Vocal mic help

JonnyPistachio

I've been using a shure sm58 for live vocals in rehersal (We've only played 2 gigs). and I use it for some vocal recodring, but I've been looking to get another mic and was looking for some feedback if anyone here has used any of these:

Shure Beta 58A ($159)
Shure SM 86 ($179)
Shure Beta 87 ($250)

thanks in advance!

ianvomsaal

JonnyPistachio wrote:

I've been using a shure sm58 for live vocals in rehersal (We've only played 2 gigs). and I use it for some vocal recodring, but I've been looking to get another mic and was looking for some feedback if anyone here has used any of these:

Shure Beta 58A ($159)
Shure SM 86 ($179)
Shure Beta 87 ($250)

thanks in advance!

I've used both Beta58/87 in live shows, and like them fine, but I wouldn't necessarily recommend recording with them since they're more
of a live MIC, and not recording mics - what you're generally looking for is a "Large Diaphragm Condenser Microphone."
Many have a SWITCHABLE PAD, and many have a FREQUENCY RESPONSE of at least 20HZ to 20KHZ (or better)
The last Mic I used in the studio was a MANLEY GOLD REFERENCE, which had a frequency response of 10HZ to 30KHZ.
You can take a look at it here - click here: MANLEY GOLD REFERENCE.
For $250 you can find a better recording mic than any of those you listed.
Check this link out and I'm sure you'll find something that fits your budget: http://www.sweetwater.com/c105--Condenser_Microphones
Hope this helps - Cheers . . .

- Ian C.T. vom Saal

Guitarhero27

for the $250 range I would HIGHLY recommend the AT4040 (Audio Technica). The frequency response is great and really helped my band out when we were in a jam and needed a good mic to record some vocals.

check out http://www.myspace.com/thefifthnj

Everything you hear is using the AT4040 for vocals.

-Seth

mccreadyisgod

Well, the first thing to mention is that the SM86 and Beta 87 are both hand-held vocal condenser mics, which means they are a little more sensative to certain sounds, especially transients ("sss" sounds, etc). They tend to be pretty crisp, and are okay on feedback but not great. No better than your regular SM58. Good mics overall, but certainly not the greatest mic for every voice. Make sure that what you're plugging your mic into has "Phantom Power," it's a voltage supply that makes condenser mics work. If your mixer doesn't have phantom power (also commonly labeled as "48v" or "48volt") then these mics won't work for you.

The Beta 58 is a dynamic mic, like the regular SM58, but it has a tighter pickup pattern, which means it's better for feedback rejection. But that also means you really need to stay right in front of the mic. If you sing away from the mic, or sway side-to-side around a mic, it's not a good idea. But if you stay right on the mic, and want to eliminate some feedback issues, it's a good mic. While it is a dynamic, it's a lot brighter than a regular SM58, which can make some singers sound very harsh. Where the SM58 is very warm, the Beta 58 is kinda sharp. The Beta 57 is also pretty similar, but has a flat-face mic grill. I've used them live a ton, both personally and as an engineer, good mics.

As far as studio vs. live applications, most studio-recorded vocals use a large-diaphram side-address mic like the other ones mentioned by the other guys. I highly recommend the MXL/Marshall mics for those on a budget for recording applications. They're amazing mics for the price. These aren't at all appropriate for a live show, just studio work. If you want to spend a little more, the Blue Baby Bottle is a great mic for medium money. These are fairly fragile mics, so not for casual use! That being said, I've used an SM58 on studio recordings and loved it... Bono from U2 has used them for years in the studio, and Tom Petty was notorious for using SM57's for studio vocals. Use a pop-filter in front of either mic, and you can get some really nice recorded vocals. The same can be said of the Beta 87 or the SM86, which are condensers to boot.

If you want to get a new mic exclusively for practice and live shows, I also recommend the Audix OM7, which is on the expensive side, but is an amazing mic with excellent feedback rejection. Eddie has used one for years and years, and I've used one off and on for a while, too. I would seriously recommend going to a store that deals with several of these mics, as well as others, and sing through them to see which one catches your fancy.

