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moved all my equipment into my basement. hum problem.

exhaustedexhausted Posts: 6,638
edited September 2003 in Musicians and Gearheads
my basement's unfinished though. concrete everywhere. i've set everything up on a big rug though. my amps sitting on concrete blocks covered with a carpet. concrete walls. amp isn't against a wall though.

and i'm getting 60Hz hum now like you wouldn't believe. why? is it the concrete? perhaps the wiring for the house along the ceiling of the basement.

i'm getting constant hum in my amp. it only goes away when i'm facing a certain direction.

this sucks, i needed to move to the basement for space reasons but if it's that noisy down there forever, i'll go crazy.
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Comments

  • dan_alivedan_alive Posts: 123
    i hate the humming.. it shits me... good luck man... it could well be the wiring, just get a good position then settle for that...

    i would love a rehearsal space.. dammit
    |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
    "It is I, with the empty bladder!"

    www.nowalletevolution.com
  • Pacomc79Pacomc79 Posts: 9,404
    it's your lights. Probably flourescent right? There's your 60 cycle problem right there no shielding on the wiring. The only way to fix it would be to route the whole thing through a ground loop/ hum eliminator.
    My Girlfriend said to me..."How many guitars do you need?" and I replied...."How many pairs of shoes do you need?" She got really quiet.
  • exhaustedexhausted Posts: 6,638
    no flourescent lights. just incandescent. same as upstairs.

    i really don't want to have to buy a power conditioner.
  • puremagicpuremagic Posts: 1,907
    Originally posted by exhausted
    my basement's unfinished though. concrete everywhere. i've set everything up on a big rug though. my amps sitting on concrete blocks covered with a carpet. concrete walls. amp isn't against a wall though.

    and i'm getting 60Hz hum now like you wouldn't believe. why? is it the concrete? perhaps the wiring for the house along the ceiling of the basement.

    i'm getting constant hum in my amp. it only goes away when i'm facing a certain direction.

    this sucks, i needed to move to the basement for space reasons but if it's that noisy down there forever, i'll go crazy.

    If you can place a piece of 1/2" wood over the concrete blocks, relay your carpet and replace your amp on top.

    Also, are you near a window, exposed pipes or a bathroom.

    Take a moment to notice what is different about the direction your turning to when your amp works right and you'll figure out how to compensate.
    SIN EATERS--We take the moral excrement we find in this equation and we bury it down deep inside of us so that the rest of our case can stay pure. That is the job. We are morally indefensible and absolutely necessary.
  • exhaustedexhausted Posts: 6,638
    no windows in the basement.
    no pipes overhead as i'm under the living room.
    there is ductwork for the heating and ventilation though.

    right now, the amp faces a wall. there is overhead wiring running perpendicular to the amp face. if i stand facing the amp, no hum.

    i'll try the wood thing.
  • Pacomc79Pacomc79 Posts: 9,404
    how is the shelding on your P/U's or Wah Pedal?


    A power conditioner may solve your problem but they do get expensive with that damn tarriff again.

    You may be able to get away with a little foil put in the correct area's?


    take things out of the signal chain until it dosen't make noise anymore.
    My Girlfriend said to me..."How many guitars do you need?" and I replied...."How many pairs of shoes do you need?" She got really quiet.
  • exhaustedexhausted Posts: 6,638
    the shielding on my guitars sucks as much as fender usually does.

    but even my rickenbacker is noisy and it's *never* hummed before. no wah pedal in my chain.

    i have shielding paint in the mail along with a shitload of guitar parts and plan to shield the new guitar and the fenders. the rick and my les paul i'm not touching though.

    i thought about covering the overhead wiring with foil.

    i can get a nady or an ART rack power conditioner for about $70US which isn't as bad as i thought. i'm going to try some other things first though (the wood, the foil).
  • Pacomc79Pacomc79 Posts: 9,404
    go with a furman, you don't need the lights and they are around 40 bucks here on sale you get EMI/RFI filtering and conditioning but with tax and fees I guess it would be about 70 I think that would be the way to kill the buzz in the amp but the guitars are still going to have that little buzz without sheilding you have a noise supressor no? I guess it only kills hiss though not buzz
    My Girlfriend said to me..."How many guitars do you need?" and I replied...."How many pairs of shoes do you need?" She got really quiet.
  • thelouderthebetterthelouderthebetter Posts: 57
    I had the same problem in my house, and I found out that it was ground loops. This is what I learned from a parade of people trying to fix it.
    I have an older house, and a lot of the receptacles weren't grounded, and some were wired wrong, so they fixed that, then you plug everything into one outlet to see if it still happens. My borrowed amp buzzed like anything, and it ended up being the doorbell transformer on the ceiling of the basement interfering with the tubes. My neighbor's sound tech told me that it's almost always the simplest things that do make things buzz, He said loose connections and open junction boxes could do it , too. and that it's the most irritating thing when touring on the road in old venues. I remember him telling me one way to find it is to get to know your amp, and as you move it , it will point in the general direction of the source. I never did that though, cause the amp was bigger than me!
    I even have an outlet tester to plug in to test the polarity in the receptacles when we played out, and that would tell you if the ground was wrong.
    You may have tried that all, but that's what I know.

