20 years ago, and it's still good.

Anon

stylo17 wrote:

http://www.edroman.com/rants/les_paul_necks.htm

just asking

Well, i've never dealt with him directly, but he does seem to get off on being controversial. He comes across as an arrogant jerk and he makes his products look good by bashing others, a practice I don't think much of.
He is extremely hypocrital. For instance, he is always complaining about ebay, yet he places items for bid there; he whines about music giants, yet his store is one. Most of the stuff he rants about doesn't upset me much and much of what he raves on about is old news to me, but i still think his site can be a very good source of information, if you take it with about a teaspoon of salt.

I have been playing gibsons for 13 years and never once had a problem.

Pacomc79

I've seen tons of broken head stocks but as a result of drops falls from stands and or user error.

I have beef with many of gibsons models in regards to quality vs value etc,but
I think it depends on the unit in question really.

Then if the neck is repaired it's a weak point from then on out. If the guitar is left for a long period with no humidity the glue can get brittle.

All I can say is that my Les Paul has not had an easy life whatsoever but the neck falling apart has never been an issue.

The body weighs a lot too (Especially LP Customs) and the physics of all that mass with the relatively thin headstock when crashed into a floor or a wall is bad news.

Django

I wonder will PJ be replacing all their Gibson's with Ed Roman guitars now?

gimmesometruth27

i have a gibson sg, les paul standard, les paul custom, and a flying v. i broke the headstock off of my standard when i was unloading after a gig a few years ago. i was just devestated as it was my first real LP and i had only had it for about a month. it fell from about the level of my knee, < 2 feet, and the headstock broke off. it was in its road case and it still broke. i paid about $130 to have it repaired and i think it plays better now than before it broke off. the sustain is dramatically improved. my tech did such an amazing job that you can't even tell that it was glued back on.

lps and sgs are known for this problem. my bass player's uncle is a vintage guitar dealer and he always said that a "les paul is not a les paul until the headstock has been glued back on."

ianvomsaal

ianvomsaal wrote:

Yeah Build-Wise . . .
Gibson guitars (compared to other makes) are fairly crappy - Agreeing with the article, yes Gibson are way overpriced and incorrectly
made. Now I won't say that I don't own a few Les Paul's & SG's myself (yes I do own quite a few of each & I LOVE my Gibson's), but
I wouldn't pay over $3k or $4k for either make anymore (it's a widely known reality that Gibson makes some of the most overpriced
crap on the market - and especially their acoustic guitars - and Gibson's quality controle, my goodness it's ALL really bad news).

Most Pro players that play Gibson on a fairly regular basis are actually given their guitar by Gibson as a marketing tool, because it helps
fule that Gibson fire for desire (or it's a fairly old Gibson with great sounding pickups that's worth a ton of money). It was funny to read
that Rick Turner worked for Gibson and saved the company from bankruptcy by basically signing Slash up as a Gibson Endorser "Without
Slash, Gibson would have finally gone the way of the dodo" - But I'll add this to the equation, Slash's original Les Paul (that he used to
record "Appetite For Destruction") wasn't a real Gibson LP - it was NOT an RI - it was actually a "custom built" knock-off of a '59 Les Paul).
Speaking of RI's, on to those Gibson Custom-Shop Re-Issues - Take a hard look at the prices of all those Re-Issues (ridiculous) - the RI's
are basically status symbols for people with money to burn (more-so than anything else). For that kind of money you can actually get a
real custom-built guitar, or maybe even a PRS that's actually hand signed by Mr. Paul Reed Smith himself (it'll honestly be a much better
built & a much better playing guitar all around). Now I'm not saying that I don't like the looks of some of those Gibson Re-Issues - the RI
that lucylespian has is a really beautiful guitar, but would I pay that kind of money for it? NEVER!!! As I said, all of those RI's are seriously
overpriced, and as I've said, there are much better instruments on the market today for that kind of money.

This is why I recently said that I've been lusting after a PRS SC-245 - this PRS SC has the same basic look as a Gibson Les Paul, but it's a
much better guitar all around (better wood, better design, better build, better balance, better playability, etc), and costs less than an RI.
Now I don't take to much stock in Ed Roman or his opinions about Gibson, but I do agree with some of what he says - Since this is coming
from me, what I've said can't be to much of a shocker (especially since my opinions lately seem to be exceedingly blunt and controversial).
But you asked - Cheers . . .

- Ian

8/14 UPDATE
I've personally had a couple issues with a few of my Gibson necks and headstocks getting hairline cracks from plain, old everyday use.
Also, the actual fretboard on an older '72 SG that I own has started to crack for no-good reason (I've never had any humidity issues,
and it's never taken a fall) - this is just a little heads up to fellow Gibson owners (not that Gibson's are the only makes prone to this).
I take very good care of all my guitars because I use them for studio work, but I've still developed some issues with a couple of mine.
It can happen no matter how well you treat your guitar (one little bump in the wrong place can develop a crack) - If it hasn't happened
to you yet, hopefully it won't, but I'd recommend keeping your fingers tightly crossed because it really sucks if it actually happens to you.

Pacomc79

so basically the moral of this thread.

If you find a Les Paul Custom or something out there that looks awesome...and it's at what looks like a bargain price in the guitar store. check the neck out really carefully before you buy it, chances are... it's got a headstock repair.

I've got a hairline crack on my headstock. I have no idea where it came from and it's never given me any trouble (about an inch long inside of the G string Tuning machine but it is disconcerting. I almost never play the thing anymore though so it mostly just sits in the closet while I sweat the finish off my 62RI Strat.

Lee M

If you're going to listen to anyone about guitars, please, for your own sake and everyone else's, let it be someone besides Ed Roman.

who's_pearljam?

Yup, let's not be listening to Ed Roman. That pic is not a typical neck break.

The old Gibson Les Pauls started with a 17 degree pitched back headstock. This left very little wood at the area around the nut where the neck meets the fingerboard, so they would fall off the stands, mostly on stage, and break.
Stages used to be cramped and full of wires and trip hazards with not as many guitar techs running back and forth taking care of guitars, so a lot of old Pauls and SG's fell and broke. :(

They changed the neck angle later and there was a little more wood to hold everything together, but Mahogany isn't structurally as strong as Maple, so you gotta take care of a Mahogany neck guitar.
A properly fixed neck IS stronger than new, though! If it's done right, the glue is stronger than the wood. I've fixed quite a few. You can put a couple of slips of wood called splines in to strengthen the joints when you fix them, too to beef up the joint.

I never broke a Gibson neck yet and well, I guess I have no plans to do it!