If you could clarify some things, we could maybe help more... are you looking for a new live mic, a recording mic, or one that can do well at both? What singer would you compare your vocal range to, or have other people compared your singing to?

Appendix:

MXL mics-
http://www.musiciansfriend.com/navigation/mxl-microphone-live-sound-microphones?N=100001+304601+202555

Blue Baby Bottle-
http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/Blue-Baby-Bottle-Microphone?sku=279003

Audix OM7-
http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/Audix-OM7-Microphone?sku=270654

Pop-filters!-
http://www.musiciansfriend.com/navigation/pop-filters-microphone-accessories?N=100001+330038

Pacomc79

Hi Dave, several questions,

Have you tried the Blue 8 Ball and what do you think of it?

and what about a ribbon mic?

JonnyPistachio

You all are a big help, thanks!

As we are just starting out, I'm not really sure what we need yet though. definitely something that we use mostly for live performances and under the $250-200 range.

I dont know how to describe my vocal range, maybe a little deeper bassy...but I have been pretty happy with my cheap old Shure sm58, except some minor feedback.

I have a lot to learn!

mccreadyisgod

Pacomc79 wrote:

Hi Dave, several questions,

Have you tried the Blue 8 Ball and what do you think of it?

and what about a ribbon mic?

Haven't tried any of the Blue ball-style mics. I'm sure there are some reviews out there, but they strike me as slightly gimmicky.

As far as a ribbon is concerned... they're terrible live-use mics, and for recording, they're polarizing. Either they fit your voice or they don't. And there are so many models out there, finding a ribbon that would fit your application would be overwhelming. Plus, they're incredibly fragile and need enormous gain from a very good, clean preamp. Not a great mic for a beginner or even intermediate musician.

JonnyPistachio wrote:

You all are a big help, thanks!

As we are just starting out, I'm not really sure what we need yet though. definitely something that we use mostly for live performances and under the $250-200 range.

I dont know how to describe my vocal range, maybe a little deeper bassy...but I have been pretty happy with my cheap old Shure sm58, except some minor feedback.

I have a lot to learn!

I'd seriously recommend the Audix OM7, then. It's great for baritone/bass vocals, and is extremely feedback-resistant. It's at the high end of your price range (usually around $230) but it's a great mic, and you can always sell it on eBay for close to it's original value if you don't like it. If there's a store near you that deals their mics, see if you can demo one.

That said, an SM58 will last you many years, and is a pretty decent mic. Unless it just isn't doing the job, you may be better off just sticking with that.

IDgotI

Studio Projects B1... I read this review:

http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/jun05/articles/studioprojectsb1.htm

and figured.... what the heck... $120? That's a pedal. Might as well give it a shot. I own an AKG c414b-xls... a very established pro level condensor usually running for around $800 new. There is no question that the 414 is the more neutral... but as the Sound on Sound article suggested, the difference between these two mics was a lot less substantial than I would have imagined based on price. They *are* different mics... I mention the 414 just to make sure to specify I've compared the B1 against an established and significant contender. The B1 is a thouroughly usable condensor mic. It is *far* more versatile and usable in my opinion than my Rode NT2, a more expensive mic with a much thinner and more grating sound. You could have a serious mic collection with Neumans and you would probably find situations in which you actually would choose the B1. That's not to say the B1 is *better* than a Neuman. Rather the B1 is a really usable mic with a quality that is quite pleasing and suits some situations like a glove. Maybe not as *many* as a Neuman (then again the fact that it's so cheap and easily replaced might make it a really good 'go to' mic in a lot of rough and tumble siutations)... but the point is to say that the B1 is a dandy mic even without any consideration about price... The fact that it just happens to be ultra cheap makes it a no brainer to give one a shot. Great on male vocs and as the review states... pretty amazing on accoustic guitars. A great way to pick up a cheap stereo mic pair as well for anyone out there looking for a budget stereo pair option.
Great mic.

JonnyPistachio

mccreadyisgod wrote:

I'd seriously recommend the Audix OM7, then. It's great for baritone/bass vocals, and is extremely feedback-resistant. It's at the high end of your price range (usually around $230) but it's a great mic, and you can always sell it on eBay for close to it's original value if you don't like it. If there's a store near you that deals their mics, see if you can demo one.