    8 years of art school and that's all I know!
    Smile :)
  • exhaustedexhausted Posts: 6,638
    i've read bad things about the furman but i'm going to see what my dealer up here can get before i order anything.

    i have an NS-2 at the end of the chain but this hum defeats it.

    which makes me think now that it's the pick-ups and i'm going to have to do major shielding operations on everything.

    dammit.

    tonight, i'm going to see how noisy my rack gear and mics are and i'll know a bit more about my problem.

    this sucks.
  • exhaustedexhausted Posts: 6,638
    thank you thelouder... that's good information. the house is about 8 years old and the receptacles are grounded but you never know how well. i play with the amp position tonight too.
  • Pacomc79Pacomc79 Posts: 9,404
    ok nevermind I've never owned a furman so I can't vouch for them.

    In my experience, Panamax and Monster Cable build the quietest one's I know of but you pay for them too.

    I bought one with EMI/RFI filtering and a circuit breaker for spike protection for my home theatre system the other day 50 bucks at Wall Mart. 45,000 amperes, unlimited Joules.
    My Girlfriend said to me..."How many guitars do you need?" and I replied...."How many pairs of shoes do you need?" She got really quiet.
  • thelouderthebetterthelouderthebetter Posts: 57
    Good luck Exhausted,
    And the other thing I forgot, that also helped a lot.
    When lightning strikes, I used to have sparks come out of my kitchen faucet. It turned out that when I had a plastic water main put in, it doesn't ground well. And I had a loose ground connection to the main ground rod outside.
    The electricians never found that after about 5 visits, the roadies from Youthinkyou'reolds old band found it one day with beers in their hands, during a barbeque! It even made my tv work better.
    Smile :)
  • exhaustedexhausted Posts: 6,638
    i'm just going by the harmony-central reviews. honestly, furman was the first name i thought of too but they're seriously almost double the price of nady and ART.
  • Pacomc79Pacomc79 Posts: 9,404
    the good old H-C. I used to spend a lot of time there.
    My Girlfriend said to me..."How many guitars do you need?" and I replied...."How many pairs of shoes do you need?" She got really quiet.
  • exhaustedexhausted Posts: 6,638
    i hate my job. i just want to go home and try to solve this problem. way more interesting.
  • Pacomc79Pacomc79 Posts: 9,404
    yeah I want to go buy a TV stand today.
    My Girlfriend said to me..."How many guitars do you need?" and I replied...."How many pairs of shoes do you need?" She got really quiet.
  • puremagicpuremagic Posts: 1,907
    Originally posted by thelouderthebetter
    Good luck Exhausted,
    And the other thing I forgot, that also helped a lot.
    When lightning strikes, I used to have sparks come out of my kitchen faucet. It turned out that when I had a plastic water main put in, it doesn't ground well. And I had a loose ground connection to the main ground rod outside.
    The electricians never found that after about 5 visits, the roadies from Youthinkyou'reolds old band found it one day with beers in their hands, during a barbeque! It even made my tv work better.

    Hey shorty, Hi. you do know your frightening him into thinking his whole house needs to be rewired.
    SIN EATERS--We take the moral excrement we find in this equation and we bury it down deep inside of us so that the rest of our case can stay pure. That is the job. We are morally indefensible and absolutely necessary.
  • exhaustedexhausted Posts: 6,638
    Originally posted by puremagic
    Hey shorty, Hi. you do know your frightening him into thinking his whole house needs to be rewired.

    i'm an engineer. don't tempt me.
  • puremagicpuremagic Posts: 1,907
    Originally posted by exhausted
    i just want to go home and try to solve this problem. way more interesting.

    Did you consider that the additional amp output of ALL your equipment could be on your circuits in that area beforehand. Check your circuit breaker to make sure what is being pulled from that area.