That said, an SM58 will last you many years, and is a pretty decent mic. Unless it just isn't doing the job, you may be better off just sticking with that.

Thanks, I think i will check out the Audix OM7 this weekend if I can track one down.
The SM58 is doing the job, but my drummer has started singing backup, so that mic will get deferred to him.

We arent all too serious about our home recordings as they're mostly for personal feedback...So using the sm58 and an sm57, i've been semi-successful at a decent recording, so I am just hoping that something like the Audix OM7 will do the job with recording as well. but as i said, the majority of its use is for live performance. I just dont have the money to get two mics right now. (Maybe after a few gigs and a few cookie jar donations!)

does the Audix OM7 require phantom power?

JonnyPistachio

IDgotI wrote:

Studio Projects B1... I read this review:

http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/jun05/articles/studioprojectsb1.htm

and figured.... what the heck... $120? That's a pedal. Might as well give it a shot. I own an AKG c414b-xls... a very established pro level condensor usually running for around $800 new. There is no question that the 414 is the more neutral... but as the Sound on Sound article suggested, the difference between these two mics was a lot less substantial than I would have imagined based on price. They *are* different mics... I mention the 414 just to make sure to specify I've compared the B1 against an established and significant contender. The B1 is a thouroughly usable condensor mic. It is *far* more versatile and usable in my opinion than my Rode NT2, a more expensive mic with a much thinner and more grating sound. You could have a serious mic collection with Neumans and you would probably find situations in which you actually would choose the B1. That's not to say the B1 is *better* than a Neuman. Rather the B1 is a really usable mic with a quality that is quite pleasing and suits some situations like a glove. Maybe not as *many* as a Neuman (then again the fact that it's so cheap and easily replaced might make it a really good 'go to' mic in a lot of rough and tumble siutations)... but the point is to say that the B1 is a dandy mic even without any consideration about price... The fact that it just happens to be ultra cheap makes it a no brainer to give one a shot. Great on male vocs and as the review states... pretty amazing on accoustic guitars. A great way to pick up a cheap stereo mic pair as well for anyone out there looking for a budget stereo pair option.
Great mic.

where can you find this mic? I didnt see it on a search of musicians friend.

IDgotI

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/339802-REG/Studio_Projects_B1_B1_Studio_Microphone.html

Btw, as a heads up... I haven't heard the more expensive mics by this company. I don't know that it follows that they would be better or as good. (the might be... haven't heard them). Fluke mics are often model specific.

mccreadyisgod

JonnyPistachio wrote:

does the Audix OM7 require phantom power?

Nope, it's just a regular old dynamic mic, just like your SM58.

samquigley

The Audix OM-7 does require a shitload of gain, though. Not a problem if you're only running vocals through the P.A., but if you're mic'ing the whole band make sure you've got enough wattage to get that vocal over the top. The OM-5 might be a better choice. I know it's not the one Eddie uses, but I'm guessing yours isn't the P.A. Eddie uses, either.
I personally think the 800-series Sennheiser's are better bang for buck. I, too, am bass/baritoney and I always had great results with the e855. Haven't tried the 900-series, but I believe they're pretty special.
And, as for handheld condensers such as the Beta87a/c/whatever ... they're much more trouble than they're worth. Trust me.

ianvomsaal

I've used a click: Sennheiser E-865 for years now, and I like it a lot.
The E-865 is considered by most to be Sennheisers best handheld mic.
For those of you that don't know, Neumann owns Sennheiser (it's basically Neumanns low end, like there's such a thing).
The E-865 is also the MIC Sting uses (and he's really picky about his sound) so I guess they must be fairly decent MIC's.
If you can find one they go for around $250.
Cheers . . .

- Ian C.T. vom Saal

coffee_party

SM58 for bar tours believe me try throwing them on your drummer while on a show and they'l still work

enharmonic

If you can, I would also try the Heil PR- 30 or 40. Incredible mics. Would be worth it at 2 times the price.