    You should have at least two free spaces on your circuit breaker to allow for at least at combined 30 amp increase before the need to heavy up.
    SIN EATERS--We take the moral excrement we find in this equation and we bury it down deep inside of us so that the rest of our case can stay pure. That is the job. We are morally indefensible and absolutely necessary.
  • exhaustedexhausted Posts: 6,638
    it should be a clear circuit but i'll confirm that. the breaker's labelled well. sadly, nothing else is plugged in right now. just my little 22W amp and a pedal board. i haven't even started plugging in the other stuff.

    the other other things are my recorder, a rack compressor and tube preamp and a lamp.

    if my monitor speakers and cd burner are on, it's because i'm mixing and my amp and/or pod and rack effects aren't on at the same time.
  • thelouderthebetterthelouderthebetter Posts: 57
    Who are you microdotcom? I'm weirded out

    I believe I need to leave this board for now

    See you all
    Smile :)
  • puremagicpuremagic Posts: 1,907
    Originally posted by microdotcom
    Don't worry, sorry , exhausted,you don't have to rewire,
    Maybe it's just best to move to a different house!
    Check the connections at the power company, too!, sometimes they're loose on the top of the tower. But wear rubber shoes! Be careful!!!!!!!! : )

    Hi Puremagic.
    What are we , electricians?

    exhausted probably best qualifies in that area. However, I, too, have all my setups in the basement and my floor is cement, so I know what he was kinda going through. My problem however was solved by splitting my circuit breaker. Rubber-backed carpet mats and wood solves my static problems. Hey, I'm a woman, finding easy solutions is our job.
    SIN EATERS--We take the moral excrement we find in this equation and we bury it down deep inside of us so that the rest of our case can stay pure. That is the job. We are morally indefensible and absolutely necessary.
  • exhaustedexhausted Posts: 6,638
    the rug i'm on is rubber backed at least. :)

    the breaker's going to get a good look tonight. and i work with electrical engineers too if i get stuck.
  • puremagicpuremagic Posts: 1,907
    Originally posted by microdotcom
    I just e-mailed back and forth with Louderthebetter. Sorry. I think the timing and the nature of my posts here and to her were bad, and I'm stupid at this. I'm lousy at trying to be funny.
    She knows who I am now, and will leave you all alone now.
    I'm sorry Louderthebetter, sorry puremagic, sorry exhausted.

    You don't have to go, its a free board, all conversations are well welcome. Stay, just remember its not personal.
    SIN EATERS--We take the moral excrement we find in this equation and we bury it down deep inside of us so that the rest of our case can stay pure. That is the job. We are morally indefensible and absolutely necessary.
  • puremagicpuremagic Posts: 1,907
    Originally posted by microdotcom
    Thanks Puremagic
    Uhh, ahem, I just said some really stupid and scary things out of the blue, not on this thread, but in mail, too, to Louderthebetter, who is a very nice person, and am not a message board post kind of guy . I think we're cool now.

    Thanks, for the offer.

    Shorty seems like a nice person, I immediately like her and that says alot for me. I hope you two work it out.
    SIN EATERS--We take the moral excrement we find in this equation and we bury it down deep inside of us so that the rest of our case can stay pure. That is the job. We are morally indefensible and absolutely necessary.
  • keven 33keven 33 Posts: 259
    good luck
    i'm headed to the basement to

    right after i give blood




    banana
    convicted
  • thelouderthebetterthelouderthebetter Posts: 57
    Whew, well, ,,,,,,,,what a day,,,,,,,,,,
    Well I'm back.
    Good luck with the hum, exhausted .

    I'm going out for the rest of the day.
    Now I'm exhausted!
    Smile :)
  • rybesrybes Posts: 136
    i had a very similar problem in my basement, my amp would humm as soon as i turned it on... ive moved since then and now its nice and quiet!

    good luck with your setup, hope you can figure out the problem and an easy solution, let me know if you do!
  • exhaustedexhausted Posts: 6,638
    somewhat fixed. there were/are a couple problems.

    1. bad extension cord. switched and it's somewhat of an improvement.
    2. amp position is playing a big part.
    3. single coils are picking up EMI.

    i *am* on an empty circuit. i've got one breaker all to myself. i'm going to check the grounding thoroughly. i am also going to invest in a rack mount power conditioner.

    once i shield my single coil guitars, things should be a lot better too.

    thanks for your help everyone.
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